Trump is almost as old as Biden!I think he needs to be taken seriously as early as possible, as literally anything could happen if he makes it to election day against Biden, particularly in light of Biden's age and the distinct possibility the US will be in a recession next year. The only silver lining is that there's a decent chance the GA election rigging attempt and classified docs cases will land him in jail before that.
Yeah but the difference is Trump's support is a **** of personality, so his voters generally don't care about his age. In Biden's case, many do, which isn't helped by Biden's occasional verbal gaffs.Trump is almost as old as Biden!
I suspect the documents case will do for him first, he basically confirmed everything in the townhall but he thinks it's all non-criminal, you'd think his advisors would tell him if he loses that case he's going to jail for likely the rest of his life
That's true, Biden needs to, but won't, drop Harris, she's been an insipid VP, some people will not vote for Biden if she's VP in case he pops his clogsYeah but the difference is Trump's support is a **** of personality, so his voters generally don't care about his age. In Biden's case, many do, which isn't helped by Biden's occasional verbal gaffs.
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That's obviously not true in CNN's case. They are fighting to reclaim the middle ground they ceded during the Zucker era, when they featured clowns like Don Lemon and Brian Stelter.CNN wants Trump to win, that much is clear, and obviously Fox.
So, democrats has to fight the media as well as the republicans going into 2024.
Isn't the new president of CNN a republican though?That's obviously not true in CNN's case. They are fighting to reclaim the middle ground they ceded during the Zucker era, when they featured clowns like Don Lemon and Brian Stelter.
Ever google ‘santorum.’Isn't the new president of CNN a republican though?
Also, they've been hiring right wing people in the last few years, such as Rick Santorum, not what i would call a moderate republican.
That's been CNN's MO since it started over 40 years ago. They pitted a left and right pundit against one another to argue with one another. I think the problem today is we have compartmentalized audiences who have been afflicted by network homophily, who now get triggered whenever they hear an opposition opinion being platformed. Unfortunately, that's not how a healthy society should work. It should allow a broader spectrum of opinions into the debate and let the audience decide which ideas are better than others. That has largely always been the CNN model.Isn't the new president of CNN a republican though?
Also, they've been hiring right wing people in the last few years, such as Rick Santorum, not what i would call a moderate republican.
Different opinions is one thing, but when the spectrum includes fascism and treason, i make an exception, those should not have their voice amplified, end of story.That's been CNN's MO since it started over 40 years ago. They pitted a left and right pundit against one another to argue with one another. I think the problem today is we have compartmentalized audiences who have been afflicted by network homophily, who now get triggered whenever they hear an opposition opinion being platformed. Unfortunately, that's not how a healthy society should work. It should allow a broader spectrum of opinions into the debate and let the audience decide which ideas are better than others. That has largely always been the CNN model.
Do you think they will dare to kick him out of the election race via a conviction while he's the front runner? I mean technically they'd have to - sure - but I will believe it when I see it.I think he needs to be taken seriously as early as possible, as literally anything could happen if he makes it to election day against Biden, particularly in light of Biden's age and the distinct possibility the US will be in a recession next year. The only silver lining is that there's a decent chance the GA election rigging attempt and classified docs cases will land him in jail before that.
If he's indicted, there will be more pressure on him by the Republican apparatus to drop out. Paradoxically, he's not likely to because the only thing that would potentially protect him from prison time is becoming POTUS again. This means he's likely to stay in the race unless he is convicted and sentenced to prison time.Do you think they will dare to kick him out of the election race via a conviction while he's the front runner? I mean technically they'd have to - sure - but I will believe it when I see it.
That's why its CNN's responsibility to fact check his lies in real time, which is what she did last night.Different opinions is one thing, but when the spectrum includes fascism and treason, i make an exception, those should not have their voice amplified, end of story.
I know being president can protect you from prosecution, wrong as it is, but what even happens if he wins from a prison cell, does he then get to walk out of there? Self-pardon?If he's indicted, there will be more pressure on him by the Republican apparatus to drop out. Paradoxically, he's not likely to because the only thing that would potentially protect him from prison time is becoming POTUS again. This means he's likely to stay in the race unless he is convicted and sentenced to prison time.
That's not how free speech should work and nor would I want it to, everyone has and is entitled to have an opinionDifferent opinions is one thing, but when the spectrum includes fascism and treason, i make an exception, those should not have their voice amplified, end of story.
This is a patently absurd position. The mad king lied and everyone cheered, the nasty woman objected and everyone sneered. The mad king was then allowed to carry on regardless.That's why its CNN's responsibility to fact check his lies in real time, which is what she did last night.
And increasingly everyone is entitled to their own facts.That's not how free speech should work and nor would I want it to, everyone has and is entitled to have an opinion
I said nothing about not being entitled to an opinion, did i?That's not how free speech should work and nor would I want it to, everyone has and is entitled to have an opinion
Her vapidity is surreal.The woman at 6:20 is the demographic Trump is banking on.
I think he already has the Stepford wife demographic sewn up. Always has.The woman at 6:20 is the demographic Trump is banking on.
That's obviously not true. The things he said, which are the fundamental unit of analysis last night, were fact checked in real time. When he lied about the election being stolen, she interjected that it wasn't true. When he lied about Jan 6th, she immediately interjected as well. The audience in the studio were irrelevant since they are an infinitesimally small group compared to the home audiences, most of which are not MAGA friendly since CNN's audience is pretty middle of the road. Therefore, CNN didn't do anything wrong at all in allowing Trump on, as long as his lies were fact checked for home audiences in real time, which Collins did a very good job of.This is a patently absurd position. The mad king lied and everyone cheered, the nasty woman objected and everyone sneered. The mad king was then allowed to carry on regardless.
No-one was held to account.
No one really knows if being President can protect him from prosecution, the Justice Department has an opinion that states that he is but it's never been tested in court, nether has a self-pardon, Trump has been advised that it's possible but given the quality of lawyers he's employed it's hard to take that seriously.I know being president can protect you from prosecution, wrong as it is, but what even happens if he wins from a prison cell, does he then get to walk out of there? Self-pardon?
Or must he serve his term from the cell?
It helped him in the Philly suburbs in 16. Not sure if that demo is still around for him today though.I think he already has the Stepford wife demographic sewn up. Always has.
If he goes to prison, he could technically still become President. Although that is highly unlikely given that a majority of the nation, including a majority of Republicans, aren't going to vote for someone in prison because they don't think they could govern. Nor is there a precedent for releasing someone from prison (spare a Presidential pardon, which would never happen) just so they can fill a political role. In fact, its the opposite that is usually the case - a political actor goes to jail for breaking the law, not the other way around.I know being president can protect you from prosecution, wrong as it is, but what even happens if he wins from a prison cell, does he then get to walk out of there? Self-pardon?
Or must he serve his term from the cell?
You think an audience laughing, clapping and booing are irrelevant to how an opinion is received outside of a studio. You also think that a 10 second interjection is adequate rebuttal for the airing of a 3 minute lie that continues both before and after said interjection. I doubt we will find a middle ground on this issue.That's obviously not true. The things he said, which are the fundamental unit of analysis last night, were fact checked in real time. When he lied about the election being stolen, she interjected that it wasn't true. When he lied about Jan 6th, she immediately interjected as well. The audience in the studio were irrelevant since they are an infinitesimally small group compared to the home audiences, most of which are not MAGA friendly since CNN's audience is pretty middle of the road. Therefore, CNN didn't do anything wrong at all in allowing Trump on, as long as his lies were fact checked for home audiences in real time, which Collins did a very good job of.
They weren't 10 second interjections. If you watched the entire thing, she was all over him the instant he lied. So much so that it clearly frustrated him to where he lashed out at her (calling her a nasty person), and at other times resulting in audible groans from the audience.You think an audience laughing, clapping and booing are irrelevant to how an opinion is received outside of a studio. You also think that a 10 second interjection is adequate rebuttal for the airing of a 3 minute lie that continues both before and after said interjection. I doubt we will find a middle ground on this issue.
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They weren't 10 second interjections. If you watched the entire thing, she was all over him the instant he lied. So much so that it clearly frustrated him to where he lashed out at her (calling her a nasty person), and at other times resulting in audible groans from the audience.
Cnn's own analysis on their website of the Town hall clearly shows the difference from the news side and the actual journalists and the top down mandate to give Trump this thing. They basically say Kaitlyn tried. But, Trump's people are so happy at this free publicity and parade of lies. How "strong he was talking all over her ignoring the fact checking.The crowd hooted, chuckled, or clapped when Trump called the former Speaker of the House “Crazy Nancy” and when he insisted that his former Vice-President, Mike Pence, had the power to single-handedly overturn the election results on January 6, 2021. They laughed when he insulted Collins. The more offensive Trump’s words, it seemed, the more they cheered. Only a day before the CNN event, a jury in New York had found Trump civilly liable for sexually abusing and defaming the writer E. Jean Carroll and awarded her five million dollars in damages. Trump’s response was to insult Carroll again on national TV. When he said that he felt sorry for her ex-husband, the audience laughed. When he called her a “whack job,” they laughed once more. When the show was finally over, the audience offered Trump a standing ovation.
Throughout, Collins struggled, and how could she not, having been assigned a near-impossible task? One revealing moment, among so many, came well into the hour, after Trump interrupted a long, untruthful speech about how he had “finished” the border wall, which he had not in fact finished, to mention, yet again, the “rigged election” of 2020. Collins tried once more to interject. “The election was not rigged, Mr. President,” she said. “You can’t keep saying that all night long.”
But he could, and he did.
His people are happy that he's on CNN again (after calling them fake news for many years). But at the end of the day, last night did more to expose him than help him since CNN is generally full of Dem leaning independents and Trump did nothing to assuage any of their concerns, nor did he say anything to alleviate concerns by women that he wouldn't go for a national ban on abortion - both of which would be absolute showstoppers to independent voters in a general election.Cnn's own analysis on their website of the Town hall clearly shows the difference from the news side and the actual journalists and the top down mandate to give Trump this thing. They basically say Kaitlyn tried. But, Trump's people are so happy at this free publicity and parade of lies. How "strong he was talking all over her ignoring the fact checking.
"Expose" what? Those Dem leaning independents know who he is. Which is why all the criticism rightly points out that it is impossible to actually air a Trump town hall and not simply be allowing him a platform to lie on your outlet.His people are happy that he's on CNN again (after calling them fake news for many years). But at the end of the day, last night did more to expose him than help him since CNN is generally full of Dem leaning independents and Trump did nothing to assuage any of their concerns, nor did he say anything to alleviate concerns by women that he wouldn't go for a national ban on abortion - both of which would be absolute showstoppers to independent voters in a general election.
A lot of people have forgotten about Trump because he's been out of office for 2.5 years and has been banned on social media during most of that time, and only communicated with his flock on Truth Social and a few sparse interviews on Fox and Newsmax. Therefore, there was a bit of a sentiment that people had forgotten how craven and morally bankrupt he was, instead looking at him more as a washed up clown mired in legal problems."Expose" what? Those Dem leaning independents know who he is. Which is why all the criticism rightly points out that it is impossible to actually air a Trump town hall and not simply be allowing him a platform to lie on your outlet.
Media dissection after 2016 about this clearly showed that the relentless airing of lies and conspiracies skews general perception. It is bad enough Fox and all the right wing media airs it nonstop.
Election workers were harassed and had to go into hiding because of election lies. Across the country volunteers just quit and figured it flat out wasn't worth the hassle and abuse these conspiracies and nutjobs were lavishing on them. Real consequences on real people from the relentless airing of lies.
Dominion and Smartmatic have the resources to sue, and in Dominion's case, get paid regarding defamatory lies allowed on the Air. But who will sue for the harassment these election workers received, death threats, being forced out of their jobs?
The same things he repeated last night that we know are false and failed in courts of law. That's not an opinion that these things didn't happen. Not saying you specifically but people who say first amendment right etc. No these networks and organizations not not have to allow conspiracies to fester and be given airtime. They made that mistake before allowing Trump to spout a litany of lies day in and day out. So what if they post an analysis on their website after. Or Jake Tapper comments that there was a boatload of lies after.
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You're right that I didn't sit through all of it and I'm certainly not gonna give it a second effort. That said, from my recollection this is very much unrepresentative of the bits I did watch. Some pushback on rigged elections, little to no pushback about sexual assault, some pushback about border wall, no pushback at all about democrats executing babies. Even when she did get slightly combative it was very much a case of who ya gonna believe, this idiot or your once and future king? With the audience very much swaying towards the latter.They weren't 10 second interjections. If you watched the entire thing, she was all over him the instant he lied. So much so that it clearly frustrated him to where he lashed out at her (calling her a nasty person), and at other times resulting in audible groans from the audience.
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The audience was a disaster, they were basically a sitcom audience laughing at trump's jokes, facial expressions and digs at collins, basically making him look like an eccentric goof and not the dangerous fascist he is.With the audience very much swaying towards the latter.
The important bit is she pushed back quite frequently. You can only be so combative with Trump before excesive arguing with him derails the entire purpose of a town hall where people get to ask a candidate questions. Given the circumstances, it went as well for CNN as it could have. They've done their due diligence by allowing him an hour or so, and will now do the same for the likes of Nicky Haley and Asa Hutchinson, and perhaps later, Christie and DeSantis.You're right that I didn't sit through all of it and I'm certainly not gonna give it a second effort. That said, from my recollection this is very much unrepresentative of the bits I did watch. Some pushback on rigged elections, little to no pushback about sexual assault, some pushback about border wall, no pushback at all about democrats executing babies. Even when she did get slightly combative it was very much a case of who ya gonna believe, this idiot or your once and future king? With the audience very much swaying towards the latter.
By allowing each candidate equal time to participate in a town hall event. These events are always partisan (as in, the audience will always be skewed towards the candidate being interviewed because they are either committed to or considering voting for them). An unfair platform would be to deliberately exclude a prominent candidate, thereby unfairly tilting the odds in favor of their opponents.@Raoul . How is CNN giving a fair platform to both parties in a fair way, when Trump hijacked this fairness menacing to pull off if CNN would not "behave" aka makong CNN selfcensor themelves to ask certain questions? IMO this is CNN giving an advanage to Trump (R) vs D
