[NLunited]

Who's talking about "Modern" football?

If we had Allison in goal, we would not have conceded the 2nd goal and we would have kept the ball more. You are acting as if none of our players can pass or run onto a football.

The thing what you don't understand is a player who can pass a ball better plays the ball into positions where the duels are not 50/50, they get played where the played receiving can control the ball.

Instead DDG just hoofs it and hopes for the best. There was times in the game where he had a pass and hoofed it to Ortega instead.

I have seen Alisson make some howlers this season.

Put Neuer in this current side and it makes him look bad.

We badly missed Martinez, who is excellent at progressive passing.

DeGea can play a pass through the lines, he has done it regularly this season. But City would not allow this, so he goes long. He was instructed to do so.

Criticize all you want, but apply some common sense. We have though choices to make this summer. There is no way all boxes are going to get ticked.

 

[arnie_ni]

I have seen Alisson make some howlers this season.

Put Neuer in this current side and it makes him look bad.

We badly missed Martinez, who is excellent at progressive passing.

DeGea can play a pass through the lines, he has done it regularly this season. But City would not allow this, so he goes long. He was instructed to do so.

Criticize all you want, but apply some common sense. We have though choices to make this summer. There is no way all boxes are going to get ticked.

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He also has players In his team that makes playing out from the back look simple.

How many times has ddg dropped the ball into someone in that situation only for them to lose it?

I can think of eriksen maguire and Fred from this season alone.

Replacing ddg to ederson won't change the fact we dont have enough players in the team comfortable receiving the ball in situations like there were John bloody stones did

Hes played this pass a few times this season. It usually ends up as a shoot for the opposition not a counter attack for us.

 

[romufc]

I have seen Alisson make some howlers this season.

Put Neuer in this current side and it makes him look bad.

We badly missed Martinez, who is excellent at progressive passing.

DeGea can play a pass through the lines, he has done it regularly this season. But City would not allow this, so he goes long. He was instructed to do so.

Criticize all you want, but apply some common sense. We have though choices to make this summer. There is no way all boxes are going to get ticked.

Yes, Allison has had howlers this season.

DDG's howlers are in knock out games as the 1st goal, deciding goal. Also, his mistakes are not his passing, most of them are his concentration, him letting shots in under his body.

Now, you names Allison, can you name me where he has costed Lfc a CL quarter, EL quarter, FA final or semi final, all in the last 3 years?

DDG cannot play through the lines, thats actually a lie. He was instructed to kick the ball to Ortega was he? Is that why Lindelof, Casemiro, Varane all drop for a short ball? SO the ball can get lumped?

Yes, and if we do not get a new keeper, we wont finish higher than 3rd, or win a CL.

 

[MadDogg]

I also noticed that when we do that daft goal kick routine, whereby the defender plays the ball to De Gea, he dithers on it and that allows the opposition forwards to close him down whereby he'll panic and either twat it long, play a risky pass or just boot it out of play. I watch how easily City play their way out of trouble from the back and how quickly it can go from a goal kick to an attack with just a couple of passes, and I just can't see how we'll ever get that with a keeper who panics. The likes of Shaw, Martinez and to an extent Varane are all capable of playing a pass though a press, Martinez especially, but if the pass to them is either shite, or plays them into trouble, then we've got no chance

What I bolded is actually what is supposed to happen. The purpose of a defender passing to the keeper in that situation is to actually draw the opposition out of position as they try to close him down. It then creates a potential overlap in the space left behind and changes the angle for a pass into the midfield either directly from the keeper or through a defender intermediary.

City did it at least once in the same game and that's exactly what happened. Rashford (I think) pushed up, the keeper and the defender did another little one-two and then the ball was quickly played straight through the centre and City were on the attack as they now had a numerical advantage in that area of the field. Arsenal and other teams do it at times as well.

The issue of course is that, as you said, De Gea just panics and isn't capable of actually playing the pass to take advantage of it.

 

[arnie_ni]

Yes, Allison has had howlers this season.

DDG's howlers are in knock out games as the 1st goal, deciding goal. Also, his mistakes are not his passing, most of them are his concentration, him letting shots in under his body.

Now, you names Allison, can you name me where he has costed Lfc a CL quarter, EL quarter, FA final or semi final, all in the last 3 years?

DDG cannot play through the lines, thats actually a lie. He was instructed to kick the ball to Ortega was he? Is that why Lindelof, Casemiro, Varane all drop for a short ball? SO the ball can get lumped?

Yes, and if we do not get a new keeper, we wont finish higher than 3rd, or win a CL.

He had a howler against RM in the CL this season.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

Think it might be out of ten Hag's hands to be honest.

All reports point to the contrary, but if it’s true that Ten Hag doesn’t have a say in whether De Gea is offered a new deal, then we all might as well log off because it’s pointless to ever expect the club to drag itself out of the cycle of mediocrity we’ve been in for a decade.

 

[evil_geko]

I have seen Alisson make some howlers this season.

Put Neuer in this current side and it makes him look bad.

We badly missed Martinez, who is excellent at progressive passing.

DeGea can play a pass through the lines, he has done it regularly this season. But City would not allow this, so he goes long. He was instructed to do so.

Criticize all you want, but apply some common sense. We have though choices to make this summer. There is no way all boxes are going to get ticked.

Exactly, finally a common sense post. I also said with Martinez we would have better control, other keeper wouldn't change much with rest of that team regarding control, he wouldn't magically make other players calmer and better at progressing ball.

Again, we do need to upgrade keeper, but people go so over the top with it.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

I have seen Alisson make some howlers this season.

Put Neuer in this current side and it makes him look bad.

We badly missed Martinez, who is excellent at progressive passing.

DeGea can play a pass through the lines, he has done it regularly this season. But City would not allow this, so he goes long. He was instructed to do so.

Criticize all you want, but apply some common sense. We have though choices to make this summer. There is no way all boxes are going to get ticked.

This is insanity that it’s still being argued after all visual and statistical evidence shows you how terrible De Gea is as a distributor/sweeper/shot stopper.

Also how in gods name would Neuer make us worse? We literally won the golden glove for one of the worst keepers in the league this year!

 

[Alfie092]

If ETH and us as a club are serious and ruthless enough, we get rid of DDG. No excuses.

His contract is up, is on crazy wages, doesn't suit modern football, age is against him and is clearly on a decline. If those reasons are not enough for ETH to get rid then I will start to have my doubts about him in terms of his plans going forward and what he is trying to build.

We can literally end this mess with a press of a button with his contract up! Guardiola and Arteta quickly rectified the GK situation with getting a modern GK and ETH needs to follow the same path.

If DDG was at another top club he would have been shifted out by now without a doubt. Him being like the 100th choice GK for Spain, under several managers too, with no Spanish fans complaining says it all.

 

[romufc]

This is insanity that it’s still being argued after all visual and statistical evidence shows you how terrible De Gea is as a distributor/sweeper/shot stopper.

Also how in gods name would Neuer make us worse? We literally won the golden glove for one of the worst keepers in the league this year!

There are alot of fans on here who do not understand the importance of a ball playing keeper. The thing is we were ok with DDG because he is such an excellent shot stopper but he has 4 howlers a season now.

These are not just any mistakes, they are howlers, I can name a few this season. Brentford, West Ham, Sevilla were all howlers.

Add to that, he lacks any sort of command of his 6 yard box, cannot pass properly, which means the team is nervy when we have the ball because DDG will most likely kick the ball to an opponent.

 

[Alfie092]

Exactly, finally a common sense post. I also said with Martinez we would have better control, other keeper wouldn't change much with rest of that team regarding control, he wouldn't magically make other players calmer and better at progressing ball.

Again, we do need to upgrade keeper, but people go so over the top with it.

He needs to leave, not just for us but for the better of his career. Not over the top at all.

 

[Kostov]

Can you name the games where Shaw and Bruno cost us? I can on the top of my head name Chelsea 2019 goal at OT, Chelsea Semi Final 2020, Barcelona 2019, Sevilla 2023, Man City 23, Leipzig 21 where DDG has made errors costing us in big moments. These are opening goals and deciding goals in games.

Its funny the names you mention because Manutd want to replace Weghorst and Eriksen.

Also, what is wrong with Anotny? It feels like you are just naming players without reason now, because Antony is actually one of the better players when the ball is played to him.

Shaw has had a dozen of absolutely dogshit games through out his career here, even this season, on top of my head I can think of is Liverpool away this season he was absolutely shocking, didn't Bruno cost us on Saturday with his no show job in the biggest game of our season? Or only GK brainfarts you rank as "costly games"?

But I thought you said that a GK will help us more than replacing Weghorst? Maybe ETH has no clue and should blow our entire budget on Maignan while we keep Weghorst up top?

Antony has been an absolute disappointment for a 100m additions. One of our better players when the ball is played to him is hardly some achievement, a winger who can't beat a man to save his life, is predictable and not very productive I rank as a problem, much bigger one than DDG not Allison.

 

[romufc]

Shaw has had a dozen of absolutely dogshit games through out his career here, even this season, on top of my head I can think of is Liverpool away this season he was absolutely shocking, didn't Bruno cost us on Saturday with his no show job in the biggest game of our season? Or only GK brainfarts you rank as "costly games"?

But I thought you said that a GK will help us more than replacing Weghorst? Maybe ETH has no clue and should blow our entire budget on Maignan while we keep Weghorst up top?

Antony has been an absolute disappointment for a 100m additions. One of our better players when the ball is played to him is hardly some achievement, a winger who can't beat a man to save his life, is predictable and not very productive I rank as a problem, much bigger one than DDG not Allison.

Yes, if a CB plays a pass that is intercepted and lets the player 1 v 1 its a mistake that led to a goal, its costly. If a goal keeper lets one under his body its costly. Bruno not showing up is costly, but you cannot say we lost / missed any goal because of him?

Yes because Weghorst is our 9 ? he is on loan and is no longer a United player. So we clearly are replacing him.

A GK is just as important as a new ST. I have not said Maignan, he is a player you have named. So we should blow our transfer spend on Kane and get no other signings?

Okay, you are not happy with Antony but we have enough wingers in Rashford, Sancho, Garnacho, Antony, Diallo to rotate if one is / isn't working.

DDG consistently making mistakes is ok though.

 

[Kostov]

I, nor anybody else that matter, can't give you a stat that hasn't been put out there. It is Harrison's metric and only he can give the information out. I also haven't criticised him for the first goal in any way shape or form. Either way, you asked the question how likely it would have been that Alisson stopped the second goal, not the first, I gave you the data. I don't see how that is relevant to the first goal. It's odd that you've completely ignored the vast majority of my post regarding the benefits of having 11 players in possession rather than 10, and asked for the probability of him stopping a shot that I think the realistic chances of him stopping were pretty low.

I ignored the entirety of your post, because I don't get hung off on stats like yourself. Statistics said that Bruno created the most goal opportunities last season, and the guy couldn't create shit on Saturday, or better off he played like an absolute amateur compared to the likes of Gundogan and KDB.

And whether Allison would have saved that. is irrelevant for one other much more important reason IMO, you don't leave the oppositions midfielder who scored an absolute screamer the other half, unmarked and alone on the edge of the box, then proceed to block him lamely by3 outfield players in the mess, but pin it on the GK at the end.

 

[Kostov]

Yes, if a CB plays a pass that is intercepted and lets the player 1 v 1 its a mistake that led to a goal, its costly. If a goal keeper lets one under his body its costly. Bruno not showing up is costly, but you cannot say we lost / missed any goal because of him?

Are you serious now? Don't you think we lost on Saturday because we were absolute pants in attack? I do, actually we have been in the gutter for 10 years because we can not create and score goals like the other top teams in the league. 36 league goals less tells you all you need to know.

Yes because Weghorst is our 9 ? he is on loan and is no longer a United player. So we clearly are replacing him.

A GK is just as important as a new ST. I have not said Maignan, he is a player you have named. So we should blow our transfer spend on Kane and get no other signings?

If I had to choose between Maignan and Kane, I'd take Kane every damn time, because I think it would improve us much more than Maignan.

Okay, you are not happy with Antony but we have enough wingers in Rashford, Sancho, Garnacho, Antony, Diallo to rotate if one is / isn't working.

DDG consistently making mistakes is ok though.

It's absolutely not okey. I want the Qatary to buy us and replace DDG with someone like Maignan, but that was not the point. I think we have bigger problems than DDG, which is frankly depressing after spending so much last summer.

 

[romufc]

It's absolutely not okey. I want the Qatary to buy us and replace DDG with someone like Maignan, but that was not the point. I think we have bigger problems than DDG, which is frankly depressing after spending so much last summer.

I agree with this, we need a massive summer of 5 players that go into the 1st 11. Keeper, CM x 2 ST and maybe a CB.

Varane cant stay fit and we need to improve the whole spine. Which is why I think Its Qatar or bust for Manutd.

We cannot go into every transfer window needing 4/5 starting 11 players, it happens every season where the deficiencies are not addressed, we overpay for players which means we cannot strengthen other areas.

 

[MadDogg]

De Gea has always tried to evade physicality to an extent. Probably the best in the world when it comes to reflexes and saving with his feet.

Used to be yes. Certainly not anymore.

 

[KikiDaKats]

Will always back him against most top goal keepers. Think his time with us is up.
Don’t buy into the he can’t distribute because that was his biggest strength when he got here. It might not have been to the highest levels but I doubt there was any in the league as good as him in his first season here.
Im of the thinking, when a goal loses the fans there is no coming back from it. Goalkeeping is centred around people trusting you and commanding a certain level of respect from players. If opposition feel they can press you, jump with you or know your weakness then the aura is gone. A United goalkeeper cant be that guy.
Even when he has a flawless performance us fans still talk of it with reservations and that for me has him cooked. A Tomasz Kuszczak aura is not what we need in goal at this club.

 

[JB7]

I ignored the entirety of your post, because I don't get hung off on stats like yourself. Statistics said that Bruno created the most goal opportunities last season, and the guy couldn't create shit on Saturday, or better off he played like an absolute amateur compared to the likes of Gundogan and KDB.

And whether Allison would have saved that. is irrelevant for one other much more important reason IMO, you don't leave the oppositions midfielder who scored an absolute screamer the other half, unmarked and alone on the edge of the box, then proceed to block him lamely by3 outfield players in the mess, but pin it on the GK at the end.

The rest of what I actually posted didn't really go into any specific stats though, I added a tweet that showed the overall successful/unsuccessful passes of each goalkeeper but that is about it, the rest was taken purely from standing behind the goal and watching the game:

Spoiler

We rely on players who are able to find space to progress the ball, that is no different to City in fairness, or pretty much any team ever. The difference is how they find space. Because they use the goalkeeper as part of their 11 in possession, they were comfortable splitting their centre backs with and dropping midfielders deep, which gave the goalkeeper more options and stretched the game which in turn obviously allowed for more space for players to progress the ball from more varied posisitons.

So essentially, they were found in space more often because in possession they had an extra player to us and were comfortably starting attacks from deep because of the goalkeepers comfortability in possession. They actually went long in the game as many times as we did, the difference was De Gea accounted for twice as many long balls as Ortega (this particular sentence is technically stats I guess that but it's hardly anything complex and is factual rather than relying on any metrics etc). So because De Gea played so many long balls which City were ready for, and Ortega had the ability to invite the press and therefore wait longer than De Gea to play a pass our midfield which in turn allowed Rodri or Stones to find space behind the player pressing, our players were generally picking up possession under more immediate pressure than theirs so the turnovers were far more likely. They have better players than us, that is not in doubt, but the game is much easier if you can play in space and that is the major difference playing in possession with 11 players vs in possession with 10 players makes.

In addition I found their pressing on goal-kicks particularly interesting as it was more about blocking spaces than actually pressing the goalkeeper. Once the kick was taken to De Gea, Haaland came to the right of De Gea without directly pressing him and they stayed high in the central areas too. This cut off Varane and AWB as we know De Gea cannot play those chipped passes out to the full backs with any consistency and also cut off the central pass to Casemiro for him to spread the play wide as we also know De Gea isn't suited to inviting any kind of press. In turn, knowing his limits in those areas, he was forced to hit the ball long to players who were neither as big nor strong as the defenders directly against them. They were more than happy to let De Gea take as much time as he wanted to make the pass because they knew that he didn't have the ability to find the player they had left in space (more often than not AWB) and the likelihood was that even if he played the long ball to the attackers well, they would regain possession.

If you can't see how it's considerably easier to create chances when you are given the ball in space behind the oppositions press, than having the ball hammered at you to try and challenge aerially against players 2/3 inches taller than you then that is some very impressive head-in-the-sand analysis. As is arguing that the defenders not marking correctly or not blocking the shot means we can overlook the fact it should easily have been stopped by the goalkeeper too.

 

[Sylar]

Not saying we should not look for another keeper at all, but reading some posts, you would think changing only keeper we would somehow gain some magical 100% control improvement which is silly.

Also that evidence proves my point, majority of his passes were short to sides of his defence, which is something even De Gea can do if defenders get open in good spots. But I guess it is De Geas fault too when we are too static and can't open.

I have seen Alisson make some howlers this season.

Put Neuer in this current side and it makes him look bad.

We badly missed Martinez, who is excellent at progressive passing.

DeGea can play a pass through the lines, he has done it regularly this season. But City would not allow this, so he goes long. He was instructed to do so.

Criticize all you want, but apply some common sense. We have though choices to make this summer. There is no way all boxes are going to get ticked.

This is contradictory isnt it? Which is it? He was instructed to go long, or defenders didnt get into open spaces?

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Look at 20 seconds. Shaw is open but he goes long. If hes instructed to go long, then were saying Shaw is going against instructions by dropping deep thus playing everybody onside if it comes back.
28 seconds, again, Shaw is open, but DDG goes long again. So if its an instruction, Shaw is going against them.
43 seconds, DDG has three options available but goes long. We had players in good open spots, so if he was capable of doing so, im sure he would have done it right?
48 seconds is the biggest one though, DDG has the ball for almost ten seconds, he has a player actively drop to try and get the ball of him as well as two men free out wide. Instead he floats it to the half way line.

Everything about the video above shows that common sense is not being used in the posts above. If hes instructed to go long, then were basically saying half the team are going against instructions knowing DDG will be told to go long.
otherwise we are saying hes going long despite having open options?

Or the most likely scenario, is that hes going long despite the options, because he doesnt trust himself to complete the passes short, and would rather hit it as far away from his goal

Impressive tracking, good job! I think most of them are included in these 20 minutes:

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There's so many things to extract from that video. I thought I'd find one example to use as the most suitable representation of the problem with De Gea…and it was nearly impossible, since there are just too many to choose from.

However, if I really have to, I'll go with the one at 06:28 when Phil Jones is forced to run back to clear a ball in what should a standard keeper clearing/grabbing action — unless that keeper is De Gea. When was that sequence, 7-8 years ago? Nothing has changed. And our defence still knows this, hence so many of the weird moments that seems unique to us, where we become vulnerable from basically nothing. He changes the way we defend most situations, some of which should not be threatening at all.

Instead he incites panic from what should be standard goalkeeping actions, as in using his hands and having good positioning. Never mind his ability with the feet, which of course is also another problem entirely.

Thanks, and to think there are so many cases where ive not listed (eg his faults vs Liverpool in the cup when Fergie was here(think it was his first season))
The bolded bit is the issue. We need to change the way we defend, we set ourselves up and so forth. The way we defend set pieces is seen by Citys second goal. We are lining up so many people near the six yard line because we have a keeper that wont come out and claim it meaning, were overcompensating thus neglecting other areas. And keep in mind, that a top keeper would normally be telling his players where to move because he has the whole view.

The minute you described, there were several instances in the cup final where it happened. The Fred one where it rolled on the line for a few good seconds, and we had to hook it away for a throw. Or one where Varane looks behind him trying to shepherd the ball back, and instead has to swing it away as well.

I, nor anybody else that matter, can't give you a stat that hasn't been put out there. It is Harrison's metric and only he can give the information out. I also haven't criticised him for the first goal in any way shape or form. Either way, you asked the question how likely it would have been that Alisson stopped the second goal, not the first, I gave you the data. I don't see how that is relevant to the first goal. It's odd that you've completely ignored the vast majority of my post regarding the benefits of having 11 players in possession rather than 10, and asked for the probability of him stopping a shot that I think the realistic chances of him stopping were pretty low.

Why do you think that happened?
Its not odd at all given the way this thread has gone for months.

What I find odd is how people are putting players above the club

 

[BelfastRed2021]

Just look at how many assists Alison has got for Salah when he kicks the long ball that he collects from crosses or overhit passes because he isnt rooted to his line Allison is confident and knows what he wants to do before he does it. Then look at Da Gea people face facts as soon as both City and Liverpool fecked off their goal keepers and brought in world class goal keepers its no suprise they started winning titles and trophies regularly Da Gea isnt in the same class as ederson or alison

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

There are alot of fans on here who do not understand the importance of a ball playing keeper. The thing is we were ok with DDG because he is such an excellent shot stopper but he has 4 howlers a season now.

These are not just any mistakes, they are howlers, I can name a few this season. Brentford, West Ham, Sevilla were all howlers.

Add to that, he lacks any sort of command of his 6 yard box, cannot pass properly, which means the team is nervy when we have the ball because DDG will most likely kick the ball to an opponent.

Yeah I could understand people being a bit slow to understand why we need to bin him off if De Gea was still producing world class shot stopping seasons. But he’s not, not even close. I guess it’s one of those things that people will just need to see in action for them to actually understand. Bring in a guy that can cleanly distribute at a high level and is confident sweeping and watch how much it transforms the entire side. Similar to bringing in Casemiro after years of not having a true DM.

 

[Cloud7]

I was watching highlights of us beating Chelsea in the League cup from a few years ago, no idea why I was, and it showed Chelsea getting a corner at the very end of the match and as it's crossed in Romero comes off his line and catches the ball. He takes responsibility, he's decisive , he stops any danger and the ref blows for FT and we've won.

Something so basic and yet it struck me how you fecking NEVER see De Gea do this.

It's just absurd we're in a situation where our Keeper refuses to do something so basic and fundamental. A huge part of his job that he just will not do. It's insane

My biggest issue with De Gea has never been his ability on the ball/passing, which is obviously quite a big issue, but the fact that he's always been so poor at coming off his line and claiming the ball off crosses/corners

 

[NLunited]

Just look at how many assists Alison has got for Salah when he kicks the long ball that he collects from crosses or overhit passes because he isnt rooted to his line Allison is confident and knows what he wants to do before he does it. Then look at Da Gea people face facts as soon as both City and Liverpool fecked off their goal keepers and brought in world class goal keepers its no suprise they started winning titles and trophies regularly Da Gea isnt in the same class as ederson or alison

No he isn‘t as good as either of those, but we ain‘t getting someone that good probably this summer. So what‘s the point?

Are you ignoring that De Gea can put a man through on goal? Because he has done so a few times in the last month.

 

[NLunited]

This is contradictory isnt it? Which is it? He was instructed to go long, or defenders didnt get into open spaces?

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Look at 20 seconds. Shaw is open but he goes long. If hes instructed to go long, then were saying Shaw is going against instructions by dropping deep thus playing everybody onside if it comes back.
28 seconds, again, Shaw is open, but DDG goes long again. So if its an instruction, Shaw is going against them.
43 seconds, DDG has three options available but goes long. We had players in good open spots, so if he was capable of doing so, im sure he would have done it right?
48 seconds is the biggest one though, DDG has the ball for almost ten seconds, he has a player actively drop to try and get the ball of him as well as two men free out wide. Instead he floats it to the half way line.

Everything about the video above shows that common sense is not being used in the posts above. If hes instructed to go long, then were basically saying half the team are going against instructions knowing DDG will be told to go long.
otherwise we are saying hes going long despite having open options?

Or the most likely scenario, is that hes going long despite the options, because he doesnt trust himself to complete the passes short, and would rather hit it as far away from his goal



Thanks, and to think there are so many cases where ive not listed (eg his faults vs Liverpool in the cup when Fergie was here(think it was his first season))
The bolded bit is the issue. We need to change the way we defend, we set ourselves up and so forth. The way we defend set pieces is seen by Citys second goal. We are lining up so many people near the six yard line because we have a keeper that wont come out and claim it meaning, were overcompensating thus neglecting other areas. And keep in mind, that a top keeper would normally be telling his players where to move because he has the whole view.

The minute you described, there were several instances in the cup final where it happened. The Fred one where it rolled on the line for a few good seconds, and we had to hook it away for a throw. Or one where Varane looks behind him trying to shepherd the ball back, and instead has to swing it away as well.



Why do you think that happened?
Its not odd at all given the way this thread has gone for months.

What I find odd is how people are putting players above the club

I‘m not sure what you don‘t understand about long ball tactics. Obviously De Gea chose to play the long ball more often this game because of instructions. You can see our players making the run.

If Martinez was playing we may have played out the back more often.

 

[lex talionis]

Just look at how many assists Alison has got for Salah when he kicks the long ball that he collects from crosses or overhit passes because he isnt rooted to his line Allison is confident and knows what he wants to do before he does it. Then look at Da Gea people face facts as soon as both City and Liverpool fecked off their goal keepers and brought in world class goal keepers its no suprise they started winning titles and trophies regularly Da Gea isnt in the same class as ederson or alison

Excellent point, but do we have a player who's anywhere near Salah in his ability to take the ball in midfield, beat 2-3 defeders and score?

The problem with the "our attack is shite because of De Gea" misses the obvious observation that our attackers are nowhere near the quality we expect them to be at. Martial, Sancho and Antony would get nowhere near the squads, let alone the starting XI, of City, Arsenal, Liverpool and probably Newcastle as well. Rashford makes these squads, but no chance does he start on a regular basis for City, Arsenal and Liverpool. Each of those would be very interested in Garnacho, but he's an incredible prospect and as of this writing, most definitely not a proven goal scorer or assist machine. The deficiencies of our front line this season have nothing to do with De Gea's passing ability or lack thereof.

 

[bosnian_red]

I‘m not sure what you don‘t understand about long ball tactics. Obviously De Gea chose to play the long ball more often this game because of instructions. You can see our players making the run.

If Martinez was playing we may have played out the back more often.

Its far more likely that we go long from the goalkeeper more often against good pressing sides because de Gea isn't capable of going short against them, or pinging it out to the fullback.

 

[Dorris]

I‘m not sure what you don‘t understand about long ball tactics. Obviously De Gea chose to play the long ball more often this game because of instructions. You can see our players making the run.

If Martinez was playing we may have played out the back more often.

He’s literally analysed in detail the weaknesses of De Gea, given examples and explained the basis for the assumptions he’s made, and your response is to question his knowledge of long ball tactics. Why don’t you counteract his points with similarly well thought out analysis that could possibly disprove him?
‘He makes saves others couldn’t’ doesn’t count.

 

[sullydnl]

Pretty clear that tactics weren't simply to keep going long given you could see other players were regularly dropping for the ball before it when long and actively discussing it with De Gea.

Which is something we've seen in other recent games too, with the likes of Casemiro visibly complaining about him going long when he was available to receive it short and The Athletic having reported another incident where Lindelof called for De Gea to play it short to Maguire only for De Gea to shoo them away and hit it long.

The most likely scenario is that the decision on when to go short/long is to a large degree left up to the players's judgement of the circumstances, with them being expected to know when it's on or isn't. And De Gea, being weak in this regard, is more cautious than is ideal.

Which is absolutely understandable from his POV, but also part of how having him as your goalkeeper hurts the team.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Pretty clear that tactics weren't simply to keep going long given you could see other players were regularly dropping for the ball before it when long and actively discussing it with De Gea.

Which is something we've seen in other recent games too, with the likes of Casemiro visibly complaining about him going long when he was available to receive it short and The Athletic having reported another incident where Lindelof called for De Gea to play it short to Maguire only for De Gea to shoo them away and hit it long.

The most likely scenario is that the decision on when to go short/long is to a large degree left up to the players's judgement of the circumstances, with them being expected to know when it's on or isn't. And De Gea, being weak in this regard, is more cautious than is ideal.

Which is absolutely understandable from his POV, but also part of how having him as your goalkeeper hurts the team.

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The incident which starts at 48s really blew my mind at the time. There’s actually a few seconds before the clip starts where DDG is allowed to verrrrrrry slowly dribble the ball towards the edge of the box. The City players make no effort to press him and Lindelof is in absolutely acres of space to his left, even after he ignores Casemiro dropping deep to take the ball of him. What is going through his head when he thinks the best thing to do here is a loft a pass straight onto the head of a city defender? How many times does this have to keep happening before he realises that 9 times out of 10 he is pissing away valuable possession, giving the ball straight back to the opposition? I usually think he’s stressed out by being pressed so defaults to the safest option and hoofs the ball out of the danger area. And I can understand that. What I can’t understand is him making the same decision when he’s not under any pressure at all. So bizarre.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

I still have the feeling that was the last we have seen of him in Man Utd colours.

 

[Big Ben Foster]

I still have the feeling that was the last we have seen of him in Man Utd colours.

Our goalkeepers technically never wear Man Utd colors, so you're definitely right

 

[Rolaholic]

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[Edwards6]

I still have the feeling that was the last we have seen of him in Man Utd colours.

I hope you're right, I'm sure Ten Hag will want to replace him but all depends what budget we have and can we raise enough funds by selling players

 

[Bastian]

Mike Mcgrath (Telegraph) reported it was a two year contract on significantly reduced terms which include bonuses dependent on the games he plays, with no guarantee of being #1. But I don't understand why they aren't signing off on the contract.

It was also reported by Rob Dawson in December last year about United working on a deal to sign Yann Sommer come the end of the season. He since joined Bayern but Neuer is now back in training and it looks like he will be the #1. Yann Sommer will likely look to move and he would be a good stop gap keeper to have for the short term. I can't see us signing a Diogo Costa or Maignan due to the cost unless the sale of the club goes through.

https://www.espn.co.uk/football/sto...eye-yann-sommer-transfer-sources?platform=amp

Yeah, that's the crucial bit, a sale. I do hope they are lining up potential targets for every possible position ETH would like to improve on, just in case.

I suspect the reporting of this now being delayed by the club whereas before it was Dave is just a way to change the angle and rehash the same story given Dave had a mare in the final.

Last summer I was thinking just give us anyone who can play, but I've watched Sommer (1.83) a bit and I don't think he's physically cut out for the Prem. I'd be hoping for a strong presence there to immediately make us feel like we've got a commanding GK again, even if they are a major prospect like that Verbruggen (1.93).

 

[Adnan]

Yeah, that's the crucial bit, a sale. I do hope they are lining up potential targets for every possible position ETH would like to improve on, just in case.

I suspect the reporting of this now being delayed by the club whereas before it was Dave is just a way to change the angle and rehash the same story given Dave had a mare in the final.

Last summer I was thinking just give us anyone who can play, but I've watched Sommer (1.83) a bit and I don't think he's physically cut out for the Prem. I'd be hoping for a strong presence there to immediately make us feel like we've got a commanding GK again, even if they are a major prospect like that Verbruggen (1.93).

Agreed mate. I quite like what I've heard about Verbruggen and if the heads of scouting along with ten Hag think he's worth investing in, then I would be in favour of us signing Verbruggen.

 

[Malone_Post]

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‘World class shot stopper’
‘Makes saves that no one else could’
Etc etc

 

[Based Adnan]

Why do people even bother engaging with those still defending this guy? If the constant shockers aren't going to change their mind neither are you. Waste of time.

 

[arthurka]

This has been going on for years but he has always had some good TV saves to put on the highlight reel. Sadly they have all but dried up so there is really nothing more to admire. He and Harry are just laughably bad.

 

[Snow]

He'll get a new contract and the reason is that if he doesn't United need to find 3 new keepers for next season.

United will sign a new nr. 1. They'll re-sign De Gea because he'll be a good nr. 2 to have and it will be cheaper to give him a new contract than to buy a new keeper specifically as a number 2. We've also really struggled to get a nr. 2 keeper for a while now so it just makes sense.