Definitely getting Maguire vibes…
Declan Rice | signs for arsenal
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
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You think he's only an OK player, but you also thought he would go to the best team in Europe. Make it make sense.
The disrespect for Carrick in this forum of all place isn't surprising, but still tragic. He was one of the finest midfielders ever produced in the UK, and only overlooked in comparison to his peers because Brits like flashy long shots and pashun running.
If Rice turns out to be as good as him then it would be one of the best deal any club can make, but he has shown nowhere near the composure and passing range Carrick possessed.
Kalvin Phillips and Fabian Delph went to the same team, it's not that hard.
Did you think Phillips and Delph would end up at City?
Urm how many times have you seen Saka put his foot on the ball and spin around on a 360 bamboozling his opponents (and maybe ever so slightly himself in Antony's case)? Also how many times has Saka played for Brazil?
Did you think Akanji or Nathan Ake would end up at City?
There's nothing in the original post that is contradictory. The poster thought Rice an OK player, he also thought that given the choice, he would have ended up at City, they are independent assessments.
Well played OO, you got me there. I concede all points.
Excellent, I'll await you to start a movement on Arsenal Mania to convince your fans to pressure Arsenal into a straight swap for Antony.
You surely want a full Brazilian front three.
Here's a good video that might suggest that he has good variety to his game, and shows he is far from just the destroyer and pass sideways and back merchant that I've seen him described as.Arguing with a pal about Rice.
He reckons Rice is way more than a holding player and is the nearest thing to Robson and Keane for years
I think he's a good player but that is a horrendous video. His weight of passing is shocking in that. The majority of passes are floated and the receiver needs to either stop their run or take it far too up on their chest to make a switch of play actually mean anything (as the defence can move towards the receiving player we the receive it)
I think he's quite similar to Keane stylistically too
Keane was a force of nature mentally and could control a game much better than Rice, though
I mean Keane was a lot better obviously, but stylistically I see the similarities
Midfield Harry Maguire 
I’m sure we dealing with more bitterness at this point and not actual thoughtful analysis on this transfer. It makes sense though, this is a United forum after all.
It’s been said above. Arteta has proven to the Arsenal fans that he is able to recruit for and build an effective football system. And his transfers in and out. have mostly been impactful and taken our team forward.
Hence the trust and calm, for the transfers in so far. There will be doubts of course, but there is also a good measure of confidence as well. Let’s see how it plays out this season.
I’m sure we dealing with more bitterness at this point and not actual thoughtful analysis on this transfer. It makes sense though, this is a United forum after all.
It’s been said above. Arteta has proven to the Arsenal fans that he is able to recruit for and build an effective football system. And his transfers in and out. have mostly been impactful and taken our team forward.
Hence the trust and calm, for the transfers in so far. There will be doubts of course, but there is also a good measure of confidence as well. Let’s see how it plays out this season.
You must have high standards if you think that's horrendous, that's all I'll say.
It's more accurate than him warrant that transfer fee Arsenal are paying. It's a significant overpay with the English tax included. Buying Rice means they won't be able to strengthen other positions and would IMO have negative impact on the team as a whole.Midfield Harry Maguire
I’m sure we dealing with more bitterness at this point and not actual thoughtful analysis on this transfer. It makes sense though, this is a United forum after all.
It’s been said above. Arteta has proven to the Arsenal fans that he is able to recruit for and build an effective football system. And his transfers in and out. have mostly been impactful and taken our team forward.
Hence the trust and calm, for the transfers in so far. There will be doubts of course, but there is also a good measure of confidence as well. Let’s see how it plays out this season.
This is just nonsense, to be honest. The narrative around Carrick is becoming more exaggerated by the year.
Carrick was a good player. At times, very good. At other times, he would struggle to impose himself.
Folk don’t like to hear it, but the reason the likes of Gerrard and Lampard were more highly rated has nothing to do with long shots and pashun; they were just much better players.
Rice is already asserting himself more in matches than Carrick ever did, and he is significantly better defensively. He isn’t as graceful, but he’s very secure in possession and comparisons aren’t unreasonable, especially when you factor in how much more Rice has to give in the coming years.
I don't get why a transfer fee would have negative impact on the team. Players can't control that and thats a one time thing. Salary is the thing that can cause issues but Saka will stay or highest paid player and maybe Odegaard with his new deal will be close to Saka so he won't be the highest paid player.
Rice is appreciated by managers & intelligence, Caicedo is more fans and teasing of their visionary sense through his unbalanced energy. Caicedo would be horrific in a pep team. Caicedo is this seasons ndombele or bissouma or ndidiMidfield Harry Maguire
I’m sure we dealing with more bitterness at this point and not actual thoughtful analysis on this transfer. It makes sense though, this is a United forum after all.
It’s been said above. Arteta has proven to the Arsenal fans that he is able to recruit for and build an effective football system. And his transfers in and out. have mostly been impactful and taken our team forward.
Hence the trust and calm, for the transfers in so far. There will be doubts of course, but there is also a good measure of confidence as well. Let’s see how it plays out this season.
Perhaps what they mean is that overpaying for Rice would limit our ability to also strengthen other positions?
Yes the fee is crazy but in case people haven't noticed, that is the market now. Inflation is real. Bellingham for £88mil. Tonali for £60mil. Seems any highly rated, relatively young player will go for at least £50mil, and that'd be a bargain. As someone who's been dreaming of Arsenal spending like this for the longest time, I really can't complain. I know it won't last, so am just relishing this. I can't wait to see who we sign next.
Yeah, Im glad you use IMO here, because its really an opinion.
Arsenal, like other teams and like businesses out there, will have done their financial planning months in advance. And have likely committed to a level of spending per transfer target. From the reported fee, to the nitty gritty like structure of the deal and bonuses, wages, extra costs involved, etc. That is why you have seen Arsenal, and other teams walk away from deals in the past, like Mudryk, like Martinez.
Yes, there may be a chance Arsenal lose out on other targets due to spending 105 on Rice. But I would say that is less likely because the financial parameters have already been budgeted for. Its more likely that other factors which cannot be planned for, are the reason Arsenal loses out on their targets.
105 big ones.Midfield Harry Maguire
I’m sure we dealing with more bitterness at this point and not actual thoughtful analysis on this transfer. It makes sense though, this is a United forum after all.
It’s been said above. Arteta has proven to the Arsenal fans that he is able to recruit for and build an effective football system. And his transfers in and out. have mostly been impactful and taken our team forward.
Hence the trust and calm, for the transfers in so far. There will be doubts of course, but there is also a good measure of confidence as well. Let’s see how it plays out this season.
Nah, that's a massive underrating of Carrick. He was a Rolls Royce at times, and played throughout our period where we for some reason just wouldn't buy other midfielders. Excellent at controlling tempo and incredible range of passing. He'd improve most sides in the PL currently (every side bar City, I'd say).
Something tells me that there maybe more to this coming up.
Something tells me you like Rice and that you are just really optimistic. He is gone. To Arsenal. And for that fee that is probably okay.
It isn’t, though. It’s a fair assessment based on his actual performances at the time.
At times, he was very good. At times, he didn’t impose himself enough. Both Gerrard and Lampard were better players and reducing their talent down to nonsense like pashun is totally out of kilter with reality.
There’s an understandable revisionism that concerns Carrick, primarily due to the way the game has moved on. I also don’t doubt that he would work very well in the kind of three man midfields that have been dominant under Klopp and Pep, but Carrick was always a tier below the very best, and certainly could have done more to impose himself when up against the best sides at the time.
Rice is 24 now, which is probably around the same age that Carrick got his move to United. At this point, Rice is already more accomplished than Carrick was at that stage. There’s an argument that he’s already more imposing, although doing that in the Champions League, right at the top level, remains to be seen.
I never said he was going to come to us - but this has gone quiet after agreeing the fee but not agreeing the pay structure.
Arsenal might not have the ability to pay the way West Ham want - paying 25 mil through 4 seasons severely makes them have literally no money to spend.
West Ham want 2x 50 mil transfer fees - which makes Arsenal’s transfer fee harder for this summer having spent 65 million on Havertz alone.
They want to buy Timber & a potential replacement for Partey too and possibly more some new additions - which makes sense why there pushing for 25mil per season route.
Keane said that at one point tooArguing with a pal about Rice.
He reckons Rice is way more than a holding player and is the nearest thing to Robson and Keane for years
Rice is a good player with a lot of potential to tap into. He’s got more in his locker than has been used. Let’s see if Arteta can unlock him
You are not in the real world, Carrick would walk into any team in the PL currently.
Carrick has to go in that world class league of players that SAF managed (which I thought he was) - people can’t call him a level below world class at certain times and then talk him up to be good enough to play in any team of the league either.
You just under rate Carrick. I have no issue with Gerrard and Lampard being better, but Carrick did impose himself in games, he just played a very different game to them
Carrick won league titles playing with Anderson, 40 year old Giggs and Tom bloody Cleverley in midfield.
He had a crap CL final playing with a broken toe and an underwhelming 12 months or so that followed due to confidence issue that was held against him ever since. Lampard and Gerrard were attackers playing in midfield, just look at the abject failure of the latter in particular when he was moved back as he got older, or their adventures for England during the Golden Gen era. Carrick was better at doing midfielder stuffs than they ever did but those don’t make headlines as goals and assists. If they were so much better, how come their teams consistently lost out to ours in the time all 3were competing for the league title, even after we lost our best player?
Rice isn’t fit to lace his boots when it comes to moving a football. He imposes himself in games so much that his team got 30% possession against the what, 7th place team in Serie A? 8th? The narrative surrounding him is exactly the same as that for Maguire or Grealish, decent players for midtable teams that got smoke blown up their ass because they stood out in a sea of shite.
I don’t think he’s a 100m player but then again the goalposts are shifting - partly due to our ridiculous spending on Antony, Maguire and the likes. I think we just have to get used to a new normal of average cost, and try to not hold it against the players.
Most of us probably think a 100m should be reserved for the like of Haaland and Mbappe, but that’s just not the reality anymore. There’s too much money in the game, and smaller clubs can now demand what they like. As a result, it’s even more important to have a manager who can get a team to be more than the sum of the parts.
Most of us probably think a 100m should be reserved for the like of Haaland and Mbappe, but that’s just not the reality anymore. There’s too much money in the game, and smaller clubs can now demand what they like. As a result, it’s even more important to have a manager who can get a team to be more than the sum of the parts.
Excellent signing for Arsenal, they are already great going forward, what they needed was more defensive steal and he will bring this
Is it just me or has there been a massive influx of Arse fans over the last 6 months or so?
It always happens when a team starts doing well.
Arsenal are looking strong for the coming season. I can see them in and around the top places again.
Yeah as I said it’s what I reckon out of that deal and what you might need in the season that ensues.
make no mistake you have planned both Havertz and Rice deal, hence you pretty much done your work early, but neither of those signings doesn’t strike me of improvement of what you most likely have to build on.
Rice is not in the elite tier of midfielders and you are grossly overpaying there. IMO we are also for Mount so it’s not being bitter or something I don’t want Rice either for the sum in question. You badly need quality CF, and a first team CB, neither is addressed so far and pretty much you already blown the whole budget.
historically you also don’t do all too well with the big money players coming in usually one is a good one other a miss and both Havertz and Rice IMO would be underwhelming ones all things considered
When did I say otherwise?
At times, Carrick was very good. For the third time.
When have we heard that before? Chelsea were favorites under Tuchel and then it went to shite. Too many times we have seen teams doing very well one season only for it to go to heck the following one.
Arsenal will be expected to contend on all fronts this season and will have CL to focus on as well (unlike EL they won't have the luxury of playing a second tier team).
They benefited a lot from having 1 match/week for most of the second half of the season compared to someone like us or even City who had a packed schedule. Let's see how they handle that kind of schedule with their squad unless they decide to not focus on any other competition again.
Are you taking the piss here, or will I need to state the obvious factor in that?
Lampard and Gerrard were midfielders by the way. Both of them better than Carrick. Better than Rice too, if that makes you feel any better
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