Then they shouldn't go about saying, oh we saw stuff so we think he's innocent. People aren't going to just believe that on the whim of the club because of the Pictures and Audio that are out in the open. That's why this situation was a damned if you do damned if you don't for the club. I agree with the outcome but I don't agree with how the club has dealt with it.
Mason Greenwood | Please be respectful and stay on topic
- Thread starter keithsingleton
- Start date
Kudus or Bergwijn?
Because unless the alleged victim confirms that they weren't playing, you can't really do much with it.
I hope ETH charges into Arnold's office like a raging bull.
Mob rule is virtuous and pure. Have you not heard?
Come on man, get that shit out of here. The girl has a right for and reportedly asked for anonymity. I'm also trying to browse redcafe without seeing pictures of seemingly battered women, all because you're trying to win an online argument.
Mods please help
Here lies the problem, evidence should NEVER be made public until a full criminal investigation has concluded the full facts. Until it is made a criminal offense to do so, situations like this Will continue to arise.
Yeh I don't blame you. I can't believe what I'm reading from some on here.
Yes he did.
He breached his bail.
He also got himself into this situation somehow.
I am not denying that.
The club are saying based on their investigation he did not:
1. Commit attempted rape
2. Commit assault
3. Commit cohesive or controlling behavior.
That is the statement of the club, whether you want to say the club is lying or not, that is what they have said.
I admit I didn't reply to those parts because I didn't have much to say about them. I'm not going to make excuses for people on twitter. Or maybe I didn't understand.
In any case, I'm sure there are fans who are more interested in football tribalism than anything else, but there are more than enough people in this and the thread in the general who have given reasonable motivations why they didn't want Greenwood at United anymore. I felt like you were being dismissive of those voices, even if that might not have been your intention.
Because you match it up with the audio and you have a picture of what was going on.
If Greenwood is the new Depp, then why did he go running back to her if he knew the allegations were BS? Would you go back to a girl who was falsely accusing you and creating fake images?
He should have let it go to court if he was innocent. You centently dont go back to the girl that makes false allegations against you. You only do that because you know you were in the wrong, at least partly and you want to create the impression that all has been smoothed over, because you have a shit ton to lose.
What utter tripe.
It means the police like nothing better than charging a public figure with something and then take ages to conclude the investigation in an attempt to save face for wasting police time and public money in the first place. I would argue that the whole incident could have been cleared up with 3-4 weeks by talking to all parties involved. Its not like they spent all that time actually investagting the whole thing. The police force is in a bigger mess than Man Utd. I think UTD have made a big mistake showing this kid the door. But thats public opinion for you - you'll all be distracted by something else soon and this lad is on the scrapheap.
Well done to all concerned.
It wasn't just one witness. It was the only witness. There's no way the CPS could get a conviction in this case without the one and only witness being willing to continue with the case. So they dropped it.
Anyway, I think the point he is making is more about how the language being used in the statements is quite open ended which could lead to it being interpreted differently in the future.
I imagine it will be a loan. They left it quite ambiguously. Hell for all we know they could come out on September 1st and say no one wanted him so he's here now.
Well imagine, I only pointed out what we don't know yet you think you know all you need to know. I for sure know now, how you got to 25k posts.
But lets not argue, have a nice evening.
Great point. I think MG will have to come out and do an in depth interview with new evidence if he wants a shot at clearing his name publically. He may not care though if he's at peace with himself.
They were brining him back up until last week.
This. There are a lot of people who are using this to signal their virtue or sublimate (understandable) anger with their lives at a time of ongoing crises and living standards issues and anxieties and the rest into a convenient scapegoat. I mean, we're all channelling stuff in different ways, and part of supporting a team is catharsis for that . But this isn't chanting about other teams being shite or questioning the board - it's trifling with branding someone a violent sexual offender against his partner and mother of his child and doing it in a public forum and impacting his career, at least in the aggregate. A healthier way to deal with this stuff (beyond doing whatever small-scale or big, political change, which is obviously replete with its own issues and frustrations these days ) would be to direct it at getting the Glazers out....
EDIT: That doesn't mean the club aren't self-interested, or that the initial evidence wasn't shocking, or even that there isn't a chance he might be guilty or at least one of the accusations. But people simply don't have any formal justification, when it comes to being able to rely upon evidence relating to an incident they never witnessed or heard (except through what everyone involved in passing judgement agrees, based on further evidence -and not just retractions, we know this from the statements - were unreliable images and sounds), to make claims about his guilt and therefore how any institution should react to it. People can come up with varieties of 'yeah, but he did' or 'did you see the evidence' or 'common sense'. But it doesn't change anything. It's our collective ignorance, which some of us admit to and act on the basis of, vs the judgement ( by those privy to more facts) that he couldn't be deemed guilty...
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Yes, I'm sure the victim and child are just beaming with joy today. We saved her!!!
Hopefully we will also put to bed the Qatar bid and possibly highlight their record when it comes to rights for women.
Every cloud has a silver lining!
Every cloud has a silver lining!
How do you know what constituted their investigation? I'm sure he had to take all factors into consideration, seeing as there is a legal aspect to this. He most certainly would have been privy to what the police had. Plus the police said they also had new evidence which neither the club nor the police seem willing to make public. So it's not straightforward. Let's stop dragging our club for a minute.
The CPS also said key new information that wasn’t made public
I can see why the club have done what they have done - but he will be getting a massive pay off. This wouldn’t stand up in any other company in the UK
I said initially that he has been branded a rapist, but you disagreed when I said there isn't evidence for rape. It's possible he did try and attempt to but I don't think the audio is enough without hearing the full thing.
Let the Crown transfer all cases into the hands of social media warriors and the decking Manchester United Investigative Agency. Why have due process at all if at end no matter what, the mob decides the verdict.
Regardless of what your opinion is it was just so badly handled. They spent 6 months doing what they could have done before last season finished even.
He'll easily get a decent club.
He'll easily get a decent club.
Not surprising given modern day cancel culture. Might as well take down statues of George Best as well. He would have been doomed in today's game.
That is fair.
But when people are out here saying the images are fake, that is equally offensive.
If polls are the measure, then I hope you're equally as pleased if the Qataris end up purchasing this club.
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thank you
I’d say the CPS acknowledging there was practically no chance of conviction after a 12 month investigation is pretty good evidence that there is clearly more to this than we’ll ever know.
I don’t know why random internet warriors think they know better though - that seems even more backwards to me.
That logic works both ways - why go back to a man who has committed a tenuous crime. Not that I subscribe to such logic. For me he’s far more likely to be an absolute scumbag than not being an absolute scumbag. What annoys me is the way the club has handled this and come to their conclusion. Arnold’s statement is even more laughable. He actually says that we had planned for his integration (makes sense given he apparently concluded Mason didn’t commit any heinous acts etc) and then changed our minds. Basically admitting that he’s reacting to the pressure. We’ve replaced Woodward with another weapon. These clowns aren’t going to guide us to any successes with their ineptitude.
If the public doesn't need to be informed then why does Greenwood even bother to make a public statement saying he did not do the things he was charged with?
What a severely disappointing end to the coolest and biggest positive we've had in years. It's the hope that gets us, but this one hurts.
Just… why…?
What is it with ‘****’ that people - mainly right wing people - are so unbelievably obsessed with…?
Greenwood is literally leaving Utd because a recording emerged that appears to show him trying to force sex on his girlfriend…
We’re reacting as a fanbase to losing our greatest academy talent for decades and also hoping that the family recovers and goes on to raise their little baby well.
And somehow, some way, it arrives at asking - ‘what if he’s a ****?’.
Just… how?
£75k per week for 80 weeks = £6m
For context, the average yearly salary is £30k per annum, let's be generous and triple it to £90k.
Would still take you 66 years to earn that and he's now going to play football elsewhere for similar amount.
"Scrapheap"
They can't. What if it exposes the victim?
Who cares if he does or doesn’t, it won’t be at Utd and that is all that matters.
This is completely wrong. You can have an opinion on something, but unless you know the facts or spoken directly with the people involved or the one investigating the matter who has the facts, you should not have the power to ruin somebodys life because of it. Here are the facts as detailed in the investigation by the club:
• The alleged victim requested the police to drop their investigation in April 2022.
• We were provided with alternative explanations for the audio recording, which was a short excerpt from a much longer recording, and for the images posted online.
• The alleged victim's family participated in the process and were given the opportunity to review and correct our factual findings.
So both the police and club have cleared him of any wrong doing, the victim continued a romantic relationship and had a child with him, so why is he being let go?
• The alleged victim requested the police to drop their investigation in April 2022.
• We were provided with alternative explanations for the audio recording, which was a short excerpt from a much longer recording, and for the images posted online.
• The alleged victim's family participated in the process and were given the opportunity to review and correct our factual findings.
So both the police and club have cleared him of any wrong doing, the victim continued a romantic relationship and had a child with him, so why is he being let go?