The Corinthian
I will not take Mad Winger's name in vain
- Joined
- Dec 10, 2020
- Messages
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- Supports
- A Free Palestine
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Do the Palestinian people have the right to self-determination, also adopted.Tweet
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I don't seem to recall any calls for an immediate ceasefire. Only westerners being murdered is sufficient for that.Just to point out that the tide began turning with the proposed attack on Rafah.
Obviously our PR is limited because, well, you just can't really explain to the world what Israel's has been doing for months (and years and decades, really).Thanks for your info.
I am an outsider, was even slightly pro Israel before 7 Oct given that Israel feels more "civilized", but feel that Israel is not doing itself any favor. The world was with your country on 7 Oct and it is amazing that your country can vapourize people's sympathy that quickly, and I see your country's PR department just keep repeating the "look how bad these Hamas terrorists are!" cliche. It is even more amazing that Israeli feel perplexed by USA's reaction to Israel's cruelty while indeed the USA has been very lenient to Israel (US's bombing of Yugoslavia is a good reference).
You trying to bring rationality into an inrrational situation, and to irrational and indoctrinated people (as @ScholesyTheWise wrote).Chances are they or a similar group will grow stronger than ever because of Israels brutality. There is a good chance that other grouos outside of Gaza that are anti-Israel will also grow in ranks.
Surprising to see Belgium, Luxemburg and Finland voted with the “anti-semitic global south”… Particularly Finland i thought their right wing government would be even more pro-Israel.Tweet
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What's a westerner? There were countries in the west calling for ceasefires at that point.I don't seem to recall any calls for an immediate ceasefire. Only westerners being murdered is sufficient for that.
You know well what a westerner is, don't waste my time with a question like that.What's a westerner? There were countries in the west calling for ceasefires at that point.
The US and UK said that the Rafah offensive was a red line. Why do you suppose that is?
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/2...li-colonialism-and-indigenous-repression/amp/What’s Paraguays issue with Palestine?
Thanks for this post. It confirms what I personally understood and gathered.There is no real PR department, at least not a functioning one.
to add to the post that Amir has written which I agree with,
one has to understand that it's a slow process that's built gradually over the years.
even since you're in kindergarten you are taught about the heroic actions of the fallen soldiers over the years.
and then you get to to 9th grade, highschool... and you want to get into the best units of the IDF, the combative ones. it's a status symbol,
and it fills young people and their parents with real pride.
You are there to make sure that the enemy doesn't hurt you. if your enemy is seen as a human being, then you have a problem.
so he has to remain a figure, A Palestinian. no name, no identity.
I grew up in a secular, liberal, anti-religion home. parents voting for left leaning parties etc.
Still, no one hardly ever said anything to me about people living in the WB or Gaza. they're just there, and they don't like us, and we don't like them.
the proposition of peace for the 1990s is dead and buried. They don't want us here, never have, never will. this is probably what's being repeated in many many homes in Israel in the ears of children, to various degrees of extremisms. My parents never said anything like that to me, but I still picked it up from the general atmosphere, from how the media here portrait the world, from Memorial Days...
So all in all, people from the non-religious public in Israel grow up to be rather indifferent about the suffering of people on the other side of the border. so long as they don't throw missiles at us and not bother us, then fine. it's a shame that they're even there but what can you do, this is the Middle East after all...
And when they do throw missiles at us, we will feck them up ten folds with our planes and drones, and they will stay put for another 20 years...
I don't think I ever met a single person from "my population group" who wished for tens of thousands of Gazans to die. people just wished for them to keep living in that open air prison and die anyway, but "not by our hands".
The shift in the Israeli society since October is that many more people will say that bluntly - "I don't give a single feck about anyone over there, that's their undoing. They made it very clear that we have no choice but to act the way we do".
I think that people are just starting to lose their minds really.
Thanks. Expected something like this and the embassy stuff does ring a bell.https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/2...li-colonialism-and-indigenous-repression/amp/
Whole article is worth a read. But standard settler colonial solidarity.
Game recognizes game.https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/2...li-colonialism-and-indigenous-repression/amp/
Whole article is worth a read. But standard settler colonial solidarity.
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Aside from Algeria, there hasn't been a single Arab country on the Palestinians side. Spineless cowards and sell-outs.Tweet
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I think the UAE have been concerned since November at least… they even worked with China on a resolution at the UNSC back then, vetoed by America… They also joint fellow Arab and Muslim countries in supporting South Africa’s genocide case…. But this is the first they are authorised by America to suspend their diplomatic coordination with Israel.Tweet
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What exactly has Algeria done, what more than Lebanon for example?Aside from Algeria, there hasn't been a single Arab country on the Palestinians side. Spineless cowards and sell-outs.
They've used their seat on the UNSC to push for a ceasefire resolution continuously. I get that they're the only Arab state on the SC but it's good that they've been leading from the front in that regard. And Algeria is one of the only Arab states to not normalise relations with Israel when all of their Arab neighbours have.What exactly has Algeria done, what more than Lebanon for example?
100%.Aside from Algeria, there hasn't been a single Arab country on the Palestinians side. Spineless cowards and sell-outs.
I'm not sure I'm a big fan of calling countries with zero power in this "spineless cowards". The middle east has been destroyed by the US and it's allies, most of these countries do as they're told or they'll face repercussions.Aside from Algeria, there hasn't been a single Arab country on the Palestinians side. Spineless cowards and sell-outs.
Your opinion only makes sense if westerners only includes half of the Anglosphere.You know well what a westerner is, don't waste my time with a question like that.
The US have had a million (not literally) red lines since Oct 7, what makes you think this one was for real? The UK just waits for whatever the yanks tell them to do.
Cease-fire resolution? Beyond the so-called Arab solidarity which never materialized in any meaningful way and because of its own struggle to gain its independence, Algeria has a long standing relationship and solidarity with Palestine, even if their support sadly doesn't amount to anything relevant. Algeria's still conditioning to this day the recognition of Israel as a state to Palestine's and it never budged from this line since 1962 (date of Algeria's independence).What exactly has Algeria done, what more than Lebanon for example?
Even if I excluded Iraq and Syria which were indeed deliberately wiped out off the geopolitical map or Jordan which never amounted to much anyway, the rest still absolutely is, especially the ones in the region.I'm not sure I'm a big fan of calling countries with zero power in this "spineless cowards". The middle east has been destroyed by the US and it's allies, most of these countries do as they're told or they'll face repercussions.
Name one western country that has officially called for an immediate ceasefire previous to the western aid workers being killed. Sure there are outlets like Novara and other small left wing outlets calling out Israel's many war crimes from the start but nothing from the main stream and nothing from any government I know of.Your opinion only makes sense if westerners only includes half of the Anglosphere.
I won't take up anymore of your obviously precious time..
You seem to have a better understanding of the power dynamics there so I'll take your point. I would however point out that the destruction and destabilisation of the most powerful nations in the region for crossing the US is probably enough of a deterrent for the rest of them. You missed out Libya by the way.Cease-fire resolution? Beyond the so-called Arab solidarity which never materialized in any meaningful way and because of its own struggle to gain its independence, Algeria has a long standing relationship and solidarity with Palestine, even if their support sadly doesn't amount to anything relevant. Algeria's still conditioning to this day the recognition of Israel as a state to Palestine's and it never budged from this line since 1962 (date of Algeria's independence).
Even I exclude Iraq and Syria which were indeed deliberately wiped out off the geopolitical map or Jordan which never amounted to much anyway, the rest still absolutely is, especially the ones in the region.
They have more than enough leverage to at least push a bit in favor of the Palestinians and they deliberately don't use it. The most powerful of them are the backbone of the OPEC. In 1973 they weaponized oil (reducing production whilst augmenting the barrel prize) wrecking political and economic havoc on the West. They'd be even more powerful now, if they decided to present a unified front. But they don't, they don't want to.
The Arabdictatorsleaders have no interest in Palestine seeing the light of the day, or a movement like Hamas achieving any kind of "victory", because they fear the domestic repercussions which could lead to them being overthrown.
They are vile, spineless cowards, shameless sell-outs and the embodiment of fecal matter. Every single one of them.
I agree on the whole, but I don't think that's entirely true.Aside from Algeria, there hasn't been a single Arab country on the Palestinians side. Spineless cowards and sell-outs.
That's always been the plan. Bribe the ones you can, destroy the ones you can't. Iran is the last man standing in the game and the next target on the list.You seem to have a better understanding of the power dynamics there so I'll take your point. I would however point out that the destruction and destabilisation of the most powerful nations in the region for crossing the US is probably enough of a deterrent for the rest of them. You missed out Libya by the way.
Israel is the West's/US's ONLY real friend in the middle -east region. Subsequently there has been since 1948 a clear 'life -line' extended to Israel from the US and from the most of Europe. Therefore short of dragging everyone into WW3, Israel knows the West and the US has its back.Plenty of Israelis think that supporting us is only valid if it's total - no matter what we do, no questions asked. It's totally simplistic and silly, but that's the way it is.
I wouldn't want to waste your time arguing about pauses Vs ceasefires but maybe Google the question 'which countries voted for a ceasefire UN' and gaze at the list of your western oppressors when you have a momentName one western country that has officially called for an immediate ceasefire previous to the western aid workers being killed. Sure there are outlets like Novara and other small left wing outlets calling out Israel's many war crimes from the start but nothing from the main stream and nothing from any government I know of.
Is Albania a Zionist state? Why cant they vote yes for the right of the Palestanians for self determination.Do the Palestinian people have the right to self-determination, also adopted.Tweet
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The US continuing to embarrass themselves on the world stage.
Iraq and Yemen.Aside from Algeria, there hasn't been a single Arab country on the Palestinians side. Spineless cowards and sell-outs.
as an outsider from asia, I found that many irish have some obsession to be "anti-west" in international politics. Can someone explain to me why is that? Because of their historical relationship with the UK?I wouldn't want to waste your time arguing about pauses Vs ceasefires but maybe Google the question 'which countries voted for a ceasefire UN' and gaze at the list of your western oppressors when you have a moment
https://www.jta.org/2023/10/25/glob...israel-country-will-the-hamas-war-change-thatIs Albania a Zionist state? Why cant they vote yes for the right of the Palestanians for self determination.
Also I think Albania have recognised the State of Palestine, unlike most of Europe. So this is a fairly complicated position they seem to adoptIs Albania a Zionist state? Why cant they vote yes for the right of the Palestanians for self determination.
Yes that's one way to put it. Obviously a lot of countries in Western Europe and North America were imperialist, or have colonial roots, or in recent history, and some have that mindset to this day (and seemingly have no urge to stop).as an outsider from asia, I found that many irish have some obsession to be "anti-west" in international politics. Can someone explain to me why is that? Because of their historical relationship with the UK?
I'm not arguing against the Arab streets, no matter which country. They are overwhelmingly in favor of Palestine and seething at what's currently unfolding, but they have no voice in what their "governments" do.I agree on the whole, but I don't think that's entirely true.
Yemen is the obvious one, and Qatar perhaps more discretely. Syria and Iraq are also both vocal supporters of the Palestinian cause, though neither have any real power or leverage to do anything of note, and not to mention they have their own domestic turmoils to try and tame. Likewise with Lebanon (not counting Hezbollah's involvement in recent skirmishes, but they're more of an Iranian proxy despite being Lebanese Arabs).
The remaining gulf states are all spineless, particularly those shamefully wanting to normalise relations with Israel. Jordan and Egypt only care about the local ramifications to their borders, but otherwise have made peace with Israel and offer nothing besides crocodile tears and lip service to appease their respective populations who feel furious with how events have unfolded.
No.Iraq and Yemen.
They are not anti-West (the irony). They just experienced what the Palestinians do and know better.as an outsider from asia, I found that many irish have some obsession to be "anti-west" in international politics. Can someone explain to me why is that? Because of their historical relationship with the UK?
Well, They control half the country with its most important cities and the "Official government" is in Saudi Arabia and to be honest are the ones that support (wrongly) the most as they directly attacking the interests of who is supporting Israel, us.Houthis are not Yemen's official leading entity
Interesting!Also I think Albania have recognised the State of Palestine, unlike most of Europe. So this is a fairly complicated position they seem to adopt
The only thing I'd disagree with here is that the UAE is asshole number 2 in the region after SA (and to be honest you could make a hearty case for them being number 1). I don't see Qatar at all in that same way.I'm not arguing against the Arab streets, no matter which country. They are overwhelmingly in favor of Palestine and seething at what's currently unfolding, but they have no voice in what their "governments" do.
As far as I know, the Houthis are not Yemen's official leading entity, that's why I left them out. The Houthis do their thing, but hardly enough to make any significant difference, and it's not a slight on them.
From what I understand, Qatar has a "Switzerland" policy since the country is too small to ever be a military power and constantly in SA's crosshair. It plays it to its strengths, but still is Asshole Nr. 2, the leading role belonging to MBS' Saudi Arabia and its medieval, barbaric regime.
Lebanon, as a country, has been effectively taken out of the game since the Israeli intervention in 1982. Hezbollah is basically is a state within a state, playing its game whilst ensuring that Lebanon doesn't implode because of its own agenda. It's a (mild) deterrent factor for Israel, but not influential or powerful enough to take the initiative.
Thanks to the US incredibly generous and selfless initiative for democracy and freedom at gunpoint, Iraq and Syria are currently failed states and will stay this way for the coming decades. Nothing can be expected from them, and the few missiles or attacks on US military bases are nothing more than a peeble in a shoe. The potential attacks could play their part in a US election year, mind.
Jordan and Egypt have been bought since 1973. They all depend on the US and Israeli money for their regime's own survival. Their autocrats could play a significant role if they went past their own interests, but they will not. In short, sell-outs.