Not at all. I've already illustrated explained how I haven't moved any goalposts, nor asked anyone to prove anything, nor made any contradictory statements.While being spot on.
If you disagree then tell me why.
Berbatov
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If you disagree then tell me why.
Spurs will in my opinion, finish in the top 10, pushing top 6. They will not make top 4, and liverpool and Chelsea have no width and our wingers will have a field day especially against Chelsea. liverpool, surprisingly, do not grind out wins without Gerrard and Torres, funny that.
United now have a central striker again, two if you count Manucho, and we can now see the best of Rooney and Tevez. Ronaldo will float around the pitch, (and his ego is too big to not try and end up losing, no-ones mentioned that), doing what he does best.
In my opinion i think that liverpool will do well to get fourth, if they lose Gerrard and Torres, who can replace them? Gerrard replaced by Alonso, not the same goal threat and drive. Torres with Ngog? Unknown quantity so can't say. Without either one of those two out liverpool look terribly weakened.
Ronaldo out, Rooney, tevez, berbatov are there, and vice versa. United's squad depth in attacking areas is our greatest asset and one that is the envy of most other clubs in europe.
Back to tottenham, good luck to Spurs, i have nothing against them, just levy.
United now have a central striker again, two if you count Manucho, and we can now see the best of Rooney and Tevez. Ronaldo will float around the pitch, (and his ego is too big to not try and end up losing, no-ones mentioned that), doing what he does best.
In my opinion i think that liverpool will do well to get fourth, if they lose Gerrard and Torres, who can replace them? Gerrard replaced by Alonso, not the same goal threat and drive. Torres with Ngog? Unknown quantity so can't say. Without either one of those two out liverpool look terribly weakened.
Ronaldo out, Rooney, tevez, berbatov are there, and vice versa. United's squad depth in attacking areas is our greatest asset and one that is the envy of most other clubs in europe.
Back to tottenham, good luck to Spurs, i have nothing against them, just levy.
Oh, so most CAFTards have 'reasonable thoughts' when it comes to Liverpool do they? That's news to me from what I've read on here.
I couldn't give a flying feck for your opinion of me and your childish insult.
You've agreed that United have a better squad and better manager than Liverpool.
You have also said that the most likely outcome this season is that Liverpool will finish ahead of United in the league.
To everyone on God's green earth - apart from you, it seems - these statements are completely contradictory.
I look at the salaries being paid, the 'big names' and egos involved and wonder how well Rooney (for example) will react to being benched in favour of Berbatov and Tevez up front.
Then there is Ronaldo and his RM frustrations.
It's all a reasonable factor to consider.
Have you not seen Tevez and Rooney's attitude. They'll react brilliantly. Berbatov will know his place in the team too.
Ronaldo is focused on being the best, and continuously bettering himself to keep himself at the top. It's what makes him unique.
I truly expect Spurs to fight relegation this season. Just because I think that all other team will want it more. Having better teams does not equal being better on the pitch, as Spurs have already proven this season.
Not at all, because there other factors involved besides who has the better squad and manager, not least the question of who will have the better squad cohesion/team spirit and the fact that a collection of better players does not always equate to having a better team in terms of on-the-pitch effectiveness and performances delivered.
Besides the squad/manager gap is not as wide as fondly believed on here.
Well, I guess we'll see won't we.
Pogue did that for me already. You are on a WUM mission here. Clearly.
I sometimes wonder if you bother to take any notice of what happens at United. Really, your post here displays a fair amount of naivety.
Have you seen, for example, how Rio Ferdinand has matured over recent seasons? I'd say that Rooney and Ronaldo have both improved their attitude immeasurably over the last 3 seasons. Ferguson's ability to bring about these changes is often overlooked imo.
I'd say that egos getting put out of joint is a far more likely scenario at Liverpool actually, with Benitez's rotation.
In other words, you've got some insider info saying that Liverpool's got great team spirit all of a sudden. And United whose team spirit is known all across the world just took a deep dip?
Greater team spirit is the only factor that takes Liverpool to second place this year? You should be a BBC pundit.
That might just be the beginning of a vaguely convincing (but ultimately incorrect) argument, if you weren't talking about the exact same squad of players that won the double last season, with the addition of just one new player, someone who is widely regarded as one of the best players in the league and exactly what was missing from our squad last season.
The size of the gap is meaningless. So long as there is any gap at all, it remains the most likely scenario that the team with the better squad/manager will finish ahead of the team with the worse squad/manager.
I mean, that's obvious, surely?
You big lovable spastic, you
Last season United had the better team spirit than Liverpool . That wont change this season. United had a better squad then Liverpool last season. Now it is even better. Last season Liverpool couldn't even get past Arsenal in 3rd place. Yet by some miracle you want us to believe your really they will leap into 2nd place above us. Or your hated rivals Arsenal?
Puhlease!
'Fondly believed'... FFS. Stop playing the 'biased United fans' card here. You made a shit point, you've been corrected, and playing that one smacks of pathetic desperation.
Questioning United's 'squad cohesion/team spirit', especially while SAF remains at the helm, is just fecking retarded.
Seriously, give up. Your argument is just a waste of time - it makes no sense whatsoever and makes it seem like you have the intellectual capacity of a plank of wood.
Old stepping stone is just bitter.
I think Spurs are still in development and will finish in the same place they did last season. Next year they will get the chance to replace Berbs and Keane and also buy a good dm.
Sacking Jol was a really bad mistake imo.
Sacking Jol was a really bad mistake imo.
Pogue simply made incorrect statements and I've already shown why.
If your definition of a WUM here is anyone who argues the case for Liverpool finishing 2nd then so be it.
We will?
I can't take the suspense.
Im not sure why this is an issue, its clearly just bitterness mixed with a bit of wummery.
Dont blame him really I would be the same if I was a Spurs fan right now. Whether I would carry it out on a United forum is a different manner.
I think their team spirit will be stronger than yours this season - you disagree. Fine.
And I haven't said that team spirit will be the only factor, far from it.
When they argue the case as badly as you do, I'd say the hat fits, so wear it.
I mean, conceding that United have a better squad and better manager kind of killed the debate before it even started.
At least it should have, if you weren't so unbelievably pig-headed.
So what's the main factor of this sudden demise for you then?
My definition of a WUM is someone who agrees United have a far better squad and manager than Liverpool, but insists Liverpool will finish ahead of us, while writing off his team's hated rivals Arsenal, who Liverpool couldn't get past last year. Something he doesn't really believe himself. I hope this helps
By the way, it's fecking cavernous...
I suggest we revisit your comments as the season unfolds. The proof will be in the pudding for both points of view.Last season United had the better team spirit than Liverpool . That wont change this season. United had a better squad then Liverpool last season. Now it is even better. Last season Liverpool couldn't even get past Arsenal in 3rd place. Yet by some miracle you want us to believe your really they will leap into 2nd place above us. Or your hated rivals Arsenal?
Puhlease!
Well here it is for the completists...Ach, you should have left the white text in, so people don't think I'm a complete psycho
Not really. I'm a pacifist and I love you really. Honest.
I'd have had to do a highlight as to which section my post addressed though & couldn't be arsed if I'm honest.
I haven't agreed you have a far better squad and manager - just better overall and not by as much as MUFC fans like to think.
And thanks, but I can decide for myself what I "really believe".
Was only joshing really.Well here it is for the completists...
Not really. I'm a pacifist and I love you really. Honest.
I'd have had to do a highlight as to which section my post addressed though & couldn't be arsed if I'm honest.
Besides, the longer this "debate" goes on, the more the thought of actual violence appeals
Glaston, i feel embarrassed for you, mate...
shoulda quite before you got too deep in arrears.
shoulda quite before you got too deep in arrears.
Was only joshing really.
Besides, the longer this "debate" goes on, the more the thought of actual violence appeals
Another similarity!
Several things have changed on the team spirit/cohesion front. Not least:
Last season Ronaldo wasn't forced to stay despite his desire to leave for RM.
Last season you didn't have Tevez or Rooney (or now Berbatov) faced with the prospect of regular bench time.
I've already said that a collection of better players doesn't necessarily translate into a better team on the pitch, and nor is it the only factor. You take the view that it's 'likely' your team will finish above Liverpool. I don't. We'll just have to agree to disagree and see how events unfold.
Oh we can do that alright. Looks like we're gonna have to.
Which, funnily enough, remind me of the conclusion of an almost identical discussion you got locked into around this time last season.
And, quite probably, the season before that.
Sadly, it seems you've learned very little from the experience.
Ah, Glaston has returned, how lovely, and he's as logical as ever.
So are you still confident that dos Santos will show to be a better player than Rosicky within 5 months, now that you've actually seen him play?
So are you still confident that dos Santos will show to be a better player than Rosicky within 5 months, now that you've actually seen him play?
Spurs will be battling relegation with the likes of Hull and Stoke this season. I am sure of it.
Bent will not be happy facing regulation bench time while Palyuchenko starts every game.
Frazier Campbell will still be pissed with his forced loan to spurs and not putting in his best every game, as he dreams of returning to Man Utd.
Dos Santos will be get lumps kicked out of him before he started crying foul and feck off back to spain.
Modric - see dos santos. replace spain with any other country you like.
Bentley will be boo-ed every home match if he play indifferently due to his arsenal connections.
Thus, I am convinced spurs will be relegated. Fact.
Bent will not be happy facing regulation bench time while Palyuchenko starts every game.
Frazier Campbell will still be pissed with his forced loan to spurs and not putting in his best every game, as he dreams of returning to Man Utd.
Dos Santos will be get lumps kicked out of him before he started crying foul and feck off back to spain.
Modric - see dos santos. replace spain with any other country you like.
Bentley will be boo-ed every home match if he play indifferently due to his arsenal connections.
Thus, I am convinced spurs will be relegated. Fact.
Glason>>>> Where"s Your Berba Gone??
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Good Point
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