Jadon Sancho

He would be great as a False 9 IMO because I dont rate him at all out wide.

He messed up that chance with Ten Hag due to bad mentality although I do believe him saying Ten Hag has his favourites through Antony over Amad and the little chances Bayndir has gotten.

Rashford/Garnacho- Sancho -Amad/Gw**d/Antony

Is still something I'm open minded about.

I also thought he had 2 good games as a RW in the PL because he had to make quicker decisions in how to release the ball.

I personally have never rated him even at Dortmund but I still think he has a future here because of his wages and a new manager coming in.

Fortitude said:

Sounds like Sancho had a good game tonight, and from the short compilation, played like we never saw here.

Click to expand...

I watched it. He made a real difference for 15 minutes or so when he came on because his touch is so good that it allowed Dortmund to keep the ball, coupled with Atletico sitting deeper with a 2 goal lead.

But then he basically faded from the game, partly because he played on the right for some of it and looked out of ideas there.

Bynoe-Gittens came on and looked much more likely to beat a man.

So, typical Sancho sort of thing. Better touch than any other wide man out there, the rest of it profoundly troubling.

A side note, Adeyemi did not look like he belonged at this level.

NoPace said:

I watched it. He made a real difference for 15 minutes or so when he came on because his touch is so good that it allowed Dortmund to keep the ball, coupled with Atletico sitting deeper with a 2 goal lead.

But then he basically faded from the game, partly because he played on the right for some of it and looked out of ideas there.

Bynoe-Gittens came on and looked much more likely to beat a man.

So, typical Sancho sort of thing. Better touch than any other wide man out there, the rest of it profoundly troubling.

A side note, Adeyemi did not look like he belonged at this level.

Click to expand...

Yeah there's no doubt he's a brilliant technician. Just has 0 application off the ball and isn't explosive enough on it to make up for that. So you just get this silky, passenger of a player that doesn't really look to make a difference either way unless he can tiki taka his way around the box.

Valencia Shin Crosses said:

Yeah there's no doubt he's a brilliant technician. Just has 0 application off the ball and isn't explosive enough on it to make up for that. So you just get this silky, passenger of a player that doesn't really look to make a difference either way unless he can tiki taka his way around the box.

Click to expand...

You could see him fitting in okay with a truly elite attacking fullback behind him like he had in Hakimi I guess, or a team like City where his ability to keep the ball would be tactically useful, but yeah it's real frustrating to watch him. The talent is there, but he doesn't have that dawg in him. A winger like Nani could be frustrating, but he was always trying to make something happen, and even Antony tries and defends.

Only thing that matters is if he is playing well enough for BVB or some other club to stump 30m-40m for him this summer.

FujiVice said:

Doesnt take much to turn it around in this game. If Ten Hag is gone, he's the type of player that will tempt a new manager to bring him back

Click to expand...

It doesn’t take much to turn it around in an attacker friendly league. He’s not cut out for the PL and we’d be absolute idiots to give him another chance. The clean slate business has to stop. That’s actually a good reason for Ineos to bring a new manager in this season - so he doesn’t waste time analysis what we have next season.

QuiteOn Fortune said:

He would be great as a False 9 IMO because I dont rate him at all out wide.

He messed up that chance with Ten Hag due to bad mentality although I do believe him saying Ten Hag has his favourites through Antony over Amad and the little chances Bayndir has gotten.

Rashford/Garnacho- Sancho -Amad/Gw**d/Antony

Is still something I'm open minded about.

I also thought he had 2 good games as a RW in the PL because he had to make quicker decisions in how to release the ball.

I personally have never rated him even at Dortmund but I still think he has a future here because of his wages and a new manager coming in.

Click to expand...

I like how our fans keep complaining about standards and rotten performances / mentality but want to keep giving the same failures and letdowns more chances.

Insanity said:

Only thing that matters is if he is playing well enough for BVB or some other club to stump 30m-40m for him this summer.

Click to expand...

100% this.

There is no way we should take him back so he can jog around with zero intensity and lose every physical battle. He’s not cut out for it here.

NoPace said:

I watched it. He made a real difference for 15 minutes or so when he came on because his touch is so good that it allowed Dortmund to keep the ball, coupled with Atletico sitting deeper with a 2 goal lead.

But then he basically faded from the game, partly because he played on the right for some of it and looked out of ideas there.

Bynoe-Gittens came on and looked much more likely to beat a man.

So, typical Sancho sort of thing. Better touch than any other wide man out there, the rest of it profoundly troubling.

A side note, Adeyemi did not look like he belonged at this level.

Click to expand...

He's not at the level of a UCL/title challenging team. His strengths are playing on the counter with space in behind, where he can utilize his speed and dribbling ability. Against teams sitting back and are defensively strong, he is rather ineffective because he doesn't have great creativity, close control, shooting or passing ability.

What's frustrating is that this was known before he was signed by Dortmund and yet they still went ahead and spent a ton of the Sancho money on him.

Insanity said:

Only thing that matters is if he is playing well enough for BVB or some other club to stump 30m-40m for him this summer.

Click to expand...

And if he’s willing to take a huge salary cut

Regardless of whether ETH is here or not next season, Sancho needs to be sold. His disrespect for the club should never be forgotten - he would only be back for cash and not playing for the club. Disgrace of a footballer to be so unprofessional.

amolbhatia50k said:

I like how our fans keep complaining about standards and rotten performances / mentality but want to keep giving the same failures and letdowns more chances.

Click to expand...

To be honest, I've never complained about anyone extensively unless everyone in a team is playing perfect & someone like Kalvin Phillips at City stick out like a sore thumb.

If everyone in a whole team is crap then I blame the manager more than the players themselves.

I'm quite supportive of our players - I hate no one and don't want anyone sold unless they do get sold then they don't get my support.

Ruud leaving for Ronaldo to grow is another sore thumb example in a well playing side when my support of a player stops only when they are sold.

I'm a supporter & I dont think i am above the United players where i should look at them from a heightened position looking down, judge them and chuck the ones I dislike in the bin.

I am a supporter that feels like the players are above me, where I look up at them and provide them support from underneath.

NoPace said:

I watched it. He made a real difference for 15 minutes or so when he came on because his touch is so good that it allowed Dortmund to keep the ball, coupled with Atletico sitting deeper with a 2 goal lead.

But then he basically faded from the game, partly because he played on the right for some of it and looked out of ideas there.

Bynoe-Gittens came on and looked much more likely to beat a man.

So, typical Sancho sort of thing. Better touch than any other wide man out there, the rest of it profoundly troubling.

A side note, Adeyemi did not look like he belonged at this level.

Click to expand...

I found it interesting for the fact a highlight package like that could be made for him from such a small amount of time on the pitch; he barely showed that much spirit in his entire time here, so it looked like the Sancho who was on course for great things as opposed to the one who was like a mouse here.

It being against Atletico also being important as a factor because you're not going to get a nastier test than them. It also cuts out accusations of what the Bundesliga is/isn't entirely, so yeah, rather fascinating and frustrating to observe.

If that player that was out there last night was like that all the time here, he'd not be in the predicament he currently is, because that's a useful asset, even taking onboard what you've said (being able to output like that for 20-30min per game even, would be invaluable to us).

I'll be tuning into the 2nd leg to watch him - did you find it profoundly troubling because he faded from the game, or is it the manner in which he faded?

I watched the last 25mins of game on TV, as I came in late from work.
I'll say in that last 25, especially the last 10mins or so...

there's this strolling in the park moment he was on that almost got me ripping ma hair off, I was screaming never mind he couldn't hear me, "move or make any sort of inverted run inside from the Right wing"

No not Sancho, he was doing the exact same thing most on here didn't like of him, he was literally walking or standing around when his teammates had the ball, when he did have it there was no drive, no running at fullbacks...

Like I stated I didn't see the game from the first half but from what I heard they were battered outplayed and out worked.

So were is this good Game narrative coming from, can anyone correct me if I'm wrong.

QuiteOn Fortune said:

To be honest, I've never complained about anyone extensively unless everyone in a team is playing perfect & someone like Kalvin Phillips at City stick out like a sore thumb.

If everyone in a whole team is crap then I blame the manager more than the players themselves.

I'm quite supportive of our players - I hate no one and don't want anyone sold unless they do get sold then they don't get my support.

Ruud leaving for Ronaldo to grow is another sore thumb example in a well playing side when my support of a player stops only when they are sold.

I'm a supporter & I dont think i am above the United players where i should look at them from a heightened position looking down, judge them and chuck the ones I dislike in the bin.

I am a supporter that feels like the players are above me, where I look up at them and provide them support from underneath.

Click to expand...

Don't no why I love the read of this post...

He would be one of the players to benefit from yet another clean slate if the manager changes.

Like some have mentioned the best case scenario is he attracts some clubs and United get 30/40 million back for him.

Let’s not waste anymore time on players that have failed at the club.

QuiteOn Fortune said:

If everyone in a whole team is crap then I blame the manager more than the players themselves.

I'm quite supportive of our players .

Click to expand...

Hopefully Ineos aren’t becuase you don’t play good football without good and suitable players. And with the manager, a majority of our players also need to be replaced and upgraded on.

We’ve been through this before. No manager is coming in and making our poor players great. They can make the better ones greater, improve the collective and replace the poor ones (like Sancho with his laughable mentality or Casemiro with his dead legs).[/QUOTE]

RuudTom83 said:

He would be one of the players to benefit from yet another clean slate if the manager changes.

Like some have mentioned the best case scenario is he attracts some clubs and United get 30/40 million back for him.

Let’s not waste anymore time on players that have failed at the club.

Click to expand...

So fourth time lucky then? That's not really how it works.

izak said:

I watched the last 25mins of game on TV, as I came in late from work.
I'll say in that last 25, especially the last 10mins or so...

there's this strolling in the park moment he was on that almost got me ripping ma hair off, I was screaming never mind he couldn't hear me, "move or make any sort of inverted run inside from the Right wing"

No not Sancho, he was doing the exact same thing most on here didn't like of him, he was literally walking or standing around when his teammates had the ball, when he did have it there was no drive, no running at fullbacks...

Like I stated I didn't see the game from the first half but from what I heard they were battered outplayed and out worked.

So were is this good Game narrative coming from, can anyone correct me if I'm wrong.

Click to expand...

Yeah I think you're wrong tbh. It's true he faded in the end but what that highlight video doesn't show is he was also tracking back a lot in the first half. He was really the only Dortmund player in the first half who played well, showed intensity, finally looked agile and quick while the rest of the team looked abysmal and were outplayed and outmuscled all over the pitch.

I don't even think his loan spell has been that good overall but yesterday looked very promising. Atletico went all out in that first half, and so did Sancho so it's not too surprising both dropped in intensity towards the end of the match. Especially when more went through Brandt and Bynoe-Gittens once they came on.

astracrazy said:

So fourth time lucky then? That's not really how it works.

Click to expand...

As I said... "Let’s not waste anymore time on players that have failed at the club."

He can’t play in the same side as Rashford. There can be only one dude strutting around on mega money who prefers the left. If it was good enough they would be regulars for England together by now.

He seems like a player/personality who will do reasonably fine with less pressure and spotlight. There must be a reason that even southgate never preferred him even when he was doing extremely well at dortmund.

I may be wrong but I can never see him shining with all the pressure and spotlight. No one will scrutinize his on and off performances at Dortmund, the way they do here.

Boavista said:

Yeah I think you're wrong tbh. It's true he faded in the end but what that highlight video doesn't show is he was also tracking back a lot in the first half. He was really the only Dortmund player in the first half who played well, showed intensity, finally looked agile and quick while the rest of the team looked abysmal and were outplayed and outmuscled all over the pitch.

I don't even think his loan spell has been that good overall but yesterday looked very promising. Atletico went all out in that first half, and so did Sancho so it's not too surprising both dropped in intensity towards the end of the match. Especially when more went through Brandt and Bynoe-Gittens once they came on.

Click to expand...

Yea i noticed the bold bit when I was watching, they played more through Brandt in the middle, he was very good for that few minutes i saw him.

ItDoesntEvenMata said:

Said it before and I'll say it again: given the circumstances around him at the club, I don't think he's had a fair crack at the whip

Under Ole - came in, the plan was sidelined through Ronnie coming back, started on the bench etc and we were poor and the whole team fell apart

The impact of the racist abuse after missing the Euro 2020 pen right before joining us, I think has some impact here t

Rangnick - everyone was poor

Ten Hag first season - obviously had stuff going on and Erik sent him away (good move). Came back, hot and cold but some promising and a lot of underwhelming moments

This season - didn't play! Was good in pre-season and then didn't even start in the Prem, whilst Antony, Rashford and Martial stank the place out.

So all in all, the only period of fair judgment for me is the December to summer of last season, which was underwhelming but I think there's still a player in there.

I appreciate loads of people will disagree with this but that's opinions innit
,

Click to expand...

He’s been given chances, he doesn’t have the physicality, mentality or work rate to be an elite attacker in the Premier League. He is hugely talented in other areas but we really shouldn’t be wasting any more time on him and hopefully he can be moved on in the summer.

tomaldinho1 said:

And if he’s willing to take a huge salary cut

Click to expand...

This won’t happen

Either he stays and we loan him again, or he goes and we significantly subsidize his wages

Either way, there’s no easy escape here folks

He had his chance to shine at United but sadly, it is time for him to be sold and give his place to an upcoming academy player. We should be more ruthless and give players a maximum of 3 seasons to show their worth ( at least 2 good seasons out of 3). If they don't accomplish this, sell them while they have some value.

CasaStreets said:

This won’t happen

Either he stays and we loan him again, or he goes and we significantly subsidize his wages

Either way, there’s no easy escape here folks

Click to expand...

Yeah it's probably an Alexis situation again. Not the worst thing in the world to be honest, think it's imperative he leaves and we just take the financial hit.

CasaStreets said:

This won’t happen

Either he stays and we loan him again, or he goes and we significantly subsidize his wages

Either way, there’s no easy escape here folks

Click to expand...

Same situation as Lukaku in Chelsea, Aubameyang /Ozil in Arsenal. It is not the end of the world as Utd has way more revenue than both Chelsea and Arsenal.

What has he shown in his time at Utd to suggest he has the mentality to be a success? That is the key issue, not ability. Yes, we could hope he was a bit more physically dynamic but the lack of fight and fire in his game has been a consistent issue. He turned up overweight in his first pre season, took him months to get match fit enough to properly last a 90, that was a red flag and there have been plenty more since.

NoPace said:

You could see him fitting in okay with a truly elite attacking fullback behind him like he had in Hakimi I guess, or a team like City where his ability to keep the ball would be tactically useful, but yeah it's real frustrating to watch him. The talent is there, but he doesn't have that dawg in him. A winger like Nani could be frustrating, but he was always trying to make something happen, and even Antony tries and defends.

Click to expand...

If Sancho is still here next year, he would do well to form a relationship with Dalot, who is fast becoming a very well rounded fullback.

Antony, Garnacho and Rashford have been alternating wings and minutes a lot this season so I haven't really seen much chemistry but there is a lot of potential imo.

Likelihood though is that we sell and use that funds for another striker/midfielder/defender anyways.

His wages will be a barrier to any sale, but if we could get 15-20m for Sancho we should bite someone's hand off and take the money.

amolbhatia50k said:

Hopefully Ineos aren’t becuase you don’t play good football without good and suitable players. And with the manager, a majority of our players also need to be replaced and upgraded on.

We’ve been through this before. No manager is coming in and making our poor players great. They can make the better ones greater, improve the collective and replace the poor ones (like Sancho with his laughable mentality or Casemiro with his dead legs).

Click to expand...

[/QUOTE]

A good manager comes in and buys good players.

Not moyes & fellini, not lukaku & Mourinho, not LVG & Rojo, not Ten Hag's buying Antony,Weghorst, Amrabat etc.

I want a better manager and I blame the manager because he would buy better players.

Pep wouldnt sign a single player listed above and would buy only players that fits his system.

So again, more than blaming the players - I blame the manager.

Who fits in with the current squad is a different story because that's actually got to be tested out.

For example people say Rashford can't play Possesion football but he arguably broke through under Van Gaal's possesion system whilst players like Sterling & Sane played for Pep's possesion sides too.

The mentality out of these players would change with a manager of high quality with better man management skills too.

I blame the manager for poor management of what players we have aswell as how they are used.

He’s damaged goods but he’ll be such a good signing for someone at these lower prices and with something major to prove. One of these lads who we will keep meeting in CL over the years. He was worth the money we paid for him he’s genuinely that talented but he needs to get his head straight and have a proper go at it wherever it is or it’ll be a massive waste. It’s not going to be here so I don’t care anymore

criticalanalysis said:

If Sancho is still here next year, he would do well to form a relationship with Dalot, who is fast becoming a very well rounded fullback.

Click to expand...

The issue there would be Sancho probably needs a very attacking fullback who is constantly overlapping (like he had with Hakimi). Dalot is decent at that and has improved his final ball, but mostly he's used to invert and help the midfield. Obviously that could change under a new manager, but I think a lot of the managers that we'd like to get would continue using him that way.

FujiVice said:

Doesnt take much to turn it around in this game. If Ten Hag is gone, he's the type of player that will tempt a new manager to bring him back

Click to expand...

ten Hag is gone as soon as the season is over. I think it’s a long shot that we see Sancho in a United shirt again, but I’d much rather see him back in the squad than Antony.

A good manager comes in and buys good players.

Not moyes & fellini, not lukaku & Mourinho, not LVG & Rojo, not Ten Hag's buying Antony,Weghorst, Amrabat etc.

I want a better manager and I blame the manager because he would buy better players.

Pep wouldnt sign a single player listed above and would buy only players that fits his system.

So again, more than blaming the players - I blame the manager.

Who fits in with the current squad is a different story because that's actually got to be tested out.

For example people say Rashford can't play Possesion football but he arguably broke through under Van Gaal's possesion system whilst players like Sterling & Sane played for Pep's possesion sides too.

The mentality out of these players would change with a manager of high quality with better man management skills too.

I blame the manager for poor management of what players we have aswell as how they are used.
[/QUOTE]
- Managers don’t have a magic wand. A better manager would undeniably do a better job than a worse manager. However in the modern game, a manager is only a part (albeit a huge part) of the solution and any manager working under the incompetent clowns being the Glazers would be hamstring by them.
- You say Pep wouldn’t want xyz but he did want Maguire, Ronaldo, Fred and Sanchez. Klopp wanted Brandt (I think) and not Salah who was the club’s choice.
- Rashford worked under LVG in a possession based system? Well, did we succeed - did we win the league or come close? Did we play great football? Rashford was an impressive young player at the time but using a failed managerial stint as proof of him apparently working in a possession based system when his skillset says the opposite, makes no sense. Sterling and Sane (at least till he dropped of a few levels) aren’t thick as a wall of bricks either. The way people here underrate Sterling is weird.

I do believe the manager is the most important person for the type of football a team plays but using the manager to shield the players is wrong and this mindset will result in another 10 years of a bad culture. ETH has to go but so do players who have proven themselves to be below the desired level.

amolbhatia50k said:

Pep wouldnt sign a single player listed above and would buy only players that fits his system.

Click to expand...

Pep has bought plenty of shit players. The number of failed fullbacks he has worked his way through, just for starters. The difference is City's £50m buys are the ones that flop, and everyone forgets about them because they immediately replace them with another £50m player the next season. United's flops cost us £70m+ and we don't shake them for five seasons.

Looked like a good performance vs Atletico tbf.

Was Ten Hag really to blame for Sancho failures at OT.
Didn't he try to work with him on his difficulties at the start of the season and give him time off to get himself sorted out.
Saying it was all the managers fault isn't my view at all.
Sancho was given loads of chances and still failed.

Buster15 said:

Was Ten Hag really to blame for Sancho failures at OT.
Didn't he try to work with him on his difficulties at the start of the season and give him time off to get himself sorted out.
Saying it was all the managers fault isn't my view at all.
Sancho was given loads of chances and still failed.

Click to expand...

What I really wonder... why does EtH's assessment of Sancho differ so much from his own, that they had this big fallout? No at Dortmund we had situations when both their manager said that Sancho didn't perform well and Sancho was just as critical of himself, if not even more than his manager. So they aligned quite well and Sancho showed that he can have a realistic view of his own performances.

The way it went it looked like Sancho didn't accept valid criticism, but why wouldn't he when he has proven that ability? To be fair he also can be a whiny little b*tch, we have precedence for that during his Dortmund time as well. But I still can't really wrap my head around all that.