Ander Herrera Revisited

Massively overhyped by our fans. The only thing that many loved about him was his passion to play for us but even that now looks questionable considering he decided to leave.
 
If Ole had joined a few months earlier, he would still be at the club.

His contract situation was terribly mismanaged and letting him go for free was terrible squad management.

I loved him as a player. He was tactically excellent and was fantastic in big games. That Chelsea game at OT he was superb. He had Hazard in his pocket for 90 minutes and still scored one and assisted the other. It was an incredible performance.

Fergie would have loved him.
 
RUCK4444 said:
Correct decision to refuse the money he wanted, he was a good player at times, however that was in a woefully bad midfield for much of his time here.

He was a good professional and ‘got’ what this club is about in fairness to him.

Ultimately wasn’t worth the money he wanted at his age and thankfully it’s worked our well with Fred and McTominay stepping up since he left.
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This. I don't think too many people thought he deserved the money he was asking for but that doesn't mean he wasn't going to be missed/needed. I think a lot of the anger was because we didn't offer him a deal sooner and let it get to the point where he could demand the amount of money that he eventually got. It did end up working out alright for the most part because of the continued improvement of Fred and Mctominay, although we definitely still could have used him.

I think Herrera was a very good player but never anything special. What made me like him so much is like you said, he "got" the club. At a time when most of our players didn't seem to care much and just were going through the paces for years at a time you could tell Herrera really cared about the club and was willing to fight for the team. I do think in most of the Fergie teams he would've just been a good squad player though and that's about it.
 
Same as I’ve always felt. He rarely did anything useful other than add some fire. The caf saw a couple of games where he was genuinely impressive and then defended him to the hilt if anyone suggested that wasn’t his regular level, in true caf fashion.

That said, I don’t believe it was the smartest move when our midfield was so unsure.

I’d still have him as depth but ultimately not really fussed.
 
Good player, but always massively overrated on here. Would’ve preferred to keep him than not, but it was the correct decision to refuse his contract demands.
 
Was a very good player for us. The season he won our POTY in was our best player.
 
Andersonson said:
POTY? Never

Overrated by many fans. A very useful squadplayer, but never good enough for a regular starting place for a team that challenges for the title.

With his salary demand letting him go was a no brainer. Would never be in the first 11 for a top CL club.

Is now a bench warmer for PSG. And rightly so.
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The guy won our POTY in 2016/2017 whether you like it or not.
 
I'd say he's the equivalent to a Fletcher - not just a very good player but a very important one.
 
gza the genius said:
This. I don't think too many people thought he deserved the money he was asking for but that doesn't mean he wasn't going to be missed/needed. I think a lot of the anger was because we didn't offer him a deal sooner and let it get to the point where he could demand the amount of money that he eventually got. It did end up working out alright for the most part because of the continued improvement of Fred and Mctominay, although we definitely still could have used him.

I think Herrera was a very good player but never anything special. What made me like him so much is like you said, he "got" the club. At a time when most of our players didn't seem to care much and just were going through the paces for years at a time you could tell Herrera really cared about the club and was willing to fight for the team. I do think in most of the Fergie teams he would've just been a good squad player though and that's about it.
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Yeah totally agree, there was a time when he was one of the only players many fans could relate to.

I would have been happy to keep him but at that late stage he held the cards like you say and chose to move for the money, fair enough.
 
I really liked him and felt that he was one of a very small number of players who had the right mentality. That said, I wouldn't swap him for Fred, who has really blossomed in his absence.
 
NinjaFletch said:
Tbh I still think he's a significantly better player than Fred, despite Fred's improvement this season and we'd be in a better position were he getting those minutes.

Oh and McTominay too, for that matter.

We haven't missed him as much as we might thanks to those two stepping up, but we'd be a better team were he still here.
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You're taking the piss with this surely?
 
I was seeing the 2017/2018 City-ManUtd replay, the 3-2 comeback, and I noticed two things.

The first one is that we were really lucky on that match, City should had scored at least 4-5 goals in the first half and 2 on the second.

The second one is that Herrera is the master of horseshitery, always fouling, diving, wasting time, etc at the time is was great to see but looking at it now it seems kind of embarrassing.
 
Rolaholic said:
You're taking the piss with this surely?
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Not at all. I think Fred has become a decent player, but one whose performances are being amplified because of how shit he had been before. Herrera's POTY season, especially with the shit around him, saw him regularly pull out more than we get from Fred. If he were still here I'm not sure it would be in debate, or that Fred would be getting in the side at all if everyone were fit.

I think @ivaldo said it earlier in the thread, but I cannot see how he would have done badly in our current set up. He's pretty much perfect for one of those two roles in Solskjaers side.
 
A really good player..who pissed it up a wall, running down his contract and joining PSG.
 
MattofManchester said:
What initially annoyed me was the fact that he was brought in as a playmaker. A more attacking, creative midfielder after the Kroos deal was vetoed by LVG. Both Van Gaal and Mourinho both believed he'd serve a better purpose as a defensive midfielder, and after winning our POTS award, he became a fairly bit part player. And even in his best season, he was more a utility player than a player with a regular role and position.

In hindsight, from my point of view, I think there was a lot more that we could have got out of Ander Herrera than what we actually did. Alongside him is Mata, who I also don't think we've ever seen the best of.

Ah, but what's done is done.
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Tend to agree. I was really excited with his signing, I'd wanted us to sign him ever since he tore us to bits with Bilbao. But he came here and was....fine. I liked him, but I never felt we got the best out of him.
 
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NinjaFletch said:
Not at all. I think Fred has become a decent player, but one whose performances are being amplified because of how shit he had been before. Herrera's POTY season, especially with the shit around him, saw him regularly pull out more than we get from Fred. If he were still here I'm not sure it would be in debate, or that Fred would be getting in the side at all if everyone were fit.

I think @ivaldo said it earlier in the thread, but I cannot see how he would have done badly in our current set up. He's pretty much perfect for one of those two roles in Solskjaers side.
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Fred is arguably the most important central midfielder out of himself, McTominay, and Matic while Bruno and Pogba can be classified as attacking midfielders. Of the five midfielders, Fred's been the one constant throughout the year.

Fred has been a very important and very good player for months now. He more robust throughout the pitch than Herrera, is a better passer and better user of the ball, which includes tempo and rhythm of the game.

Herrera spoke much more openly and loving about United, much more than Fred because his English is ten times better and he understood the gravitas of United. Fred just gets on with it, yet he knows how much he appreciates the club and what it is. Both players have shithousery in the game, but Herrera's is greater, which endears him more to fans and hid his overall influence. Herrera is a better defensive midfielder and overall disrupter and would pair nicely with Fred, who is the more overall better central midfielder playing as an 8 providing bite, energy, ball retention, passing, and pressing. Fred's shooting is crap and would say Herrera is a better on that end, but it's not something he could hang his hat on much either.
 
I liked him, but he wanted to be paid like a superstar as he was getting later in his career and we rightly didn't give it to him. PSG were willing to so I'm quite ok with him choosing to leave. Didn't hurt that McTominay was pretty much ready to fulfill his role in the squad.
 
Agree with alot here who say good player but far far overrated by United fans. You would swear he was Roy Keane the way people talk about him.

Not missing him and said it at the time, there's 100's of Ander Herrera's in the world and easily can be replaced and improved
 
A lot of players wouldnt be missed much if you spent £123 million on the area they were best at (defending), or £174 million if we include Fred who was bought the season before for the same position.

It took £48 million for us not to miss Pogba anymore with Bruno's signing. So it would be quite embarassing if we had spent £51 million on Fred, £75 million on Maguire and £48 million on AWB and then we still missed Ander's defending.

Yet I would suggest that if we had all these players signed for big money plus Ander and Smalling we'd have a better defensive record than Sheffield United and Leicester who currently have a better record than we do this season. AWB is a giant defensive upgrade on Young, Maguire has been solid albeit with a huge price tag and Ander is a better ball winner than Fred.
 
buckooo1978 said:
Herrera was a good midfielder who did everything well. He wasnt amazing at anything in particular- just really dependable and in my eyes the perfect backup squad midfielder. He was excellent at times in the defensive role under Jose and really stood out with interceptions and tackles per game. He certainly looked a better defensive option to me than Matic who was awful for years before a brief spell of good form under Ole since Christmas.

I think I'd put him ahead of Matic, Pereira and Lingard. In his final season he was better than Fred and McTominay and the collapse on our results neatly coincided with his injury too. Maybe he would have declined this season as they have come on but we will never know.

There seems to be a lot of revsionism on Herrera after his departure and it seems to be about his contract.

Although I was a fan if it is true he was after 200k a week plus then we did the right thing moving him on. That kind of wage for a squad player of his age isnt great though and I'd happily have had him stay ahead of Lingard/Matic or Periera.

I felt this was more an issue of the clubs management of his contract and we left it really late before acting - the club has previous with this re:Evra
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What previous with Evra? 90% sure we did this when Evra was already in his 30s not a player in his 20s.
 
SAFMUTD said:
He was a really likeable player, but never worth the salary he was asking, in hindsight him leaving allowed Fred having more minutes and I think Fred is a superior player with a higher sealing.

Ander is in the Smalling, Mata, Shaw category, likeable players that are good but not great which we tend to keep and overpay instead of upgrading them.
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Smalling and Shaw are much better players than Herrera. Ridiculous comparisons.
 
izec said:
I think he was a valuable squad member and still would have been if fit. His injuries catched up lately, but when fit, great option to have to rotate with Matic, McTom and Fred. He was on their level. Especially in the big games, he was up for it and very flexible. I still would have kept him, and moved on the likes of Pereira and Lingrad. I think Ole wanted him to stay but he made his decision to leave before he arrived.

Nothing more to add to it. Good player, some will say should have stayed others will say he was overrated, but in the end, we don't depend on him now that McTom and Fred have stepped up.
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Let's put Herrera into perspective with Fred, Matic, McTom, Pereira, Mata and Pogba, assuming all fit and available.

We found Herrera had a few great performance but half of the time he was un-used by Mourinho even when available, that was a puzzle to me, until we have seen the true Fred.

IMO Herrera is not as good as (a fit) Matic on positioning, although he is hard working no doubt. Herrera made some great pass but not consistent enough compared with Pogba or Fred. Even Pereira was capable of taking some great shot outside the box better than Herrera.

So Herrera was kind of short in every department, a decent squad player and hard worker, but so was McTom. For half a season everyone missed him, but I don't think we ever look back after McTom and Fred fire up.
 
His defensive tenacity often consisted of running at whoever had the ball at a 100mph and leaving massive gaps in the centre. The playstyle made him popular but we'll be fine without him
 
Ekeke said:
A lot of players wouldnt be missed much if you spent £123 million on the area they were best at (defending), or £174 million if we include Fred who was bought the season before for the same position.

It took £48 million for us not to miss Pogba anymore with Bruno's signing. So it would be quite embarassing if we had spent £51 million on Fred, £75 million on Maguire and £48 million on AWB and then we still missed Ander's defending.

Yet I would suggest that if we had all these players signed for big money plus Ander and Smalling we'd have a better defensive record than Sheffield United and Leicester who currently have a better record than we do this season. AWB is a giant defensive upgrade on Young, Maguire has been solid albeit with a huge price tag and Ander is a better ball winner than Fred.
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Your last point about Ander and Smalling is a little bit questionable because Man United have the 4th best defensive record by conceded goals. Leicester has only conceded 2 less, but has scored 14 more goals than United. Sheffield United only have a +4 GD and are the most defensively solid and defensive squad outside of Liverpool when looking at goals conceded. The defending hasn't been much of any issue as much as the goal output in the first half of this season and seasons previous.
 
edcunited1878 said:
Fred is arguably the most important central midfielder out of himself, McTominay, and Matic while Bruno and Pogba can be classified as attacking midfielders. Of the five midfielders, Fred's been the one constant throughout the year.

Fred has been a very important and very good player for months now. He more robust throughout the pitch than Herrera, is a better passer and better user of the ball, which includes tempo and rhythm of the game.

Herrera spoke much more openly and loving about United, much more than Fred because his English is ten times better and he understood the gravitas of United. Fred just gets on with it, yet he knows how much he appreciates the club and what it is. Both players have shithousery in the game, but Herrera's is greater, which endears him more to fans and hid his overall influence. Herrera is a better defensive midfielder and overall disrupter and would pair nicely with Fred, who is the more overall better central midfielder playing as an 8 providing bite, energy, ball retention, passing, and pressing. Fred's shooting is crap and would say Herrera is a better on that end, but it's not something he could hang his hat on much either.
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Not much to disagree with in this post.
 
edcunited1878 said:
Your last point about Ander and Smalling is a little bit questionable because Man United have the 4th best defensive record by conceded goals. Leicester has only conceded 2 less, but has scored 14 more goals than United. Sheffield United only have a +4 GD and are the most defensively solid and defensive squad outside of Liverpool when looking at goals conceded. The defending hasn't been much of any issue as much as the goal output in the first half of this season and seasons previous.
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We also have been prone to silly mistakes leading to goals all season. Most of our matches this season we've done fine defensively for the vast majority of the games but had our mistakes punished. We couldn't manage to do that up at the other end with our attackers to create balance.
 
edcunited1878 said:
Your last point about Ander and Smalling is a little bit questionable because Man United have the 4th best defensive record by conceded goals. Leicester has only conceded 2 less, but has scored 14 more goals than United. Sheffield United only have a +4 GD and are the most defensively solid and defensive squad outside of Liverpool when looking at goals conceded. The defending hasn't been much of any issue as much as the goal output in the first half of this season and seasons previous.
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I dont believe it is. The season before last we had the best defensive record with those players. £175 million of players would only have helped them get back to their best. Smalling did it without them or teammates of much quality at Roma.

Sheffield United and Leicester have reached those levels of defensive solidarity without all the resources we have. Its simply a case that we used all that money to get by without our reliable defensive players, instead of adding to them and being rock solid. Usually if you have a big restructure like that its paid in part by departing players. In our case it was Lukaku money... Smalling was on loan and Ander recouped us nothing.
 
edcunited1878 said:
Fred is arguably the most important central midfielder out of himself, McTominay, and Matic while Bruno and Pogba can be classified as attacking midfielders. Of the five midfielders, Fred's been the one constant throughout the year.

Fred has been a very important and very good player for months now. He more robust throughout the pitch than Herrera, is a better passer and better user of the ball, which includes tempo and rhythm of the game.

Herrera spoke much more openly and loving about United, much more than Fred because his English is ten times better and he understood the gravitas of United. Fred just gets on with it, yet he knows how much he appreciates the club and what it is. Both players have shithousery in the game, but Herrera's is greater, which endears him more to fans and hid his overall influence. Herrera is a better defensive midfielder and overall disrupter and would pair nicely with Fred, who is the more overall better central midfielder playing as an 8 providing bite, energy, ball retention, passing, and pressing. Fred's shooting is crap and would say Herrera is a better on that end, but it's not something he could hang his hat on much either.
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Fair point. Herrera was indeed a terrible user of the ball. He didn't have the ability, composure and confidence to hold onto the ball and look for better options. He panicked every time he received the ball, and he just wanted to get rid of it asap as if it was a bomb. As a result, he failed to dictate the tempo of the game and made plenty of sideway and backward passes, which weren't helpful to the team.

Many praised his POTY season. Yes he played well and did his job consistently while others didn't, that's why he got the award. However, this didn't mean he's the best player in terms of ability. Shaw, Valencia and Chicharito all won it once but they clearly weren't players with top quality. The fact that Mourinho replaced Herrera with Matic immediately after the POTY season implied he's deficient in certain aspects in his game.
 
roseguy64 said:
What previous with Evra? 90% sure we did this when Evra was already in his 30s not a player in his 20s.
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i mean in terms of not getting a contract tied up early

have you heard/read about his late contract renewal attempt with Evra? it was the same with Vidic

The point is if you extend contacts of your best players at the right time you can avoid teams like PSG (Herrera) or Juve (Ramsey/Can/etc) offering those big bumper salaries
 
Ronaldo's Mum Eh? said:
There might be some recency bias here, because I recall everyone being upset at our midfield before Bruno arrived.

Herrera was everything we wanted in a United player. We dropped the ball by not renegotiating much earlier (and compensating him with a much fairer contract). Instead we looked at renewing trash like Lingard.
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I agree. A midfield of McTominay, Bruno, Fred and Herrera would've been pretty decent. We're still short on numbers for the squad game.

I don't know how much he wanted, but it would've been more worth it than whatever we're paying Lingard.
 
Had a great determination, PR team, and engine. That was it.

Good decision to let him go.
 
buckooo1978 said:
i mean in terms of not getting a contract tied up early

have you heard/read about his late contract renewal attempt with Evra? it was the same with Vidic

The point is if you extend contacts of your best players at the right time you can avoid teams like PSG (Herrera) or Juve (Ramsey/Can/etc) offering those big bumper salaries
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Is this really true? I've always thought United wanted to get rid of Evra and Vidic (and Ferdinand) due to their terrible performances, and their failure at their respective new club justified that. Maybe I wasn't following the news closely, but I didn't remember the attempt to extend their contracts.

I agree with the rest though. Late renewal attempts do not do us favor and give other teams an opporunity to sneak in.
 
He's a good player and we should have done more to keep him. I feel he would be more competent in a functioning team. He's not a world beater or someone who is going to win you games on his own but he's tactically disciplined, a very clever player in and out of possession and pops up with a few key goals. He also understand the club and what it took to play for Man Utd.

I don't believe Fred or McTominay are better than Herrera. I would like to have had Herrera as our first reserve going into the 2021-2022 season. A bit like Nicky Butt was for United, someone who was reliable, did a job in certain games and would still feature heavily across a season due to injuries/suspensions and rotations.
 
People have become too hung up on his poty award. For context we finished 6th place that season, and if not for Zlatan's unfortunate injury he would have got it 100%.
In EL where we did something of note I would say Pogba, Mkhi and Rashford were miles better and more important than him.
Good player but nothing special in all his time here. He had some fantastic games, but more times he was invisible and failed to influence the games.
His shooting technique was really bad also.
 
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