He deserves to start the next one based on that cameo (can it be a cameo when he is probably the main driving force behind us getting back into the game?).
Anderson
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I'm constructing my opinion on what I have seen the last 5 years, why after seeing him come on as a sub and play well would that be so bizarre?
And we've seen Valencia serve up shite for most of the season, has his ship sailed too?
Welbeck has has a couple of crap games too, ship sailed?
Seriously, if you can't see what Anderson has to offer after that cameo just 24 hours ago, you've gotta give yourself a slap in the face.
Because young players improve and it's obvious for anyone with eyes that Anderson has improved a lot and adds an excellent dimension to our team. Just 24 hours ago you saw him come on and turn a game in our favour with a great performance, and you instantly say, "I think his ship has sailed"... that's just strange to me. It's like closing your eyes and putting your hands over your eyes saying "I've made my mind up, I don't wanna hear, I don't wanna see".
Unless he's physically not up to it, I'd like to see Fletcher start with Clevz and Ando v West Ham. This:
Fletcher
Clevz/Ando
Rooney
Hernandez/RvP
Ando has earned a start. If he's not up to a full 90, we can bring on Scholes or even -- horror of horrors! -- Giggs late in the game. And if Fletcher isn't up for a full 90, then bring on Carrick.
The objective should be to destroy West Ham by the 60th minute and I'd like to see Ando be a big part of that destruction. Surely this is not asking too much!
Fletcher
Clevz/Ando
Rooney
Hernandez/RvP
Ando has earned a start. If he's not up to a full 90, we can bring on Scholes or even -- horror of horrors! -- Giggs late in the game. And if Fletcher isn't up for a full 90, then bring on Carrick.
The objective should be to destroy West Ham by the 60th minute and I'd like to see Ando be a big part of that destruction. Surely this is not asking too much!
You're making my argument stronger and yours weaker with this quote! Bizarre line to take! Valencia has been brilliant for us since he joined and he has had a dip in form why would his ship have sailed? Anderson is almost opposite recent rise in form but failed to deliver consistently since he joined. Ps Welbeck is a youth Anderson is not.
No need to resort to calling people a twat all the time. I only got involved because it was clearly bullshit.
Welbeck is just 2 years younger than Ando.
It's fine, if you wanna have you mind "make up about a player" then that's cool with me, but I've seen more than enough over the 5 years to show me that without injury, Anderson would already be a superstar. Had he not shown me that though, I'd still appreciate his performance yesterday and think, feck me this lad is good. I certainly wouldn't claim any player's ship has sailed after a performance like that.
Oh and Anderson has not "failed to deliver consistently since he joined" for any other reason than injury, the poor fecker. In pretty much every spell uninjured he has shown huge amounts of his vast potential. Some bad games along the way just as we've had from the likes of Welbeck too and many other youngsters.
I know what Anderson has to offer but I'm not kidding myself into thinking Anderson is suddenly the answer to our problems. Yes he deserves a start against West Ham, but that is all his 30 minutes means.
He has a tendency to look good one week and then get outplayed by vastly inferior opponents the next. In my opinion Anderson won't fulfill his potential. We're measuring him against such low standards, when in the bigger picture we need a midfielder that can dominate games and potentially put us back on top in Europe. I just can't see Anderson doing that. For the short term, yeah he's an option. That's as far as it goes for me though.
Nothing of the sort I'd say it is the quite the contrary that giving the evidence we have been presented with in front of us it is you who is closing your eyes. I hope your faith in Anderson proves to be correct but the evidence points otherwise. Although if someone comes in and adds that level of drive that Anderson gave yesterday it would be great. But Anderson has only showed little flashes in his time here.
Yeah, because he's spent most of it out injured or returning from injury.
Come on Lawman, you know that doesn't make sense. You're basing your opinion on 5 injury ravaged years rather than concentrating on some of the excellent performances he has put in this year and last when fit.
Or being unfit and out of condition when required. When on song Anderson is brilliant but we have hardly heard that tune since he's been here wake up and open your eyes. There is a glimmer of hope with him but nothing more, I hope he grabs it but stop making excuses for him and being blind in your assessment.
what's his passing completion stats?
As I said stop making excuses for him he has had 5 years to nail a starting spot and what is the longest run of games he's managed to do? How many games in a row has he played well? We have seen little cameos nothing more. Get real we are all desperate due to a couple of aging players in this position but i'd wager you we are more likely to buy a player in and he will cement this position than Anderson stepping up. As much as I'd love that to happen the evidence is not in his favour.
Never have truer word been spoken. This sums the whole situation up for me.
How old was Fletcher when he became a key player?
This tickled.
Forget about that, it's all about those first years at the club (actually, lets just forget how good he was in his first season, just for the sake of argument). Oh, and forgot about the huge knee injuries etc too.
A player can never suddenly stay injury free and begin to mature. Zidane was the best player in the World at 21 don't forget. And that Henry lad, rubbish he was for a long while.
By the way, he's played 155 times for us.
Forget about every good performance, every decent performance, let's focus and those few games where he didn't play well, and sell him for 3 million to Wet Ham
...and all the utter, utter shite performances.
Lawman is telling you how it is. You should listen.
It's true that Anderson hasn't really had a consistantly good season in his United career. And as I've stated for the last three summers, we should've got another midfielder in.
But we're outside of the transfer window, and the fact of the matter is Ferguson seems to have put his trust in the midfielders we've already got. So what I want to see, is us utilizing what we've got as well as possible.
We're not doing this IMO. We're putting out midfield partnerships of a large variety with one common rule: They're not suited to play together.
When we've gone into games with balanced midfields, we've looked good/great. Newcastle, Chelsea away and Arsenal are examples. So why can't we start playing midfield partnerships that's at least got a decent chance of working?
Anderson is part of at least two of those combinations.
But we're outside of the transfer window, and the fact of the matter is Ferguson seems to have put his trust in the midfielders we've already got. So what I want to see, is us utilizing what we've got as well as possible.
We're not doing this IMO. We're putting out midfield partnerships of a large variety with one common rule: They're not suited to play together.
When we've gone into games with balanced midfields, we've looked good/great. Newcastle, Chelsea away and Arsenal are examples. So why can't we start playing midfield partnerships that's at least got a decent chance of working?
Anderson is part of at least two of those combinations.
Agreed. Ship has sailed.
I'm always right is telling YOU how it is, you should listen.
As much as they are important they don't paint the whole picture like the players drive or influence he has on his team mates. I try to base opinions on performances rather than stats but still they do have a purpose.
I'm always right clearly isn't always right.
Well, we did with Fletcher, and Liverpool fans have with Lucas.
And well, neither of these players had to go through the shocking injury issues that Ando did before "coming good".
Good post couldn't agree more.
Pocco I'm giving up with him, I would love Anderson to come good and think he should be starting to see if he could finally nail a spot in the team but I'm always right is now just blindly defending him and you can't debate with someone like that who is unwilling to consider anybody else's point of view. Leaving before it gets childish.
I'm not blindly defending him, the debate started with me simply saying I find it a strange point of view to write him off after a match winning performance yesterday.
I simply want you to accept that players can and do "come good". It's not "blind" in that Anderson has been unbelievably unlucky with injury during his time here.
Yeah, I don't dislike Anderson or have an agenda against him, just telling it how I see it. I'd love him to come good. Until maybe the last year or two I held out similar levels of hope, but it gets to a point where you draw the line and accept when you believe he's not going to turn that corner.
I'm out too until we have something more to discuss ie. Anderson starting a few games.
I agree of course he could I hope he does but most players don't suddenly come good after 5 years so to do so he'd be in the minority can you not simply accept this? Your blind backing of Anderson was admirable to start with now it's getting annoying. You are not always right and your point of view here is wrong regardless if Anderson comes good, he has not shown anything in his time here that he looks like holding a starting spot down. If he does it for 8-10 games on the trot then I would agree with you but in 5 years he hasn't so the problehood is he won't come good don't you concur?
Well if you want an accurate picture of Anderson over the past two seasons, when he has had a run in the team he has done well. There was a period where it looked he could offer a consistent goal threat. But then, the inevitable happened. He got injured. And he didn't just get injured for a few weeks. It would be for months. Although it's his sixth season here, in terms of playing time, it's closer to around four and a half.
It's been a while since Ando has been absolute dogshite and I think it's time we give him more of a chance. He has had some poor games for us but this was more so an issue about 3 or 4 seasons ago.
I think his past injury troubles are keeping him out of the side at the moment. I'm not sure why else we aren't putting more faith in this lad. He certainly has improved from when he first arrived. He has more purpose to his game. You couldn't say that in his first season other than he was a very energetic player. To accompany his ability to drive from midfield, he has worked on how and when he passes.
Yesterday was an example of what he can do. Although it was QPR, the starting midfield 2 weren't doing much better. In any match, you want your players giving you a good chance to win and Anderson is increasingly showing the capability to do that. Anderson has done well against better opposition but it's been some time since we've seen him do it. That doesn't lie completely at his feet, he has to be selected.
Saying nonsense like "he doesn't dominate top class midfields" doesn't make sense to me when we haven't dominated a top side in a while. Even more so when the effectiveness and functionality of a midfield partnership is more important than having one stand-out individual in midfield. We've seen his best in a midfield 3 and at times a midfield 2 (performances against Chelsea in prem, Arsenal in CL, christmas run with carrick, Cleverley at beginning of last season). It's just weird saying he hasn't progressed when he's not had enough consistent runs to judge him on due to injury. He's shown more than "only little flashes". As fans, we seem to have a hard time remembering his good moments.
Once again, I think maybe this is why Sir Alex is delaying from using him more in the squad. Anderson can do what our other midfielders cannot and if Fergie sees that as important enough to hold Ando back from more game time as a reason to avoid getting another long-injury layoff, then fine by me. But let's stop this nonsense that he hasn't improved. He has but once the staff determines he's fully ready, it's time he gets a run in the side. Then I think we can get a better barometer of how much he has actually improved. It's silly to say that he hasn't.
In those 5 years he had an excellent first season, ruptured a cruciate ligament, been in a severe car accident and then, after an excellent start to last season, suffered injuries that made him miss another 5 months of football. So unlike other footballers, Anderson really has had difficult circumstances to "come good".
Oh and plenty of players come good at around Ando's age (24), hardly the "minority".
It's like you have erased the injuries and are blaming solely the player and his performances for not nailing down a starting place, and that is the issue I have with you. I think he certainly would've nailed a starting spot last year, until he got injured again. Yes, he's had a few bum performances along the way, I'm not denying that, but so do all young players, but he's also had some brilliant performances in that time too. And in the past 2 seasons, I think he more often than not, has been excellent when used.
Plato since your quoting me let me answer that. I never once said he hasn't improved and he doesn't offer anything different to what we have, he certainly does has he improved enough not sure he doesn't get picked enough for different reasons. He has his weakness for me lack of consistency and his lack of positioning himself off the ball to receive it being two of the main ones. Yes these can be worked on, but giving that he has failed to hold down a starting spot in the team in 5 years I am not pinning my hopes on him, I doubt he will but would love nothing more than see him become our lynchpin in the midfield. I feel like i am stating the obvious here with Anderson. Does anyone think he is going to be our main midfielder for the next 5 years or do you think it is more likely we will buy someone? From what I have seen it looks far more likely we are going to buy some one or Cleverley will step up.
You are now twisting the argument and my words to suit you. I give up, you clearly know better than anybody else although the facts are there that when he has not been injured he has not been in the starting 11. Maybe Fergie is wrong and you are right. The fact we are playing two guys who are nearly 40 in front of him shows you the faith the manager has in him. I hope he comes good but the jury is out. Time to stop the excuses he's now on his umpteenth chance to try and win a starting spot and be a regular. I'm not overlooking his injuries but his form at times has been poor also.
My worry with Anderson is, if the injuries he's had are more bad luck than weak constitution, what if we leave him out and allow him to build up strength for months, and when we let him back in he gets injured again anyway? Maybe we should be playing him while he can, who knows what will happen when he starts playing.
I don't really believe that, it's just a worry in the back of my mind. I think SAF is doing the right thing and I hope it works. If we get a fit, fresh and motivated Anderson firing on all cylinders in the second half of the season, I'll be a happy man.
I don't really believe that, it's just a worry in the back of my mind. I think SAF is doing the right thing and I hope it works. If we get a fit, fresh and motivated Anderson firing on all cylinders in the second half of the season, I'll be a happy man.
I agree.
But he has also been severely hampered in that, when in good form, injury has hit.
That's not me twisting anything or saying I'm right, just telling it as it is. As I said earlier, I was convinced as were many others at the start of last season, that Anderson was gonna nail a starting spot, but then he missed the rest of the season from December. Once again, from what I've seen this season, I think he's our best option. That's not to say he won't get injured anytime soon. I also think he's being held back now because SAF is worried about his injury issues.
He's still here. That says to me SAF still has faith. Most of us were losing it, if it hadn't already long since gone, last summer. Mind you, I don't see it as either/or. I think Anderson has an important part to play in coming years, but I think we'll need to buy a midfielder at some point too.
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