Antony under investigation by Brazilian authorities for domestic abuse | Back in the squad

[Castia]

United have to deal with this quickly now.

He has to be suspended pending further developments.

The longer United hesitate to announce this, the more negative press etc.

Whether he's actually guilty of what he's accused of doesn't matter here: this is purely a matter of damage control.

When the quotes and clips from this upcoming interview air they will no doubt shit their pants and suspend him the negative press is about to run all over the club and player

I mean this has the potential to make the Greenwood case look like childs play, rumours are rife that they're going to accuse the club of some sort of cover up if im reading the articles correctly.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

I mean this has the potential to make the Greenwood case look like childs play, rumours are rife that they're going to accuse the club of some sort of cover up if im reading the articles correctly

It could be an unholy mess, yes.

But precisely for that reason, the very least they can do is to suspend the fecker, as in: yesterday.

We're run by idiots, though - that much is clear.

 

[Spark]

And the club would lose.

Yeah probably the useless cnuts.

 

[astracrazy]

Wow didn't realise this

I only got that off a comment in this thread from someone who said they were reading up about the first accusation, so may not be 100% true, but we had a game then apparently he played in. But as an example of a field day a defence could have if claims in interviews aren't correct.

 

[bstb3]

Ten Hag must be feeling relieved, no he can skip Antony without people bringing up the transfer fee.

I'm not sure he's feeling too good that someone he has known and worked with (and presumably gets on with) for years is up for something as nasty as this. It wouldn't make my day that's for sure....

Look it's ok to want Antony out as a player if people think he's not up to it. However being happy that something like this has happened (if it's true) because it gets rid of him, or if he is falsely accused and the dirt ends him, is fecking low. Have people genuinely lost sense of perspective here? 3 women have potentially been battered, but at least we can get rid of someone who isn't up to it so its not all bad. On top of that a young guy who plays for the team we support is in an unholy mess but tough, he's not good enough. Just wow.

 

[SouthMancRed]

the negative press is about to run all over the club

Just another day then.

 

[Crimson King]

United have to deal with this quickly now.

He has to be suspended pending further developments.

The longer United hesitate to announce this, the more negative press etc.

Whether he's actually guilty of what he's accused of doesn't matter here: this is purely a matter of damage control.

To be honest I think that because of what happend with Greenwood they won't suspend him unless he's actually convicted of something. If they suspend him and nothing comes of the charges (or it's settled in civil court, which seems most likely based on evidence so far) then they'll have to bring him back at some point, which will bring the story back into the media spotlight and ignite the court of public opinion.

It's actually less damaging to just say 'it's in the hands of the authorities' and ride through the negative press, which will eventually move on with the news cycle. Then if no charges come you just carry on, no need to reintegrate and what not. If he is charged and found guilty you do what needs to be done then as swiftly as possible and hide behind the rule of law.

This is basically what Arsenal are doing with Partey, made easier by the fact the press can't name him, obviously.

I'm not saying I agree with it, but in terms of long term risk assessment that's what most well run organisations would probably do. It's pretty much what happens in the US whenever there's some big sports scandal.

Edit: well run being the key phrase in that last part...

 

[NotThatSoph]

I only got that off a comment in this thread from someone who said they were reading up about the first accusation, so may not be 100% true, but we had a game then apparently he played in. But as an example of a field day a defence could have if claims in interviews aren't correct.

Which comment was that?

 

[astracrazy]

Which comment was that?

It will be in the first couple of pages

 

[Todd]

This is a really, really bad look on the heels of the Greenwood situation.

If the club don't suspend Antony now, they've lost the plot.

 

[astracrazy]

This is a really, really bad look on the heels of the Greenwood situation.

If the club don't suspend Antony now, they've lost the plot.

I think they will, but I also think there is the added complication with the club doctor. If they accept the allegations to suspend him, then are they not also admitting to some level of the club covering this up? I don't know.

 

[Seveneric]

I'm not sure he's feeling too good that someone he has known and worked with (and presumably gets on with) for years is up for something as nasty as this. It wouldn't make my day that's for sure....

Not to mention it was allegedly ETH that insisted on signing him.

The manager insisted on signing a (so far) underwhelming player that the club (based on his recommendation) ended up paying hideous fees and wages for, and It’s now looking like said player might be done for with the added joy of dragging the club’s image down. Not sure how this can be spun into something that looks remotely good for the manager, quite the opposite actually.

 

[NotThatSoph]

It will be in the first couple of pages

I just checked the first 10 pages and didn't find anything.

 

[chocolate cloud]

It feels like the club is out of control. They seriously need to put a blanket over this fire and say Antony has been suspended until further notice. Will be refreshing to see him out of the team at least but them dawdling over suspending him is absolutely insane. Do it now, a full week before the next game.

 

[AdamColeBebe]

He does look like a prick to be honest.

Kinda makes Erik look stupid. I mean, he did fecking train him for years didn't he?

I'm sure there are ways to recognize a potential molestor. Do they have psychological tests on their medical?

What this club needs is a profiler. We can't let this happen anymore.

What on earth are you talking about?

 

[lex talionis]

For the love of God, or the gods, the club must act today.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

It's actually less damaging to just say 'it's in the hands of the authorities' and ride through the negative press, which will eventually move on with the news cycle.

I'm not sure that's true in this case.

United are under extreme scrutiny compared to pretty much any thinkable employer, including other football clubs.

I'm not sure "riding it out" is a viable option here. If he is - at some point in the future - found guilty, the club's reputation will take a massive hit. The narrative will be that Manchester United actively protected a criminal.

Three individuals have made accusations against the player. Sure, it could all fizzle out with no conviction, etc. But I wouldn't gamble on that. In fact, I would call it positively idiotic to gamble on it. It is a much safer bet to just suspend him. If it turns out, in time, that these accusations are bogus/have no merit, fine - but a) the player doesn't have much of a case against the club and b) even if he does (as in: he claims that he was unreasonably or even illegally suspended), that's surely a relatively minor concern (he can hardly sue United into bankruptcy).

 

[astracrazy]

I just checked the first 10 pages and didn't find anything.

I just been looking back, page 7.

" Trying to read up on it but it seems that at least one of the incidents she's claiming happened on a certain date and he was in the UK, and he was actually playing against Bournemouth or someone at the time. Not sure where she was though "

True or not or where she was I don't know. My point just being anything said in the interviews the defence would have a field day if anything is incorrect, for argument sake here if she claimed the incident happened in Brazil - which I thought she did but I could be wrong to be fair.

 

[The Urban Goose]

is he going to be okay or is he "finished" like greenwood ?

They've set a precedent with MG, this must follow the same path.

 

[hobbers]

They've set a precedent with MG, this must follow the same path.

Greenwood case isn’t comparable given the audio so that isn’t a precedent.

Even then the club suspended him the same day he was first arrested.

 

[NotThatSoph]

I just been looking back, page 7.

" Trying to read up on it but it seems that at least one of the incidents she's claiming happened on a certain date and he was in the UK, and he was actually playing against Bournemouth or someone at the time. Not sure where she was though "

True or not or where she was I don't know. My point just being anything said in the interviews the defence would have a field day if anything is incorrect, for argument sake here if she claimed the incident happened in Brazil.

That Antony was in the UK on one of the dates isn't very surprising, as it's alleged to have happened in the UK. This is referring to the incident where the club arranged for a doctor.

 

[7even]

I have talked on WhatsApp with my 23 year old daughter (my wife’s daughter to be exact) who lives in São Paulo, only a few miles away from Antony’s place, and she says that most of locals (a majority is female) condemn him and social media in Brazil/SP is full of abusive comments, mostly against Antony.


I unfortunately have no doubts that some of the things he’s accused of is true but at the same time I wouldn’t totally trust all these women. When money, fame and media coverage is involved probably everybody has their own agenda. On top of that we have a local police force with corruption into their core, a legal system with similar problems and most lawyers with zero scruples. Not to mention a rotten local and national media with more interest of click baits and viewers than the truth.

It’s like a mixture of all bad things you need in a case like this and unfortunately I think Antony’s United career is over.

Without neglecting the supposedly crime what a tragedy for the young man on so many different levels. So so young….

 

[Red Shorts]

How have they not suspended yet? It's a strong indication they are taking this seriously.

Seems to be getting worse day by day

 

[reelworld]

Fecking hell.

So this was an issue before he even signed for us? ETH has a growing list of questionable decisions when it comes to these people. I saw a post on reddit that mentioned about 3 cases where he backed players at previous clubs that committed crimes etc. He backed Overmars when he got outed. He wanted to sign Arnautovic until fans pushed back. He wanted Greenwood back. And now he's signed a guy that could be the worst of the lot, even though he'd already been accused of some of this before hand. And to make matters worse, he had already spent a year or two with him at Ajax.

You couldn't write this really.

yeah, this is the reason I'm not 100% comfortable with Ten Hag tbh.
He maybe a genius tactically, but he needs to think about this stuff too, not just footballing skills.

The more I think of it, if Ten Hag really wanted to just focus on the footballing ability of his future/current players, then we need someone above him who could overrule him. Because not just from the moral perspective, this is costing the club a massive amount of money and bad publicity

 

[Melville Red]

Club is also to blame in my opinion. I would have thought that one of the things the club should do before signing any player is to check their criminal records.

If Antony hasn’t been arrested he won’t have a criminal record would he, and you only get a CRO if found guilty in a court of law.

 

[astracrazy]

That Antony was in the UK on one of the dates isn't very surprising, as it's alleged to have happened in the UK. This is referring to the incident where the club arranged for a doctor.

Do you think this is one of the reasons he still hasn't been suspended? I keep wondering if suspending him would also be an admission that this is/could be true and would obviously look like they did try and cover it up. I don't know. What a mess.

Not to mention it was allegedly ETH that insisted on signing him.

The manager insisted on signing a (so far) underwhelming player that the club (based on his recommendation) ended up paying hideous fees and wages for, and It’s now looking like said player might be done for with the added joy of dragging the club’s image down. Not sure how this can be spun into something that looks remotely good for the manager, quite the opposite actually.

Which academy coach brought Greenwood into the club, they need some blame too.

 

[Suv666]

He does look like a prick to be honest.

Kinda makes Erik look stupid. I mean, he did fecking train him for years didn't he?

I'm sure there are ways to recognize a potential molestor. Do they have psychological tests on their medical?

What this club needs is a profiler. We can't let this happen anymore.

that’s daft, how will your boss know what you’re upto in your personal life. Its not like anyone who’s a rapist announces it at his workplace.

 

[NotThatSoph]

Do you think this is one of the reasons he still hasn't been suspended? I keep wondering if suspending him would also be an admission that this is/could be true and would obviously look like they did try and cover it up. I don't know. What a mess.

I don't think they were ever going to suspend him without him being charged with a crime, no matter what happened that night. More women coming out might change the calculation, but I don't know.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Not to mention it was allegedly ETH that insisted on signing him.

The manager insisted on signing a (so far) underwhelming player that the club (based on his recommendation) ended up paying hideous fees and wages for, and It’s now looking like said player might be done for with the added joy of dragging the club’s image down. Not sure how this can be spun into something that looks remotely good for the manager, quite the opposite actually.

The problem for me is that he has nothing to justify the attitude. We tried to put it off as having a winning mentality last season, but the truth is he's just a twat. We hoped he could be our twat, etc

 

[Mourinhonista]

Could easily be another Mendy situation. When a court of law charges him, then we can talk. Personally i'd suspend when he's convicted, not before. Can't wait one or two years, it's simply unfair towards the player who's career is very short.

 

[Lash]

I don't think they were ever going to suspend him without him being charged with a crime, no matter what happened that night. More women coming out might change the calculation, but I don't know.

I don't think you can really suspend someone if they've not been charged with anything, unless you're the one doing the investigation. Might be wrong.

 

[DickDastardly]

I'm almost certain we can't literally read minds yet. Maybe Musk is working up to it.

You don't have to be a mind reader to spot a rotten apple.

I'm quite certain there are mental health professionals who are able to use some tools to evaluate and spot a possibility of something like this happening.

Someone working as a professional coach should strive to educate themselves in all sorts of psychology.

Not saying Erik should have known he's a fecking rapist.

But he does have a weird temper attitude.
Maybe he could have picked up on that vibe and not pursue the transfer.

that’s daft, how will your boss know what you’re upto in your personal life. Its not like anyone who’s a rapist announces it at his workplace.

Coaching football players isn't your old regular "boss - employee" workplace.

You're dealing with 16, 17 year old kids here, who are on massive superstar wages with through the roof Ego's and fancy sports cars.

It's not a 9-5 job working with highly educated people in a non competitive profession.

We need to invest in proper psychologists, profilers.

 

[LARulz]

Could easily be another Mendy situation. When a court of law charges him, then we can talk. Personally i'd suspend when he's convicted, not before. Can't wait one or two years, it's simply unfair towards the player who's career is very short.

Convicted or charged? Cos even Greenwood I don't think was convicted

 

[talking robot]

The club set a dangerous precedent by exiling Greenwood while nevertheless claiming his innocence. To be coherent, now any player who is accused of wrongdoing by a social media mob has to receive similar treatment, even if falsely accused. I'm not at all saying I know whether Antony is guilty or not, but a single or even multiple accusations should not be enough cause to have a player punished until the facts are examined in a court of law (which is the only place where details will be examined neutrally, and with enough scrutiny to tell us what is most likely to be the truth). If only public pressure matters, while truth (plus institutions seeking truth) counts for little, that is not a manageable or desirable way of running an organisation (or society for that matter).

 

[Andersonson]

Why do you think that?

The pressure by fans and media will sufficate everything. It's too much going on to not deal with it heavily. He will look very weak if Greenwood is thrown away and Antony plays like nothing has happened. Sancho case is also there. Media will be all over this for a long time and I think the dressing room will collapse if players like Antony have a free card. I didn't say it was correct, but we have a very bleak management above the manager. Don't trust them to make the correct call at all regarding any of this

 

[Beachryan]

If we were still the United of the SAF era, I think we'd have some leeway to try and pull the 'these accusations are taken very seriously, the club and player will cooperate in every way with the relevant authourities and will re-evaluate our position if anything officially changes. But at the moment, the player has not been charged with any crimes, denies any wrongdoing and therefore is available if the coach believes he should be selected."

Because United had some gravitas, a good record of professionalism and obviously Fergie. But today? With the Glazers in charge and after the Greenwood fiasco we lack all crediblity. Imo we have to give into the mob here, no matter if he's innocent or not. Which is sad and pathetic, but it's where we are as a club.

 

[hobbers]

As damning as other people coming forward is overall, the club still cant suspend him until he's formally charged. Doing so would be a monumental cock up.

 

[redshaw]

Could be a long time before any clear understanding is gained. I could see him being withdrawn for a couple of months as he possibly won't be in a good frame of mind to play but a full on suspension for 1-2 years seems a bit much, especially with other players continuing. MG is probably an exception not a precedent or rule for any player under an accusation to be suspended indefinitely.

 

[Eugenius]

Has he even been arrested yet? Isn't there a certain Arsenal player who has been arrested and bailed for similar issues and no one is complaining that he plays?

 

[golden_blunder]

I hope Antony case is like Neymar when he was being framed/falsely accused.

By his sister?