Are Bruno and Rashford a problem?

Musclehead said:
The leadership on this team has been missing for a decade. This is part of the problem. Name a player who takes the game by the throat and says damn if we are not going to win? Then expects that from every other player? As someone on here said, there are different ways of leading, Bruno does not lead, he follows.
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The problem is, being the captain, the team does follow him - the good parts and the overwhelmingly bad parts as well.
 
Lentwood said:
We won't know until we have a competent manager in-charge.

The problem at the moment is not individuals, it's the system(s)
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You're right, giving these two players the roles and responsibilities that they're incapable of performing, is solely on the manager. And they're duly sinking him.
 
Bruno just suffering from new contract syndrome, same as Rashford.

But the sly smile when subbed last week was very telling. Think the players will start downing tools after the break
 
Redstain said:
Bruno was a disaster today, Rashford is bereft of confidence but he's kept it simple and the play ticking over.

Lost count how many times today the attack failed due to Fernandes Hollywood pass attempts.

If United get a half competent manager in, Bruno's period of being the talisman is over. It's not a surprise that he's never featured in a United which have a balance midfield.
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It’s not just the Hollywood balls for me, I feel a lot of the time he’ll make an “accurate” pass to another player but it’s a yard or two behind where it needs to be, by the time the receiving player has adjusted their run, the momentum has been sucked out of the attack. It’ll go down as an accurate pass on his stats, but it wasn’t really.

And then a couple of times a game, he’ll play an absolute defence shredding peach of a pass, which is largely something none of our other players seem capable of.

It’ll take a confident manager willing to sacrifice that, for a more consistent style of play to emerge. Bruno papers over some very large structural cracks for us.
 
I don't think this is a problem that falls at the feet of individual players, but I personally think Rashford isn't going to get any better, on an individual level.

Fernandes is arguably our best player, but he isn't playing well of late, and can't pull the strings like you'd expect him to in a team that has a losers mentality and isn't coached by a manager who can instil a vision and sell it to the team.

Our system is unclear to me. You can analyse it all you want, but we have players on paper who have real talent, and either the players are broken, or the manager can't coach them cohesively enough to get a tune out of them on a regular basis. The rot has set in with this manager.
 
I think it's so clear Rashford is a problem there is literally no point in discussing it. Bruno on the other hand I've been worried about for the last few years. The way he plays the game doesn't seem to suit a team that can win the league, constantly trying low percentage Hollywood passes, rarely pulling it off and turning over possession constantly.

Basically I think the existence of Bruno and Rashford has triggered this decision to push to this so called 'transitional' style of play, and i just don't think we can win the league with it, even if we did have a competent manager.
 
fergiewherearethou said:
We could find out if our incompetent manager would bench them for 2-3 games and see the outcome for himself.
You don't have to be a genius to try and change things.
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It's not an argument in defence of the individuals necessarily. I rate Bruno, I don't rate Rashford, but that's not the point.

My point is that our system is so ludicrously flawed that it renders analysing any individuals entirely pointless.

Its like trying to assess a sprinter who's coach is demanding they run backwards, a rugby team who've been instructed not to use their hands or a golfer who's playing with an umbrella.
 
Bruno isn't a problem. He has absolute elite skills that any competent coach would correctly utilise. Unfortunately it seems ETH isn't that and yet still he's generally our only hope of a positive result

Rashford is a problem as he remains our best bet for goals despite the fact he's barely had a good game in 18 mths. That every possible replacement we have is young and inexperienced means we've had to persevere with him. Unless one of Garna/Hojlund/Zirkzee or Amad suddenly have a break out season we'll have no choice but continue relying on him and sadly I see him getting worse rather than better. His heads gone
 
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Get in Rabbiot or another central midfielder and go 4-3-3 with Mainoo, Ugarte and Rabbiot is the only way forward. Rashford and Bruno should be dropped.
 
Bruno would be fine in a better team where everything isn't expected to go through him and he's not captain (meaning, a team with a competent head coach)

Rashford however is dog shit and we should be looking for buyers.
 
honirelandboy said:
Get in Rabbiot or another central midfielder and go 4-3-3 with Mainoo, Ugarte and Rabbiot is the only way forward. Rashford and Bruno should be dropped.
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Yeah like that is going to happen. They all have a circle jerk session going on every day. Why they would they be dropped?
 
Red_Aaron said:
Bruno isn't a problem. He has absolute elite skills that any competent coach would correctly utilise. Unfortunately it seems ETH isn't that and yet still he's generally our only hope of a positive result

Rashford is a problem as he remains our best bet for goals despite the fact he's barely had a good game in 18 mths. That every possible replacement we have is young and inexperienced means we've had to persevere with him. Unless one of Garna/Hojlund/Zirkzee or Amad suddenly have a break out season we'll have no choice but continue relying on him and sadly I see him getting worse rather than better. His heads gone
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This about sums it up for me
 
Red_Aaron said:
Bruno isn't a problem. He has absolute elite skills that any competent coach would correctly utilise. Unfortunately it seems ETH isn't that and yet still he's generally our only hope of a positive result

Rashford is a problem as he remains our best bet for goals despite the fact he's barely had a good game in 18 mths. That every possible replacement we have is young and inexperienced means we've had to persevere with him. Unless one of Garna/Hojlund/Zirkzee or Amad suddenly have a break out season we'll have no choice but continue relying on him and sadly I see him getting worse rather than better. His heads gone
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Such elite skills he couldn't do a basic pass yesterday.
 
Liverpool not giving Salah a new contract due to his age and slight decline whilst United give new deals to Bruno/Rashford despite them having less offensive output combined highlights the difference between the two clubs.
 
Who should we get as a coach? Who can we get? This shits been going on for 10 years now and most of the names that have been mentioned over this time have failed everywhere they went instead of here and most of the rest have faded into obscurity.
 
I remember a time when Rashford was being compared to Mbappe on here.Crazy how he has fallen off
 
TonyShneak said:
I think it's so clear Rashford is a problem there is literally no point in discussing it. Bruno on the other hand I've been worried about for the last few years. The way he plays the game doesn't seem to suit a team that can win the league, constantly trying low percentage Hollywood passes, rarely pulling it off and turning over possession constantly.

Basically I think the existence of Bruno and Rashford has triggered this decision to push to this so called 'transitional' style of play, and i just don't think we can win the league with it, even if we did have a competent manager.
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This indeed.
 
The real problem with both and others including Onana is that it doesn't matter how badly they play, they know they'll be in ten Hag's first eleven for the next game.

Playing favourites at the top level of any team sport is poison.
 
BuzzKillington said:
It’s not just the Hollywood balls for me, I feel a lot of the time he’ll make an “accurate” pass to another player but it’s a yard or two behind where it needs to be, by the time the receiving player has adjusted their run, the momentum has been sucked out of the attack. It’ll go down as an accurate pass on his stats, but it wasn’t really.
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Reminds me of a YouTube video I was watching today where they said Bruno is like a delivery man who'll get the package to you, but it won't be in one piece through the letterbox, it's gonna be in bits dumped on the lawn or the driveway!
 
Bruno is a very good player, what he needs is to be moved back into the 8 and told not to charge around like a madman and just play ball from deep. His range of passing is great and he is very physically fit, really feel he is being misused but we have no Mount to sit in the 10.

Rashford looks pretty washed up currently, I think we should have cashed in when we could rather than keep him while he flounders.
 
Should have sold Rashford to PSG two years ago (if the rumors were true). Don’t know what to make of Bruno’s wild inconsistency. One game he scores from outside the box, outside of the boot passes that are sublime. Next match he’s hellbent on giving the ball away cheaply. A new contract was probably a bit hasty, in hindsight.
 
Carrying an ineffective winger (Rashford) is costing us and it''s sinking ETH.

If Liverpool had Rashford playing for them, they wouldn't have won 3-0. Their attacks are positive, direct and fast. Ours mostly the opposite.

He's lost his confidence AND clearly struggling with a misfiring system. We do play some decent football, sometimes, and do sometimes look like we might score. The problem is when other teams attack, it often looks like they will score. We're not getting the ball into dangerous areas at all, and choosing to overpass and/or slow things down when attacking. Watching visitors being so direct against us every time at OT is more demoralising to me than anything else.
 
I find it interesting if you go back to Brunos very first game with us and look at the areas he was picking the ball up in. He's been moved from the advanced 8 position, to now playing like a second striker at times.
 
MDFC Manager said:
The problem is, being the captain, the team does follow him - the good parts and the overwhelmingly bad parts as well.
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When have you ever seen Bruno be a pure star, grab the game and say we are winning this? The guy really has little compete level, sure there are moments, but start to finish few. I like to watch games from yester year and the difference is something to behold. Setups, discipline, compete levels are 50x what they are today. In fact, they are what they are, an 8th or 10th best team at present. Look at what Klopp did, progressed year over year. This team is going in the opposite direction. Spending money, bringing in players then declining. Something is broken here, more than just on the field.
 
The short period of time in which Bruno and Rashford went from being our main men to build a team around to being "a problem" and "not suitable to succeed as a team" seems ridiculous to me. It's pretty obvious that a lot of it has to do with EtH's tactics, especially when we talk about Bruno. He is forced to play a role that doesn't suit his player profile and the Bruno from Ole's days, who picks up balls from everywhere across the pitch and distributes them is unrecognizable by now. Whether you now think they are the problem or that ten Hag is the problem because he fails to work with his main players, is based on your personal view. But to say that these players are somehow the main reason why we are so unsuccessful is a bit off imo. We all know that they used to be great players not so long ago, it's not that hard to remember.
 
FlawlessVictory88 said:
Liverpool not giving Salah a new contract due to his age and slight decline whilst United give new deals to Bruno/Rashford despite them having less offensive output combined highlights the difference between the two clubs.
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It remains to be seen if that will be the correct decision. Salah is still the best player in the league and a match winner. That’s not an easy player to replace particularly if they lose him for nothing. I don’t see how that’s good squad management at all.
 
Lentwood said:
It's not an argument in defence of the individuals necessarily. I rate Bruno, I don't rate Rashford, but that's not the point.

My point is that our system is so ludicrously flawed that it renders analysing any individuals entirely pointless.

Its like trying to assess a sprinter who's coach is demanding they run backwards, a rugby team who've been instructed not to use their hands or a golfer who's playing with an umbrella.
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I agree with you, but if the current system is flawed, as a manager, wouldn't you try and change things?
It's clear as daylight that what he tried didn't work, or worked only sporadically, which is not sustainable on the long run.
 
fergiewherearethou said:
I agree with you, but if the current system is flawed, as a manager, wouldn't you try and change things?
It's clear as daylight that what he tried didn't work, or worked only sporadically, which is not sustainable on the long run.
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He won't change though will he, because he's arrogant and stubborn. He's used to running all over NAC Breda and Groningen with a vastly superior team and he almost beat Tottenham once, so that's convinced him he's operating at a level of genius nobody else can comprehend.
 
Rashford increasingly so, Bruno in terrible form right now but will come good.

They're not ideal but there's bigger issues at the club right now. I would prefer to play the season with them than without, unlike a few current members of the first team.
 
Lentwood said:
He won't change though will he, because he's arrogant and stubborn. He's used to running all over NAC Breda and Groningen with a vastly superior team and he almost beat Tottenham once, so that's convinced him he's operating at a level of genius nobody else can comprehend.
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If last season's league performance wasn't a lesson, it's clear that he won't change.
Being stubborn is not necessarily a defect as long as the end goal gets you to success, but it is not the case with him.
 
Westerkerk said:
I don't think this is a problem that falls at the feet of individual players, but I personally think Rashford isn't going to get any better, on an individual level.

Fernandes is arguably our best player, but he isn't playing well of late, and can't pull the strings like you'd expect him to in a team that has a losers mentality and isn't coached by a manager who can instil a vision and sell it to the team.

Our system is unclear to me. You can analyse it all you want, but we have players on paper who have real talent, and either the players are broken, or the manager can't coach them cohesively enough to get a tune out of them on a regular basis. The rot has set in with this manager.
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I will agree on the system is broken. I just don't get the why or the how of it? This team was a championship team for decades, 2 people leave and the wheels fall off. That is pure poor succession planning.
 
We desperately need to gain more control in midfield and stop being overrun. I can’t find a fit for Bruno if we ever try to achieve this, which under EtH we are not likely to as he clearly doesn’t see the problem. Is Bruno a good player, of course he is - but he’s more of a luxury at the moment as he doesn’t really contribute to the defensive aspects of midfield. At times we are more or less playing 4-2-4 and wondering why there is a gaping hole in midfield. In the other Best X1 thread I couldn’t fit either Bruno or Rashford in - two of our most highest paid players.
 
Both can be but they are also capable of so much more.
Rashford lacks confidence at times.
Bruno lacks composure at times.

If they can overcome those obstacles they will be amazing to watch.
 
The Oracle said:
Between the Premier League, Champions League, and the League Cup, we have played a total of 14 games so far this season.

We have had a very poor start to the campaign, yet there was a standout match when we played really well.

That match was against Crystal Palace at home in the Carabao Cup, when we won 3-0

...Bruno and Rashford didn't play in that 3-0 win, yet they have played in every other game this season.

Are Bruno and Rashford a problem, or was it just a coincidence that in the best match we have played this season, Bruno and Rashford didn't feature?
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Should Rashford and McGuire have been added to this list of players out and maybe controversially, Bruno, if taking the captaincy, which I think is necessary becomes a sticking point ???
 
Reddeadphoenix said:
Should Rashford and McGuire have been added to this list of players out and maybe controversially, Bruno, if taking the captaincy, which I think is necessary becomes a sticking point ???
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You're replying to a post that's almost a year old.

McGuire, really? Maguire.

And lastly, what are you saying?
 
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