Barca and Real - showing up La Liga?

RedRover

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Just watched the Real and Barca games and was, as usual, very impressed - particularly by Barca, winning at a canter yet again.

The stats for Barca are incredible: over 900 passes in the game (aparently the highest ever recorded by Opta), Xavi completed over 120 (more than any other player in La Liga in the 67 minutes he was on the pitch, Valdes hasn't conceded in the last 10 hours of football he's played and they've scored 27 goasl since they last conceded.

Firstly, just so I'm clear I've never seen any team play the game like this. The performance against Madrid was incredible and was probably the best team performance I've ever seen. Madrid are a good side but just not good enough it seems.

My point is that while its superb watching Barca play, what does it say about La Liga? It's certainly the best league in the world in terms of technical ability and skill level, but for me that doesn't make it the most entertaining.

Its a two horse race every year and those two horses are far and away better than the others (Villarreal currently sit 16 points of Barca in 5th place). You get only one really big derby - El Classico, and the other games are all pretty much teams fighting it out for third or fourth place.

The PL can be accused of being a closed shop in the past, but arguably not any more. For me the intesity of the game in England is often mistaken for physicality on its own, and while that plays a part its not the full story.

The PL has the excitement that La Liga doesn't. There's something charming about the likes of Blackpool who go out and take a chance, Bolton trying to play real football against teh bigger sides and even the likes of Stoke trying to batter a better team about - clashes of style rather than guaranteed winners in a league were anything can happen in one off games - even if the end result is usually the same, against a league where most teams don't even look like scoring against the top two.

I'd be interested to know people's opinions on the PL generally. Most entertaining league in the world?
 
Well, the premier league has been a two horse race for quite some time - with arsenal as close third. In terms of leagues won, it's pretty similar between LL and EPL for the last 10 years (Valencia snatched a couple this decade).

When you go deeper and start talking about "the grit of Bolton" or "the character of Blackpool", personally I just don't follow La Liga enough to be able to characterize the teams there in the same manner. Maybe some of you guys do and really know which players are good at Hercules or Deportivo etc, but honestly I think most of the tards on here just simply give the EPL a lot more attention and therefore want it to be better/more exciting. A bit similar to how people are pro-mac or pro-windows.
 
Look past the top two and La Liga is also pretty exciting. I'd say it's way more interesting than the Premier League.

For Blackpool, see Mallorca last season. Skint, with dodgy finances, a squad thinner than a size zero model and the quality of a relegation side - nearly getting into the Europa League. Of course, there were serious questions about whether this was the rough equivalent of financial doping gone wrong, with Mallorca owing money left right and centre, and although they were kicked out eventually, they really did nearly pull off a dream ending.

Then you had Néstor Gorosito and his hilarious hairstyle pulling out mid-table form from a comatose Xerez, but unfortunately he joined too late to save them. He did take their relegation to the final round of fixtures before determining their relegation, though.

Then you have the extremely exciting "second-tier" sides - Sevilla, Villarreal and Atlético - all with very good sides and play really good football.

La Liga must blood a million talented kids per season, too - watching Canales last season was a real sight. Past seasons have included Álvaro Negredo, whoever the Barcelona academy decide to produce, Muniain, De Gea and Asenjo, to name a few.

I do think that some of the defending in La Liga is borderline suicidal at times, but that only makes for ridiculously-exciting games.
 
F-Red said:
Look at the points tally between the two leagues. 8th spot in La Liga last year was 45pts off the top spot. 8th in the Premier League was 25pts.
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That might just be because the 1st place team in La Liga is one of the greatest teams of all time.
 
F-Red said:
Look at the points tally between the two leagues. 8th spot in La Liga last year was 45pts off the top spot. 8th in the Premier League was 25pts.
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That shows the gaps between the top teams in respective league vs. the rest, doesn't say much about absolute strength of mid-table teams though.

In another words, Everton cannot say they were stronger than Bilbao, just because they were 'only' 25 points of Chelsea, whereas Bilbao were 45 points of Barca. Remember Barca accumulated 99 points last season, where Chelsea only got 86. It's all relative.
 
kietotheworld said:
That might just be because the 1st place team in La Liga is one of the greatest teams of all time.
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Madrid only had something like 3 points less than them and they clearly aren't one of the best sides of all time so it kinda disproves your theory don't you think?
 
Care_de_Bobo said:
Madrid only had something like 3 points less than them and they clearly aren't one of the best sides of all time so it kinda disproves your theory don't you think?
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Not really - it just shows how far ahead of the curve Real Madrid (and Barcelona) are compared with the rest of La Liga.

That Real Madrid side wasn't one of the best of all-time - but it was a pretty good team (or perhaps more accurately, pretty good set of players).
 
La Liga is a joke, not really arsed what anyone else thinks. The fact Madrid got something like 97 points last year and didnt win the league is just laughable.
 
RedRover said:
The PL has the excitement that La Liga doesn't. There's something charming about the likes of Blackpool who go out and take a chance, Bolton trying to play real football against teh bigger sides and even the likes of Stoke trying to batter a better team about - clashes of style rather than guaranteed winners in a league were anything can happen in one off games - even if the end result is usually the same, against a league where most teams don't even look like scoring against the top two.
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Hercules are doing the Blackpool thing - they even did it at the Nou Camp and came home with 3 points. There's a fair few kickers around too, but just as United and Chelsea seldom get kicked out of a match by Stoke, Madrid and Barca seldom lose to them.

As for Bolton, half of La Liga are Bolton - trying to play football against better sides.

What's odd about La Liga is that no one battens down the hatches when they're a goal or two down (and most of them don't do it when they're a goal or two up either). I'd guess it's partly cultural and it's partly down to the fact that goal difference doesn't matter much. They'll all try and get a point until they're at least three behind :smirk: Even when they're playing Barca and everyone else knows that the game's over once Barca score.

The current freakish form of Madrid and Barca is like watching an arms race being played out, but like all things it's not static. It didn't exist two years ago - and it's unlikely to exist in two years time.
 
kietotheworld said:
I think Real Madrid are a fantastic side.
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I think they're a good team to watch.

There's been something psychologically wrong with them for a while though.

I think partly down to the fact that half the team think they could get culled in the next transfer window and partly the outrageous press/fan pressure in general. The team hadn't won a knockout match of any kind for three years when Mourinho arrived and for the past couple of years you can throw the Barca games in as a kind of knockout match as well. Appalling stage fright - and they've still suffering it away from home.
 
F-Red said:
Look at the points tally between the two leagues. 8th spot in La Liga last year was 45pts off the top spot. 8th in the Premier League was 25pts.
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Obviously that's because Barca & Madrid are far superior to the rest. I reckon both would run away with the PL as well. Their ability to beat lesser sides is far greater than any one of the top teams in England.
 
TonyMontana said:
The mid-table clubs are more strong in the PL than in La Liga.
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The two teams in 10th and 11th (which is the middle) of the PL are Blackpool and WBA. I would fancy Spain's Mallorca and Sevilla against those two.

Randall Flagg said:
I dont think so. Also I reckon relegation canditates are stronger in La Liga.

But PL pisses all over positions 3-6/7
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Agree 100%.
 
The PL is just a better league at the moment, I think. Yes Barca and Real can be brilliant to watch due to the talent they have, but look at that Chelsea-Spurs match yesterday, the relentless pace that you just wouldn't get in La Liga between the title favorites and a 4th/5th place team.
 
There's far too much Pro-Premier League wanking at RedCafe.

There are other good leagues in the world, not just England.

I'd rather watch Villareal v Bilbao than Bolton v fecking Blackburn Rovers any day of the week.
 
It's a terrible league ATM. A bit of a joke to be honest. Rather than a case of two great teams, it's more a case of one great team and the other looking great because the rest of the league is not very good.

The premier league is miles better. Ronaldo scored at the rate he's doing for fun in Spain only during his best ever season in England. Apart from that season his scoring rate was a bit more human. It's ridiculous really, it's like a home game every time for Barca or Real. It's a sham ATM.
 
amolbhatia100 said:
It's a terrible league ATM. A bit of a joke to be honest. Rather than a case of two great teams, it's more a case of one great team and the other looking great because the rest of the league is not very good.

The premier league is miles better. Ronaldo scored at the rate he's doing for fun in Spain only during his best ever season in England. Apart from that season his scoring rate was a bit more human. It's ridiculous really, it's like a home game every time for Barca or Real. It's a sham ATM.
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It really isn't that bad.
 
Plan M said:
It really isn't that bad.
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You're right. I exaggerated. Obviously it is a good league, but for me it has kind of died. Two of the worlds best play there and they barely get tested. It's not a fun league to watch at all for me.
 
It's true that no other club seem to "have a go" at Barca or Real Madrid, which is a shame, because it would make the league far more interesting at the top.

But like I've already said, I prefer the midtable fixtures in La Liga to the Premier League.
 
la liga teams are suited to playing open, attacking football. Which just so happens to make things easier for teams like Barcelona and Real. Its the same as when Arsenal come up against one of the few premier league teams lower in the table that like to get the ball on the floor, pass it around and attack. Arsenal destroy them. La liga is like a whole league of teams who want to play the ball around and get a goal or two but it leaves them as easy pickings when things dont go perfectly, against a much better opposition like Madrid or Barcelona. There are a few days where it does go perfectly though and they get their result, usually playing brilliant football too
 
Barcelona v Chelsea
Real Madrid v United
Valencia v Arseanal
Sevilla v Tottenham
Mallorca v City
Getafe v Villa
Villarreal v Liverpool
Athletic Bilbao v Everton
Atlético Madrid v Birmingham
Deportivo La Coruña vBlackburn
Espanyol v Stoke
Osasuna v Fulham
Almería v Sunderland
Zaragoza v Bolton
Sporting de Gijón v Wolves
Racing Santander v Wigan
Málaga v West Ham
Real Sociedad v Newcastle
Hercules v West Brom
Levante v Blackpool

Based on last year's standings - anyone have enough knowledge of both leagues to make an analysis?
 
It's embarassing how Barce and Real will both drop points in about 2 games now max till the end of the season.

What a bad leauge.
 
Its a very good league, Barcelona and Real Madrid have just spent their fortunes a bit more wisely than City. They'd have very similar success in the premier league.
 
Twigginater said:
It's embarassing how Barce and Real will both drop points in about 2 games now max till the end of the season.

What a bad leauge.
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The PL has had a very similar years. We have walked the league at least 3 times. And Chelsea have once too. At least in Spain the 2 will be close together.

Over the years La Liga has been far more competitive than the PL. Valencia, Deportivo. Atletico, Real and Barc have all won it in the time that just 3 have in the PL. Plus teams like Sociadad and Seville have all looked serious contenders in the past decade.

It’s all cycles, but to say La Liga is a bad league is well off the mark. It just so happens that right now 2 of the world’s strongest teams are firing on all cylinders right now
 
x42bn6 said:
Not really - it just shows how far ahead of the curve Real Madrid (and Barcelona) are compared with the rest of La Liga.

That Real Madrid side wasn't one of the best of all-time - but it was a pretty good team (or perhaps more accurately, pretty good set of players).
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I think thats the point I was trying to get at. Barca are a truly great side - there's no doubt about that, but they can only accumulate so many points.

The fact that Real were so close behind - the difference being the Derby result - kind of highlights the point: Barca are fantastic and woudl probably win any leage in the world, but the team right behind them who finished miles above any other team haven't passed the second round of the CL for six years.

Its an interesting argument though.
 
Plan M said:
There's far too much Pro-Premier League wanking at RedCafe.

There are other good leagues in the world, not just England.

I'd rather watch Villareal v Bilbao than Bolton v fecking Blackburn Rovers any day of the week.
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Bolton v Blackburn was a very entertaining game actually. Had a bit of everything and again, a clash of styles.

Perhaps people love the PL on here because most are English, or (usually) United fans. Just a thought.
 
Plan M said:
There's far too much Pro-Premier League wanking at RedCafe.

There are other good leagues in the world, not just England.

I'd rather watch Villareal v Bilbao than Bolton v fecking Blackburn Rovers any day of the week.
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This is Sky's fault in a way. When you have Andy Gray constantly saying things like only in the PL bottom can beat top and late goals only occur in the PL some tend to fall for it.
 
RedRover said:
Bolton v Blackburn was a very entertaining game actually. Had a bit of everything and again, a clash of styles.

Perhaps people love the PL on here because most are English, or (usually) United fans. Just a thought.
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There is absolutely no doubt about that.I went to italian and spanish club fans forums and yeah most of them prefer their national league or the league their favorite team plays in
 
Kraftwerker said:
With the TV deal, the top two in La Liga is set in stone for the next decade.

I can't even predict the top two in the Premier League this season, let alone for the next decade.

SPLiga.
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In no particular order it will be us and Chelsea. Guarenteed
 
Randall Flagg said:
This is Sky's fault in a way. When you have Andy Gray constantly saying things like only in the PL bottom can beat top and late goals only occur in the PL some tend to fall for it.
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Oh man, that is one of the most annoying things about Gray, right up there with the little dialogues between players he improvises.
 
Kraftwerker said:
With the TV deal, the top two in La Liga is set in stone for the next decade.

I can't even predict the top two in the Premier League this season, let alone for the next decade.

SPLiga.
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It's not set in stone, at all. They had the same type of TV deal in 2007/08 and Barcelona finished third. You could probably predict the the top two in the Premier League this season if you tried, it'll be the same as it has been for 4 of the last 5 seasons.
 
The comparisons to the SPL are pretty tiresome. The last time the Spanish league winners weren't Real Madrid or Barcelona was in 03/04, which was quite a while ago but is the exact same length of time since the winners of the league in England weren't Chelsea or Manchester United. The last time the winners of the league in Scotland weren't Celtic or Rangers was in 84/85.
 
Wonder Pigeon said:
The comparisons to the SPL are pretty tiresome. The last time the Spanish league winners weren't Real Madrid or Barcelona was in 03/04, which was quite a while ago but is the exact same length of time since the winners of the league in England weren't Chelsea or Manchester United. The last time the winners of the league in Scotland weren't Celtic or Rangers was in 84/85.
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The comparison with the SPL is valid when you look at the last couple of seasons though.

Even when United and Chelsea were at their most dominant, the gulf between them and the rest of the league was nothing like as marked as the gulf between Real/Barca and the rest of La Liga (or Celtic/Rangers and the rest of the SPL)
 
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