Tis true
Benitez
- Thread starter wr8_utd
- Start date
It depends on where you are making the decision.
I would rather be in a champions league final than a EL final before I knew either result.
I would rather be in the champions league final not knowing that result than knowing I had already won the EL.
Surely you cant say you'd rather lose a CL final than win a EL one knowing both results?
If Moyes fails to get us through our group with the squad and the seeding we have then he's off to a deeply worrying start. And if he does that and is out of the title running by December then I think his job may be under threat.
Over the longer term being a key phrase. You think in the summer of 2009 when we lost Ronaldo and Tevez and brought in Valencia and Owen, was Ferguson thinking "I wont settle for anything less than European domination". In the context of an argument over what would be an acceptable season, good season, bad season, for a new manager, Fergie's own admission that "you can't win the league every year" holds some relevance, I imagine.
Since we're discussing Rafa specifically, he had nothing to do with their CL group stage exit. He took over 3rd place team in the league, finishes 3rd, wins the Europa League. Of course it's not groundbreaking stuff, but it's a decent showing at the very least, especially given the attempts to hound at the club.
FSW has done well, give him another year at the chavs!
Hard to say.
The Europa league holds no relevance to me at this moment in time to be honest. It's just what I've become used to at United. We've been spoilt. Straight simple! I'm not trying to run down Chelsea's achievement or anyone else's.....Having said that, in about 5 years time I'll be posting here stating why us winning the Europa league is better then the CL
I bet he's currently sitting at his laptop with Word open, updating his CV.
Will he write a book about this one? Maybe give after dinner/conference/works party speechs about how amazing his half time team talk was and how he single handedly turned the tie in chelseas favour with his inspiring wordplay
If anything he's under achieved. He should be walking away with a Cup treble in all honesty. They blew the World Club Cup and the League Cup.
Chelsea wasn't out of title running by December. And as I said, I don't have high expectation of new manager on his first season. And that include even if we go out on the CL group stage. Us finishing 3rd next season isn't the end of the world, as that is understandable. With the squad we have in the last 2-3 years, I can't see any manager in the world could land us 2 league titles, other then Fergie. Then you combine that with us having new manager in Moyes.
First season for a manager like Moyes is a write off, in my book. Anything else is a big bonus. The 2nd and 3rd seasons are where I expect to see us being a strong force again.
Got to hand it to him; he's a survivor. Here's a song that could have been written for him (listen for the great horn solo by Rico Rodriguez):
He was there for half of the season, I don't think he proved anything we didn't know about him. He did a good job, but you would expect him to do that because he is a good manager(I know lot of us won't admit that).
This is the manager who won Champions League with a team that lined up with:
Dudek, Finnan, Hyypia, Carragher, Traore, Alonso, Gerrard, Riise, Kewell, Garcia, Baros.
Players like Josemi, Nunez, Cisse and Smicer also played a part in their campaign. This is a genuinely awful side compared to teams they faced (Capello's Juventus, Chelsea, Milan), mostly assembled by Houllier (Alonso and Garcia are the only Benitez buys in here). He had already proven that he can get the best out of players, especially in the short term.
He's basically done the same thing at Chelsea now. He hasn't proven that he can build a great side and sustain it long term which was the main issue Liverpool board had with him. His 2007-09 team was really talented - Reina, Alonso, Mascherano and Torres were all great buys and they had some decent players like Agger, Skrtel and Kuyt too. Then it all went wrong when he had to add the last ingredients to the team - he tried to sell Alonso and replace him with Barry, eventually sold Alonso and replaced him with Aquilani, bought Keane for £20m and Johnson for £18m and generally lost the plot. It'd be unfair to judge him on his time at Inter because it was a short spell and he wasn't allowed to make any changes which is why I think it's ridiculous when people say that he 'destroyed Inter'. He didn't do anything to them and they required a rebuilding work even though it was a CL winning team.
Dudek, Finnan, Hyypia, Carragher, Traore, Alonso, Gerrard, Riise, Kewell, Garcia, Baros.
Players like Josemi, Nunez, Cisse and Smicer also played a part in their campaign. This is a genuinely awful side compared to teams they faced (Capello's Juventus, Chelsea, Milan), mostly assembled by Houllier (Alonso and Garcia are the only Benitez buys in here). He had already proven that he can get the best out of players, especially in the short term.
He's basically done the same thing at Chelsea now. He hasn't proven that he can build a great side and sustain it long term which was the main issue Liverpool board had with him. His 2007-09 team was really talented - Reina, Alonso, Mascherano and Torres were all great buys and they had some decent players like Agger, Skrtel and Kuyt too. Then it all went wrong when he had to add the last ingredients to the team - he tried to sell Alonso and replace him with Barry, eventually sold Alonso and replaced him with Aquilani, bought Keane for £20m and Johnson for £18m and generally lost the plot. It'd be unfair to judge him on his time at Inter because it was a short spell and he wasn't allowed to make any changes which is why I think it's ridiculous when people say that he 'destroyed Inter'. He didn't do anything to them and they required a rebuilding work even though it was a CL winning team.
He won that final not Benitez.Gerrard decided to take the game by the scruff of the neck when Milan thought they'd won it,and saved Benitez' reputation.
After that, you're right he did lose the plot
Very hard to go into a side halfway through and judge his worth over the entirety of a half season. If Moyes was to get 3rd, get kicked out of CL and we were to win Europa League , I'd be happy with that as he's new to the job and hopefully with time he could translate that success to the CL.
By giving a manager time, he can see the strengths and weaknesses in the squad and react accordingly. If you keep chopping and changing managers, every new manager will take time to take into account or come to term with the existing problems and will face a similar slow starting period where he'll encounter problems.
By giving a manager time, he can see the strengths and weaknesses in the squad and react accordingly. If you keep chopping and changing managers, every new manager will take time to take into account or come to term with the existing problems and will face a similar slow starting period where he'll encounter problems.
That's modern football though. We are no longer in a position to be able to pretend otherwise, Moyes will need time but the days of a coach staying for years is really over. Wenger is now the longest serving manager in the PL but who knows how much longer that will last
They still needed to reach that final (I agree that they were extremely lucky to win it and Gerrard played a major part and bailed them out, to an extent) by beating Juventus and Chelsea over two legs, neither of them were pushovers really - Juventus were winning Serie A that season and Chelsea were by far the best side in England. It's only that season, Liverpool consistently overachieved in Europe under Benitez except for his last season and the time they went out to Benfica (2005-06, wasn't it?). They knocked out what seemed to have been Barcelona's best team in years with Ronaldinho and Eto'o in 2006-07, after winning at Camp Nou too.
The fact Liverpool were even in Istanbul is one of football's great miracles. That side was shocking on paper.
I get the excuse that 'hey that's modern football..' but is that leading to any sustainable success? no... so why don't chairmen realise they're being counter-productive. 2-3 years is enough to sense if there is progress, and as long as there is progress... no need to go in chopping and changing, unless there is a situation like ourselves or Bayern, where there is bound to be a drop as you're replacing whilst in a position of strength.
I do think however that Mancini was making some very poor decisions and I think he was making his position untenable, he seems quite antagonistic and doesn't seem to be the greatest judge of players... still don't get the decision to get rid of De Jong and how the likes of Milner and Barry feature for a side aspiring to win the CL I do not know. He arguably deserved one more year to at least be given the chance that he possesses the ability to rectify what is wrong with the current side.
On the other hand there is Arsenal where I'd argue Wenger has been given almost too long, he's not bringing any success, they're not bringing in players of the right character and ability to challenge the elite but I assume that there is a serious warchest building and that Wenger has thus been biding his time hence the mutual desire to keep the 'status quo' and not rock the boat at the Emirates. Clearly there is faith that Wenger has still 'got it' and backed with the right money he is capable of producing a top notch side.
Gerrard played a real captain's game that night. He just refused to be beaten.
Hardly a miracle considering Monaco and Porto played the previous season's final.
It's a cup.competition, upsets happen.
Yeah but they needed to beat Juventus and Chelsea on the way, two of the most solid sides in Europe that season.
Porto the season before beat an under-par United side that was struggling in the league, Lyon and Deportivo - only Lyon out of all these teams went on to win their league that season. Besides, Porto had a great team back then with the core of Carvalho, Maniche, Costinha, Deco and Derlei. The spine of that team was also the spine of Portugal team that went all the way to the European Championship final a month later.
Monaco beat Lokomotiv, struggling but still great Real Madrid (amazing achievement) and Chelsea side still under construction. Their squad wasn't really impressive, of all their players Giuly went on to have a good spell at Barcelona and obviously Evra went on to be a key member of a successful United side but the likes of Rothen, Prso, Squillaci, Bernardi, Cisse, Ibarra and even Morientes didn't do much afterwards. That 2003-04 season was the highlight of their careers.
Both were unexpected finalists but Liverpool in the final a year later was even more of a shock to me considering they actually had to beat two great sides to get there, completely against the odds because they didn't have much going for them on paper. With the exception of still inexperienced Alonso and great Gerrard it was a genuinely awful team.
Not really....Hamann was the main reason
You have to admit FSW has done well. For having to play 70 odd games this season, the Chavs have been quite good. He rotated the squad really well and made many good decisions. To be fair he actually deserves another year, even though EssexRob will disagree.
You know what I will say, he deserves a chance at another club, just not ours.
He will surely come back and haunt you chavs one day.
He's a decent manager, but unfortunately for him, he won't be put in positions to prove that he's decent manager.
The biggest problem he has is that nobody aside from Liverpool has any respect for him or even rate him. For Christ's sakes Aston Villa fans did want him as their manager despite the accolades he has achieved. During the course of the season, players do need motivation at times and it's hard to motivate people who have no respect for you. That's probably why Chelsea and Inter underachieved in the league under Rafa's leadership, despite the quality that both squads possessed.
With that in mind, I wouldn't give Rafa credit for Chelsea winning the Europa League. If players need inspiration for a cup final, they really shouldn't be playing football. I doubt Roy Keane needed a word from Fergie in Turin to put on the display he did.
The biggest problem he has is that nobody aside from Liverpool has any respect for him or even rate him. For Christ's sakes Aston Villa fans did want him as their manager despite the accolades he has achieved. During the course of the season, players do need motivation at times and it's hard to motivate people who have no respect for you. That's probably why Chelsea and Inter underachieved in the league under Rafa's leadership, despite the quality that both squads possessed.
With that in mind, I wouldn't give Rafa credit for Chelsea winning the Europa League. If players need inspiration for a cup final, they really shouldn't be playing football. I doubt Roy Keane needed a word from Fergie in Turin to put on the display he did.
Don't understand why Liverpool went for BR when Benitez, 100x better manager, was available. Maybe he's seen as the Suarez of manager, talented but too much baggage by their owners (or their advisers).
The man comes across as a fat clown who can barely get a coherent thought out of his gob in front of a mike, but he can actually manage a club and I don't think anyone would deny he's done a much better job at Chelsea than was expected of him.
Roman has an interesting decision to make. Of course his decision was already made when he appointed RB as "interim manager", but securing a CL spot, winning the Europa trophy and beating United in the FA Cup is actually pretty decent stuff for his CV.
Quite a turn of events it would be if Roman said eff you to Jose and gave Rafa a shiny new two-year contract.
Roman has an interesting decision to make. Of course his decision was already made when he appointed RB as "interim manager", but securing a CL spot, winning the Europa trophy and beating United in the FA Cup is actually pretty decent stuff for his CV.
Quite a turn of events it would be if Roman said eff you to Jose and gave Rafa a shiny new two-year contract.
he took over the strongest team left in the second tier of european football. i wouldnt get carried away with anything. yet another benitez achievement put on a plate for him.
And if there's one thing that is clear about Benitez from the first moment that you see him, it's that when something has been put in a plate for him he won't let it go to waste.
Seriously, how does someone who's around professional athletes and world class training facilities and access to the best nutrition experts on earth become so obsese? I get an extra 5-10 pounds for a middle-aged man, or any man I suppose. But an extra 70???
Possibly Napoli bound..
Eurosport.com EN
BREAKING: Our Italian office reports Napoli chairman Aurelio De Laurentiis is in London to discuss a two-year deal with Rafa Benitez
Eurosport.com EN
BREAKING: Our Italian office reports Napoli chairman Aurelio De Laurentiis is in London to discuss a two-year deal with Rafa Benitez
Why did Napoli's manager leave? Looked to be doing a great job there..
I thought Mancini was Napoli bound
He resigned saying that he wants a change. Inter and Roma want him but he might take a year long break from football. He did an excellent job at Napoli during the last 4 years.
So another Guardiola then.
Rafa vs the Mafia should be fun!
If he goes there, RAWK will still be claiming that he can win the PL next season.
He's biding his time for United job in the next 6 years.