Better striker for Real Madrid: Raul or Benzema?

TenonTen

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And you have a permanent hate boner for him.
Guess that evens it up.
No. He's great and very complete. He was underrated for a long time. But his recent form has led to a weird kind of revisionism where people are just pretending as if he has always been this striker. He has not. For years, his finishing was really inconsistent and patchy(it was embarrassing at times for a Real Madrid striker) and even in his peak now he simply can't produce the numbers some of the elites did.

This kind of revisionism is leading to an obvious overrating of the player which is really weird considering he was underrated for so long.
 

giorno

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At the moment i'd say Raul, due to a product of their times

This could change in less than a month though

Benzema is objectively the better player
 

JPRouve

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No. He's great and very complete. He was underrated for a long time. But his recent form has led to a weird kind of revisionism where people are just pretending as if he has always been this striker. He has not. For years, his finishing was really inconsistent and patchy(it was embarrassing at times for a Real Madrid striker) and even in his peak now he simply can't produce the numbers some of the elites did.

This kind of revisionism is leading to an obvious overrating of the player which is really weird considering he was underrated for so long.
Nor could Aguero.
 

BalanceUnAutreJoint

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No. He's great and very complete. He was underrated for a long time. But his recent form has led to a weird kind of revisionism where people are just pretending as if he has always been this striker. He has not. For years, his finishing was really inconsistent and patchy(it was embarrassing at times for a Real Madrid striker) and even in his peak now he simply can't produce the numbers some of the elites did.

This kind of revisionism is leading to an obvious overrating of the player which is really weird considering he was underrated for so long.
Indeed. It is absolutely revisionism that he has a superior goal+assist per 90 minutes output than the likes of Kane,Henry or Aguero over their respective careers. /s
Aguero has never had a season with more G+A than Benzema 11/12 by the way, no need to speak of his current form.

The bolded part is funny to me because you can easily argue that Benzema's 21/22 season is clear of any season of Lewandowski or Suarez if you take into account that:
-His team is nowhere as good as MSN Barca or Treble winning Bayern
-He scored an outrageous amount of his goals vs top teams and not versus Deportivo la Coruna and Sporting Gijon
 

horsechoker

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Players playing in the modern age are by default better than those from a decade ago.

Raúl would be playing for Wolves if he played today.
 

Gio

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Real Madrid hadn't won a European Cup in over 30 years until Raul came along. They've won 7 since. He catapulted them back to the top and made them credible again. He provided the platform for their position at the pinnacle of the European game that they now take for granted. He was central to each of the 3 Champions League Real won in the space of 5 seasons, scoring 3 goals in finals (for context, Benzema has 1 in 4 and we're about to lose our shit if he gets another this month). His record in big games was mostly brilliant - 2 goals to knock out United's treble-winners in the 99/00 quarter-finals, followed up by another 2 goals to dispose of Valencia in the final. Same in 01/02, an outside-of-the-box belter to squeeze out Barcelona in the semi-final, and then the opener in the final. Similarly, he put some phenomenal defenders to the sword. 4 goals in 360 minutes against Alessandro Nesta, 4 goals in 360 minutes against Lucio, and 4 goals in 362 minutes against Rio Ferdinand. Just because he had a long and public decline doesn't mean he wasn't outstanding in his prime and, Ronaldo up to 99 aside, in the mix for best forward in Europe from any time between 1995 and 2003.
 

dinostar77

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Raul as hierro describes him was a 8.5 out of 10 for everything. But more than the sum of his parts. Fabulous striker for his particular era. Very different striker to Benezma which makes a comparision moot.

Is Benzema better than Hugo Sanchez or Puskas or butruganeo or di stenfano or ronaldo or Cristiano Ronaldo? Very difficult to compare eras, style of play, quality of the league etc.
 

B20

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I thought Raul flattered to deceive a lot. A player with his talent should have stepped up at some point as a genuine balon d'or contender. I don't think he ever looked like that for anything more than short bursts in the first half of his career. He rode a lot on being good enough to play for real Madrid as a local lad.

He was never as good as the likes of villa and Torres at their peaks.
 

Lay

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It was around 05/06, he was 29-30 yo, he declined and had a long draughts, I remember it because coaches like Queiroz, Luxemburgo or even Capello wouldn't dare to bench Raul, Capello was lucky RVN was there to score goals for him
That was a weird time. He was stinking up the place but the fans went mental if he was subbed off.

Raul was such a classy player but was never a player I would have wanted at United. Benzema I would have had here easily
 

Iker Quesadillas

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Raul was a better striker for Real Madrid. Benzema has been, perhaps, a better player. But not a better striker.
 

carvajal

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As it has been said Raúl was very important for the history of the club, his appearance with Valdano is like a generational change.
His problem is that at 28/29 he was finished, he had a reputation as a dictator and had problems with Aragonés, shortly before the golden era began, so his legacy has been somewhat overshadowed.
Obviously right now it's easy to single out Karim but Raúl at 22/23 years old would easily be on a par with him.
His status could go up if he ends up being a first team coach.
 

Tavern in the town

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No. He's great and very complete. He was underrated for a long time. But his recent form has led to a weird kind of revisionism where people are just pretending as if he has always been this striker. He has not. For years, his finishing was really inconsistent and patchy(it was embarrassing at times for a Real Madrid striker) and even in his peak now he simply can't produce the numbers some of the elites did.

This kind of revisionism is leading to an obvious overrating of the player which is really weird considering he was underrated for so long.
Being exceptional in the twilight of his career which led people think thinking he was that good all along. The Paul Scholes fallacy.
 

GatoLoco

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Contrary to what many people think, Raul was someone who changed his position very often during his career, sacrificing himself for the benefit of the team. As an example, he could play in the same lineup with Zamorano and Amavisca as the main strikers under Valdano, behind Mijatovic and Suker under Capello, with two out of three strikers Mijatovic, Suker and Morientes under Heynckes or behind Morata and Anelka under Del Bosque and still be extraordinary in those circumstances, playing from deep in midfield to give his team "oxygen", linking up with teammates between the lines, providing defensive balance thanks to his spectacular stamina and appearing in the area by surprise with his ability not to be detected as Rio Ferdinand once remarked.

This game vs Barcelona in 1999/00 where he plays with Savio, Morientes and Anelka at the same time and still manages to appear in attacking areas is just one example of this role Raul had to play at for the benefit of his club.


These things you won't see them in his stats in Wikipedia. As Bozidar Maljkovic said: “stats are like bikinis: they look nice but they don't let you see everything”.

This Raul's versatility not that many people know about -maybe because most of them had a closer look to Raul when Beckham went to Madrid for the first time- very often gave Madrid the competitive edge against teams that at times could look stronger on paper like Barcelona, Bayern Munich, Manchester United and Valencia.

Also, he should have been a Balon D'Or contender? Well he was. We live in the information era, it's not that tough to double check these facts nowadays.
 
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TenonTen

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Being exceptional in the twilight of his career which led people think thinking he was that good all along. The Paul Scholes fallacy.
Exactly. You can only cringe at some of the insanely revisionist posts. :lol:
 

Andrade

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It's close, I'd say Raul. But this forum has a permanent hard-on for Benzema so he's better than everyone apparently.

From this generation, apart from the obvious 2, I rate Zlatan and Aguero as better strikers/Centre Forwards than Benzema overall career considered. Benzema is the 5th best striker of this generation.
It is strange, the elevation of Benzema above seemingly everybody in recent times. I put it down to people having short memories, and that also speaks to people not realising how good Raul was.

You can't really count M and R because I think they're a different category altogether, but just among strikers in this generation, I'd put Suarez, Lewa, Ibra and Aguero above Benz. There's other players who have an argument as well, but I'd choose those four for sure.
 

roonster09

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It is strange, the elevation of Benzema above seemingly everybody in recent times. I put it down to people having short memories, and that also speaks to people not realising how good Raul was.

You can't really count M and R because I think they're a different category altogether, but just among strikers in this generation, I'd put Suarez, Lewa, Ibra and Aguero above Benz. There's other players who have an argument as well, but I'd choose those four for sure.
Not a chance Ibra is above Benzema.

Just like how Benzema had criticism, i remember Bayern fans complaining about Lewa for not scoring in important games in CL. Then in last 3-4 years he was different beast.

Benzema was always very good, it's just that he went to next level in last 2-3 seasons.
 

BalanceUnAutreJoint

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Being exceptional in the twilight of his career which led people think thinking he was that good all along. The Paul Scholes fallacy.
Literally the 4th striker with the best career goal+assit ratio in the 21st century ahead of all of Aguero,Kane,Henry,Eto'o,R9,RvN,RvP,Cavani and anyone that's not named Suarez,Lewandowski or Zlatan (who all have have played outside of Europe's T5 leagues unlike Benzema)
3rd all time CL top scorer
Madrid's all time assister and 2nd all time top scorer.

Sounds like it's not so much a "Paul Scholes fallacy" but you not knowing ball or not paying enough attention
 

Tavern in the town

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Literally the 4th striker with the best career goal+assit ratio in the 21st century ahead of all of Aguero,Kane,Henry,Eto'o,R9,RvN,RvP,Cavani and anyone that's not named Suarez,Lewandowski or Zlatan (who all have have played outside of Europe's T5 leagues unlike Benzema)
3rd all time CL top scorer
Madrid's all time assister and 2nd all time top scorer.

Sounds like it's not so much a "Paul Scholes fallacy" but you not knowing ball or not paying enough attention
That’s nice. Please point me to another all time striker who scored 5 league goals in a season.
 

BalanceUnAutreJoint

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That’s nice. Please point me to another all time striker who scored 5 league goals in a season.
Henry scored 4 at Barcelona in 09/10
Both Suarez and Aguero had seasons with less G+A than Benzema 17/18 while being starters and playing 30+ games :
Suarez 2011/12 : 11 goals 3 assists in 31 games
Aguero 2012/13 : 12 goals 2 assists in 30 games
Benzema had 5 goals and 11 assists in his worst season ever, it's objectively clear of theirs.

By the way this isn't even a very convincing argument in the first place, just low-tier twitter level trolling.
 

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You have to be really young to say Benzema. Raul was much more than a striker, he's a legend for Mardid, the kind that has an unbreakable bond with the fans. When you think ok the likes of Keano, Maldini, Totti, and Puyol etc, you don't just think about their stats, their influence can't be measured by numbers.
 

harms

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I thought Raul flattered to deceive a lot. A player with his talent should have stepped up at some point as a genuine balon d'or contender. I don't think he ever looked like that for anything more than short bursts in the first half of his career. He rode a lot on being good enough to play for real Madrid as a local lad.

He was never as good as the likes of villa and Torres at their peaks.
Like that you mean? And he was better than Owen.

Ballon d'Or 2001 said:
1. Michael Owen England Liverpool 176
2. Raúl González Spain Real Madrid 140
3. Oliver Kahn Germany Bayern Munich 114
 

roonster09

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You have to be really young to say Benzema. Raul was much more than a striker, he's a legend for Mardid, the kind that has an unbreakable bond with the fans. When you think ok the likes of Keano, Maldini, Totti, and Puyol etc, you don't just think about their stats, their influence can't be measured by numbers.
Better striker/player - Benzema.
Bigger legend - Raul for the reasons you mentioned.
 

roonster09

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I thought Raul flattered to deceive a lot. A player with his talent should have stepped up at some point as a genuine balon d'or contender. I don't think he ever looked like that for anything more than short bursts in the first half of his career. He rode a lot on being good enough to play for real Madrid as a local lad.

He was never as good as the likes of villa and Torres at their peaks.
Somehow everything associated with Liverpool is better than anything else.
 

TheLord

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Benzema is definitely the better striker. Raul will always the bigger legend, in part, because he is Spanish.
 

Andrade

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Not a chance Ibra is above Benzema.

Just like how Benzema had criticism, i remember Bayern fans complaining about Lewa for not scoring in important games in CL. Then in last 3-4 years he was different beast.

Benzema was always very good, it's just that he went to next level in last 2-3 seasons.
Your reasoning?

Also, Lewa has still been consistently better than Benz over their entire careers in my view.
 

GatoLoco

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The season Benzema is having justifies buying a dictionary for synonyms just to post in the forum

Extremely nuts to see that kind of consistency and clutch moments throughout a whole season.
 

El Jefe

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As it has been said Raúl was very important for the history of the club, his appearance with Valdano is like a generational change.
His problem is that at 28/29 he was finished, he had a reputation as a dictator and had problems with Aragonés, shortly before the golden era began, so his legacy has been somewhat overshadowed.
Obviously right now it's easy to single out Karim but Raúl at 22/23 years old would easily be on a par with him.
His status could go up if he ends up being a first team coach.
Good to see the Madrid fans supporting what I could remember about Raul. To me he was never really the same once Ronaldo became your main striker. He had to give up a bit of himself with each galactico signing but after Ronaldo, it meant he was pretty much 4th fiddle to Zidane, Ronaldo and Figo. In the first year, with all of them he was still effective but as you mention he lost his legs pretty early.

As great as Benzema is and he really is great, the technique Raul displayed on his finishing was out of this world and he was a really good link player as he showed in his partnership with Morientes and even later on at Schalke.

As you mention, history won't be as kind to Raul's greatness because of the Spanish NT success after he left and Ronaldo pretty much blowing away all the records he set for RM. It's a bit similar to Ballack in that respect both greats of their time that might not be remembered as they should.
 

roonster09

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Your reasoning?

Also, Lewa has still been consistently better than Benz over their entire careers in my view.
Lewa played in significantly inferior league than Benzema, La Liga was by far the best league for a decade. Lewa scored lot of goals but Benzema was always a complete player. He played second fiddle to Ronaldo, once Ronaldo his goal scoring record has been very good.

Regarding Ibra, he didn't have career like Benzema. He was a liability in big games because of his lack of workrate. His KO record was poor too, at least before he joined PSG and I don't think he scored many at PSG in KO stages.

Scoring shit loads in (with all due respect) inferior league where he was part of team that was miles better than next best won't put him ahead of player like Benzema.

Suarez, Lewa, Benzema are level above Zlatan.
 

TenonTen

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Lewa played in significantly inferior league than Benzema, La Liga was by far the best league for a decade. Lewa scored lot of goals but Benzema was always a complete player. He played second fiddle to Ronaldo, once Ronaldo his goal scoring record has been very good.

Regarding Ibra, he didn't have career like Benzema. He was a liability in big games because of his lack of workrate. His KO record was poor too, at least before he joined PSG and I don't think he scored many at PSG in KO stages.

Scoring shit loads in (with all due respect) inferior league where he was part of team that was miles better than next best won't put him ahead of player like Benzema.

Suarez, Lewa, Benzema are level above Zlatan.
Current La Liga's level is nothing to shout about. :lol:


Lewandowski has a better goalscoring ratio in UCL than Messi and Ronaldo ffs.

Dude has 100 goal contributions for a team like Poland and will easily end up as the 2nd highest international scorer after Ronaldo.

But sure, it's just the Bundesliga. His consistency and peak is levels above Benzema.

40 plus goals in 7 consecutive seasons now. For reference, Messi and Ronaldo have like 9 or 10. Benzema can only dream of being that consistently elite.

Can make arguments for Zlatan above Benzema too.
 

Madridista2000

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Raul was for a long time top scorer in CL.
He overshadowed all the great strikers of the 90's and start 00's in the biggest competition in Europe. Won it 3 times as well after RM had not won it since the 60's.
That should tell you how good Raul was.
 

tjb

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It is strange, the elevation of Benzema above seemingly everybody in recent times. I put it down to people having short memories, and that also speaks to people not realising how good Raul was.

You can't really count M and R because I think they're a different category altogether, but just among strikers in this generation, I'd put Suarez, Lewa, Ibra and Aguero above Benz. There's other players who have an argument as well, but I'd choose those four for sure.
He's had about 4 absolutely world class season over the last few years. He was very good during most of the Ronaldo years too. I actually think the opposite. I think people are looking at him and thinking its a smaller sample size than it is. He's operating at Drogba 2010 level, but has been doing its for about four seasons now. Raul never came close to that. Add that to the fact that he was part of such a strong forward line between 2011 and 2018, consistently scoring and assisting, then you realize that he's far better than it's being made out to be. He's not as good as Suarez or Lewandowski who had so many great seasons, but I do think he's on par with or above Ibra and definitely above Aguero.
 

roonster09

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Current La Liga's level is nothing to shout about. :lol:


Lewandowski has a better goalscoring ratio in UCL than Messi and Ronaldo ffs.

Dude has 100 goal contributions for a team like Poland and will easily end up as the 2nd highest international scorer after Ronaldo.

But sure, it's just the Bundesliga. His consistency and peak is levels above Benzema.

40 plus goals in 7 consecutive seasons now. For reference, Messi and Ronaldo have like 9 or 10. Benzema can only dream of being that consistently elite.

Can make arguments for Zlatan above Benzema too.
Are you getting triggered because I said Bundesliga is inferior league?

At least read the post properly, i said Benzema and Lewa are at same level. I said Lewa also had criticism from Bayern fans saying how he doesn't score in big KO games, which was changed in last 3-4 years

Ofcourse you can make argument for Zlatan above Benzema, it would be just wrong argument and it's nothing new to see wrong arguments when it comes to Zlatan.
 

Rightnr

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As a footballer, it's Benzema and it's not even close.

Raul was basically a very good Spanish van Nistelrooy who was home-grown.

Benzema has basically carried Real this and last season. Raul was never even close to doing that.

I couldn't care less about the legend stuff.
 

TenonTen

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Are you getting triggered because I said Bundesliga is inferior league?

At least read the post properly, i said Benzema and Lewa are at same level. I said Lewa also had criticism from Bayern fans saying how he doesn't score in big KO games, which was changed in last 3-4 years

Ofcourse you can make argument for Zlatan above Benzema, it would be just wrong argument and it's nothing new to see wrong arguments when it comes to Zlatan.
Genuinely curious about how people perceive Benzema vs Zlatan. Would love to see a thread on it.