Though we bought him for Right wing after Selling Zaha and Shifting Valencia as the Right back sticking Mata on the right.
Board vs Jose
- Thread starter AshRK
- Start date
But what if Ed is only obeying orders from the Glazers that the fundings wont flow out that easily?..
I agree about the deadwood, but I think Matic and Lukaku do take us up a level. Matic is the holding midfielder we've been crying out for for ages and we were desperate for a striker, Lukaku was the best available. The two players themselves aren't the issue, it's the failure to get the players around them to get the best out of them. Hopefully Fred addresses some of that.
I don't know why we can't seem to sell players. Maybe we can't get adequate replacements so we just keep holding on.
Its looking like one more signing and we probably have a budget of 70m or so...why would we prioritise a centre back in our current predicament? We have holes in RW and at LB at least in defence we are competitive we have feck all on the right wing.
The board should do themselves a favour and bin this twat off before he manages to do it himself.
Agreed. It feels like the board don't really want to back him as he wants aging players with no exciting qualities, no marketing value and no resale potential. From a commercial, business and entertainement perspective he's out of tune with the fans and the board and thus a summer of spinning wheels that will likely result in buying Harry Maguire for £70M on deadline day, when the core values and footballing ideals of the club and manager are so far apart it's stupid to just wait for the wheels to come off..
And get who?
I think Harry Maguire would be a good signing, to be fair. He's a good defender and brilliant in the air. Think Smalling that can actually play a bit. But generally, I agree.
You get the impression that Mourinho would happily sell Martial and bring in Perisic/Willian. I can't blame the executives for questioning the long term sensibility of that. Especially when they get it in the neck for, you know, not having a long term vision.
It's likely (most definitely) that Woodward and other executives look at the likes of Martial, Shaw and even Bailly and think... 'well fecking get them singing then'.
Mourinho's done. But I've been saying this a while. If people want to watch bollocks every weekend and justify it then that's up to them.
Whoever I list it'll be "They've won nothing" so why even bother? I doubt we could get Zidane but you never know, Jardim won a Ligue 1 title against the odds with a vibrant young team and got to a CL semi, I wouldn't mind him, maybe one of the young coaches like Nagelsmann, we've went older and experienced for 4 seasons and it's been soul destroying dogshit to watch, so perhaps a different aproach might be the answer, maybe those that want the Class of '92 to get a shot would get their wish.
I've got nothing against Maguire, I think he's a bit cumbersome but he's decent, but you have to feel this is a last ditch thing because the board wouldn't front up the money for the older options.
I think the lack of a new LB when it's clear Shaw has no chance of ever succeeding under Mourinho is the clearest example of the board not wanting to let the younger players Moruinho doesn't like, go, for fear he'll be out the door shortly anyway and we could have several assets there that a different manager with different man management style and football ideals could get a lot out of.
I agree on the last part, I feel like we are just ticking off the days until his reign is over and we can reset and try again, hopefully with someone more in tune with the clubs values and identity.
You contradict yourself in the first paragraph. Firstly you state the quality players that pep inherited then go on to say it's down to pep > Jose. Surely it's not a fair comparison when the state of the club's they arrived at were in totally different conditions. Added to the fact the that pep had a much easier starting point (with a much better squad) then went on to break the premiership transfer spend in one season!
The board should be getting crucified here, they would be at madrid or barca. Weve made 1 neccesary signing despite the manager saying he gave a lost of 5 players suitable for 1 position. Get it done. We clearly have too many players and theyre hanging on to darmian, rojo etc for a few million here or there. The same few million allegedly not stumped up for perisic last year
You're underestimating United Job. The pressure is so huge to deliver even for likes of Jose who's been at the game for so long. No manager not named Ferguson can manage the club the size of United, promote youth and also win championships. Class of 92 would lose their legendary status within months if anyone of them manages us.
No more than the pressure at Barca or any of the other big clubs and they've covered the bases under more than one manager, right now any manager that could deliver top 4 for the money men and entertaining football for the fans would get plenty of time given the utter dross we've had for half a decade now.
For that to work, the first step is to get a top notch squad. We are just getting there after close to a decade of poor buys since Ronaldo left. Then Finish consistently on top4 and then we can talk about exciting football. Barca and Real are blessed that are the favorites for every South American talent and wonderful weather. Still Barca spent ¢45m on a position for which they already spent ¢130m last season. Thats the level of investment it takes to fortify a squad. Our board is only granting every 3 of the 5 targets requested.
More to the point - the club's wages to turnover is 45% (City's is 59% and Real's is 57%, Liverpool's is 61%) - we need to match this level of ambition. If we were spending 61 % of turnover on wages, we could afford several more Pogbas and Sanchezs in this team. Most other champions league contenders have at least two players for each position. United have zero right wingers and or full time right backs. What is wrong here?
Why do we need to go through that slow a process? Klopp has been at liverpool for 6 months longer then Mourinho at United. Its night and day the football the 2 are playing. He implemented his exciting football and then revamped the squad with more quality players to iron out the mistakes. We are useless going forward if it's not through individual quality. We cant control games on the ball against opposition with any sort of possession style, regardless of quality of midfield. Our defence is constantly a shambles. Our only success is through the individual bits of play from star players. De gea saving us, clinical finishing, and generally just grinding it out. We're awfully managed and I've said it before but easily the worst "big club" in the world at the moment, in terms of how we are run from a footballing perspective, and the trash we deliver on the pitch.
If I were Ed/Glazers I would get rid of him now, today. Put McKenna in charge for the season. Hire some some top notch coaches/analysts to help him. Heck, if no one available, get Rene and Shorts to come back. Then they have a whole season to get a new manager depending on what happens.
They think they can wait for him to miss top four and then sack him - but he's so toxic right now and it doesn't look like ending any time soon - that they'd be better off limiting the damage he's making with his awful behaviour. He's dragging the club into the gutter.
We might not get top four using this strategy, but at least the negativity and drama will end. Besides, we're not getting top four with Jose in this mood, so what's the point of him being around?
It's also pointless getting him more players as it won't change the way he has us playing. Save the money for the next manager.
I hope to God we're not approaching the relegation places by the time the club finally sacks his ass. People think this isn't a real possibility, but the way he's carrying on, I would not be surprised.
They think they can wait for him to miss top four and then sack him - but he's so toxic right now and it doesn't look like ending any time soon - that they'd be better off limiting the damage he's making with his awful behaviour. He's dragging the club into the gutter.
We might not get top four using this strategy, but at least the negativity and drama will end. Besides, we're not getting top four with Jose in this mood, so what's the point of him being around?
It's also pointless getting him more players as it won't change the way he has us playing. Save the money for the next manager.
I hope to God we're not approaching the relegation places by the time the club finally sacks his ass. People think this isn't a real possibility, but the way he's carrying on, I would not be surprised.
This will be a pivotal year for Jose imo. After improving from 5th to 2nd, the pressure will be on to make a serious title and CL challenge, otherwise I think the board may part company at season's end.
We hired Jose knowing what he bring to the table. Why are you expecting flamboyant football when he has failed to do that in any of his clubs he's been. But luckily for us, Jose is a winner and that's been a constant where ever he has been(along with losing the team later). I think Jose never played controlling football like ever and is always dependent on counter attack and Individual quality (like hazard at Chelsea). The reason we've been so poor under him is because we had a piss poor squad when he came in and doesn't have a leader at all. We're gradually improving on the quality of the squad while finishing above the people you seem to rave like Klopp. So defiantly not everything is lost and we're progressing.
The squad quality is nowhere near that bad, we should be playing so much better than we do with what we have, and I think we'd be seeing much heftier investment this summer his Mourinho's targets ticked any of the clubs boxes. The blaming of the squad for the trash he serves up is weak and it also isn't to blame for his absolutely poisonous personality that deflates the players we have that could give us more, you cut out poison rather than let it slip deeper into the blood stream.
I don't think we can make that assessment based on today given that the players we fielded were a motley crew of a few first teamers, fringe squad players, and youth.
It’s all going tits up lads. Even considering the horrific Moyes beginning, this must be the most negative atmosphere we’ve had since Fergie. At least then we’d all gone a bit mental and didn’t know what was going on.
The amusing part about all of this is that if Jose was asking for marketable superstars, I can see the board being far more willing to go out and get them.
Silly question and personally can’t see it happening. But does anyone think following his latest comments that the board might sack him before the end of August? Can you imagine if Pogba went to the board and said he wants to leave?
While i agree that he could get more out of the squad , i don't think his press talks affect players negatively. He's been like this for ages and still we managed to finish second. So he maybe speaking to the media in one way and to the players in totally different way, we don't know that. If the board thinks he's poison, he'd not have received a contract extension. So if the've confided in him to go forward , i think he deserves to get the players he wants as both board and Ed aren't football men.
Go on Ed, get us Neymar.
They gave him a one year extension, that's the bare minimum, and him and Ed are not the only shot callers at United, the Glazers and other board members will be well aware of how we are now viewed in the footballing world, as the ugly stepchild of Europe's elite teams managed by the most unlikable manager around who is seen as the poster boy for anti-football. He can get them top 4 without them having to spend enormous amounts of money on players with no marketing or resale value and no potential to develop further, thus the stand-off we are in right now, he's the wrong fit for this club.
Doesn't need to be Neymar, if Mourinho was asking for Pulisic or Leon Bailey I think the purse strings would be readily loosened.
That's it. If Ed doesn't get at least 2 more at the end of the window, I'll start a petition on change. org 
I don't think they'd sack him if he finishes top 4 again.
I think Jose may walk at the end of the season if he secures top 4, but no title challenge.
Yep. Not difficult is it? The wealthiest club on the planet given a lower budget than Everton so that these parasites can build their personal wealth.
That's what i don't get. Extension is a way to reward a good deed. They acknowledged Jose is doing decent and deserves more years but wouldn't let him buy his team for him to win the league because they're not marketable? That's incompetence of the board i'd say. Either back the manager or fire him and get a new one. We cant keep buying only 75% of the required targets and then set a high expectation for the season.
And yet, we've won an F.A Cup, a League Cup and the Europa League since Klopp's been in England, to go alongside our higher league finishes. So how can people keep mentioning Klopp's Liverpool time as the antithesis of a "slow process." I can almost guarantee that even if in 12-mths time we're looking down at a trophyless Liverpool in the table we'll still hear more threads concerned about Liverpool's clear strategies and exciting potential.
What revamping has Klopp done that Mourinho hasn't? Sold their best player to Barcelona to make way for a couple of midfield signings whom are yet to kick a ball in the Premier League? We have already sold all bar a few of LVG's mishaps, with Mourinho strongly insinuating that the remaining are going to follow the likes of Depay, Schmidfield, Blind and co. out the door. I'm not a Mourinho super fan but in all fairness he's steadily 'revamping' this squad 3 or 4 pieces a window.
City are in full force but are looking like they're done for the window. If we add a centre-half to Dalot, Fred and a rejuvenated Pereira, Mourinho really can't complain about expecting us to mount a title challenge. Not unless we lose the likes of Marital and/or Pogba too. It's laughable if he does.
I'm not having a go at your post, and I'm all for slating the asthetics of a Jose team if you're comparing it against at team with an equal or higher trophy haul (like City,) but the constant fluttering at Liverpool around these parts isn't warranted at this stage.
The extension allows them more time to see who would be available without him being out of contract at the end of this season but at the same time without giving him another 3 years they'd have to pay off. The Glazers are likely to be happy with top 4 and he got it with this squad last season, so far only Liverpool have really strengthened signifigantly, the other top 4 challengers haven't done a lot and City are already well out of touch.
Just on the Pereira point, he did nothing last season and a couple of decent games in these garbage matches against poor opposition in meaningless friendlies doesn't count for much, and I like the kid but he's yet to do anything in a competitive match for United, I remember on LvG's first tour Fletcher looked a million bucks, but once we started playing PL football instead of friendlies it was clear that his level had shifted quite a bit and he couldn't offer much.
Trust me, all of this has been spoken thousand times on this forum to no effect. It doesn't take a genius to see what we were getting when we hired Mourinho, people may not like his philosophy or his football but it has brought him success at every club he's managed including here. Why would he risk his job and uproot what he knows to play an attacking brand of football? Just to please some fans on the forum?
It's like folks have completely erased 2015/16 season from their memories (wouldn't blame them), it's chalk and cheese as to where we are. Just look at the status of van Gaal's signings and where they are playing football right now. Two veterans we had are also gone in space of two years. Most of the deadwood we cultivated during those period, we're still facing repercussions due to that. Unable to sell them due to their huge wage packets. Least I can credit Mourinho is in bringing the required quality during his two years. Likes of Pogba, Bailly, Sanchez etc. can offer a lot more and if he were to go in near future, next manager will have a much better base to build upon. He's improved our squad along with our results, not so much in the football department. But then he's always been results first manager, so why the outrage?
We have CL football for first time since Fergie retired in two consecutive seasons, it's clearly not many Utd fans want but you need to walk before you run. We've made small steps in various directions, there's some stability in the squad. Players actually show fighting spirit when we are down compared to Moyes/LVG days where we were resigned to losing. We've also made 3 finals in two years which is also a step up. Things can improve if we were to get rid but they could also be so much worse.
Again, I doubt much of this will make sense because most on here have already made their mind up (few did a long while back) and are continuously going regurgitate same arguments ad nauseam.
When it comes to the board and their lack of transfer activity, I feel like LeBron James screaming at JR Smith for not knowing the clock at the end of game 1 of the Finals.
Totally agree. Some of the fans here would be plucking their hairs out wondering how we finished second , last season ahead of their favorite manager Klopp. I mean , how is it possible for someone who plays horrible football to finish higher than someone who plays scintillating football? Some would even wish bad results on united if it leads to Mourinho getting sacked. We live in such times sigh.
I feel that for the first time in his career, Jose is struggling with being in a genuine multi challenger title slog. His resume was built on him managing clubs that could blow the opposition away in terms in terms of resources (first Chelsea stint) or in two-team leagues where he inherited almost flawless squads - he took over Inter after they had just won three-titles on the bounce. Preparing for Juventus or Barcelona twice-a-season is different to fighting for a highly competitive champions league spot against City, Chelsea, Liverpool, Spurs and Arsenal.
This is why I give Mourinho some leeway here. His United side have just finished second to a better-settled team who comfortably outspent us. It really is that simple. It would be hypercritical of us to throw decade-long accusations of buying the league at him and then at the same time criticise him for not winning it at United when he was comfortably outspent. We're all United supporters here, we should recognise this hypocrisy even if the general media don't.
I'm not knocking him or his resume - his Porto and Inter cup teams were mint, and it's admirable he took on the United challenge considering the circumstances, but a part of me feels that perhaps he thought Ed "We can do things in the transfer market that other clubs can only dream of" Woodward and the board were going to provide almost limitless backing to get our title back. We've spent heavily, but considering our commercial incomings (and revenue-to-wage numbers,) this isn't obviously the case.
If someone had told me back in early 2016 that we'd appoint Mourinho and spend almost 500 mill over the next two years I would have put money on us obtaining the likes of a Bale, Messi, Neymar or a returning Ronaldo. Maybe Jose had a similar thought.
This is why I give Mourinho some leeway here. His United side have just finished second to a better-settled team who comfortably outspent us. It really is that simple. It would be hypercritical of us to throw decade-long accusations of buying the league at him and then at the same time criticise him for not winning it at United when he was comfortably outspent. We're all United supporters here, we should recognise this hypocrisy even if the general media don't.
I'm not knocking him or his resume - his Porto and Inter cup teams were mint, and it's admirable he took on the United challenge considering the circumstances, but a part of me feels that perhaps he thought Ed "We can do things in the transfer market that other clubs can only dream of" Woodward and the board were going to provide almost limitless backing to get our title back. We've spent heavily, but considering our commercial incomings (and revenue-to-wage numbers,) this isn't obviously the case.
If someone had told me back in early 2016 that we'd appoint Mourinho and spend almost 500 mill over the next two years I would have put money on us obtaining the likes of a Bale, Messi, Neymar or a returning Ronaldo. Maybe Jose had a similar thought.