Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

[Zlatattack]

Do people really think the consumer will switch from BMW's, Mercedes and Audi to Jaguar or Lexus just because they Germans will be more expensive? Some might but the vast majority won't. It'll make it even more of a status symbol.

Are Vauxhall Ford Toyota Honda and Nissan going to take the market from VW, Seat, Skoda, Renault, Fiat, Citeron? Maybe.

 

[Paul the Wolf]

Do people really think the consumer will switch from BMW's, Mercedes and Audi to Jaguar or Lexus just because they Germans will be more expensive? Some might but the vast majority won't. It'll make it even more of a status symbol.

Are Vauxhall Ford Toyota Honda and Nissan going to take the market from VW, Seat, Skoda, Renault, Fiat, Citeron? Maybe.

None of the major UK car manufacturers are British. The Japanese have already said they will pull out without frictionless borders as have BMW , Vauxhall is owned by PSA. They will all move to the European mainland. It's not just the tariffs to worry about.

 

[Green_Red]

See Id get a ban for that but Im guessing you will Bertie Ahern it.

Last time you were callin me Tubriday and Enda. Today its Unionist and Bertie Ahern. Ye literally havent got a feckin scooby doo have ye? Where are you from?

 

[Ramshock]

Last time you were callin me Tubriday and Enda. Today its Unionist and Bertie Ahern. Ye literally havent got a feckin scooby doo have ye? Where are you from?

Im from Kingston Jamaica mate.

 

[Stanley Road]

Personally I am beginning to think my own country should consider getting out with this tariff on US goods. Ireland doesnt even manufacture Steel /Aluminium and we're being forced to put tariffs on US goods because Merkel and Macron are unhappy because their industries have been hit by Trumps policies. feck the EU! Theres only 2 countries that even matter and none of their policies are designed for the benefit of EU citizens not living in the economic center.

Share Victory, Share Defeat. Those are the club rules. We're all innit together.

 

[Mozza]

14% (not 40%) of cars produced in Germany go to the UK (at the moment) and as being mainly high range cars someone will pay 60k will also pay 66k for their car. That 14% represents only 1.7% of all of Germany's exports, it's peanuts.

The point is with your other arguments when the UK leaves they will have collaboration with no other country. Germany have 26 other countries + those in agreements outside the EU.

Of course the EU will not come out unscathed but you are comparing a minor scrape with an amputation. Of course supply chains will be disrupted both ways. The 27 other countries in the EU can cope, the Uk's oxygen supply will be cut off.

Trump happens to pick Steel and Aluminium, the UK exports Steel and Aluminium, he could pick something else, he's talking about cars. The Uk's biggest export is cars and that's to the USA. Ireland don't make cars.

If crashing out on a 'no deal' basis was likened to a self inflicted wound, the EU is chopping off a finger, the UK is chopping off an arm.

 

[Mozza]

But how many of the tariffs imposed by the US affect Irish companies and how many tariffs imposed by the EU affect Irish consumers? At some poibt you kind of have to take the blinkers off and think is this actually good for Ireland?

Being a member of the EU. Your economy is the size of a gnat compared to the US, any time they wanted to bully a concession from you they could. This round of tarrifs might not hurt you much directly but the next round? You might need some mates then

 

[4bars]

What will happen is the 29th of March will come and then those businesses in Europe that rely on British trade will come to the table and Britain will work out a trade policy that suits Britain.

It can get cockier. ...That suits Britain, so EU will bent to UK. What do you think europeans think when a brexiteer says that?

EU will take a blow no matter what, but the benefits of having a pebble in the shoe, with a preference treatment (and asking for more), blocking decisions as a buffer of US will be more positive than the UK being out of the EU. Also, the EU have to show that the project can't be threatened by anyone.

EU is a terrible club to be in, I would rather prefer not to be in. But economically speaking there is no discussion that is a big mistake to leave. Leaving and accepting the Union custome/4 freedoms would be ideal.

 

[Mozza]

EU is a terrible club to be in, I would rather prefer not to be in. But economically speaking there is no discussion that is a big mistake to leave. Leaving and accepting the Union custome/4 freedoms would be ideal.

I'm genuinely curious why is it terrible?

 

[4bars]

I'm genuinely curious why is it terrible?

Uf, it will be difficult to explain MY OPINION with my poor english. Also is not the thread to do it.

IMO, politically speaking they don't do politics (in the big scheme of things) but what economically suits better the private sector and the politicians that they are bind to them. When everything goes right, we are europeans. When it goes wrong you are German, you are greek, you are brittish, you are spanish, etc...The austerity rules applied in europe during the crisis for example. In Greece had been draconian. Instead of treating and reacting with it as a part of you (EU), the EU treated Greece like something external, not forgiving anything, not reacting in time and pressuring a lot while the referendum that took place in Greece not respecting at all the sovereignty of a member. Even so the referendum was won by the ones that they did not want a 3rd rescue plan, but the greek government cave in because the EU gave no other option. I read some things about Varoufakis and how the EU worked, and it was appalling.

That is just an exemple. Others like the international policy on the middle east, the way we treat refugees and immigration, the way they tried to feck us over with the CETA and the TTIP with secretively negotiations, the recent law that they past about internet, etc...


Is an excellent economic union area that is becoming more and more dangerous because is eroding little by little the social welfare of the european states in favour of the neoliberalism.

 

[Abizzz]

If crashing out on a 'no deal' basis was likened to a self inflicted wound, the EU is chopping off a finger, the UK is chopping off an arm.

No, no. Our finger is chopping off itself.

 

[Adisa]

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[Mozza]

Uf, it will be difficult to explain MY OPINION with my poor english. Also is not the thread to do it.

IMO, politically speaking they don't do politics (in the big scheme of things) but what economically suits better the private sector and the politicians that they are bind to them. When everything goes right, we are europeans. When it goes wrong you are German, you are greek, you are brittish, you are spanish, etc...The austerity rules applied in europe during the crisis for example. In Greece had been draconian. Instead of treating and reacting with it as a part of you (EU), the EU treated Greece like something external, not forgiving anything, not reacting in time and pressuring a lot while the referendum that took place in Greece not respecting at all the sovereignty of a member. Even so the referendum was won by the ones that they did not want a 3rd rescue plan, but the greek government cave in because the EU gave no other option. I read some things about Varoufakis and how the EU worked, and it was appalling.

That is just an exemple. Others like the international policy on the middle east, the way we treat refugees and immigration, the way they tried to feck us over with the CETA and the TTIP with secretively negotiations, the recent law that they past about internet, etc...


Is an excellent economic union area that is becoming more and more dangerous because is eroding little by little the social welfare of the european states in favour of the neoliberalism.

I agree with that to an extent about Greece, however the response has a lot to do with domestic politics as opppsed to the EU. Similarly for the immigration crisis. If their was no EU the crisis would still have happened, Italy and Greece would still be alone and dealing with a large number of refugees. Atleast with the EU there might be a collective response.

I belive the EU is the only hope for lefty politics. Against the competition from mega nations like the US and China and the globe straddling power of multinational corporations only the EU as a collective, and not our individual nations have a chance of holding a higher standard for consumers. Personally I don't think it does a bad job in that regard currently It's unionism for nations

 

[JPRouve]

I agree with that to an extent about Greece, however the response has a lot to do with domestic politics as opppsed to the EU. Similarly for the immigration crisis. If their was no EU the crisis would still have happened, Italy and Greece would still be alone and dealing with a large number of refugees. Atleast with the EU there might be a collective response.

I belive the EU is the only hope for lefty politics. Against the competition from mega nations like the US and China and the globe straddling power of multinational corporations only the EU as a collective, and not our individual nations have a chance of holding a higher standard for consumers. Personally I don't think it does a bad job in that regard currently It's unionism for nations

You can't really agree with that, surely. The EU isn't a federation, it's a cooperation of countries, every country is sovereign, you are always greek, british or spanish.

 

[Mozza]

You can't really agree with that, surely. The EU isn't a federation, it's a cooperation of countries, every country is sovereign, you are always greek, british or spanish.

Its an imperfect union, but it's working on it

 

[Paul the Wolf]

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What Brexiters fail to understand is that you can always find other people to buy your products but if you can't produce your products you have nothing to sell.

Thus as cars are a major export of the UK, not only to the EU but especially worldwide, if they no longer have any car makers they've got no cars to sell.

 

[JPRouve]

Its an imperfect union, but it's working on it

But what he is suggesting is only relevant in a federal system which the EU isn't because no member state want it at the moment, not Greece, not Italy or Hungary.

 

[C3Pique]

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Imagine my surprise.

I had a conversation with my Dad about Brexit last year - he's more intelligent than me, well read, and doesn't believe everything he reads - and he could only say that the german car makers would ensure we get a good deal.

I explained the complexities of UK car manufacturing and their dependency on free movement and it was like talking to a wall. Scary how many people believed in this bollocks.

 

[JPRouve]

Imagine my surprise.

I had a conversation with my Dad about Brexit last year - he's more intelligent than me, well read, and doesn't believe everything he reads - and he could only say that the german car makers would ensure we get a good deal.

I explained the complexities of UK car manufacturing and their dependency on free movement and it was like talking to a wall. Scary how many people believed in this bollocks.

And the German manufacturers do not control Germany let alone the other 27 member states.

 

[4bars]

I agree with that to an extent about Greece, however the response has a lot to do with domestic politics as opppsed to the EU. Similarly for the immigration crisis. If their was no EU the crisis would still have happened, Italy and Greece would still be alone and dealing with a large number of refugees. Atleast with the EU there might be a collective response.

I believe the EU is the only hope for lefty politics. Against the competition from mega nations like the US and China and the globe straddling power of multinational corporations only the EU as a collective, and not our individual nations have a chance of holding a higher standard for consumers. Personally I don't think it does a bad job in that regard currently It's unionism for nations

An idealistic EU is a very good idea, the problem is that is not working on the ideals that they proclaim but is becoming more and more a servant of the private sector. Is definitely not going in the good direction but in the opposite one. But of course is only my opinion and my perception.

For economic purposes, the bigger the better. For social purposes, IMO the smaller the better. Decentralization is key and the EU is amassing a huge amount of power and it wants to concentrate even more. That concentration of power only makes it easier for the ones that want to control the economy with non-ethical intentions.

I will not continue with this derailing though. Sorry I will not answer in this thread

 

[JPRouve]

An idealistic EU is a very good idea, the problem is that is not working on the ideals that they proclaim but is becoming more and more a servant of the private sector. Is definitely not going in the good direction but in the opposite one. But of course is only my opinion and my perception.

For economic purposes, the bigger the better. For social purposes, IMO the smaller the better. Decentralization is key and the EU is amassing a huge amount of power and it wants to concentrate even more. That concentration of power only makes it easier for the ones that want to control the economy with non-ethical intentions.

I will not continue with this derailing though. Sorry I will not answer in this thread

The EU is based on the EEC, it's first mission is economic and for the private sector. You are confusing you ideal with the EU.

 

[Sweet Square]

If their was no EU the crisis would still have happened, Italy and Greece would still be alone and dealing with a large number of refugees. Atleast with the EU there might be a collective response.

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The EU is hardly helping.

 

[4bars]

The EU is based on the EEC, it's first mission is economic and for the private sector. You are confusing you ideal with the EU.

The EU has laws and tribunals that decides on absolutely everything. Human rights for example. The origins are in the Ruhr agreement but is way more complex and they want to go even more complex than an economic union. Another matter is that Money talks and is where they get serious and precisely for that matter they have as secondary anything else and they will bypass, trample and destroy anything that goes against their economic agenda that is exactly the same as the US (and others). Just little by little without noticing.

I fell for it again sorry!

 

[Abizzz]

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The EU is hardly helping.

Yes it is helping. Both those tweets actually describe how it is helping. It may not help to the extent you would like, but that doesn't mean it isn't helping.

 

[JPRouve]

The EU has laws and tribunals that decides on absolutely everything. Human rights for example. The origins are in the Ruhr agreement but is way more complex and they want to go even more complex than an economic union. Another matter is that Money talks and is where they get serious and precisely for that matter they have as secondary anything else and they will bypass, trample and destroy anything that goes against their economic agenda that is exactly the same as the US (and others). Just little by little without noticing.

I fell for it again sorry!

You know that it's not the case but still spread this nonsense? While there are common rules, every country has fairly different policies and rules. As for Human Rights, the EU follows pretty much the ECHR which comes from the Council of Europe.

 

[Ramshock]

Being a member of the EU. Your economy is the size of a gnat compared to the US, any time they wanted to bully a concession from you they could. This round of tarrifs might not hurt you much directly but the next round? You might need some mates then

The US economy is worth $18 triliion and the EU economy is worth $15 trllion., How the hell does one make the other look like a gnat? They are #1 and #2 respectively. Why do you think Trump and his boss Putin are colluding to bring them down?

 

[Sweet Square]

Yes it is helping. Both those tweets actually describe how it is helping. It may not help to the extent you would like, but that doesn't mean it isn't helping.

You might want to give those tweets another read.

 

[Ramshock]

The EU has laws and tribunals that decides on absolutely everything. Human rights for example. The origins are in the Ruhr agreement but is way more complex and they want to go even more complex than an economic union. Another matter is that Money talks and is where they get serious and precisely for that matter they have as secondary anything else and they will bypass, trample and destroy anything that goes against their economic agenda that is exactly the same as the US (and others). Just little by little without noticing.

I fell for it again sorry!

Stop spreading falsehoods please.

 

[Massive Spanner]

The US economy is worth $18 triliion and the EU economy is worth $15 trllion., How the hell does one make the other look like a gnat? They are #1 and #2 respectively. Why do you think Trump and his boss Putin are colluding to bring them down?

Pretty sure he means the Irish economy, not the EU economy?

 

[4bars]

Stop spreading falsehoods please.

Extend why they are falsehoods

Or in another words. Accept criticism

 

[Abizzz]

You might want to give those tweets another read.

So I've read them again and they still say the same. They are turning back boats and patrolling 30 miles off of Italy, both of which is helping Italy.

 

[Ramshock]

Pretty sure he means the Irish economy, not the EU economy?

Ok that makes it a stupid fecking post then because as a member of the EU the US cant single out Ireland on anything. Just like Trumpler when he wanted to cut a deal with Merkel thinking that was possible to deal only with Germany. Ireland comes as a package with the EU as the brits are finding out over the border issue. Ireland also has a highly skilled work force that US multinationals would begrudge giving up. Theres nothing to be gained by Ireland leaving the EU, it would be a disaster. Its basically only a West Brit on redcafes dream.

 

[Ramshock]

Extend why they are falsehoods

Or in another words. Accept criticism

Why am I to accept criticism? I am not the EU

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36247456

 

[Ramshock]

Extend why they are falsehoods

Or in another words. Accept criticism

Also name a law made by the EU that you want changed.

Maybe you can do better than this guy.

 

[Adisa]

The EU has laws and tribunals that decides on absolutely everything. Human rights for example. The origins are in the Ruhr agreement but is way more complex and they want to go even more complex than an economic union. Another matter is that Money talks and is where they get serious and precisely for that matter they have as secondary anything else and they will bypass, trample and destroy anything that goes against their economic agenda that is exactly the same as the US (and others). Just little by little without noticing.

I fell for it again sorry!

Jesus!

 

[Simbo]

Imagine my surprise.

I had a conversation with my Dad about Brexit last year - he's more intelligent than me, well read, and doesn't believe everything he reads - and he could only say that the german car makers would ensure we get a good deal.

I explained the complexities of UK car manufacturing and their dependency on free movement and it was like talking to a wall. Scary how many people believed in this bollocks.

Same situation with my dad, couldn't believe it when I first realised he was voting Brexit, but there was no debating with him, he got pretty heated about it. He gets all his news from the daily mail unfortunately.

 

[Mozza]

The US economy is worth $18 triliion and the EU economy is worth $15 trllion., How the hell does one make the other look like a gnat? They are #1 and #2 respectively. Why do you think Trump and his boss Putin are colluding to bring them down?

I meant the Irish economy alone

 

[Mozza]

Ok that makes it a stupid fecking post then because as a member of the EU the US cant single out Ireland on anything. Just like Trumpler when he wanted to cut a deal with Merkel thinking that was possible to deal only with Germany. Ireland comes as a package with the EU as the brits are finding out over the border issue. Ireland also has a highly skilled work force that US multinationals would begrudge giving up. Theres nothing to be gained by Ireland leaving the EU, it would be a disaster. Its basically only a West Brit on redcafes dream.

The poster I was replying to was talking about Ireland leaving the EU because the tarrifs didn't target them so why should they take part in the retaliation

 

[Mozza]

The EU has laws and tribunals that decides on absolutely everything. Human rights for example. The origins are in the Ruhr agreement but is way more complex and they want to go even more complex than an economic union. Another matter is that Money talks and is where they get serious and precisely for that matter they have as secondary anything else and they will bypass, trample and destroy anything that goes against their economic agenda that is exactly the same as the US (and others). Just little by little without noticing.

I fell for it again sorry!

EU law needs to pass national governments and at anyone time there are enough left wingers around to halt any excessive moves to the right.

 

[EyeInTheSky]

Also name a law made by the EU that you want changed.

Maybe you can do better than this guy.

This can’t be fecking real. Must be someone on a wind up having a bet with his mates