No, he is very knowledgeable and absolutely right. Read my post above. You should view Casemiro as you would have viewed Xabi Alonso (but a bit more ferocious in the tackles and with worse passing range). If you want someone with other characteristics, a dynamic all action running midfielder, someone like Barrios would have fit the bill (don't know if he still has the legs). Also Sunday Mba of Nigeria was incredible many moons ago but he was probably an age cheat as he was without a club at the age of 29 so I suppose his real age was +6 or something.
Casemiro | United Player
- Thread starter Tom Van Persie
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
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Just to clarify.
It is the clubs money. The Glazers have never paid a penny towards transfers.
Thiago signed for 20m pounds not euro (not including add ons), and he had less than a year left on his contract. He was clearly planning to leave Bayern as he’d run his contract down. Casemiro was settled and only renewed last year and had another 3 years on contract. It’s clearly going to cost more to convince someone settled for leave especially as we’re essentially in a rebuild.
If you’re worried about us spending big on younger players, we’ve apparently bid 80m euros for Antony and 100m+ for Felix.
Thank you for your analysis.
But anyone who says the bolded about Guillem Balagué, it is hard to take seriously.
Such a dumb signing. Guess we don't learn from past mistakes.
Great to see how many fans are easily pacified by the dopamine hit of a big name signing.
Great to see how many fans are easily pacified by the dopamine hit of a big name signing.
Yep, there's absolutely zero wrong with that if that's what happened.
But an alternative explanation would be that we failed to secure the target(s) with the profile ETH actually wanted, and then ended up signing an entirely different type of midfielder for big money in the latter days of the transfer window while desperate to strengthen.
It might be that explanation is completely untrue. But it would be more in line with the last decade of disjointed recruitment, where multiple managers complained about the club not securing their primary targets.
So you can't blame fans for being suspicious that it wasn't a successful and thoroughly considered mid-transfer-window pivot to targeting a completely different type of midfielder as our big signing. That's the kinda trust the club has to earn from the fanbase.
I wonder if ETH has seen in the last 2 games that you need a holding ball winning midfielder i.e. a proper number 6,Teams in the premiership can hit you so fast on the break that you will always need that insurance.Can the high press really work in our league without one.
Right. Cos it's the same scenario? Liverpool, a team fighting for titles at home and abroad, with a team at its peak, sign a player of that age for 20mill.
We, a team that needs a complete and utter gut and rebuild, sign a player that age for 3 times the price.
Maybe try a group text?
How is it a dumb signing?
Right player at the wrong time
That's the spirit.
Look at it like United, a team desperate for a DM for the past 5 years, signed arguably the best DM around who will have no problem in being a world class DM for the next 3 years if not 1 or 2 more.
You don't need to plan for 5 years. You can only ever plan for the immediate 3 years. The only thing Casemiro doesn't have is resale value ... But in terms of what he provides on the pitch? There hasn't been a better signing for us in ages.
Does it really matter one way or the other? At the end of the day, we finally addressed our biggest problem position for the past 5 years. Whether it was a panic signing or not, whether it was the profile Ten Hag wanted or not, whether we lucked into it or not... Its what we needed, and it's a fantastic signing for us and will stabilize us and give us breathing room to actually create a plan if we have no plan with squad building now.
He's a good player. But he's clearly not our first, or even second choice. I don't think he suits the style we want to play. He's nearing the end of his career. He's costing way more than he should, and I'm very dubious at to how much hunger he has left.
I hope I'm wrong. I just feel this has all the hallmarks of our recent big name panic signings to quiet the discontent of the fans.
Hope I'm wrong. Can't all drink the coolaid.
Agreed. But we're here now and it is what it is. All in all a great transfer.
Our 2nd choice was Rabiot who isn’t fit to clean Casemiro’s matchday worn underwear.
Please enlighten me, exactly what has he got so wrong? I can't say I follow him weekly but clearly the man has some standing through what he has produced over the years?
I can't believe we are signing a bang-average player in a position we don't need and that the player is also 48 years old, FFS get a grip!
In terms of this particular signing, I don't think it matters at all. We're so weak that complaining about having to choose a Casemiro-shaped improvement over FDJ-shaped one is laughable. It's all good.
In terms of the broader picture of whether our recruitment is going to be good enough though, I'd say it does matter. Because even if the end result in this case is fine, it implies bad times ahead if the process that got us there is the same shit-show we've seen for the last decade. Even if it doesn't show here, it will show in other transfers as we go along.
He is meant to sit and give others the platform to press and be proactive with his own defensive actions.
Not hard.
Not hard.
Oh I agree. Rabiot is no good. Honestly, I think it reinforces my inhibitions.
Where's the plan? Where's the forward thinking? This is a scattergun approach to signing players. "Oh look, a big name player might be available, let's try sign him."
Just look at how all the successful teams have built. It's with long term planning in mind. There's none of that with this signing.
So how about that cull of Bayern fans we were considering?
Yeah, we have needed a DM. But I don't think this particular DM fits Ten Hag's approach, or at least, my understanding of Ten Hag's approach. Maybe I'm wrong. Really hope I am.
I would question his motivation coming to United at this point. If he still has that hunger to be one of the best, he'd angle to go to a side that is in with a chance of winning the big trophies for the rest of his career. He has 2 or 3 more years at the top, most likely. United aren't going to be challenging for trophies in that time. He's coming for money.
Watching Espn earlier and the pundits just making it sound like he’s gone purely for the money only, as if he’s a mercenary.
signing for Manchester United isn’t going to the Chinese super league or Saudi league. This is a big club and maybe, just maybe, it’s the time for a totally different challenge.
he has won everything there is to win in a team that is expected to win everything. They have signed two very young players that play in his position and can’t guarantee him the same playing time, can’t give him a longer contract.
maybe coming to united and helping build the club up is appealing for him at this stage.. aswell as playing in the PL (best most challenging league on earth. It’s a totally different challenge and hopefully one he will relish.
If he wanted a easy pay cheque and a easy time he 1000000% would not of come here at this moment in time.. but of course because it’s man United he couldn’t possibly want to come here.. to play infront of 76,000 fans each week and wear a badge that really fecking means something.. In a struggling side that he will improve. He is what we need so badly.. maybe he sees that. Maybe he is excited by this prospect. Wish ABU media would just shut the feck up.
signing for Manchester United isn’t going to the Chinese super league or Saudi league. This is a big club and maybe, just maybe, it’s the time for a totally different challenge.
he has won everything there is to win in a team that is expected to win everything. They have signed two very young players that play in his position and can’t guarantee him the same playing time, can’t give him a longer contract.
maybe coming to united and helping build the club up is appealing for him at this stage.. aswell as playing in the PL (best most challenging league on earth. It’s a totally different challenge and hopefully one he will relish.
If he wanted a easy pay cheque and a easy time he 1000000% would not of come here at this moment in time.. but of course because it’s man United he couldn’t possibly want to come here.. to play infront of 76,000 fans each week and wear a badge that really fecking means something.. In a struggling side that he will improve. He is what we need so badly.. maybe he sees that. Maybe he is excited by this prospect. Wish ABU media would just shut the feck up.
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I was asking my Brazilian wife’s son in law who’s born and live in São Paulo and has followed Casemiro since he was a teenager.
My key notes from his assessment.
Experience.
Leadership.
Discipline.
Calmness.
Warrior mentality.
A few other lines translated from Portuguese by my wife’s oldest daughter who speaks a little bit English. (WhatsApp is our friend)
A positionally sound and excellent ball winner. Very good at reading the game. His presence will make it easier for our defense to be more positionally safe and it will allow especially Fred more freedom to press higher up in the pitch. His most valuable attributes isn’t what he do when he has the ball, it’s what he do the rest of the time when he control the central area in front of our CB with his sheer presence.
I share this view.
I have probably seen Real Madrid play at least 15+ games every season the last 10-15 years, especially in the CL and games against their rivals in La Liga. Case/Modric/Kroos and Biscuit/Iniesta/Xavi is probably two of the best midfield trios I can remember in the last 20 years. Perfectly balanced, unmatched skills combined with the right mentality and necessary winning instinct. I don’t like to compare players from different eras but Casemiro as a DM is up there with the very best.
In his position it’s often all the running and hard work that we don’t see that’s the main difference between a very good and thos who’re totally indispensable.
My key notes from his assessment.
Experience.
Leadership.
Discipline.
Calmness.
Warrior mentality.
A few other lines translated from Portuguese by my wife’s oldest daughter who speaks a little bit English. (WhatsApp is our friend)
A positionally sound and excellent ball winner. Very good at reading the game. His presence will make it easier for our defense to be more positionally safe and it will allow especially Fred more freedom to press higher up in the pitch. His most valuable attributes isn’t what he do when he has the ball, it’s what he do the rest of the time when he control the central area in front of our CB with his sheer presence.
I share this view.
I have probably seen Real Madrid play at least 15+ games every season the last 10-15 years, especially in the CL and games against their rivals in La Liga. Case/Modric/Kroos and Biscuit/Iniesta/Xavi is probably two of the best midfield trios I can remember in the last 20 years. Perfectly balanced, unmatched skills combined with the right mentality and necessary winning instinct. I don’t like to compare players from different eras but Casemiro as a DM is up there with the very best.
In his position it’s often all the running and hard work that we don’t see that’s the main difference between a very good and thos who’re totally indispensable.
Very different players. Rabiot is something like 1.90 and physically similar to Fellaini or Pogba. He has a great stride, is very strong for his position but in his mind he is a technician. He has quite nimble feet and is a good passer. In that way he is more similar to Pogba than Fellaini but Rabiot has a mean streak to him which is more Fellaini than Pogba. So a mix so to say.
Probably best as an 8 box-to-box but he would certainly love to think that he is a 10. With his mother as his agent he is unfortunately a bit spoiled and hasn't fully reached his potential. Used to watch him a lot at PSG when Zlatan, Lavezzi and the rest were still there. This boy could have been the next Vieira for France but he got in the way of himself, every bit as talented as Verratti. In fact those 2 + a third player should have become the worlds best midfield trio seeing how good they were while still only 20-22 years old.
You and your son in law are dead on. Rafa Benitez thought so too and boldly made Casemiro a starting player instead of stars like James Rodriguez/Isco. Perez wasn't happy, Benitez was fired, but Rafa was ultimately proven right. Zidane who followed tried a midfield without Casemiro for the first couple of months but quickly realized Benitez was right and re-inserted Casemiro. Rest is history.
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ESPN pundits are as ABU as they come.
it was horrendous. Like listening to gabby agbonlahor talk sport but worse.
Its constant. But they are populist... the moment United is on the upswing again, they will jump on that train reluctantly.
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Yeap. Less whinging and more fighting.
How doesn't he fit? Ten Hag didn't use Frenkie for too long. Look at them since Frenkie left. He used Edson Alvarez as a 6 and changed his build up structure. Frenkie is just a rare, unique player for him so he plans differently with and without him.
We needed a top class Midfielder NOW, not a good prospect that could improve us in 2/3 years. If we continued this season with a midfield of Mcfred we would only slip further behind the top clubs, therefore making it even harder to recruit quality in the future.
I couldn't give a shiny shite whether he's 30 or 35. He's a really good player in a position that we are desperately in need of upgrading. Brilliant signing in my opinion.
Again, perhaps I'm wrong there so! I'd see Casemiro as a trigger for opposition when we have ball. Didn't fit with my understanding of his system, but my knowledge isn't huge there, didn't watch loads of ajax
Hope you're right
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