even more damning, isn't it
Chelsea appoint Thomas Tuchel
- Thread starter RashyForPM
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The Bundesliga is shit compared to the EPL and I point that out constantly but whatever. But yeah, I think Guardiola is the best coach I've witnessed and Tuchel is the closest thing there is to him style wise.
That being said, I also think that you guys have absolutely zero clue about football. Moreover, I think it's cringey and childish that you can't look past your biases. Don't get what you find in football but probably you are more interested in the tribal aspects of it than the actual sport. Boring.
Embarrassing with the smilie yeah, Maguire’s outperformed him all season, which aint strange considering one in his prime and the other 36 in a new league.
As I say, laugh worthy 3 years ago (because Silva really was THAT good), daft today.
Your posts are getting worse every day.
Are you able to interact like a normal person? To people that can actually engage; have I missed something here? Has Thiago Silva had some sort of standout season that isn't being talked about? He's only played a full 90 minutes twice in the PL since the end of JanuaryI don't think it's an extreme reaction. Thiago Silva. Harry Maguire.
He missed all of their FA Cup games bar one, and missed both games against Atletico.That seems a bit more balanced.
Yeah. Harry Maguire who has been everpresent this season and has had an incredibly strong second half of the season vs. a 36 year old Thiago Silva that has struggled to see much of the pitch.Maybe a touch. Harry Maguire over Thiago Silva.
Jesus, please climb out of your own ass.
Why am I not surprised that you are not very fond of metrics?
Walking stereotype, congratulations.
You should be a bit nicer. Maybe you'll find somebody who explains the offside rule to you, then. I'd even draw you pictures if you want
Would definitely agree that fitness is a skill / trait that is often overlooked at the moment and Maguire has to get credit for it. If you were picking a player to have in your side for the next year you'd be crazy to not take Maguire; if you were picking a player for a one off match tomorrow for me at least I'd still lean towards Thiago Silva (unless the opposition has prime Crouch or the like in!)
Like I said, Silva offers so much value in terms of his passing - some of our poorer performances under Tuchel where we've struggled to break the opposition down have coincided with his absences. His ability to move the ball quickly out of defense through the lines has really been invaluable, and on top of that if you sit off him he has an unbelievable range of passing (see our first goal this past weekend against Fulham).
In my humble opinion, Maguire is a weak link in the United squad.
Thiago Silva is our best defender and we as a team have the best defense in Europe, currently. I think Harry Maguire is a very good centre back and I hope he continues playing like he has done for England this summer, but even with that huge age gap he's not in the same conversation as Thiago Silva.
This a thousand times. I have been asking myself what some of these posters actually get out of watching football. Yes, nobody is expecting a Man United fan to enjoy Man City contesting a Champions League final but these incredibly insecure and needlessly defensive posts, for no reason whatsoever, really have to stop. If you once said something positive about player X and team Y, it obviously means you're biased towards them and hate their rivals and everything you say must be judged on that. Or maybe, just maybe, not everyone is into petty rivalries (particularly foreign posters who, surprisingly to some it seems, signed up to this forum because they have an affinity towards Man United or the Premier League in general) and can see things objectively and just enjoy a good game of football without raging at the keyboard and comparing this versus that to death.
Shit opinion.
He's your best defender in a side lacking top class defenders. Tuchel has come in and turned you into a resolute side through playing 5 at the back, but the options of Rudiger, Zouma and Christensen are hardly up to much are they. How is the Chelsea defence better than Man City's, out of interest?
I don't understand what Thiago Silva has done this season that puts him on this pedestal. I've not heard anyone, anywhere lavishing praise on him yet here you are grandstanding him like he's from another planet. Based on this season Maguire is absolutely in the same conversation.
You have the best defence because you barely let any chances in and defend as a unit at all time. Your press is also immense along with your ability to keep possession and control the game. The opponent simply doesn't have the answer how to unlock you atm. So in general, I don't think that Silva is having a hard time defending in that team.
Which, overall, gives another credit to Tuchel.
Tuchel is truly a world class manager. Tactically astute. He transformed them in a week after taking over Lampard. Haven’t seen Chelsea play this well since Conte’s first season.
Thiago Silva was one of the best Chelsea players (any position) under Lampard until his injury. That was in a back four, in a subpar defending team.
Bags of talent in this squad, and a lot of potential especially from the likes of Havertz still to come. The thing thats blowing me away the most though is the energy, its the end of the season and they're still pressing non-stop and making lightning quick attacks. If we can get a top class CF in, then next season should be amazing. Hats off to Tuchel for what he's achieved since coming in, reaching 2 finals seemed like a dream towards the end of Frank's reign.
Because we've kept 19 clean sheets in 25 games under Tuchel including Man City, Real Madrid, Atletico Madrid, Tottenham, Liverpool & United. We are the best defense in Europe currently, and he's been the best defender out of our bunch.
I think those three are all very good defenders, who've looked worse than they are due to bad organisation at the back under Lampard. Rüdiger in particular looks brilliant these days, but he's always had all the tools be a top class defender. It just seems now he's finally making that next step and it's coming together, when previously his talent was held back by lack of concentration at times.
That's honestly mental
In all honesty, I watched them less before and under Lampard.
Under Tuchel, the way they defend as a unit and press as a unit seem far more impressive then any individual performance. I mean, atm Rudiger looks like prime Boateng.
Yeah, I think in this forum two completely different ways of consuming football collide with each other. There are many people with genuine interest in the sport and others who think it's their duty as a fan to despise everything related to their rivals. I don't get along with those people, neither here nor in real life. Just don't get how anyone can be proud to be biased. And it's also so toxic. Wonder if those guys can even watch a football match with friends supporting a different club or if they even can befriend those in the first place.
I like banter and rivalries superficially but if you start antagonizing people because they support a different club (especially since football fans are generally proud to be a 'born' XYZ supporter) this just goes too far and in fact this instinct is very similar to xenophobia. Not only childish but very simplistic.
Oh and all that aside, how exhausting does it have to be to be so toxic all the time. Why even watch a match of football when you can't enjoy it since you have to despise both teams not due to personal reasons but because you have a feeling that it's your duty to do so?
Tuchel is a quality manager. People put too much emphasis on player surnames but often disregard the influence a manager can have with a team. This Chelsea team is also one where improvement can be made in a multitude of areas.
This chat is stupid. Both Maguire and Thiago Silva are excellent CBs, though Thiago Silva is clearly better.
I also think he edges it despite a rocky start, but it's not like they're on different planets. I'm guessing Hansi doesn't watch all of our games in which it owuld be understandable if he only noticed his mistakes in the highlights.
STRIKER !
Hard to argue against this. The system works and that’s with a relatively average defence individually (that’s a complement).
Thiago Silva didn't even play against Atlético! Or Man Utd. Or Liverpool. Or Spurs.
By my reckoning City have conceded 16 goals in 26 games. They've played United, Liverpool, PSG, Spurs, Dortmund, Chelsea etc. 13 clean sheets. No doubt Chelsea will have conceded less than that, but is there much in it?
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On talent and ability Silva is ahead of Maguire no questions asked but if you're comparing them individually 1 vs 1 and taking them out of their roles in their team, to say a 36 year old being 'definitively' better than Maguire is a bit out there.
Silva and Lindelof is not a significantly worse pair on paper but Maguire has literally played the most amount of minutes of any player this season across all the leagues. He is the physical, aerial brawn and playmaker at the back next to the passive Swede. I doubt Silva would be able to replicate the same not because he doesn't have 'it' but simply because he wouldn't be able to do it at the longetivity Maguire has shown.
Maguire with Rudiger and Christensen/Zouma is almost overkill in terms of defence and whilst you'd lose a bit of Silva's passing, it's stronger enough not needing to play 3 at the back.
A fit and in form SIlva in a one off game, sure I can accept most would take him over Maguire but to extrapolate his best peaks/periods of form over the guy who plays every single thing is terribly out of context.
Maguire has been imperious for us and whilst we are a hardworking defensive team with two combatitive defensively minded midfielders, I think we work way harder for that due to not being coached as well. Chelsea are defensive with the tactics, emphasis on the possession play and pressing. We're more hard running box to box.
Silva and Lindelof is not a significantly worse pair on paper but Maguire has literally played the most amount of minutes of any player this season across all the leagues. He is the physical, aerial brawn and playmaker at the back next to the passive Swede. I doubt Silva would be able to replicate the same not because he doesn't have 'it' but simply because he wouldn't be able to do it at the longetivity Maguire has shown.
Maguire with Rudiger and Christensen/Zouma is almost overkill in terms of defence and whilst you'd lose a bit of Silva's passing, it's stronger enough not needing to play 3 at the back.
A fit and in form SIlva in a one off game, sure I can accept most would take him over Maguire but to extrapolate his best peaks/periods of form over the guy who plays every single thing is terribly out of context.
Maguire has been imperious for us and whilst we are a hardworking defensive team with two combatitive defensively minded midfielders, I think we work way harder for that due to not being coached as well. Chelsea are defensive with the tactics, emphasis on the possession play and pressing. We're more hard running box to box.
I've thought Rudiger was class since he joined, despite him having some poor times since, and Christiansen always had huge unrealized potential. Zouma is the one with probably the lowest ceiling, although he's far from being poor. I can't help but wonder if having Silva around has given the others a bit of a masterclass in training. Since JT left we haven't really had that level of experience in defence to share.
Rüdiher was probably one of the last defenders I expected to tmachieve this level. Always thought he was painfully average and never understood why Chelsea signed him. Proving me wrong big time.
Yes, absolutely true. Every part of the team carries each other, which raises every individual.
What I wanted to highlight is that Silva's individual class stood out more under Lampard, when the collective was weaker. General consensus was that his inclusion transformed Chelsea's defense from last season (Mendy being rightly mentioned as well), and many observers had him as an early Chelsea POTY candidate. Around the time of his injury, Mount had begun taking over.
Now that defense is first and foremost about the collective, I agree. However, what hasn't changed is Silva's class and importance when it comes to playmaking from the back. One of the best in the world in that position, and a big factor for a team that rarely gets into trouble building from the back. Some pretty brilliant attacking passes too this season.
You asked why Chelsea have a better defense against City and that's my answer. Thiago Silva in my opinion has been our best defender, just ahead of Rudiger and Christensen.
I don't think Lampard was as bad as people made out to be. He had his moments, Arsenal away, Derby vs Utd, Ajax away. But with the summer signings, he didn't know how to fit them into a working system. That's the lack of experience. Tuchel goes back to a back 3 and got Havertz and Werner playing to their strengths.
Not much in it but you only have to look at the styles of City and Chelsea to see that one team is more susceptible to the ball in behind than the other.
Remember looking at Chelsea's team in 2013/14 and thinking how Mourinho is making them slowly but surely into a proper team that can challenge for title, as they were more od a cup them for few seasons until he took over. Feels similar with this Tuchel's Chelsea now, you can expect much of them next season (and they are achieving things this season already).
In EPL, tbh, city and Chelsea have the greatest squad depth. We are two or three personals short. Hope this summer we can fill at least two to address it, midfield and RW.
Tuchel is a top coach, no doubt about it. He steadies the ship and solidifies the defense. But I am not sure if the way they play now can make Chelsea a title challenger next season. They have to evolve their play to score enough.