Cop in America doing a bad job, again

[NoLogo]

Scocking

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/05/us/buffalo-police-suspension-shoving-man-trnd/index.html

What's wrong with American Cops? How do they feel threatened by everything, so they have to use excessive force all the time?

I so another video a few minutes ago where again cops where kneeing on someone's head/neck area after they already had him on the ground with 4 people. Are they teaching their cops to do that?

 

[entropy]

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[afrocentricity]

https://www.wweek.com/news/city/202...being-pepper-sprayed-while-filming-an-arrest/

"As the man sputtered and spit and gasped, I, for reasons that I'm sure are clear, shouted to get the feck off his neck"

 

[GiddyUp]

What's wrong with American Cops? How do they feel threatened by everything, so they have to use excessive force all the time?

I so another video a few minutes ago where again cops where kneeing on someone's head/neck area after they already had him on the ground with 4 people. Are they teaching their cops to do that?

They used people and their vehicles as human shields in a shoot out, in a highway in the middle of the day. They don't give a shit about the public. They are collectively an embarrassment to public service.

 

[oneniltothearsenal]

Whoa whoa there buddy, don't you dare think about touching my overtime! It's one of the best perks of the job.
LAPD officers have been getting vacation days banked in-lieu of OT for years and only recently with their new contract got OT back. I obviously love my overtime, but looking at it objectively there is a lot of money put into it. Although it has been argued that for police and fire departments, it costs more to recruit and hire brand new employees, send them to academy/drill tower for months, and train them in the field in order to keep up with staffing levels. That's why a lot of smaller departments recruit and hire lateral officers that already have experience and completed probation. It should be noted however that a lot of the OT is not even paid by the department. There are movie/tv shoots, concerts, sporting events, parades, festivals, etc. that pay the department for X amount of police officers to staff events, and it's usually all OT pay for officers on their day off.
Because police work is unpredictable, OT is sometimes necessary (department paid) if there's a late arrest, late report, or critical incident. And this goes back to my earlier post regarding police benefiting greatly from liberal labor laws and MOU's. It's not an office/clerical job that you can hold off to complete tomorrow. Suspects have to be booked, reports need to be written and filed, evidence needs to be packaged and booked.

The bold sounds very problematic. If I work an office job 40 hrs/week then I take some sidework on the weekends, I don't get overtime rates. That's ridiculous to me that officers get overtime rates when they choose to do sidework like concerts or movie shoots.

Also I wouldn't place the blame on "liberal labor laws". Its more the result of the bargaining power of the unions with politicians that get elected on "tough on crime" bullshit rhetoric.

Since this is a George Floyd protest thread, I can assure you almost every department impacted has canceled days off and vacations for all their officers to staff the skirmish lines and/or handle normal calls for service while the protests are going on. That's a lot of OT getting paid out.

Much of which is completely unnecessary. Police getting overtime so they can shove a 75 year old man or do things like below is highly problematic:

https://slate.com/news-and-politics...rgbY_CPbL3NEPneGLMW_kpkh_l5M2aP3ICM_XH8hlozFE

The fire department are the real OT scammers! They work two back-to-back 24-hour shifts. What they commonly do is trade days with their colleagues and work FOUR days straight. That's 48 hours of OT in 1 week! Even though their base pay is lower than police, most of them make more in a year because of OT pay. Speaking of Fire, they are a way more discriminatory organization than police IMO. They're a real "old boys club" and almost all white males, with a few black sprinkled here and there. They rarely hire for attrition because it's less opportunity for OT. The hazing culture is like police departments were back in the day. Still, they really have it good. I'm jealous of them.

I agree with the decriminalization of drugs. Recreational marijuana is already legal now, and other drug offenses have been lowered from felonies to misdemeanors, or misdemeanors to infractions. Though according to your 2nd chart, opiate deaths didn't skyrocket until after 2007 where the 1st chart ends. But nonetheless drug possession and abuse is more of a health issue and shouldn't result in the mass incarcerations we've seen for the past few decades.

I understand a lot of people will have an issue with the amount of OT pay for police, but I've been on the job long enough to see other scams like workers comp (staying home for 1 whole year full pay), extended and questionable leaves of absence/sick days, able-bodied police officers doing civilian/admin work, frivolous complaints/lawsuits of discrimination/harassment/racism/sexism/retaliation with significant pay-outs, suing the department for injuries/illnesses with again more pay-outs. And the best one : https://www.latimes.com/opinion/editorials/la-ed-drop-pension-20180206-story.html
Of course I'm biased, but I don't mind the OT because at times it's necessary due to the nature of the job. And a lot of the special OT assignments are not paid by the department anyway. I personally have a bigger problem with my colleagues who, although grown-ass men and women who call themselves cops, are always scamming and crying or playing victim to get a lawsuit or promotion/special assignment. It goes against what I stand for.

Well, this definitely sounds like the police departments have a lot of systemic issues with how they hire and how they train if you see these scams happening. Doesn't exactly give us normal citizens a lot of confidence in police departments to be doing the right thing does it?

 

[choiboyx012]

The bold sounds very problematic. If I work an office job 40 hrs/week then I take some sidework on the weekends, I don't get overtime rates. That's ridiculous to me that officers get overtime rates when they choose to do sidework like concerts or movie shoots.

Also I wouldn't place the blame on "liberal labor laws". Its more the result of the bargaining power of the unions with politicians that get elected on "tough on crime" bullshit rhetoric.



Much of which is completely unnecessary. Police getting overtime so they can shove a 75 year old man or do things like below is highly problematic:

https://slate.com/news-and-politics...rgbY_CPbL3NEPneGLMW_kpkh_l5M2aP3ICM_XH8hlozFE




Well, this definitely sounds like the police departments have a lot of systemic issues with how they hire and how they train if you see these scams happening. Doesn't exactly give us normal citizens a lot of confidence in police departments to be doing the right thing does it?

It’s not really a “tough on crime” bullshit, it’s just the agreements cities have with event venues, film crews, stadiums etc to require police staff as security.

You do know that not all protests resulted in old grandpas getting injured? Many, including my department, had very peaceful protests. But we still have to have enough teams available to respond in case things spiral out of control. And while that’s going on we need enough officers to answer normal radio calls, because the world (and crime) doesn’t stop for protests. So yes, it’s (OT) kind of necessary.

Per your last paragraph, no i don’t believe it’s a problem with hiring and training. People can fake it through the hiring process. It’s impossible to predict with any test or interview how an employee is going to be once hired on. From my experience people’s true colors and personalities show once they finish probation. At that point you’re a full-fledged civil service employee and there’s too much invested in that officer.
I will suggest, however, that there needs to be a discussion on civil service protection. It’s very difficult to get rid of problem employees. There’s a complex and time-consuming process involved. I’ve seen many officers get fired and/or demoted, but many of them come back due to their civil service due-process being violated, or they sued the department and got their job back as a settlement.
We’re a medium-sized department so we have our fair share of shithousery. But it’s usually just a minority of the department who do these “scams” or play victim to get a fat pay-day. I’ve read somewhere that police departments are one of the most toxic working environments. It definitely is true. I’ve been on long enough to see and hear all the drama among all the ranks. But it’s all about the mindset and personality. Most of us get along and do the job with professionalism and try to have a good time, then bitch about it in the locker room when we’re going home.

 

[Grinner]

Just reading about those Met police who were attacked in hackney. The guy with the baseball bat was an Asian shopkeeper who went to help the officers. I hope he gets some recognition for that.

 

[TheReligion]

The bold sounds very problematic. If I work an office job 40 hrs/week then I take some sidework on the weekends, I don't get overtime rates. That's ridiculous to me that officers get overtime rates when they choose to do sidework

Don't do an office job then and join the cops.

 

[RedPed]

With all of these new videos of police mistreatment coming to light, the notion that there are just a few bad apples is just bullshit. It's just beyond comprehension the stuff that they have managed to get away with all these years. It's absolutely disgraceful. The whole lot needs to be just swept clean and start again. They're corrupt as feck.

 

[Grinner]

With all of these new videos of police mistreatment coming to light, the notion that there are just a few bad apples is just bullshit. It's just beyond comprehension the stuff that they have managed to get away with all these years. It's absolutely disgraceful. The whole lot needs to be just swept clean and start again. They're corrupt as feck.

I have a sneaking suspicion that the reality is actually somewhere between this and what the coppers in this thread reckon about it.

 

[RedPed]

I have a sneaking suspicion that the reality is actually somewhere between this and what the coppers in this thread reckon about it.

I don't really have time for what the coppers think. They're all part of the problem. I guarantee you they all know of a colleague who is probably a little unorthodox or have seen/heard stuff that should have been reported but just dismissed as being one of those 'bad apples'. 'Bad apples', I fecking hate that term.

 

[Grinner]

I don't really have time for what the coppers think. They're all part of the problem. I guarantee you they all know of a colleague who is probably a little unorthodox or have seen/heard stuff that should have been reported but just dismissed as being one of those 'bad apples'. 'Bad apples', I fecking hate that term.

so they are all bastards?

 

[RedPed]

so they are all bastards?

You trying to stitch me up for another infraction? But seeing as you've asked me the question, yeah pretty much! They've all been complicit to varying degrees in turning a blind eye to the odd incident. So they can't really be good cops can they?

 

[Grinner]

You trying to stitch me up for another infraction? But seeing as you've asked me the question, yeah pretty much! They've all been complicit to varying degrees in turning a blind eye to the odd incident. So they can't really be good cops can they?

no but I'm trying to point out that generalisations don't really work. We've all got to figure it out together or we're fecked. The police who post on here seem to be decent guys. Have you ever turned a blind eye to any illegality by anybody you know? Yeah I know coppers are on different standards, but you know what I mean.

 

[afrocentricity]

no but I'm trying to point out that generalisations don't really work. We've all got to figure it out together or we're fecked. The police who post on here seem to be decent guys. Have you ever turned a blind eye to any illegality by anybody you know? Yeah I know coppers are on different standards, but you know what I mean.

Highlighted the important part for you.... and anyone else that doesn't get it.

You can't clean up the police force without help from..... you guessed it, the police force.

 

[klsv]

Twitter talking about Atlanta Police shooting a fleeing, unarmed, black man in the back and killing him. Videos posted as well, with accusations of the officers picking up shells ro cover up. Apparently a lot of witnesses were also at the spot.

 

[RedPed]

no but I'm trying to point out that generalisations don't really work. We've all got to figure it out together or we're fecked. The police who post on here seem to be decent guys. Have you ever turned a blind eye to any illegality by anybody you know? Yeah I know coppers are on different standards, but you know what I mean.

Who's the 'we' you're referring to? It's not the public's problem. The police have to sort their own shit out.

See this is what pisses me off. Any time someone tries to justify police behaviour, they come up with a lame excuse. These people have chosen their profession and have very high standards to maintain EVERY day. There's no room for off days because guess what, on an off day someone dies. You would take a different view if it happened to you, which I'm guessing it hasn't. If they can't sign up to that they should take up a different profession.

As I said the coppers on here may well be decent guys but I'm willing to bet my life that they have at some point seen or heard something that was inappropriate and let it slide. The police have been generalising for decades and it seems to have worked out well for them....until now. Until they stand up and own that shit, yeah they are all bastards (as you put it).

 

[Grinner]

Highlighted the important part for you.... and anyone else that doesn't get it.

You can't clean up the police force without help from..... you guessed it, the police force.

So you've highlighted the bit that I wrote to let me know about it?

yeah I know it is important, I wrote it.

 

[afrocentricity]

So you've highlighted the bit that I wrote to let me know about it?

yeah I know it is important, I wrote it.

Well it wasnt just aimed at you was it? Great that we are in agreement though...

 

[Ludens the Red]

Who's the 'we' you're referring to? It's not the public's problem. The police have to sort their own shit out.

See this is what pisses me off. Any time someone tries to justify police behaviour, they come up with a lame excuse. These people have chosen their profession and have very high standards to maintain EVERY day. There's no room for off days because guess what, on an off day someone dies. You would take a different view if it happened to you, which I'm guessing it hasn't. If they can't sign up to that they should take up a different profession.

As I said the coppers on here may well be decent guys but I'm willing to bet my life that they have at some point seen or heard something that was inappropriate and let it slide. The police have been generalising for decades and it seems to have worked out well for them....until now. Until they stand up and own that shit, yeah they are all bastards (as you put it).

Can only speak for here (UK) but whenever I’ve used discretion it’s been with members of the public not with colleagues. It is rare to see or hear something inappropriate from colleagues and if you do it’ll most likely be a punch up after work drinks or someone driving like a twat and people regularly get reported for this.
Racism in Britain is very rarely obvious. I’m sure there are officers with extreme views but they’d never air them at work or let their mask slip. It’s all hidden away under layers so how exactly would you snuff these people out?

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....ed-following-gorilla-monkey-race-remarks.html

You’d have to get really lucky as above..

“On an off day somebody dies” This would apply more to US policing id say, not really here. But yeah most policing day in day out is just really mundane and Ive had plenty off days but it would be forgetting to do something. It’s so rare to be involved in a life/death situation.

 

[entropy]

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[berbatrick]

not the best lot of apples

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[Rado_N]

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A Few Bad Apples™

 

[berbatrick]

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[caid]

A Few Bad Apples™

A few bad apples spoils the bunch is the full saying. So its actually pretty appropriate

 

[choiboyx012]

We once had an old-timer former nypd guy who worked there in the 80s and 90s. He had some absolutely crazy stories. Stuff that he and other officers did, and also things that gangs and suspects used to do to them. I’m never surprised by anything coming from the nypd. For such a liberal progressive city their PD is one of the most backwards among the large metropolises. Today they’re still very much like the lapd were prior to the 90’s rampart scandals and federal consent decree.

 

[Rado_N]

We once had an old-timer former nypd guy who worked there in the 80s and 90s. He had some absolutely crazy stories. Stuff that he and other officers did, and also things that gangs and suspects used to do to them. I’m never surprised by anything coming from the nypd. For such a liberal progressive city their PD is one of the most backwards among the large metropolises. Today they’re still very much like the lapd were prior to the 90’s rampart scandals and federal consent decree.

Reminds me of the old timer cop turned author in Brooklyn 99 harking back to the “good old days”.

 

[MrMarcello]

not the best lot of apples

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[Rado_N]

Is that an iron cross at the bottom too?

 

[)_(]

There's been some stories from people coming out who've talked about the time they tried to do the right thing and who were basically shunned(if they were lucky).

 

[freeurmind]

 

[RedPed]

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Another guy shot in the back whilst running from the police. Why is their first course of action always to shoot? The guy was only sleeping in his car at a Wendy's ffs!

 

[adexkola]

Just kick out the bad apples and train the rest, that'll do it

 

[roseguy64]

Just kick out the bad apples and train the rest, that'll do it

That's what's happened in a few places. Particularly Camden, New Jersey. Disbanded and people had to reapply.

 

[TheReligion]

Who's the 'we' you're referring to? It's not the public's problem. The police have to sort their own shit out.

See this is what pisses me off. Any time someone tries to justify police behaviour, they come up with a lame excuse. These people have chosen their profession and have very high standards to maintain EVERY day. There's no room for off days because guess what, on an off day someone dies. You would take a different view if it happened to you, which I'm guessing it hasn't. If they can't sign up to that they should take up a different profession.

As I said the coppers on here may well be decent guys but I'm willing to bet my life that they have at some point seen or heard something that was inappropriate and let it slide. The police have been generalising for decades and it seems to have worked out well for them....until now. Until they stand up and own that shit, yeah they are all bastards (as you put it).

What a horse shit comments. Pretty disrespectful too. Not that you care about being offensive seeing as you're quite happy to call people racist when they don't agree with you in other threads. It seems your speciality is making sweeping generalisations before looking to engage your brain.

 

[choiboyx012]

The video doesn’t show the actual shots fired, but if the officer did indeed shoot him in the back as he was fleeing then he is fecked. There’s no justification for shooting fleeing suspects unless they pose a deadly threat to the officer or public if not immediately apprehended (Tennessee vs Garner).

 

[Gehrman]

The video doesn’t show the actual shots fired, but if the officer did indeed shoot him in the back as he was fleeing then he is fecked. There’s no justification for shooting fleeing suspects unless they pose a deadly threat to the officer or public if not immediately apprehended (Tennessee vs Garner).

Did they know that he was going for a tazer and a not a gun though?

 

[choiboyx012]

Did they know that he was going for a tazer and a not a gun though?

That is the question. But still weak. Even if he had a gun, if he’s simply running away you can’t shoot unless he actually turns around or points it.

 

[RedPed]

Did they know that he was going for a tazer and a not a gun though?

Course they did. It was the cop's own taser and the guy was otherwise unharmed. There was still no reason to shoot him.

 

[Pow]

Did they know that he was going for a tazer and a not a gun though?

He didnt have a gun. He takes their taser then runs and they shot him.