Based on one of the videos Suedesi posted earlier I'm guessing homeless person vs police is a regular occurrence...
Cop in America doing a bad job, again
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That's a tough one. While it seems to be justified I think the approach could have been less intense. They approached as a kill squad and did just that. No intention to do anything else.
https://www.krqe.com/news/crime/apd-releases-details-on-august-22-officer-involved-shooting/
https://www.krqe.com/news/crime/apd-releases-details-on-august-22-officer-involved-shooting/
WTF!! How do you even justify that? Anyone know what happened to these cnuts? If anything. Sickening! Don’t know how anyone could see that video and view it as anything other than straight up murder.
That's why you try to find out more about it. According to the police in Albuquerque he had a pistol style BB gun in his waistband and was reaching for it. But I agree it presents badly and they should have approached it with an absence of military precision.
Fecking load of bollocks! Team of cops armed to the teeth could’ve easily surrounded the guy and dealt with him without force. He was laying down at the start unaware they were even there, posing no threat to anyone. Just looks like a bunch of cnuts with itchy trigger fingers intent on provoking the guy into a reaction to justify shooting him.
If American police were bartenders in Dublin they would be in a mental home or serial killers. I've never seen a group of people who have all the advantages and training available to deal with minor situations be so afraid of their lives. They are either too cowardly for their job or they are lying to cover up their fecked up urges to assault and bend people to their will.
Yeah I mentioned that above with the kill squad comment. Like Shane alluded a different approach would likely have had a more positive outcome.
Like Tamir Rice, these guys seemed to be going completely off the details from a call. Doesn't look like they took much time to observe him. Engagement was aggressive. Straight to the standoff, no attempt at of personal engagement. No demonstrable understanding of how a person intent on actually shooting people would act. A real shitshow.
I would say they could have de-escalated it. They could have cufffed him when he was sleeping or something like that.
https://www.abqjournal.com/1380152/apd-man-shot-by-officers-in-august-was-armed-with-bb-gun.html
Gives a bit more pertinent information.
Gives a bit more pertinent information.
Deadly weapons = Tazers, BB Guns, Toy Guns, Swearwords, etc. Punishable by death....
I know what BB guns & toy guns look like. In America they can get ya killed, problem wouldn't you say?
The gun in question
I asked you earlier if you watched the video that @Suedesi posted, you never responded but in one of them you will see that often police lack the training to deal with these situations in a way that minimises the risk of loss of life....
Distance, time, cover...
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They looked well trained here. No sense risking your own life for a madman waving a gun at other people.
If you have that on your person in America you'll end up dead. No questions asked.
The gun in question
Shoot first asks questions later.
Your stupid to have them in public.
I'm seeing a person with a mind that's made up that won't even watch a ~10 minute video to challenge his mindset... I could be wrong. For now I'll assume that I am not.
Fecking disgusting behaviour from the police.
Would you engage a nutter with a gun with a smile and a handshake? I doubt you'd last long as a cop in the US with that sort of approach to the job.
[inserts images of lockdown protesters with high powered weaponry and body armour]
But yes @arnie_ni, you're mostly correct...
People with mental health problems deserve to be shot?
I think I am going to give this thread a break or just leave it completely. The absolute callousness with which people “getting what they deserve” or “engaging (the) nutter” is discussed is saddening.
Losing loved ones to violence of ANY type is not something to be mocked or WUMed about and each person discussed on these pages was loved by someone.
Think of the phone call that woman in the park made about the black bird watcher.
Id imagine someone made a similar call about this homeless guy said he has a gun etc etc and thats why they sent the guys trained to kill and just not the closest patrol car.
He probably had the gun to scare of people from attacking and beating him, for his own protection.
Some of y'all could do with watching that video though (no offense).
Proper preparation for the encounter would have probably saved that guys life (because as you say, they were probably informed of an armed man).
I'm no PO but based on what the guy was saying they could have approached from distance using cover and spoke to the homeless guy trying to deescalate and get him to dispose of the "weapon". Being that they were at a distance and behind cover they would appear less threatening, they would be more assured in their actions due to lower threat (nobody was in any immediate danger), and if (as I mentioned in an earlier post) they had a non lethal option they could have used that first to incapacitate him...
To me, the life of a suspect just doesn't seem to be a consideration. Some of the reactions & responses in this thread reinforce that feeling...
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They could have simply overpowered him and cuffed him. It looks like he was lying down sleeping.
Thats all well and good, but if that was the intention that unit wouldnt have been sent.
They likely got an active shooter type call and the aim was to neutralise the target.
My point being, i dont think its those individual cops fault, its the system.
They done what they were sent to do
Thanks for understanding the need for US policing to be dismantled and replaced.
They're not hitmen though are they? They're still cops, sent to 'protect and serve'. I get what you mean though...
Based on how they approached and in what numbers i presume that they had a call about armed man.
They warned him couple of times and he didn't listen and then reached for his "gun". What should have they do there? Wait that he fires first? They don't know that it is bb gun.
On the other hand, this frontal approach was bad. They could and should have catch him by surprise and cuff him before he even realise what is happening there.
There is pretty simple solution for all these shooting in America. Gun control. There is no coincidence that Europe has dozen times less killings than USA. Because Europe countries have strict gun control. Cops behave like cowboys there because they know that every person can have a gun.
They warned him couple of times and he didn't listen and then reached for his "gun". What should have they do there? Wait that he fires first? They don't know that it is bb gun.
On the other hand, this frontal approach was bad. They could and should have catch him by surprise and cuff him before he even realise what is happening there.
There is pretty simple solution for all these shooting in America. Gun control. There is no coincidence that Europe has dozen times less killings than USA. Because Europe countries have strict gun control. Cops behave like cowboys there because they know that every person can have a gun.
Pointless. Itl be the same guys apply.
It needs restructured with severe penalties for overstepping the line.
It needs a culture change.
They done what your talking about in northern ireland.
Dismantled and replaced the RUC with PSNI but apart from those close to retirement age everyone was rehired is how I understand it went
They did use the non-lethal option. Problem is half a second later the rest of them used their lethal options.
If they retrain and come back with new qualifications then sure, otherwise no, this isn't rebranding the old police with a new name. There won't be any more shootings of homeless people if we recognize that, probably we don't need a SWAT team going to respond to a homeless man call, but a social worker. The police's role in urban societies needs to be scaled back drastically. For the few items where you need an armed force to respond, selectively hire there and do all the training necessary and penalize oversteps in authority.
It’s called “sympathetic fire“ or contagious shooting where one starts shooting instinctively at a target when others do. Which is why if you’re using the less-lethal (taser, 40mm launcher/rubber rounds) you’re supposed to yell out to your team “less lethal, less lethal!” Or “taser, taser” etc before you actually fire, to prevent the sound triggering other officers with guns to start shooting.
Thanks for the insight. It's sad because I went through the bit where they shot him a few times and he looks to be stunned from the non-lethal round.
Cheers, thought so.
Bunch of supercops posting here who are prepared to confront an armed nutcase with no worry for their own or their colleague's safety.
Don't forget cellphones, if you have one of these in the dark you are done.
But every person doesn't have a gun and that's the point people are making about policing. Let's not forget the shoot out on a highway when police were using civilian filled vehicles as a shield. They are not up against paramilitaries over here, they shouldn't be acting like a military force. They are poorly recruited and trained and without a full 180 in their mentality it will not end well for this country.
They're also poorly paid and poorly treated. I'm not sure how you recruit better, when as soon as a recruit is given their badge they're treated as 'one of them.' That's not a criticism of your post by the way, just an observation.
You would not, I would not. But is their job to handle these situations correctly. Policemen are supposed to be trained to assess and act accordingly. It might happen by accident a few times, but it seems to be the norm
The problem it might be that the training is shit and an average of 21 weeks and specially, they are not afraid of the consequences so they go with full force
You can't measure a policeman supposed skills and professionalism to a normal person. They are suppose to be better in these situations as they are trained and PAID for it
It's society's failing that there are mentally ill people with guns out there. Asking cops to fix that is ridiculous.