Declan Rice

[MadMike]

Id love Rice but think West Ham will price him too high. He’d cost us more than we paid for Bruno.

In total yes, certainly. Though it might about the same outlay if we offset the potential Lingard fee.

Personally I'm more keen on AC Milan's Franck Kessie. He's more technical than Rice as we saw from the games against AC in the Europa. He's a couple of years older than Rice at 24 but that's still a great age. He's been at AC for 4 years now and might be up for a move and a pay rise, while AC won't ask the exorbitant money W.Ham will ask for Rice.

I think we could get Kessie for £40-45m (AC bought him for £21m) whereas Rice will probably cost us that, plus another ~£20m offset from Lingard.

 

[romufc]

We should go to West Ham, ask them the price, if they say something like £70m plus then walk away without even negotiating..

He isn't that special that we need to even bother with a drawn out transfer, there is other players around Europe we can get for £40m.

Let the scouts earn their money and give us a list.

 

[gajender]

In total yes, certainly. Though it might about the same outlay if we offset the potential Lingard fee.

Personally I'm more keen on AC Milan's Franck Kessie. He's more technical than Rice as we saw from the games against AC in the Europa. He's a couple of years older than Rice at 24 but that's still a great age. He's been at AC for 4 years now and might be up for a move and a pay rise, while AC won't ask the exorbitant money W.Ham will ask for Rice.

I think we could get Kessie for £40-45m (AC bought him for £21m) whereas Rice will probably cost us that, plus another ~£20m offset from Lingard.

I saw nothing special from Kessie against us, I wouldn't be in favour of spending £40-45m on another slightly above average midfielder but luckily he wouldn't cost that much due to his contract running out .
Kessie makes sense as cheap squad option for €20-25 m if we are planning mass clear out of our midfield otherwise we should stay away.

 

[bosskeano]

Paying 70m for Rice would be beyond stupid. We are better off getting Ndidi or Boussuma for 30-40m as they are every bit as good as Rice and half the pricetag.

You could bring in Camivinga and either of those two for what it would cost to buy Rice, so which is better business for the squad?

 

[Inigo Montoya]

In total yes, certainly. Though it might about the same outlay if we offset the potential Lingard fee.

Personally I'm more keen on AC Milan's Franck Kessie. He's more technical than Rice as we saw from the games against AC in the Europa. He's a couple of years older than Rice at 24 but that's still a great age. He's been at AC for 4 years now and might be up for a move and a pay rise, while AC won't ask the exorbitant money W.Ham will ask for Rice.

I think we could get Kessie for £40-45m (AC bought him for £21m) whereas Rice will probably cost us that, plus another ~£20m offset from Lingard.

Great shout. Saw him take 2 super pens yesterday. The guy is a beast and has the temperament to boot.

 

[Inigo Montoya]

Paying 70m for Rice would be beyond stupid. We are better off getting Ndidi or Boussuma for 30-40m as they are every bit as good as Rice and half the pricetag.

You could bring in Camivinga and either of those two for what it would cost to buy Rice, so which is better business for the squad?

While I agree with everything you have said, I'd say that Rice does offer much more of a goal threat than Bissouma- though I have gone on record as saying I'd love him here.
No chance we get Ndidi at that price, and I do think he's overrated.

Camavinga is a huge talent but I fear he's Bayern Munich bound

 

[bosskeano]

While I agree with everything you have said, I'd say that Rice does offer much more of a goal threat than Bissouma- though I have gone on record as saying I'd love him here.
No chance we get Ndidi at that price, and I do think he's overrated.

Camavinga is a huge talent but I fear he's Bayern Munich bound

it looks like Leicester are close to agreeing a deal with Boubakary Soumaré for a fee around 25m who plays the same role as Ndidi. Now his contract isn't up until 2024 so it makes you wonder if they are finding his replacement possibly as they expect bids for him over the summer. 40m might be enough to take him especially after they missed out on the CL spot.

Camavinga is the guy i'd like to get the most as i think he would be brilliant alongside Bruno. He's brings a bit of flair but isn't afraid to get stuck in and defend.

 

[bosnian_red]

While I agree with everything you have said, I'd say that Rice does offer much more of a goal threat than Bissouma- though I have gone on record as saying I'd love him here.
No chance we get Ndidi at that price, and I do think he's overrated.

Camavinga is a huge talent but I fear he's Bayern Munich bound

You don't really buy a defensive midfielder for their goal threat though. If they can be creative from deep that's a huge plus, but expecting goals is a bit pointless. You have the more attacking mid next to him, then the front 4 to get the goals. The defensive midfielder we need to get should be based on being able to hold a midfield defensively and provide cover for the back 4 enough to partner Pogba with Bruno up top. Ndidi would be great at that, Rice can grow into that though he's nowhere near Ndidi as of now. Fabinho is another one. Fred and McTominay are both box to box players, Matic is the only true DM we have and he's well past it by now.

 

[Zoo]

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[TMS]

it looks like Leicester are close to agreeing a deal with Boubakary Soumaré for a fee around 25m who plays the same role as Ndidi. Now his contract isn't up until 2024 so it makes you wonder if they are finding his replacement possibly as they expect bids for him over the summer. 40m might be enough to take him especially after they missed out on the CL spot.

Camavinga is the guy i'd like to get the most as i think he would be brilliant alongside Bruno. He's brings a bit of flair but isn't afraid to get stuck in and defend.

Could be a Choudhury replacement if they are looking to move him on, I've seen him linked to Newcastle and that he's open to a move. At his age he should be looking to play every week and he's much more likely to at Newcastle than Leicester. Soumare would be a nice squad upgrade for Leicester as they start to look to compete on all fronts perhaps.

Regardless of if Soumare was a replacement for Choudhury or Ndidi Leicester wouldn't let Ndidi go for £40m, not a chance. Do you not remember the Maguire saga and signing? We'd be looking at a similar fee most likely for him or Rice.

 

[Inigo Montoya]

You don't really buy a defensive midfielder for their goal threat though. If they can be creative from deep that's a huge plus, but expecting goals is a bit pointless. You have the more attacking mid next to him, then the front 4 to get the goals. The defensive midfielder we need to get should be based on being able to hold a midfield defensively and provide cover for the back 4 enough to partner Pogba with Bruno up top. Ndidi would be great at that, Rice can grow into that though he's nowhere near Ndidi as of now. Fabinho is another one. Fred and McTominay are both box to box players, Matic is the only true DM we have and he's well past it by now.

I am aware of that, it's the all round package I was referring to. Keane improved his defensive duties no end but still offered a goal threat.

When players from various positions can chip in with goals it's a bonus. As much as Maguire is a lynchpin of our defence, Vidic was unbelievable at set pieces especially corners. We need that, not suggesting that Rice is the be all and end all but just highlighting his strengths and areas to improve.

 

[Inigo Montoya]

Could be a Choudhury replacement if they are looking to move him on, I've seen him linked to Newcastle and that he's open to a move. At his age he should be looking to play every week and he's much more likely to at Newcastle than Leicester. Soumare would be a nice squad upgrade for Leicester as they start to look to compete on all fronts perhaps.

Regardless of if Soumare was a replacement for Choudhury or Ndidi Leicester wouldn't let Ndidi go for £40m, not a chance. Do you not remember the Maguire saga and signing? We'd be looking at a similar fee most likely for him or Rice.

Plus he's really rubbish...

 

[MadMike]

I saw nothing special from Kessie against us, I wouldn't be in favour of spending £40-45m on another slightly above average midfielder but luckily he wouldn't cost that much due to his contract running out .
Kessie makes sense as cheap squad option for €20-25 m if we are planning mass clear out of our midfield otherwise we should stay away.

We must have watched a different game then, because I thought he bossed the midfield against us at OT.



He's also been instrumental in AC Milan's resurgence in the 2nd half of the season and their 2nd placed finish. He's in with a great shout to being voted in the team of the season in Serie A.

 

[crossy1686]

While I agree with everything you have said, I'd say that Rice does offer much more of a goal threat than Bissouma- though I have gone on record as saying I'd love him here.
No chance we get Ndidi at that price, and I do think he's overrated.

Camavinga is a huge talent but I fear he's Bayern Munich bound

He's done nothing but talk about how much he loves Madrid over the last few seasons. I think his club also have an agreement in place with them for when he does leave.

 

[crossy1686]

In total yes, certainly. Though it might about the same outlay if we offset the potential Lingard fee.

Personally I'm more keen on AC Milan's Franck Kessie. He's more technical than Rice as we saw from the games against AC in the Europa. He's a couple of years older than Rice at 24 but that's still a great age. He's been at AC for 4 years now and might be up for a move and a pay rise, while AC won't ask the exorbitant money W.Ham will ask for Rice.

I think we could get Kessie for £40-45m (AC bought him for £21m) whereas Rice will probably cost us that, plus another ~£20m offset from Lingard.

Realistically, players who score or create goals cost more than players that stop goals. If scoring and creating was easier than being a spoiler, defenders would be worth more than strikers.

With that being said, Lingard should cost more than Rice (I know he's in his last year of his contract). Surely West Ham need Lingard more? Rice is easier to replace for them.

 

[Judas]

I honestly think we'll go for Rice and if we can't get him buy no one else for the midfield, unless Pogba goes that'll change things.

 

[Bebestation]

There was a day when I saw our defence playing really high up in the field.

Its that day where I realised we needed Rice.

We have a goal keeper that allows our ball playing defenders to get out forward. We will have a ball winning midfielder capable of dropping in between the CB's to either help out defensively, or to win the ball and recycle the possession to the nearest ball playing defenders (we will buy one this summer) to start a counter attack at an angle. We have defensively capable fullbacks that have the ability to provide width and get forward.

We have the ability to play an extra attacker because of Rice. As Simple as that sounds, that cannot be underestimated.

Alot of the CDM's that people might want, may be more technical or better on the ball - but would also possibly need a less attacking player to balance them out in deeper areas; a player to do the pure ball winning of a midfielder.

 

[MadMike]

Realistically, players who score or create goals cost more than players that stop goals. If scoring and creating was easier than being a spoiler, defenders would be worth more than strikers.

With that being said, Lingard should cost more than Rice (I know he's in his last year of his contract). Surely West Ham need Lingard more? Rice is easier to replace for them.

This isn't remotely how this works. There's multiple factors taken into account when estimating transfer fees, such as: age, desirability, position, nationality, contract situation, the financial ability of the prospective buyer etc. Generally, EPL teams only sell their young English startlets to other EPL teams at a huge premium especially if the team that comes knocking is a "rich" club. Hence 22yo Rice, will cost a pretty penny.

Lingard is neither young (he is 28) nor is he really a startlet. He left here 5 months ago being totally unwanted and we don't need him since Fernandes has been so instrumental for us. His contract with United is entering its last season and he's a free agent next summer. Lingard is likely to want to stay in London, given his spell there and the faith Moyes has shown in him, knowing that if he comes back to United he'll only be a bench warmer and his confidence will likely plummet again as a result. All that puts a cap on how much we can ask for him.

You're telling me you'd spend more than £20-25m on Lingard on his final year of contract? No chance.

 

[crossy1686]

This isn't remotely how this works. There's multiple factors taken into account when estimating transfer fees, such as: age, desirability, position, nationality, contract situation, the financial ability of the prospective buyer etc. Generally, EPL teams only sell their young English startlets to other EPL teams at a huge premium especially if the team that comes knocking is a "rich" club. Hence 22yo Rice, will cost a pretty penny.

Lingard is neither young (he is 28) nor is he really a startlet. He left here 5 months ago being totally unwanted and we don't need him since Fernandes has been so instrumental for us. His contract with United is entering its last season and he's a free agent next summer. Lingard is likely to want to stay in London, given his spell there and the faith Moyes has shown in him, knowing that if he comes back to United he'll only be a bench warmer and his confidence will likely plummet again as a result. All that puts a cap on how much we can ask for him.

You're telling me you'd spend more than £20-25m on Lingard on his final year of contract? No chance.

I don't think Lingard would walk away for nothing. If United offered him a new contract and promised to sell him if West Ham come in with a decent offer, I'm sure he'd sign it.

Lingard took West Ham to a whole new level this season with his creative influence. As I said, that's harder to replace (more costly also) than a spoiler in the form of a CDM. I'm not saying Rice will be cheap or Lingard will be expensive but this Lingard plus £30m stuff is nonsense.

 

[bsCallout]

I just want us to forget this overrated/overpriced player. This is our chance again to get our DM right and he doesnt have the passing technique for the role. We need a carrick/thiago motta type of player. Even a younger matic will do.

His name's Garner.

 

[MadMike]

I don't think Lingard would walk away for nothing. If United offered him a new contract and promised to sell him if West Ham come in with a decent offer, I'm sure he'd sign it.

Why would he do such a thing? It only increases the risk of him spending the rest of his career on the bench. Why would he take an unwritten promise for anything? What's to guarantee him United's expectation of a "decent offer" isn't something ludicrous which then rules out the move for him?

I for my part am pretty sure that if he was offered a contract he'd just sit on the offer until he saw what West Ham are willing to offer him and make his mind then.

Lingard took West Ham to a whole new level this season with his creative influence. As I said, that's harder to replace (more costly also) than a spoiler in the form of a CDM. I'm not saying Rice will be cheap or Lingard will be expensive but this Lingard plus £30m stuff is nonsense.

I think it will be Lingard and a lot more than £30m but we'll see. You don't get 22yo English starlets for less than £50m for any position. We paid £50m for a 22yo right back from Palace for Christ's sake, you think 6th-placed West Ham won't ask over £60m for a midfielder? Cause I would if I were them and I think they clearly will too. I expect them to value Lingard at ~£20m and ask for at least £40m on top for Rice.

 

[golden_blunder]

In total yes, certainly. Though it might about the same outlay if we offset the potential Lingard fee.

Personally I'm more keen on AC Milan's Franck Kessie. He's more technical than Rice as we saw from the games against AC in the Europa. He's a couple of years older than Rice at 24 but that's still a great age. He's been at AC for 4 years now and might be up for a move and a pay rise, while AC won't ask the exorbitant money W.Ham will ask for Rice.

I think we could get Kessie for £40-45m (AC bought him for £21m) whereas Rice will probably cost us that, plus another ~£20m offset from Lingard.

I don’t see it with Kessie I really don’t

 

[crossy1686]

Why would he do such a thing? It only increases the risk of him spending the rest of his career on the bench. Why would he take an unwritten promise for anything? What's to guarantee him United's expectation of a "decent offer" isn't something ludicrous which then rules out the move for him?

I for my part am pretty sure that if he was offered a contract he'd just sit on the offer until he saw what West Ham are willing to offer him and make his mind then.



I think it will be Lingard and a lot more than £30m but we'll see. You don't get 22yo English starlets for less than £50 for any position. We paid £50m for a right back from Palace for Christ's sake, you think 6th-placed West Ham won't ask over £60m for midfielder? Cause I think they clearly will. I expect them to value Lingard at ~£20m and ask for at least £40m on top for Rice.

Because he's previously stated he doesn't want to leave United, it's his boy hood club and he's worked hard to get to where he is now. If he was offered inroads back to the first team I'm certain he would take it. We don't know what he's thinking, he might fancy a West Ham move or he might be seeing this as a way to force himself back into the equation at United.

Rice isn't a starlet, he's not an 18 year old Rooney or Greenwood, he's not even a 22 year old Carrick. West Ham keep plucking figures out of the air because he's the only saleable asset they've got, and they're hoping to sell him and revamp a majority of the squad based on that money. It isn't going to happen, no one's going to pay 'bank of England' money for Rice, even his name is the most boring and basic carbohydrate going!

 

[golden_blunder]

Paying 70m for Rice would be beyond stupid. We are better off getting Ndidi or Boussuma for 30-40m as they are every bit as good as Rice and half the pricetag.

You could bring in Camivinga and either of those two for what it would cost to buy Rice, so which is better business for the squad?

They aren’t the same type of player though. They don’t sit. They are like dogs who chase every car wheel that passes and even chase after it. Rice keeps his position. He’s a pure DM

 

[MadMike]

Because he's previously stated he doesn't want to leave United, it's his boy hood club and he's worked hard to get to where he is now. If he was offered inroads back to the first team I'm certain he would take it. We don't know what he's thinking, he might fancy a West Ham move or he might be seeing this as a way to force himself back into the equation at United.

Rice isn't a starlet, he's not an 18 year old Rooney or Greenwood, he's not even a 22 year old Carrick. West Ham keep plucking figures out of the air because he's the only saleable asset they've got, and they're hoping to sell him and revamp a majority of the squad based on that money. It isn't going to happen, no one's going to pay 'bank of England' money for Rice, even his name is the most boring and basic carbohydrate going!

I guess we'll see.

 

[Hammondo]

We must have watched a different game then, because I thought he bossed the midfield against us at OT.



He's also been instrumental in AC Milan's resurgence in the 2nd half of the season and their 2nd placed finish. He's in with a great shout to being voted in the team of the season in Serie A.

Very comfortable on the ball.

 

[golden_blunder]

He's done nothing but talk about how much he loves Madrid over the last few seasons. I think his club also have an agreement in place with them for when he does leave.

Don’t let @JPRouve hear you saying that!

 

[Hammondo]

Realistically, players who score or create goals cost more than players that stop goals. If scoring and creating was easier than being a spoiler, defenders would be worth more than strikers.

With that being said, Lingard should cost more than Rice (I know he's in his last year of his contract). Surely West Ham need Lingard more? Rice is easier to replace for them.

Strange I don't think that fits for Guardiola. At least not at city.

 

[JPRouve]

Don’t let @JPRouve hear you saying that!

He has said nothing about it, he barely talks to the press. Madrid medias have been claiming non stop that he wants to join them though.

 

[Bebestation]

I don’t see it with Kessie I really don’t

I think sometimes players can catch the eye because of the way they dribble in certain areas of the pitch or under a pressure.

This is kind of all I saw with Kessie - I don’t really see why he should be our one and only central CDM.

If it was a replacement for Fred then I could understand it more but I guess that’s with alot of these Bissouma or maybe even Ndidi like players - they are more a replacement for Fred than a pure Matic replacement in our squad.

 

[golden_blunder]

I think sometimes players can catch the eye because of the way they dribble in certain areas of the pitch or under a pressure.

This is kind of all I saw with Kessie - I don’t really see why he should be our one and only central CDM.

If it was a replacement for Fred then I could understand it more but I guess that’s with alot of these Bissouma or maybe even Ndidi like players - they are more a replacement for Fred than a pure Matic replacement in our squad.

That’s how I see it too. I want a player who will keep his shape and help the defence whilst our more attacking player players get on with it.

 

[Lash]

That’s how I see it too. I want a player who will keep his shape and help the defence whilst our more attacking player players get on with it.

Surely if that's your main trait then spending potentially 70m on Rice isn't the best answer though?

 

[USREDEVIL]

Rice? Meh. I guess James Maddison isn't really what we need but there's got to be a better option than Rice.

 

[RedRonaldo]

We must have watched a different game then, because I thought he bossed the midfield against us at OT.



He's also been instrumental in AC Milan's resurgence in the 2nd half of the season and their 2nd placed finish. He's in with a great shout to being voted in the team of the season in Serie A.

Looks really good keeping possession and helping out the attack. But how does he do defensively? I thought we need a strong DM to support our fine AM. With Hannibal we already have a future no.8 who is pretty decent on the ball, but we need a DM.

 

[JPRouve]

Surely if that's your main trait then spending potentially 70m on Rice isn't the best answer though?

A young version of Casemiro would be ideal, it has to exist somewhere.

 

[bosskeano]

They aren’t the same type of player though. They don’t sit. They are like dogs who chase every car wheel that passes and even chase after it. Rice keeps his position. He’s a pure DM

i can't argue that point as you're right about them not being the sitting type of player like Rice but neither really is Yves Bissouma or Ndidi to an extent. Unless you sell one of Fred or McT then i don't see Ole bringing in a true holding midfielder because those two have played almost every big match. I'd rather have a more mobile dog that wants to constantly nip about on players heels than an old dog who sits on the porch because that's where he's been told to sit.

The one big argument/complaint we have with the McFred double pivot isn't the defensive side it is their ball playing ability. Camavinga, Bissouma and Ndidi bring the ball playing ability but also that tenacity to kick the piss out of people when needed. That is really what City have with Gundogan, Silva, Foden etc.... they aren't ball winners but they aren't afraid to kick someone, harrass them to win a ball back and they are damn good on the ball.

 

[gajender]

A young version of Casemiro would be ideal, it has to exist somewhere.

How do you rate Rice ?

 

[Lash]

A young version of Casemiro would be ideal, it has to exist somewhere.

I'm not saying I know who it is, but surely there must be!

 

[JPRouve]

How do you rate Rice ?

I haven't watched him enough to have a strong opinion.

 

[yamo123x]

Rice in my opinion does the job of both fred and MCT thus freeing up an opportunity for a more creative central midfielder.

Rice is quick, industrious and physical.....whilst being good on the ball too. If we could do a deal involving Lingard we should do it