I don't know, he's one of those players who's a bit deceptive. He's no Drogba or anything but he's not easy to push around and is very good in the air, so a big defender has to mark him. He is a handful for defenders, especially with his off the ball movement.Is he feck, he couldn’t fight his way out of a wet paper bag. He’s got some good attributes, but he’s soft as shite.
Yeh, that looked very much 50-50 with both players jumping for the ball. A harsh yellow. TBH I thought the ref let Brentford get a way with far too much timewasting and feigning injury.The first yellow he got itself should not have been a yellow. Standard of refs in PL is very poor, don't expect much from them.
You are correct. He is a player reborn playing the false 9/#8 hybrid for Arsenal.He took some penalties, but he wasn’t ever the penalty taker. That was always Jorginho. And yet still, Havertz will most likely have his most productive season in England this season.
9 goals in a season for one of the best attacking sides in Europe must be an extremely false 9.You are correct. He is a player reborn playing the false 9/#8 hybrid for Arsenal.
Because he mostly played in midfield during this season. But when you look at the stats since he started playing continuously as a striker (which is the last 6 matches) he as 5 goals and 4 assists. That's a world class run9 goals in a season for one of the best attacking sides in Europe must be an extremely false 9.
Rejuvenated is strong - he just obviously needs to be used as an attacking hub with direct runners around him. He's never going to lead the league in goals but he is and always has been an elite facilitator.A goal and an assist today, MOTM for me. Arteta has completely rejuvenated him. People keep talking about how we need a more prolific striker...we're top scorers with 75 goals, 4 more than City and 5 more than Liverpool (who have a game in hand). Not sure I agree with that narrative anymore, or at least we may not have to break the bank to get someone absolute top quality. If Jesus can follow in Havertz's footsteps and be more clinical in front of goal (and stay fit), we'd be in even better shape.
Not to argue semantics but most people (your lot especially) were laughing at how we overpaid for Havertz. I also thought the fee was high. Yet he has turned out to be well worth it and still has his best years ahead of him. Perhaps if Arteta hadn't persisted with him in midfield earlier in the season he'd have bagged more goals. Either way, I feel there is much more to come from him. Maybe he will turn out to be that LCM Arteta supposedly bought him for and we get a more prolific striker upfront.Rejuvenated is strong - he just obviously needs to be used as an attacking hub with direct runners around him. He's never going to lead the league in goals but he is and always has been an elite facilitator.
I also thought the club overpaid for him and his start to the season was pretty poor but you're right that more recently he's settled in and really contributed with a strong run of form. It's looking more like he was a good buy although I'm still not convinced that LCM role is what he'll be best at.Not to argue semantics but most people (your lot especially) were laughing at how we overpaid for Havertz. I also thought the fee was high. Yet he has turned out to be well worth it and still has his best years ahead of him. Perhaps if Arteta hadn't persisted with him in midfield earlier in the season he'd have bagged more goals. Either way, I feel there is much more to come from him. Maybe he will turn out to be that LCM Arteta supposedly bought him for and we get a more prolific striker upfront.
It's a rare win/win/win transfer. If I could defend our (generally idiotic) fanbase, by most indications this past summer he was seemingly meant to be the Xhaka replacement and in fairness that's how he was deployed initially.Not to argue semantics but most people (your lot especially) were laughing at how we overpaid for Havertz. I also thought the fee was high. Yet he has turned out to be well worth it and still has his best years ahead of him. Perhaps if Arteta hadn't persisted with him in midfield earlier in the season he'd have bagged more goals. Either way, I feel there is much more to come from him. Maybe he will turn out to be that LCM Arteta supposedly bought him for and we get a more prolific striker upfront.
He makes sense for a versatility perspective, but the fee is still ridiculous. 9 goals and 5 assists so far isn't really well worth it for someone who's mainly playing up top and you're likely going to invest heavily in his position come the summer. He's certainly turned a corner for your guys now and contributing consistently, we'll see if that's enough to win you anything come the end of the season.Not to argue semantics but most people (your lot especially) were laughing at how we overpaid for Havertz. I also thought the fee was high. Yet he has turned out to be well worth it and still has his best years ahead of him. Perhaps if Arteta hadn't persisted with him in midfield earlier in the season he'd have bagged more goals. Either way, I feel there is much more to come from him. Maybe he will turn out to be that LCM Arteta supposedly bought him for and we get a more prolific striker upfront.
But he hasn't played mainly up top this season, he mostly was used in midfield. There the fee was ridiculous, but if we limit his stats to the matches he actually played up top he is scoring more than one goal/assist per match, you have to pay that money for a striker who gets those numbers in the PL.He makes sense for a versatility perspective, but the fee is still ridiculous. 9 goals and 5 assists so far isn't really well worth it for someone who's mainly playing up top and you're likely going to invest heavily in his position come the summer. He's certainly turned a corner for your guys now and contributing consistently, we'll see if that's enough to win you anything come the end of the season.
Yeh, it's interesting because the players (Rice, Havertz) have said that Arteta has made them think of football differently. I think the versatility aspect is the main thing they're talking about - if Havertz turns out to be a very viable option as striker (which he already is) AND midfielder for us, then the fee looks much better. He's only 24 and has a very good engine on him. Next to Odegaard, he doesn't stop running. Arteta seems to want versatility from his players more than anything - Trossard, Martinelli, Havertz and Jesus are all having to show they can play anywhere in the front 3 and/or midfield. Saka is the only attacker that doesn't move around.He makes sense for a versatility perspective, but the fee is still ridiculous. 9 goals and 5 assists so far isn't really well worth it for someone who's mainly playing up top and you're likely going to invest heavily in his position come the summer. He's certainly turned a corner for your guys now and contributing consistently, we'll see if that's enough to win you anything come the end of the season.
He has played in midfield at least half the games this season. We’ll see how long he can keep it up but he has been one of the best players in the league the last couple months when playing consistently upfront.He makes sense for a versatility perspective, but the fee is still ridiculous. 9 goals and 5 assists so far isn't really well worth it for someone who's mainly playing up top and you're likely going to invest heavily in his position come the summer. He's certainly turned a corner for your guys now and contributing consistently, we'll see if that's enough to win you anything come the end of the season.
Great season? hes been garbage most of the season. How is the Havertz at Arsenal any different to the one at Chelsea?.He was always a really good technical player, but I think he is using his size more now and is enjoying playing with better footballers around him.
Chelsea have definitely made their team worse, it’s about where they go from here and what they do next. But Havertz has had a great season and he probably should have been one of the ones they held on to.
Yeah it was looking rough for a while but credit to him. Arsenal fans wanted him out of the team for a stretch of the season. He’s fought through the adversity and it’s looking a very positive season for him.He has played in midfield at least half the games this season. We’ll see how long he can keep it up but he has been one of the best players in the league the last couple months when playing consistently upfront.
In the end, 60m isn’t what it used to be. United paid that for Mount, Spurs for Richarlison, City for both Doku and Nunes, Liverpool for Szoboslai. That’s without even getting into more expensive players like Antony or Mudryk.
I’m sure Arteta would very gladly pay it again.
How exactly? He was playing pretty well in midfield up until December. In fact, had we not handed you £60m to keep FFP / PSR from the door, I would have been fairly happy with his performances. If it was a £40m transfer from Brighton, for example, no one would have batted an eyelid.Great season? hes been garbage most of the season. How is the Havertz at Arsenal any different to the one at Chelsea?.
He's now back at CF when the narrative was Chelsea ruined him and he isn't a CF. Arsenal will buy a CF in the summer then where does he play? back to nobody knows what his best position is.
He definitely hasn’t been garbage most of the season. I know Chelsea fans will take a lot of persuading but he has been one of arsenals better performers in one of their best seasons in a while and has performed well up front or in that advanced 8 role.Great season? hes been garbage most of the season. How is the Havertz at Arsenal any different to the one at Chelsea?.
He's now back at CF when the narrative was Chelsea ruined him and he isn't a CF. Arsenal will buy a CF in the summer then where does he play? back to nobody knows what his best position is.
Right now Arteta has reverted back to using him almost exactly how Chelsea used him. He was mostly pretty awful when he was being used in midfield. Arteta had to either bench him or move him up front. It seems to me that Arteta was really determined to make Havertz the midfielder a success but he’s had to swallow his pride a bit when he realised what Tuchel realised 2 years ago, that Havertz cannot be relied on to be a competent PL midfielder. Now that he’s up front, he’s useful, but now that he is up front, I don’t see a different player to the one we had for 3 years.He definitely hasn’t been garbage most of the season. I know Chelsea fans will take a lot of persuading but he has been one of arsenals better performers in one of their best seasons in a while and has performed well up front or in that advanced 8 role.
He has helped them win duels further up the pitch and looks to have pushed on physically to the player he was at Chelsea. Only about 11-12 players in the whole league have scored more than him, so it’s not exactly a knock to his contributions
I don't think so, he just evolved away from that role. While it's true that Wirtz replaced him in Leverkusen by now Wirtz playing behind Havertz works quite good.Better than Wirtz.
It seems like you don’t watch full Arsenal games all that much (which is perfectly understandable). Havertz was fine in midfield for us. He won a crazy amount of individual duels, never stopped running and had better defensive stats than Xhaka in his last season with us. However, he wasn’t as productive as Xhaka was in his last season so the were doubts over whether he was worth the price tag.Right now Arteta has reverted back to using him almost exactly how Chelsea used him. He was mostly pretty awful when he was being used in midfield. Arteta had to either bench him or move him up front. It seems to me that Arteta was really determined to make Havertz the midfielder a success but he’s had to swallow his pride a bit when he realised what Tuchel realised 2 years ago, that Havertz cannot be relied on to be a competent PL midfielder. Now that he’s up front, he’s useful, but now that he is up front, I don’t see a different player to the one we had for 3 years.
I don’t think I’ve missed more than 5 Arsenal games this season, or any of the last couple of seasons. My people are Arsenal fans. I live with them. Watch football with them. We discuss/argue about Arsenal every single day. Havertz in midfield was damn near invisible almost every time. I’ve never checked his underlying stats, so I’ll take your word for it but he was not even a little bit impressive in midfield. Moving him up top is what I said he needed and it’s been good for him.It seems like you don’t watch full Arsenal games all that much (which is perfectly understandable). Havertz was fine in midfield for us. He won a crazy amount of individual duels, never stopped running and had better defensive stats than Xhaka in his last season with us. However, he wasn’t as productive as Xhaka was in his last season so the were doubts over whether he was worth the price tag.
He’s never been garbage and was very much a competent midfielder. He's been a near ever-present in the team that is currently top of the league and prepping for a CL QF, he’s been more than competent - he’s been a real asset.
I dont watch Chelsea all that regularly, so if you think he’s no different to the player you had for 3 years, I’ll take your word for it. But he’s currently one of the best players in a team that is challenging for the most important trophies, so if that’s actually true I don’t think it was a good move to sell him.
There’s one Chelsea fan in here that doesn’t rate him at all, but in fairness to him, he didn’t rate him when he was at Chelsea either so at least he’s consistent and it isn’t a case of a bitter ex. The rest of us have been fairly complimentary to Havertz when he has had good games.Chelsea fans won't like to admit Havertz has been very effective for Arsenal since the turn of the year.
If Wirtz brings his bundesliga game with him then he will kill it, but I also think Havertz's physicality seems to be underrated, as well as his mentality. He's really good for the PL. Never stops fighting, never shies away from a duel.I don't think so, he just evolved away from that role. While it's true that Wirtz replaced him in Leverkusen by now Wirtz playing behind Havertz works quite good.
Pretty much took the words out my mouth, these Chelsea fans will watch some highlights and look at G/A stats and draw conclusions that Havertz has been 'awful' but he's pretty much always been competent at worst, it's his progressive play that's let him down and that's what Arsenal fans have mostly been disappointed with when he's played in midfield. Since the move to CF he's been getting better game on game and has been very prolific with his G/A, if he was some random player Arsenal bought in the summer, everyone would be raving about how good he's been this year.It seems like you don’t watch full Arsenal games all that much (which is perfectly understandable). Havertz was fine in midfield for us. He won a crazy amount of individual duels, never stopped running and had better defensive stats than Xhaka in his last season with us. However, he wasn’t as productive as Xhaka was in his last season so the were doubts over whether he was worth the price tag.
He’s never been garbage and was very much a competent midfielder. He's been a near ever-present in the team that is currently top of the league and prepping for a CL QF, he’s been more than competent - he’s been a real asset.
I dont watch Chelsea all that regularly, so if you think he’s no different to the player you had for 3 years, I’ll take your word for it. But he’s currently one of the best players in a team that is challenging for the most important trophies, so if that’s actually true I don’t think it was a good move to sell him.
From 60 million down the drain to 9 goals most fans are pretty happy already to be honest. It is a failed experiment to play him as #8 and he played better in this Arteta tactic - a box of 4 midfield with Odegaard, Havertz, Rice and Jorginho, and Havertz plays the false 9/#8 hybrid role in this. I doubt he will be a clinical striker that scores 15 to 20 league goal a season.Let’s temper the hype a bit. He’s still only on 9 goals, granted he spent half the season faffing about in midfield. He’s already equalled his best league tally at Chelsea but he has some way to go better his best tally in all comps.
I think this is a really good comparison. He’s not nor will he ever will be an out and out goal scorer. He’s too unselfish.Very similar player to Firmino. Rivals always down playing what he does for his team and claiming (insert player) could do it better.
They are quite different players, thats like arguing if Foden is better than Bellingham.Better than Wirtz.
And here I thought Wirtz was a top class talentBetter than Wirtz.
IMO he is proving the perfect competition/ alternative to Jesus in that playmaking striker. I will not be surprised if he convince Arteta to target a prolific or potentially prolific two flank winger over a center forward next summer, in attack. So that Trossard, Martinelli, and Saka are pushed to develop into even more of goal scoring flank men.I think this is a really good comparison. He’s not nor will he ever will be an out and out goal scorer. He’s too unselfish.
He could’ve had more assists today if Jesus was a better finisher. But just like when Liverpool had too dominant wingers, I think arsenal are inching towards that same thing too where a striker like firminio/havertz can be extremely effective
Havertz is Bellingham?They are quite different players, thats like arguing if Foden is better than Bellingham.
Or comparing Titus Bramble to Zidane.They are quite different players, thats like arguing if Foden is better than Bellingham.
People vastly overrate state the importance of getting an out and out goalscorer as a number 9. Most teams hoping to compete would be better off with an all rounder who helps the other attacking players maximize their output and keeps the attacking play unpredictable.Very similar player to Firmino. Rivals always down playing what he does for his team and claiming (insert player) could do it better.
100% agree.People vastly overrate state the importance of getting an out and out goalscorer as a number 9. Most teams hoping to compete would be better off with an all rounder who helps the other attacking players maximize their output and keeps the attacking play unpredictable.
