Elon Musk | Owner of X

[Revan]

If aerospace regulation is to be taken as precedent I think it would be very hard to get this adopted when the ultimate decision entity is essentially a black box and not a clearly defined state machine.

Agree, the legal framework is gonna be a clusterfeck.

I also think that ultimately it will get adopted. Never in our history, we have declined to use technology.

BTW, aereospace industry is exploring the usage of modern AI too. I actually interviews and had an offer from Airbus last month, where one of the things I would have worked on would have been autonomous driving for airplanes. They seem more interested in interpretability than any self-driving car I am aware of, though.

 

[Stack]

OK, so ask yourself why BMW haven't licened this incredible tech and made an absolute fortune? Perhaps it's because it was autonomous and the reality is the tech still is nowhere near being here.

Legislation issues.
The sorts of legislation issues that mean that cameras for wing mirrors arent yet a widespread thing because only a very small handful of countries have legislated for them. Cameras for wing mirrors improve how slippery a car is through the air which is a major assist for improving EV battery range. Have a look into that, its a whole thing.

The tech isnt there yet but its far far further along than people think. Its not just the cars that need to be ready for level 4 or level 5 Auto driving, roads, signage etc all need to be upgraded. Upgraded in terms of things that will talk to the cars.

Car design is roughly 3-4 years ahead of what makes it to market.
There are currently new trials of autonomous transport busses and cars taking place in various cities. There have been trials that have finished and new ones start.
My example was something from 4 years ago.
Ask yourself if you think BMW have just stopped there.

 

[langster]

Of all the supposedly desirable future tech, this is right at the bottom of my wishlist

Damn straight!

I was promised hover boards and jetpacks and flying cars by now. All I've got is a PS5 and a fecking Smart phone.

I'd much prefer a hover board.

 

[utdalltheway]

Can we get back to Musk being a cnut?
At least that's what most would agree on.

 

[B20]

You're still in the car?

I am not however, "wasting time behind the wheel." I honestly don't know what point you think you are making.

 

[Member 125398]

Can we get back to Musk being a cnut?
At least that's what most would agree on.

He's definitely a something and, whatever that is, he's a complete and utter one of it.

 

[Eyepopper]

Can we get back to Musk being a cnut?
At least that's what most would agree on.

Trying to figure out who he reminds me of has been annoying me for ages, and I've finally got it.

It's jedward, he reminds me of jedward.

 

[Member 125398]

Trying to figure out who he reminds me of has been annoying me for ages, and I've finally got it.

It's jedward, he reminds me of jedward.

He's given his mother a lovely pearl necklace.

 

[Murder on Zidane's Floor]

I am not however, "wasting time behind the wheel." I honestly don't know what point you think you are making.

No worries

 

[Bepi]

Trying to figure out who he reminds me of has been annoying me for ages, and I've finally got it.

It's jedward, he reminds me of jedward.

Are we the baddies?

 

[UnrelatedPsuedo]

I think self driving cars will be amazing.

No more having to be the sober driver. no more wasting time behind the wheel if you are a long distance commuter.

and car leasing will be vastly different in urbanised areas. no need to lease a car. you lease a pool of cars with every one else. and it comes and picks you up when you need and drops you off where you want. no need to worry about parking either. it will do it for you. you just get out at your destination and your car goes looking for a parking spot.
in fact with such car pools widespread, parking issues in the cities will be a thing of the past, since much fewer cars can service far more people.

traffic jams will be far fewer as all cars will accelerate and decelerate optimally in congestions and always choose optimal routes.

Traffic accidents will be vastly minimised.

No more hit and runs either. you may be able to get in the drivers seat drunk but it won't let you steer yourself if under the influence.

1. No they won’t
2. 99% of drivers are sober already. Alcohol is the problem. Not the car.
3. Trains and buses exist
4. This ‘leasing’ system already exists
5. Parking issues will scale. The fewer spaces we need, the more that people can reclaim streets.
6. The traffic jams point may have a small point of value, but weight of traffic means it will Never be solved by a vehicle.
7. Driverless cars crash
8. If you think driverless car companies will be on the hook for killing people after you elect to let it drive itself… you’re mad. It will still be your fault.

None of what you believe is really tied to reality. I used to believe most of it. It falls over at the first point of sensible interrogation though. I’m almost all directions.

None of it works without foolproof tech and 100% adoption. We will never have either.

 

[Withnail]

Just don’t see the allure of the self driving car.

It's complete insanity. There's no feckin way I'll ever trust it.

 

[Krakenzero]

Can we get back to Musk being a cnut?
At least that's what most would agree on.

But what has he done?

I'm no expert in the subject, but I'd think self driven cars are not a long term solution for the transportation issue. IMO big cities could and should have some self driven taxi system that drastically reduce issues with traffic, accidents, parking space requirements, etc. and for uptown/small towns plus long distances a strong transportation network with priority/exclusive roads (ideally trains) should do the trick. That leaves particular cars (self driven or not) mainly for the last mile altough they can still be usable for long distances at increasing costs, since they'd have to cover most of the share for infrastructure, accident risk costs, etc. Well, either that or the Jetsons/Futurama solution

 

[Withnail]

Trying to figure out who he reminds me of has been annoying me for ages, and I've finally got it.

It's jedward, he reminds me of jedward.

Ah now Jedward are alright these days

 

[Bebe]

Around 1.3 million people are killed each year in car accidents. Having cars that drive better than humans, means far less deaths, while also people can work in them like we do in trains etc. Overall, a more enjoyable experience.

Of course, we are nowhere near reaching that stage where autonomous driving cars are reliable.

I'd be down with an autonomous vehicle doing long highway drives for me so I can work, watch a movie or whatever else. I wouldn't consider it a more enjoyable experience in most of my current life though; I quite enjoy driving (might have something to do with the lack of significant traffic where I live).

 

[caid]

I think my dream version of autonomous driving is basically a train to be honest.

 

[Eyepopper]

Ah now Jedward are alright these days

 

[Berbaclass]

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[calodo2003]

Oh, no!

Anyway...

 

[B20]

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It's almost as if his fortune wasn't real, in the sense of being actualisable or utilisable, and thus, evaporates just easily.

Measuring wealth based on stock value is cloud castle measurements.

 

[4bars]

Disagree. Cars are inefficient cause most of the time they are parked doing nothing. By having cheap robotaxis, people are gonna buy fewer cars, the traffic is gonna get better cause cars won't spend so much time checking for parking etc. So it definitely makes sense, but executing it requires solving autonomous driving, which seems to be harder than initially though.

Besides the point, BMW are pretty shit in this aspect. Waymo (Alphabet) and Cruise (GM) are leading, Tesla is the best of the rest, then there are many other companies ahead of BMW. But most think that this is a two way race between Waymo and Cruise, with Tesla a distant third.

It really is different type of code. Coding neural nets is not that hard, training them is harder. In many ways, the real code is the weights of the network, which are a function of the algorithm and the data, not the Python/C++ script. While there are human-related bugs there, most 'bugs' are gonna be neural net-related so different types of bugs.

A blog post that explains this better from ex Tesla's senior director, who lead Tesla's autopilot until a year ago (though he might have been at OpenAI back then) Andrej Karpathy: https://karpathy.medium.com/software-2-0-a64152b37c35

Everything he said there still stands, just that now the number of weights is in hundreds of billions, instead of millions (some models have reached trillion+ weights). Also, back then (2017) different domains (vision, NLP, speech) used different types of networks, now all are converging to a single type (Transformers).


It depends where. In Europe, I agree. In the US where the cities are far more spread and the roads are bigger, then no, public transport is not the answer. Don't know much about other regions.

So if less cars are sold, which is the incentive of carmakers to develope this technology?

 

[Revan]

So if less cars are sold, which is the incentive of carmakers to develope this technology?

Higher margins, crushing competition. Plus, the main player (Google) is not a car company.

Plus, it is not necessary that there will be less cars, more like fewer privately owned cars. Essentially replace some privately owned cars with cars owned by robotaxi companies.

 

[4bars]

Higher margins, crushing competition. Plus, the main player (Google) is not a car company.

Plus, it is not necessary that there will be less cars, more like fewer privately owned cars. Essentially replace some privately owned cars with cars owned by robotaxi companies.

The only thing i hear is "less cars". And if automakers dont allow the technology,google will neex to create its new car, that it could happen, but in 10-15 years after the technology is good enough, so 20-25 years

 

[Abizzz]

I never understood this "cars are inefficient because most of the times they are parked" reasoning.

Surely the same can be said about:
-Houses
-Beds
-Chairs
-Conscience

Never mind something like a couch or tv.

People want their own cars because its an extension of their private space that they can take around with them. Transportation is only one function they fulfill.



Anyone remember when Elon promised Model 3 owners gonna earn more money through it than paying for it by renting it out as a robotaxi? Surely that's over 5 years ago now!?

 

[The Firestarter]

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Go fash, no cash

 

[Revan]

I never understood this "cars are inefficient because most of the times they are parked" reasoning.

Surely the same can be said about:
-Houses
-Beds
-Chairs
-Conscience

Never mind something like a couch or tv.

People want their own cars because its an extension of their private space that they can take around with them. Transportation is only one function they fulfill.



Anyone remember when Elon promised Model 3 owners gonna earn more money through it than paying for it by renting it out as a robotaxi? Surely that's over 5 years ago now!?

To be fair, sharing houses or beds would not be nice. Sharing cars is much better, with cars staying most of the time doing nothing.

 

[langster]

I don't know about other countries but nobody in the UK owns their own car. The DVLA own the car, you're just the registered keeper of the vehicle.

 

[Abizzz]

To be fair, sharing houses or beds would not be nice. Sharing cars is much better, with cars staying most of the time doing nothing.

I'm not so sure. You trust your life to the car and it being well maintained can save your life eventually. Do you really trust a corporation or a random stranger to take care of it as well as you do? We'll need airline/train levels of regulations for those companies and they're basically all run by regulation dodgers.

 

[BootsyCollins]

I don't know about other countries but nobody in the UK owns their own car. The DVLA own the car, you're just the registered keeper of the vehicle.

So somebody owns it then : (

 

[Revan]

I'm not so sure. You trust your life to the car and it being well maintained can save your life eventually. Do you really trust a corporation or a random stranger to take care of it as well as you do? We'll need airline/train levels of regulations for those companies and they're basically all run by regulation dodgers.

Like the auto-mechanic you send the car to?

Of course, we need regulations.

 

[F-Red]

I don't know about other countries but nobody in the UK owns their own car. The DVLA own the car, you're just the registered keeper of the vehicle.

No, that's incorrect. The only thing the DVLA owns is the registration.

 

[Abizzz]

Like the auto-mechanic you send the car to?

Of course, we need regulations.

That's a stranger I selected myself, partly based on imperfect information (reputation) . With car sharing you have to trust whoever the random stranger was that used it before you. For robotaxis companies could build up reputations I guess.

 

[Tarrou]

I don't know about other countries but nobody in the UK owns their own car. The DVLA own the car, you're just the registered keeper of the vehicle.

what?

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

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It’s all been worth it to own the libs though.

 

[B20]

I never understood this "cars are inefficient because most of the times they are parked" reasoning.

Surely the same can be said about:
-Houses
-Beds
-Chairs
-Conscience

Never mind something like a couch or tv.

People want their own cars because its an extension of their private space that they can take around with them. Transportation is only one function they fulfill.

I don't know where you live, but in the city, parking is a major issue for car owners. Beds are not.

 

[Abizzz]

I don't know where you live, but in the city, parking is a major issue for car owners. Beds are not.

I live in a city and rooms for beds are definitely a hot commodity here.

 

[B20]

I live in a city and rooms for beds are definitely a hot commodity here.

Solutions should be welcomed for that too then, just like cars and parking.

 

[Abizzz]

Solutions should be welcomed for that too then, just like cars and parking.

I have my doubts that can ever happen. Even if you magically made enough space to fill all demand that in itself would make it less attractive because it would then be unlimited and people would crave something else they can't have, making the magical solution obsolete.

To me robotaxis, car sharing, uber etc. are all just businesses. The imagined "benefits to society" are largely marketing.

 

[B20]

I have my doubts that can ever happen. Even if you magically made enough space to fill all demand that in itself would make it less attractive because it would then be unlimited and people would crave something else they can't have, making the magical solution obsolete.

So basically, all the advances of modern society over the past 100 years are not in fact real benefits to society?

"people wanted electricity, and once they all got it, they found something else they can't have."

Shouldn't have bothered. Ingrates.

 

[Abizzz]

So basically, all the advances of modern society over the past 100 years are not in fact real benefits to society?

"people wanted electricity, and once they all got it, they found something else they can't have."

Shouldn't have bothered. Ingrates.

Well without electricity I wouldn't need to bother responding to this post, so there's that. People want to live in city centers now but as little as 20-30 years ago everyone wanted a back garden and to live in the green belt version of their city.


Replacing parked cars with empty cars driving around to pick people up doesn't sound like the boon to urban life that some people make it out to be.