European Super League

[Ixion]

I've sat on the front row of the Stretford End on European Nights against others in this shitty 12 clubs and sat on the back row of the North stand third tier against relegation fodder and I was just as happy to watch either. I don't care who United are playing or what world class names they have. Football is more than just watching Ronaldo and Messi. I''ve sat in disbelief as some teams with no right to beat us walks out of Old Trafford with the points. That's how it should be, not teams like that closed off so they can never embarrass us.

That's pretty embarrassing tbh.

No it's good banter. If the 6 were kicked out it would be the best solution anyway.

 

[stevoc]

The story had just broken but it was before the announcement wasnt it and certainly before all the furore. He was able to deflect it as nobody really had much info.

He did't get it as bad as Klopp, but they were still pricks for putting him in that position by leaking the news before the match.

 

[ReddBalls]

A thread by someone who doesnt have a clue whats already in place.
We need less hysteria and more substance. Without actual facts football will struggle to legally stop this.

He is citing numbers. If they're not true, it would be easy to refute them. So why don't you?

 

[Withnail]

Just out of interest does anyone know what is Simon Stones view is on all this? He usually posts what other people have said. Has he voiced his opinion?

He's reporting on the story as it's his job.

Does his opinion matter?

 

[Zlatan 7]

Yep. Doubt Perez has the power to change the rules of world football to be honest. 12 are struggling to get the job done as we stand.

They won’t be playing under the rules of world football will they? Unless fifa crumble too

 

[SirAF]

It would be worse if the Glazers and FSG hung onto this crusade while the rest of the lot chicken out and this ends with us and Liverpool getting points docked in the league.

Probably the worst case scenario.

 

[Withnail]

He did't get it as bad as Klopp, but they were still pricks for putting him in that position by leaking the news before the match.

Oh yes agreed on that.

 

[Fox_Chrys]

Hard to say, it would obviously worth less, but never 10%. The rights are currently around £1.5bn per year... you'd probably be looking at half I think, as the EPL brand alone would still be a thing and a big deal.

Looking locally...

Sky pay £200m per year for Prem rights.

They pay roughly £120m per year for Championship rights.

So it certainly won't be 10% locally at least.

Wow I didn't realise it was that close. I think the EPL would be fine then given that the money would be more evenly spread so effectively softening the blow.

 

[pratyush_utd]

It's different asking someone who works to put foodon the table to stand up and asking people with millions in the bank to do it.

I don't see why bank account difference should matter. Players are normal people who are more talented than us and have earned the money. Why should they do something normal people would not do ?

 

[Rightnr]

They are not freedom fighters. This notion that they should go against their employers publicly is just naive and stupid. No one here will do it. Not sure why it is expected of players and managers

I remember people calling Rashford Prime Minister. How is this different?

These people are not normal workers fighting for day-to-day survival. They can stop now and live better than 99% propel on the planet.

This spiel about them not going against their employer is just another excuse for cowardice and inaction.

 

[Tom Van Persie]

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[Eckers99]

These clubs have riddled themselves with debt due to their own choices so now they want to feck the footballing world to get themselves out if. Fecking jog on.

In a nutshell. No consequences for their own mismanagement, either historical or future. How clubs the size of Barca and Real could have the nerve to plead poverty, when they've had it so good for so long and allowed themselves to waste hundreds of millions rather than developing their own talent and working within their (still immense) means is fairly breathtaking. The disconnect is something else.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

It says in this article Sky pay nearly £1.2b per season for PL rights

https://www.sky.com/help/articles/sky-channel-changes

Ah yeah it is that I think - the typo confused me. It say "Sky has chosen to pay £1,193 million per annum under the terms of the new deal, down £199 million per annum. " ... (obviously its not down from £199m!)

What it does mean though (unless my worldwide figure is also wrong!) is that the bulk of the tv revenue comes from Sky, and I think - max - it would be reduced by 50% without the Big 6... there would still be a ton of interest in this country.

 

[pratyush_utd]

I remember people calling Rashford Prime Minister. How is this different?

These people are not normal workers fighting for day-to-day survival. They can stop now and live better than 99% propel on the planet.

This spiel about them not going against their employer is just another excuse for cowardice and inaction.

I don't remember Rashford calling himself Prime minister. They are well off because they are bloody good at something. Don't understand this notion that they earn more money so they should behave differently

 

[JJ12]

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As if the Glazers will give a flying feck. They don’t even watch games. They watch the bottom line.

 

[pratyush_utd]

It is arrogance, but it is also the truth. The only thing that changes is the illusion that these other teams can compete (long term).

In the words of George Orwell, ‘all teams are equal, but some are more equal than others’. Agnelli is just translating what that means, that teams are not equal and telling the others to feck off.

Yeah I know. All this talk of giving someone a chance, only Everton and Leicester have managed to be in Champions league and that too for one season. Unless you are bought by Arab state or russian oligarchs, champions league is just an illusion

 

[Zlatan 7]

They are choosing to withdraw themselves from Europe. No way they will move from EPL. There is no compulsion to play CL if you play in EPL. So there are no grounds to remove them. Even UEFA can't do anything.

No, they are choosing to go and play in a league that is outside the regulations of fifa and uefa. They can’t then act all spoilt and say we still also want to be part of existing leagues. They can take their ball and feck off to their own tinpot league with it.

 

[ChaddyP]

And yet it’s much more interesting to see Man Utd vs Milan than Man Utd vs Granada even though it was a later round of the tournament.

In many ways it’s just a stronger version of the seeding and coefficient system. I don’t love it. Particular as the European cup trophy is so iconic but let’s judge the CL with the same eyes.

If it was all fair then any team should be drawn with any other in the group stage. Why not have two English teams in the same group? Why not have groups of death? Football has always prioritised the big clubs.

We faced granada in the el quarters. We faced 3 difficult teams in CL group and failed to get through. 3 of these teams are also not in the super league.

CL isn't perfect but your example makes no sense

 

[Berbaclass]

So let’s just let it roll now then? It’s started. Someone didn’t speak up ten years ago? feck them it’s already started.
It’s never too late to speak out and wanting everything to crumble to just watch it like some soap opera or because no one spoke out before is pretty childish imo.

I’m just saying I’m at a point where the events of the last 20 years, Glazers etc, where I’m not too concerned about the bigger picture. It’s not worth the stress to me. I watch United and I’m still a fan but I’ll watch them if they play in the CL or in the ESL. Doesn’t matter to me.

It’s all about money. Not the love of the game. The PL don’t want it to happen because of money. The other clubs in the PL don’t want it to happen because of money. UEFA, FIFA. None of them are driven by “the love of the game” like the media would have us believe. This ESL would simply transfer money to different people and the current establishment don’t like it.

 

[diarm]

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I wonder have they done the actual maths or do they think because they finished 7th behind the 6 that makes them champions?

As in, have they gone through each gameweek individually to remove every fixture involving the 6, to see who finished on top that year without any of those points?

 

[sun_tzu]

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As if the Glazers will give a flying feck. They don’t even watch games. They watch the bottom line.

The glazers will just sell the space to the highest bidder ... any why not we are gonna need all the money we can get in the new super league

 

[red4ever 79]

He's reporting on the story as it's his job.

Does his opinion matter?

I just asked becuase I know he is always one of the ones at the pressers asking questions and I know he has close affiliation with the club

 

[markhughes]

Fully support the strongest possible action against Utd and the rest of them, honestly even if the Super League doesn’t take off the intent is more than enough to consider walking away from the club permanently.

Let’s see how things go but I have never felt less connected with this club, it’s embarrassing to say you support Man Utd at this moment in time. FC Manchester must be wondering if their fan base is going to go through the roof!

 

[ReddBalls]

Yep. Doubt Perez has the power to change the rules of world football to be honest. 12 are struggling to get the job done as we stand.

He obviously can in his own made up league outside of the associations. That's part of the problem with it. FIFA and UEFa aren't ONLY leeches, they also regulate the rules of the game, which every team that plays in competitions run by associations must adhere to.

 

[Berbaclass]

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Flags

Do you think they would ever notice?

 

[GBBQ]

As if the Glazers will give a flying feck. They don’t even watch games. They watch the bottom line.

Every little action that is taken will help. If this was just a United issue it might have limited impact but realistically if the action of Liverpool and united fans gave a few other clubs some concerns then it might test the resolve of the others.

 

[Skåre Willoch]

If this goes through, what happens to the non-"big-6" clubs with huge debts, reliant on the influx of money coming from the TV deals just to stay alive? The average Championship team spend 107% of their revenue on salaries, simply because they might eventually reach the promised land and erase the deficit. West Brom, Norwich, Fulham have all been able to stay relevant because of the "parachute" money, what will happen to those kinds of clubs? The players contracts are legally binding for years to come, so it isn't as simple as "stop paying silly money". If the money dries up, and the TV deal(s) collapse by even 20-30%, it would be catastrophic.

Even though I kind of support the whole "kick them (us) out" take, I think it would literally mean the end of a huge amount of clubs in England, and I don't understand how they can possibly allow that to happen. That's not even cutting off the nose to spite the face, it's cutting of the entire head.

Just to be clear, I fully support kicking out all the teams involved in the Super League. I just don't understand how that's even an option.

 

[Revan]

Yeah I know. All this talk of giving someone a chance, only Everton and Leicester have managed to be in Champions league and that too for one season. Unless you are bought by Arab state or russian oligarchs, champions league is just an illusion

Everton haven’t.

Since Abramovich bought Chelsea, the only English team, outside of the big 6, who managed to be in UCL is Leicester for a single season (they might qualify this season too). Out of 300 or so attempts, only once it happened.

It was an illusion all along. This just destroys the illusion but not more than that.

 

[acnumber9]

My point (perhaps clumsily put) was that there are other clubs with a lot of history. Villa and Nottingham Forrest have won the European Cup (something Arsenal haven't done), for example. Everton have won league titles.

Are Arsenal, on current form (and over the last few years) more deserving that other PL clubs who have a history too?

On the basis of what they’re forming the league for? Yes. It’s for TV money. Arsenal would attract more viewers than Nottingham Forest. It’s silly to compare them. You can’t say Arsenal don’t deserve it on current form and on the other hand mention Villa, Forest or Everton as being equally deserving. Even if it’s just based on historic sporting merit, Arsenal shit over those sides mostly.

 

[SmallCaine]

Anyone know how reliable this guy is?

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[sun_tzu]

I’m just saying I’m at a point where the events of the last 20 years, Glazers etc, where I’m not too concerned about the bigger picture. It’s not worth the stress to me. I watch United and I’m still a fan but I’ll watch them if they play in the CL or in the ESL. Doesn’t matter to me.

It’s all about money. Not the love of the game. The PL don’t want it to happen because of money. The other clubs in the PL don’t want it to happen because of money. UEFA, FIFA. None of them are driven by “the love of the game” like the media would have us believe. This ESL would simply transfer money to different people and the current establishment don’t like it.

Id add in that all these pundits talking about how bad it is for the game are also on the payrol of Sky and BT who are not exactly neutral parties on the issue given the TV rights they own to the premier eague and CL

 

[diarm]

Fully support the strongest possible action against Utd and the rest of them, honestly even if the Super League doesn’t take off the intent is more than enough to consider walking away from the club permanently.

Let’s see how things go but I have never felt less connected with this club, it’s embarrassing to say you support Man Utd at this moment in time. FC Manchester must be wondering if their fan base is going to go through the roof!

The one glimmer of hope I am clinging onto is that if the ESL can be beaten, the Glazers might sell.

 

[Infra-red]

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I doubt the Glazers are even aware that there are flags in OT.

 

[Zlatan 7]

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feck this voting and get the banners gone, let them have a soulless anfield and old Trafford to play their spoilt rich games in

 

[pratyush_utd]

No, they are choosing to go and play in a league that is outside the regulations of fifa and uefa. They can’t then act all spoilt and say we still also want to be part of existing leagues. They can take their ball and feck off to their own tinpot league with it.

What gives UEFA the right to determine who should play where? Don't understand this all of a sudden love for UEFA. Fifa wants a similar league for Africa. So most likely it will get ratified. Champions league can continue without them. Also Clubs do need to play in competition ratified by FIfa or UEFA. They have voluntarily removed themselves from European competition. That's about it. If UEFA could, they would have removed them from this year competition. They didn't because legally they can't do anything. Next year is different because these clubs will no longer be member of European club competition. They don't need UEFA permission to play in domestic league

 

[acnumber9]

To be fair, in the context of a European League for European competition they don't.

Forest and Villa have more European Cup success than either.

But even the ‘founders’ of this nonsense aren’t trying to claim that’s what this is based on.

 

[diarm]

Anyone know how reliable this guy is?

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Big London-centric politics head isn't he? I could see him being pally with Levy.

 

[esmufc07]

West Ham need to call on the GSC.

 

[pratyush_utd]

Everton haven’t.

Since Abramovich bought Chelsea, the only English team, outside of the big 6, who managed to be in UCL is Leicester for a single season (they might qualify this season too). Out of 300 or so attempts, only once it happened.

It was an illusion all along. This just destroys the illusion but not more than that.

Everton did make it to 3rd qualifications in 2005 if I am not wrong. That time it wasn't automatic qualifications for 4th place team

 

[Drifter]

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Money. They looked at the club's income and said let them in. Leicester as one more PL title than Spurs, but it's all about how much cash can you generate.