Finishing 3rd, 33 points off PL winners, and no Trophy (yet) is utter rubbish and shouldn't be celebrated...

[DomesticTadpole]

This needs to be spoken about more tbh

Before the F.A. Cup semi and EL semi I was really happy that we could end the season with at least one trophy maybe even two. I am thrilled that they pulled the season round and got third place. However those semi's showed how the squad has been left in flux for so long. We have eleven to fourteen players, that is it. If any of them have a dip in form we suffer. Even though we should be happy that the break gave Rashford time to come back, I am not entirely convinced he is fully fit, but again due to the squad he is having to play and is getting criticism when it might not entirely be fair. The vibes coming out of the club now have me worried about any potential business we will do. I want the process of getting the age of this team down to continue, not plugging gaps with players who do not want to be here and are p*ssed off because their own club does not want them.
If they really cannot afford Sancho, then use your scouting and get good young, hungry players who ambitions have not been met yet. I am happy with what could be the future of this club, but my mood could change.

I really wanted Ole to show everyone that he is up to the task. Yet how the season ended still left doubts.

 

[Statue of Limitations]

If people can honestly not see the direction we are going in then I don't think they have been paying much attention, with all due respect.

3rd place was the maximum we could achieve in the league and we aren't in the EL final due to going out by a thin margin v a Sevilla side we played off the park.

You can take it to the bank that there will be nothing like 33pts between us and Pool or City.

We will be strengthening, (as have Chelsea) so if we maintain our current form, I cannot see how we don't improve on last years showing; an amazing rally post the new year saw us relentlessly reel in both Leicester and Chelsea.

I look at our team and I see heart, passion and an identity which we have missed for years.

I'd take this good feeling, optimism and form over a shiny pot and no hope of progress in the league. This team is good to watch again!

 

[AshRK]

The Sevilla game reminded me of our FA cup final against Arsenal in 05, the most one sided final and yet somehow we lost. It is upsetting we lost the sevilla game but I am not going to read too much into that result.

 

[UNITED ACADEMY]

Many said the season could not be concluded as there was still hope for Europa. Now we're knocked out and I wonder how do these people think?

Nothing has changed. The point of this season is to make progress and so does next season hoping us to make another progress. The aim is to win the league & CL in the future after all, not staying in top 4 with no progress/improvement like Spurs & Arsenal were and this project takes more than 2 years minimum.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

The Sevilla game reminded me of our FA cup final against Arsenal in 05, the most one sided final and yet somehow we lost. It is upsetting we lost the sevilla game but I am not going to read too much into that result.

Don't think it was as one sided as that nor was our opposition anywhere as good as Arsenal. But we did play quite well against Seville. Can't knock the general performance

 

[Tom Cato]

This needs to be spoken about more tbh

It's a bit of a unfair comparison because for the first time since SAF took over the club, we are in a official rebuild of the squad, with the aknowledgement that we are building, not competeing, only participating and laying the groundworks for a new trophy filled era. 2022/2023 is the season we can be realistic about challenging for the PL title and European titles, the domestic cups are a bit yesnoyesnoyesnoyesnomehyesok

 

[Jackal]

Worst post of 2020 so far. Completely lacking any semblance of context.

What context?

Two years ago, it was criminal to have been knocked out by Sevilla. It was unacceptable to have finished 2nd & 19 points below the league champions.
Suddenly, finishing 3rd(33 points below) and getting knocked out by Sevilla is progressive.

The standards continue to drop below sea level. Jacques Cousteau would be proud.

 

[RUCK4444]

The Sevilla game reminded me of our FA cup final against Arsenal in 05, the most one sided final and yet somehow we lost. It is upsetting we lost the sevilla game but I am not going to read too much into that result.

Exactly. It's knockout football, anything can happen.

 

[Sandikan]

No-one is "celebrating" 3rd and the semi finals.
But any half rational fan recognises that it took a superb improvement in the second half of the season to secure. Plus it's a good step forward from last season in all ways.

The biggest step is obviously breaking into that top 2 and competing for the title - and any even slight prospect of that relies totally on what summer business we do.

No signings - 3rd will be our ceiling.
A couple of gamechangers - and things going for us - who knows.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Don't think it was as one sided as that nor was our opposition anywhere as good as Arsenal. But we did play quite well against Seville. Can't knock the general performance

Agreed. We didn't actually outplay them (as some have claimed), it was more a touch-and-go type of scenario. But they certainly did not outplay us either - and we could've won that match.

Another factor in this equation is that we're talking about the EL - a competition that is, well...it is what it is. Not that grand in itself. We didn't have to win it for CL purposes. The idea pushed by some - that this was some kind of meaningful "test" for Ole - is just silly. We lost a knock-out match - one we could've easily won with a bit more rub of the green - in a competition which doesn't mean much in itself. And all this happened under very unusual circumstances to boot.

 

[bludsucker]

What context?

Two years ago, it was criminal to have been knocked out by Sevilla. It was unacceptable to have finished 2nd & 19 points below the league champions.
Suddenly, finishing 3rd(33 points below) and getting knocked out by Sevilla is progressive.

The standards continue to drop below sea level. Jacques Cousteau would be proud.

Two years ago we were playing like a mid table team punching above their weight. We made every team we played look like favorites for the title. Hence coming second so far behind the title winners using such negative tactics was unacceptable. Now we are playing much better football and are building a team with a certain identity. So it isn’t the same is it. Also two years ago the manager was shitting on everything United. Be it the academy or the heritage of this club. This time around the manager is taking pride and inspiration from the clubs legacy and also bringing through some pretty good footballers from the academy. So yeah i find that reason enough to be optimistic.

 

[Machine Elements]

Yup. 4th was the minimum and we got 3rd which is more than okay imo. Klopp didn't achieve that much in his first full season.

Hopefully we'll stay away from Europa League for good from now on.

So we are expecting a CL final from Ole next year I suppose?

 

[Ali Dia]

What context?

Two years ago, it was criminal to have been knocked out by Sevilla. It was unacceptable to have finished 2nd & 19 points below the league champions.
Suddenly, finishing 3rd(33 points below) and getting knocked out by Sevilla is progressive.

The standards continue to drop below sea level. Jacques Cousteau would be proud.

you certainly have a point if we don’t continue to invest aggressively but as things stand you have to give the benefit of the doubt

 

[Infra-red]

Not a great season, not an abysmal one - the absolute bare minimum benchmark of CL football was achieved.

There will need to be an improvement next season or we'll have to see large scale changes to the backroom staff.

 

[monosierra]

Until we have a better squad, the best United can do under OGS are dozen-match streaks when we look like world beaters before the team plays itself to exhaustion and run out of ideas. Third is the best we can fight for under these circumstances. We don't even need world class players in every department - coaching and training can do wonders like what Klopp and his team has done at Liverpool after 3 seasons + of honing the system and wise investments.

 

[romufc]

No one is celebrating 3rd, we are pleased to achieve 3rd whilst knowing there is a lot of improvement required.

A rebuild is based on spending money yearly improving the team, the way Liverpool and City have done so. Liverpool went 3 seasons spending £150m, same as City

We spend £150m on summer then drop off to £50 next, then we realise why its not working.

Either we back the manager or get one that they will back for a prolonged period.

 

[monosierra]

Not a great season, not an abysmal one - the absolute bare minimum benchmark of CL football was achieved.

There will need to be an improvement next season or we'll have to see large scale changes to the backroom staff.

For better or worse, doing the minimum to attain CL is exactly what the Glazers want. We cannot afford to miss out on the CL but we don't need to win the title either as far as the bottom line is concerned.

 

[bludsucker]

So we are expecting a CL final from Ole next year I suppose?

Who knows? We may get to a final. We may be knocked out in the group stages. But i would be more interested in the journey. Let’s just enjoy the football on display. It’s a welcome change from the drudgery of the previous managers. And if we win something along the way then so much the better.

 

[AshRK]

Don't think it was as one sided as that nor was our opposition anywhere as good as Arsenal. But we did play quite well against Seville. Can't knock the general performance

Sevilla are a very good side. They have not lost since February and are very good in possession and yet we made them look inferior. The point is had we won Ole would have been hailed. Play that 45 min to 60 mins 10 times and we should have scored 3 goals at least. On any other day we would have won it 4 or 5-1 and all would have looked amazing but we lost and you see lot of gloomy posts.

I am not going to say Ole is perfect but I am seeing progress but the key is to sustain and improve on that. Again next season if we are fighting for top 4 come May, then we have to look for better options

 

[VorZakone]

It's a bit of a unfair comparison because for the first time since SAF took over the club, we are in a official rebuild of the squad, with the aknowledgement that we are building, not competeing, only participating and laying the groundworks for a new trophy filled era. 2022/2023 is the season we can be realistic about challenging for the PL title and European titles, the domestic cups are a bit yesnoyesnoyesnoyesnomehyesok

This is absolute rubbish honestly. So we should just give up any expectations for 2020/21 and 2021/22? Why even watch those seasons then? Let's all tune in during 2022/23!

Klopp had a shit Liverpool side in 2015/16 but managed to reach 2 finals anyway. And within 2.5 seasons he had reached the CL final. If we hypothetically use the same trajectory for Ole, we'd be in the CL final next season.

Furthermore, there is 0 guarantee that it'll be a successful "rebuild process". So to "wait it out" is absolute rubbish. Every year you have a shot at 4 trophies and every year you buy or sell players, this isn't exclusive for precious Man Utd. Every club has to deal with it.

 

[flappyjay]

What context?

Two years ago, it was criminal to have been knocked out by Sevilla. It was unacceptable to have finished 2nd & 19 points below the league champions.
Suddenly, finishing 3rd(33 points below) and getting knocked out by Sevilla is progressive.

The standards continue to drop below sea level. Jacques Cousteau would be proud.

From 6th, clearing out a few deadwood. Also the difference between Sevilla then and now was the appalling performance. This time we can point to our lack of clinical finishing last time it's like we didn't even try.

 

[Infra-red]

For better or worse, doing the minimum to attain CL is exactly what the Glazers want. We cannot afford to miss out on the CL but we don't need to win the title either as far as the bottom line is concerned.

This is correct - neither the Glazers nor Woodwood will care in the slightest whether we finish first, second, third or fourth. However, we can all see how narrow the margins are between the sides that finished top 4 and those that didn't. With the financial rewards for CL qualification so great (and the costs for missing CL so severe), it is a dangerous tightrope to walk.

If the Glazers had any sense, they'd at least sanction the requisite investment to put some daylight between us and Wolves/Spurs/Arsenal/Leicester etc.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

For better or worse, doing the minimum to attain CL is exactly what the Glazers want. We cannot afford to miss out on the CL but we don't need to win the title either as far as the bottom line is concerned.

This is the problem with some American owners who do not have relegation, that some teams are just happy to exist. That only so many teams can win, so instead of trying to get to the same level they are just happy that people come to watch them. They don't have the same type of transfer system, they draft players, they trade players for a mixture of other players. Not sure some are too happy about having to pay a fee to another club on top of whatever contract they give the player.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

The point is had we won Ole would have been hailed.

Probably not, in fairness - not by a very vocal segment on here.

 

[Bastian]

I agree with the OP on everything. Someone said it ignored the context, but that context aren't just some external events over which there is no control. There was a decision not to buy a midfielder last summer, there was a decision to play players seconds back from the injury table in relatively unimportant games, playing players when they were already injured, extending contracts of overpaid and unwanted players (hyping them up), setting us up as a counter-attacking team, etc. This maybe creates some context within which - having a break of 3 months to get back injured players - finishing third is a fantastic achievement (or whatever it was Ole said).

I think Ole has shown some progress this season, in terms of being an actual head coach and getting the team to play a style that suits the stature of the club, but the sample size was very small and we soon hit a wall in terms of tiredness. Nonetheless, he figured out a way to beat the low block and that was in the form of Bruno, who of course could have been bought last summer.

The best thing about Ole is that he's lifted the mood. Whether he can actually develop along with the team and become a top manager remains to be seen. He's afforded every possible excuse in the book by those who support him and expectations have been massively lowered. If this was someone with no United connection presiding over the last 18 months - presumably - the case would be radically different.

There is no way we can go into next season with his running players into the ground philosophy. If it turns out that the owners aren't ambitious enough to compete for trophies and be positive in the market, Ole simply has to put pressure on them. The club comes before everything else, right..?

 

[romufc]

With the financial rewards for CL qualification so great

If we don't spend money, does CL financial rewards even matter to us? If we are going into the CL without having the squad to win it, we are going to become a mockery club in Europe, already are in England.

Just some dumb people in charge.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Probably not, in fairness - not by a very vocal segment on here.

Why it would be a trophy. Poch has never won anything(the ones most seem obsessed with). I want the board to back him, not fob him off with other teams cast offs. Buy players other teams want to keep, not ones they can't get out of the door quick enough, there is usually a good reason for that.

 

[VorZakone]

Arsenal had a great season in 2015/16, achieving #2 showed fantastic progress and since then they've won 0 PL's and CL's.

 

[AshRK]

Probably not, in fairness - not by a very vocal segment on here.

Probably yes but they would have been laughed at as some have already made up their mind that he is nothing more than a PE teacher. You look at online trolls in social media bringing back the sevilla loss 2 years ago and saying how unfairly Jose was treated. People didn't abuse Jose for the loss but for his mannerism after the game. Imagine Ole after teh game throwing our players under the bus , I bet most would have turned against Ole too.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

Why it would be a trophy. Poch has never won anything(the ones most seem obsessed with). I want the board to back him, not fob him off with other teams cast offs. Buy players other teams want to keep, not ones they can't get out of the door quick enough, there is usually a good reason for that.

He wouldn't have won the trophy, though - just the match.

And then IF he had won the trophy, certain people would have downplayed that too.

Come on - you know what I mean. We have a number of posters on here who simply don't like the idea of Ole being the United manager - it's obvious.

 

[Infra-red]

If we don't spend money, does CL financial rewards even matter to us? If we are going into the CL without having the squad to win it, we are going to become a mockery club in Europe, already are in England.

Just some dumb people in charge.

The club will have no interest at all in winning it - getting us to that point will require an absolutely enormous financial outlay.

They will want a squad that is decent enough to guarantee qualification every year though. I would say that our squad in its current guise, is not of the requisite quality to do that. It needs some investment this summer.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

People didn't abuse Jose for the loss but for his mannerism after the game.

Yeah that (it was infuriating as hell) - but also the fact we looked hopeless. Which we did not the other night - we lost, fair and square, but we certainly didn't look hopeless.

 

[romufc]

The club will have no interest at all in winning it - getting us to that point will require an absolutely enormous financial outlay.

They will want a squad that is decent enough to guarantee qualification every year though. I would say that our squad in its current guise, is not of the requisite quality to do that. It needs some investment this summer.

I will give you an example. Arsenal. They wanted to have a squad decent enough to guarantee qualification and did that for years however; other teams around them got more ambitious. Spurs, Arsenal, Chelsea, City, Liverpool all have more ambition than Manutd at the moment.

 

[Smithy89]

If people can honestly not see the direction we are going in then I don't think they have been paying much attention, with all due respect.

3rd place was the maximum we could achieve in the league and we aren't in the EL final due to going out by a thin margin v a Sevilla side we played off the park.

You can take it to the bank that there will be nothing like 33pts between us and Pool or City.

We will be strengthening, (as have Chelsea) so if we maintain our current form, I cannot see how we don't improve on last years showing; an amazing rally post the new year saw us relentlessly reel in both Leicester and Chelsea.

I look at our team and I see heart, passion and an identity which we have missed for years.

I'd take this good feeling, optimism and form over a shiny pot and no hope of progress in the league. This team is good to watch again!

Agree with a lot said here, but with the current squad as it is i don't see us going far in the champions league and getting top 3/4 again. Now that is from a completely cynical and pessimistic point of view.

 

[Amadaeus]

What context?

Two years ago, it was criminal to have been knocked out by Sevilla. It was unacceptable to have finished 2nd & 19 points below the league champions.
Suddenly, finishing 3rd(33 points below) and getting knocked out by Sevilla is progressive.

The standards continue to drop below sea level. Jacques Cousteau would be proud.

Yup, we are moving the goalposts to fit Ole standards not Manchester United standards. Next season is make or break for Ole. Even though some fans sees this season as successful, if he emulate this season accomplishments next season, he should be sacked. Heck, we won’t even have to wait till the end of the season if by Christmas, we aren’t among the title contenders.

 

[100]

This is absolute rubbish honestly. So we should just give up any expectations for 2020/21 and 2021/22? Why even watch those seasons then? Let's all tune in during 2022/23!

Klopp had a shit Liverpool side in 2015/16 but managed to reach 2 finals anyway. And within 2.5 seasons he had reached the CL final. If we hypothetically use the same trajectory for Ole, we'd be in the CL final next season.

Furthermore, there is 0 guarantee that it'll be a successful "rebuild process". So to "wait it out" is absolute rubbish. Every year you have a shot at 4 trophies and every year you buy or sell players, this isn't exclusive for precious Man Utd. Every club has to deal with it.

There is no guarantee of anything in football. We've tried throwing money at players for the past 6 years, and we're at square one. Now we're moved on to rebuilding with a more sustainable approach. Investing in youth so that our teams will enjoy much longer periods of success. You can go out and buy 6 27 year old superstars tomorrow and you'll be doing the same again in a few years. We've giving ourselves the biggest possible window whilst building in a way that we can change managers without the problems we had previously.

I don't know how anyone can watch the last 6 years and not understand what we're trying to do. Just curious, what do you think we should do?

 

[Member 113277]

At the moment, it's not about winning trophies - the unpalatable truth is we are not good enough to expect this. The next season needs to be about developing more killer instinct and resiliance and building consistency.

If we can continue to put together long undefeated runs and get our goals for/against average to 2.5/3, then we can have aspirations.

Ole has overseen a good start, but now is on the hook to show he can build on where we are now.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

He wouldn't have won the trophy, though - just the match.

And then IF he had won the trophy, certain people would have downplayed that too.

Come on - you know what I mean. We have a number of posters on here who simply don't like the idea of Ole being the United manager - it's obvious.

Yes I know what you mean. Ole has been saying for ages that players are going, well the people who deal with that have to do their job, he has said he needs better squad depth, well get him the right players. This has to be a team for the future, not a stop start team that has a rotating door every season. Build him the squad he wants so he can build that winning mentality he yearns for.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

The club will have no interest at all in winning it - getting us to that point will require an absolutely enormous financial outlay.

They will want a squad that is decent enough to guarantee qualification every year though. I would say that our squad in its current guise, is not of the requisite quality to do that. It needs some investment this summer.

So we get Arsenalised?

 

[el3mel]

From 6th, clearing out a few deadwood. Also the difference between Sevilla then and now was the appalling performance. This time we can point to our lack of clinical finishing last time it's like we didn't even try.

We got the same points in both this season the last one, and scored only one more goal. Our progress from 6th to 3rd can be attributed to the drop of quality in surrounding teams than us gaining more points or scoring more goals actually, because we simply didn't.

The end of the season was positive but if you're talking about context then you have to put that in context too.