Has this season hit rock bottom for you yet? If no, what, in particular, will be the final nails in the coffin?

McUnited

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It's because the competition for 4th has been particularly bad this year. Has to be noted that the gap between us and Chelsea is now 6 points so we aren't all that close as of now and the next swing is important if we want this to be a race.
The gap between us and Chelsea is 6 points. But the gap between us and Newcastle (in 14th place) is 4 points. With a difficult run of games coming up, we could quite easily slide into the bottom half of the table. Next up are...

Wolves
Chelsea
Watford
Everton
Man City
Tottenham

On current form I wouldn’t expect many points out of this. So, no, we’ve yet to reach rock bottom!
 
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Scriblerus

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If you list our results in order of the opponent's current league positions, it reads like this (/ between results where we have played a team twice)- highest placed teams first (i.e. it runs from L'pool to Norwich)
D/L W W W W D D D D/L L D W/L L/W W D L L L W/W
Which is pretty shocking. Against teams above us, P5 W3 D1 L1 10pts (2 per match)
Against teams in the 30-34 point range : P12 W3 D5 L4 14pts (1.17 per match)
Against the bottom 6 P 7 W3 D1 L3 10pts (1.42 per match)

If our sparkling form continues at this level (and are there any signs that we are going to learn how to break down teams that defend against us, or start getting clean sheets? Not to my eyes) without our best forward, we can look forward to
5 games against the bottom 6 - 7 points
6 games against the middle group - 7 pts
plus whatever we can get away at Leicester and Chelsea, and home to City :

That would mean we are heading for 48 points plus our tally from those last 3.
So 48 points, then.

4th place my arse.
 

thepolice123

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The gap between us and Chelsea is 6 points. But the gap between us and Newcastle (in 14th place) is 4 points. With a difficult run of games coming up, we could quite easily slide into the bottom half of the table. Next up are...

Wolves
Chelsea
Watford
Everton
Man City
Tottenham


On current form I wouldn’t expect many points out of this. So, no, we’ve yet to reach rock bottom!
Jesus christ.

It will get brutal.
 

Tel074

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What makes all this worse for me is that it's been happening for how many years ?
The same thing happened under Moyes but we learnt nothing at all we didn't get a plan in place to get back to the top.

We have idiots running the club who thought let's chuck hundreds of millions at the problem and buy any random footballer we can get our hands on instead of putting football people in charge of footballing matters .

Thankfully the anti Glazer anti Woodward songs got louder last night and most of the ground participated .

Us fans know how great our club is it's a pity the owners don't
 

Denis' cuff

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I bottomed out last night.

Owners don't care.
Board don't care.
Manager cares, but is clueless.
Players don't care - despite what they churn out on twitter.

Our club has been reduced to a money churning golden goose and they're all suckling from its (currently-fat-but-soon-to-be-dry) teat.

Don't be fooled. None of them care.
this

sick of the feckers all making a fortune out of it, to boot.

Why would they care?
 

MartinRed

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In a days like these I think that there is no room for more nails.
 

Denis' cuff

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For those Ole In fans? Maybe relegation to League 1 would really give them something to think about.

Try growing up.

i doubt there are many “Ole in fans” (pathetic cliche for sheep) But there are a lot of “what difference would any other manager make? fans”.

klopp, pep, etc they aren’t going to make any/much difference with this ownership.

we keep changing managers. it doesn’t work unless they are properly supported (yeah, I know you can’t see it)

so many brain-dead’s around who can’t see it.

all this, the parasite owners, mercenary players and bandwagon fans who don’t support or understand the club, a consequence of past success. Shouldn’t be this way.
 

Florida Man

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The gap between us and Chelsea is 6 points. But the gap between us and Newcastle (in 14th place) is 4 points. With a difficult run of games coming up, we could quite easily slide into the bottom half of the table. Next up are...

Wolves
Chelsea
Watford
Everton
Man City
Tottenham

On current form I wouldn’t expect many points out of this. So, no, we’ve yet to reach rock bottom!
 

Judge Red

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Another ‘morning after’ and no action taken. This club is prepared to go much lower.
 

Alabaster Codify7

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My opinion remains the same - we have much lower depths to plummet under this coaching team and manager.

By March, we're going to be 10th or lower. Ole cannot stop a nosedive - he proved that last season. Our team has no spine - they've proved that numerous times. That is a melting pot for disaster - I can honestly see this team hitting 13th-14th position by April. Without Rashford, we don't score goals. It's as simple as that.

There are two ways we can stop the nosedive. Either the board sign 2 new players to lift the mood and contribute to attacking/goals, and/or they fire Ole and the squad gets that new manager bounce again that MIGHT scrape us into the top 4.

Do neither, and we're finishing in the bottom half.
 

Yakuza_devils

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I thought that we will never be worse than under Moyes. Or we will never appoint a manager with limited experience such as only managing Everton with some success.

How wrong I was.

Lo and behold, we have a Molde and Cardiff manager in charge of us. Enough said.
 

sunama

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Try growing up.

i doubt there are many “Ole in fans” (pathetic cliche for sheep) But there are a lot of “what difference would any other manager make? fans”.
There are plenty of "Ole in" people on this forum.
Only yesterday I read comments made, before the game that people are excited to see where Ole's MUFC goes.
I remember reading a comment that we are young, but in a few years we will be amazing (or words to that effect).
I also read that this is the most hope that some forum poster had, since SAF left.

I assure, there are many many Ole inners, who think that he is doing a marvelous job.
Have a read of this thread and you will see how much belief there is in Ole:
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/a-tactical-shift-from-ole-shirley-not.452896/
 

sunama

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I thought that we will never be worse than under Moyes. Or we will never appoint a manager with limited experience such as only managing Everton with some success.

How wrong I was.

Lo and behold, we have a Molde and Cardiff manager in charge of us. Enough said.
Words cannot describe how much I dislike Moyes. Not as a person, but more because of what he did (destroying a Championship winning side, in 10 months).
But even I know that Moyes is a far better manager than Ole.
There isn't a single EPL team who would swap managers with us.
 

MancunianAngels

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Final nail for fans is irrelevant

Final nail for Woodward will come if we lose on Sunday, fall 10 points behind 4th and get knocked out of Europa.

Even Moyes only went post Bayern and Everton in 2014
 

Sweet Square

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Yeah this is what rock bottom really means for football supporters

Wycombe kicked off their new season in League Two with a 3–1 victory away at York City.[18] Despite this strong start, Wycombe went through a bad period soon after and for a while sat just above the relegation zone in League Two. On 22 September 2012, after Wycombe's third successive defeat, Waddock was sacked as manager with immediate effect.[19]

Former club captain, Gareth Ainsworth was immediately named as the caretaker manager in Waddock's absence. Just over a month later, on 8 November 2012, Ainsworth was named as Wycombe's permanent manager. He signed a contract, lasting for the rest of the season.[20] Ainsworth revitalised the squad and the club as a whole, and steered Wycombe safely away from the relegation threat. Wycombe eventually ended the season in 15th place, nine points clear of relegation. At the end of the season, Wycombe's player-manager Gareth Ainsworth announced his retirement from professional football (after an 18-year career), although he signed a new two-year contract as Wycombe manager.[21]

At the start of the final day of the 2013–14 season, Wycombe were three points adrift of safety in the relegation zone of League Two. However, after a 3–0 win away at Torquay,[22] and Bristol Rovers losing to Mansfield Town,[23] Wycombe finished in 22nd place, above Bristol on goal difference, to remain in the Football League.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wycom...(2012–19)_and_promotion_to_League_1_(2017–18)

In part it was the ambition of the club's directors to develop higher than League One status, where Wycombe lasted for 10 years, which led to instability, the ripping up of that democratic structure and, ultimately, the reliance on Hayes and his funding. In 2004, the fans, proud of their democratic ownership, were told that the club had run up an overdraft and £2.2m debts, including £321,000 in interest-free loans from the directors. Given players' wage inflation straining clubs in the lower divisions, the directors proposed finding new investors – and such businessmen would invest only if they had an ownership stake.

Reluctantly, due to the financial hole in which the club had been sunk, enough supporters voted to allow the club to become a company owned by a handful of shareholders. The supporter-members retained a 25% stake, and the right to elect a director to the board, but many fans who had followed Wycombe for years resented that a sporting structure which had served them so well had been undone.

Hayes, who made millions from an internet loans business which he sold to the credit card company MBNA in 2005, arrived as an investor after that. Over succeeding years he increased his loans to Wycombe, and in 2008 he bought Wasps rugby union club, who had been Adams Park tenants since 2000. There, he enjoyed a partnership with the club's most distinguished player, Lawrence Dallaglio, and began to develop expansion plans.

In 2009 Hayes's loans to Wycombe had increased to around £7m and he moved to take the club over completely, presenting fans with an ultimatum which made him quite unpopular despite the scale of his investment. Hayes offered to reduce his debt by £3m in return for being granted 100% ownership of the club. Were he to be turned down, he would withdraw his financial support, which could have been calamitous for the club.

The deal was approved, with reluctance by many. Then Hayes, as the outright owner of both Wycombe and Wasps, advanced his ambitions for the clubs, unveiling proposals for a new, 17,500-seat stadium. He presented the vision of MK Dons, where league status was controversially claimed by moving Wimbledon there, and whose new stadium was built with enabling retail development, a project Hayes admires.

Many Wycombe fans, says the supporters trust spokesman, David Cook, are deeply attached to Adams Park and they were sceptical about the move. They questioned whether the football club of High Wycombe, a relatively small Buckinghamshire town, could happily occupy so large a stadium and suspected the project was more for Wasps' rugby future than Wycombe's credible good.

Wycombe district council did admire Hayes's ambition, and was supportive of the plans, until the leader of the council changed, and in June last year, after two years' work, the council rejected the proposed development. Hayes decided quickly that he did not wish to stay involved if the aspiration of expansion had been dashed, and resolved to sell the club.

"I've always been someone who builds things," Hayes told the Guardian. "When the stadium was turned down, the club was left with just survival, and that isn't me."

The supporters trust, which merged in 2008 with the old founding member company, began to develop plans to take over, stay at Adams Park and try to run the club sustainably. After long negotiations with Hayes which were not always happy, the trust and Hayes agreed a deal which appears fair to both. Hayes wrote off around £4m of loans, sold the club and the ground, leaving £1.5m owed to him, which the trust has 10 years to pay off.

In February Hayes was arrested by Metropolitan police officers as part of Operation Tuleta, an investigation into suspected computer hacking, and he has been bailed until February. Hayes denies any wrongdoing and says the arrest had nothing to do with his decision to sell. Last month a consortium which involved the former Wasps player Ken Moss bought the rugby club from Hayes for an undisclosed sum.

At Wycombe the supporters trust has separated the ownership of Adams Park from the club, so that it can safeguard the ground's future. On and off the field it has found running the club an immediate struggle. The 125th anniversary match against AFC Wimbledon on 22 September was planned as a celebration but, after a limp 1-0 defeat, the trust-owned club sacked the manager, Gary Waddock. Since then, under the caretaker Gareth Ainsworth, Wycombe have had a mini-revival, beating Torquay United, Fleetwood, and crisis club Portsmouth in the Johnstone's Paint Trophy, and the embattled mood has lightened a little.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/d...blog/2012/oct/16/wycombe-wanderers-league-two
It isn't being 5th in the premier league and potentially missing out on a 60 million pound midfield signing.
 
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Sp00ks11

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I stand by what I said in the summer before a premier league ball was even kicked, we will finish the season in or around 10th. Things are going to get a lot worse before they get better, and I feel indifferent to that fact nowadays. Losing no longer surprises, annoys or upsets me. Quite sad really.
 

OleTheGreat

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The problems are deep and i don't think we have a future that looks bright. I'm a huge United fan but my eyes just closes immediately after we start playing because we're at a snail's pace compared to the other on and off the pitch. I don't even think signings will help this team because we do not have a structure away from the pitch and no plans for how we want to play on the pitch. For years Ole has played under SAF and he knows everything that a manager should do to motivate his players but i don't think Ole has those things in him. Secondly, if Ole wanted to play counter attacking football and if he thought that's the United way, well! he might be right but for God's sake take a page from the great and use the 4-4-2 formation. Use Martial and Rasford upfront. Pogba/Mctominay/Fred/Matic can play in the midfield 2 together and i think with the help of the wide players, they can keep teams at bay.
 

Kostov

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Imagine thinking 5th is rock bottom in a league of 20 teams.
We are 6 points off 4th, and 4 points above 14th place. Does being 5th mask that shambolic info for you?

30 points behind the leaders and only 11 points above relegation. Feck me that's depressing.
 

yamo123x

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It was sad to watch last night but so predictable.

Someone mentioned on an earlier post that no one cares abou the football side of the club , the owner, the board, the players-- and that Ole does care, he does but is he is clueless to turn this around. Spot on,
There is no style of play, there is no semblance of creativity, i do not see what we are actively trying to achieve. I FEEL for OLE but he is just another fall guy for the incompetence and disregard of a poorly run business.
 

space

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To me this now feels as low as Moyes, but in a different way. I just cannot see how we can get out of this. Hurts being a United fan at the moment. Hope we can find a spark from somewhere.
 

Alabaster Codify7

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Yeah this is what rock bottom really means for football supporters





It isn't being 5th in the premier league and potentially missing out on a 60 million pound midfield signing.

No context, mate.

Standards for Manchester United are very different for Wycombe Wanderers' standards - although that doesn't take anything away from Wycombe's situation there, which is very sad.
 

Robbie Boy

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Try growing up.

i doubt there are many “Ole in fans” (pathetic cliche for sheep) But there are a lot of “what difference would any other manager make? fans”.

klopp, pep, etc they aren’t going to make any/much difference with this ownership.

we keep changing managers. it doesn’t work unless they are properly supported (yeah, I know you can’t see it)

so many brain-dead’s around who can’t see it.

all this, the parasite owners, mercenary players and bandwagon fans who don’t support or understand the club, a consequence of past success. Shouldn’t be this way.
You mean the same fans who made a thread labelling themselves the "Ole in brigade" :confused::confused:
 

Foxbatt

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It has for me. It has got nothing to do with Ole in or Ole out. Today's statement that the cub fully supports and backs Ole is what did it for me. If they are supporting all the way, then they should buy him players all the way.
What is the point of saying that they support him while undercutting him? Everyone knows we need players this January window.

When we got relegated I cried. But from the second week we knew that we would go back up to the 1st Division and if my memory serves me right, we were top all the way. So from the first moment we had hope and belief that we would get promoted.
Now all hope has been dashed. If we had a top class manager, then at least there is hope. With an incompetent manager and a worse CEO and terrible owners all the light has been put out.
Sometimes I feel that The Glazers and Woodward are closet Liverpool fans trying to destroy us from the inside. Or else how can you justify most of the decisions they make?
 

Eire Red United

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Squad is paper thin, can’t blame that on Ole, he bought 3 decent players in the summer who have done well, and promoted plenty of youth who have been superb. Williams in particular has been a real shining light. Losing your 3 most important players at this stage of the season would feck anyone up never mind us who didn’t have much to begin with. And we’re still in with a shout of getting 4th and still in the cups.

We are toothless going forward but it’s not as though we haven’t been that way for years.... add McTominay, Rashford, Pogba or another midfielder who has that bit of magic to unlock defences and a centre back and we are laughing.

The biggest thing that annoys me is how fecking unlucky we are with injuries... although at this stage it’s clearly more than luck....
 

VanGaalyTime

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Prediction: we only win one more premier league game this season. We beat Watford at home. We finish 15th and Ole resigns in May.
 

Alabaster Codify7

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Prediction: we only win one more premier league game this season. We beat Watford at home. We finish 15th and Ole resigns in May.

Not that bad, but its going to spiral out of control for sure. I reckon by early March we're going to be firmly 10th in the league, around 15pts off 4th/5th. From there, it's probably going to capitulate a bit more, we'll finish 9-12th or something.
 

Ikon

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Or Ole saying "Alexis will come back in the summer and will prove us all wrong."
One thing that I have praised Solskjaer for is his efforts at clearing out the deadwood players that are robbing this club.
With the comments in this press conference about bringing back Sanchez, Solskjaer has now lost my support, Ole Out..!!