Are you nuts? That France team was class! Platini, Tigana, Giresse, Fernandez…or Brazil with Zico, Socrates, Falcao, Cerezo…you can hardly find a better midfield quartet in the decades to follow. And it’s not like they were dull, functional units! It definitely wasn’t a golden era for attackers, but Platini in Euro ‘84 surely ranks as one of the most incredible achievements you’ve seen…
Is Michel Platini the most disregarded of the true greats?
- Thread starter Fortitude
- Start date
His hair was great the rest a bit meh. Rummenigge was also a underrated great but had worse hair.
The problem he has is that he was the best player in the world prior to Maradona. Maradona, like Messi and Ronaldo, made his peers and others he preceded him look relatively average. Platini had the misfortune of meeting him at the tail end of his career, so the image of Maradona being definitively better than Platini was formed. Particularly as a lot of what people know about that period comes from the media and magazines. He wasn't the most flashy player, so with not as much media coverage, for the average football fan, the idea of him is not as great as his performances show he was.
He also had the misfortune of not winning a world cup. Unlike Cruyff who reached the final, Platini never did. Pre-2000 world cups were how the media narrated greatness of players. His Euro's performance largely gets swept under the rug due to this. It's the reason why I dislike the discussion of world cups to decipher legacy. It made some sense in the 70's , 80's and 90's because the coverage of the sport was not as good as it is today. Leagues were not as accessible and statistics and highlights were not as prevalent. This meant that it was difficult to actually detail how good a player was and fans had to rely heavily on the media to get a clear picture of what was going on. This meant, despite it only being a 4 week tournament, players who justified the hype during these periods could be overglorified, while others who didn't, for various reasons including injury would be wrongfully judged.
I honestly believe Di Stefano also falls into that category. Underrated due to not having a meaningful impact in a world cup despite their club careers being far superior to some of the people considered better than them.
He also had the misfortune of not winning a world cup. Unlike Cruyff who reached the final, Platini never did. Pre-2000 world cups were how the media narrated greatness of players. His Euro's performance largely gets swept under the rug due to this. It's the reason why I dislike the discussion of world cups to decipher legacy. It made some sense in the 70's , 80's and 90's because the coverage of the sport was not as good as it is today. Leagues were not as accessible and statistics and highlights were not as prevalent. This meant that it was difficult to actually detail how good a player was and fans had to rely heavily on the media to get a clear picture of what was going on. This meant, despite it only being a 4 week tournament, players who justified the hype during these periods could be overglorified, while others who didn't, for various reasons including injury would be wrongfully judged.
I honestly believe Di Stefano also falls into that category. Underrated due to not having a meaningful impact in a world cup despite their club careers being far superior to some of the people considered better than them.
Cruyff is the most disregarded, many just don't seem to rate him at all. He's one of the triumverate at the top along with Pele and Maradonna.
Seriously? I only hear and read of Cruyff in godlike terms. He makes every top ten I’ve ever come across.
It was mostly because Zidane won the long awaited first ever World Cup for France and then followed that up with a Euro title. He also managed to drag France to another World Cup final at the twilight of his career and almost won it. However, I will not argue against it if you think Platini is better, I just have a soured view of him after all the things that he had done post-playing. In the paragraph above what you have bolded, I have even defended Platini when there was someone who thinks that Henry is a better player for France and that Platini is not even in the top 3, because that is just too ridiculous of a take. Personally, I am just not a big fan of all his power grabbing and corruption fueled campaign in his administrative career, and I agree that it might have clouded my judgement on him as a player.
Zidane is the most over rated of the greats due to a handful of games. R9 was the best of his generation but many will say Zidane and even put him in top 5/10 ever.
Easily one of the best players I've ever seen and the best French player I have ever seen. Before 1986, no one would have laughed at you if you compared Platini to Diego Maradona. Great final ball player, fantastic all round passer, great finisher, great playmaker, good dribbler and his football IQ is one of the highest I have ever seen. I think his antics with UEFA has tarnished his reputation.
Probably because he doesn't pass the eye-test for those of us who were born too late to see him play
Especially in comparison to the players who he is always compared to
Especially in comparison to the players who he is always compared to
Depends on the average age of the posters here. For people who need to look at past videos to get to know the players before, Platini does not rate high on the wishlist.
And the UEFA debacle doesn't help at all.
And the UEFA debacle doesn't help at all.
So goths and or goats?
I'd wager that if football fans of today could see past greats of the game week in week out as they do their favourite team/player, complete with highlight reels, they might give them their due respect. That lack of exposure, coupled with a lack of interest in what came before, accounts for the underestimation of a lot of really good players.
Also, our memories are remarkably short. What are the odds that decades from now the discussion will be about why the current greats are not thought of as highly as they should be? Pretty high, I think.
Also, our memories are remarkably short. What are the odds that decades from now the discussion will be about why the current greats are not thought of as highly as they should be? Pretty high, I think.
That, and playing for Madrid. Playing for Barcelona/Madrid will always get you a truckload of fans talking you up on social media and elsewhere. It also vastly increases your chances at winning a ballon d’or, which is now an important metric we use to measure careers. R9 played for Madrid too but he was never as good there as he was at Inter. Not by a mile.
Hard to put it better than this, I totally agree
He got eclipsed by Maradona, so did zico to be honest and later on he got eclipsed by Zidane in France as well.
By the time the 1986 world cup was there was no argument about who the best player of that era was.
In regards to his all time status I say he's top 15 but I'd rank zico even higher.
By the time the 1986 world cup was there was no argument about who the best player of that era was.
In regards to his all time status I say he's top 15 but I'd rank zico even higher.
Which is a fecking shame as in my humble opinions that era of football was the most packed ever.
Van Basten the best no 9 ever, Matthäus the best all round midfielder ever etc etc you get the picture.
I still regarded him as greatest French player ever. He is one of best playmaker the world have seen, one of finest passer in the game too, with elegant touch/ball control.
He has won 3 Ballon D'ors, won a Euro with probably 2nd greatest individual performance in major tournament (9 goals in 5 games), and won a CL too being top sorer of competition. I mean, anyone with those achievements and footballing, deserved to be mentioned among the top 10 in GOAT ranking.
Saying that, he is still clearly behind Messi, Pele, Maradona, Ronaldo, Cruyff, Di Stefano, Beckenbauer in my GOAT ranking though.
He has won 3 Ballon D'ors, won a Euro with probably 2nd greatest individual performance in major tournament (9 goals in 5 games), and won a CL too being top sorer of competition. I mean, anyone with those achievements and footballing, deserved to be mentioned among the top 10 in GOAT ranking.
Saying that, he is still clearly behind Messi, Pele, Maradona, Ronaldo, Cruyff, Di Stefano, Beckenbauer in my GOAT ranking though.
Agreed, with all these talks I have been thinking about Totti and Rui Costa for several weeks and it's amazing how little we talk about them even though they were marvelous players. Only Messi and Ronaldo would be clearly rated higher than them in the past decade.
Why did Platini retire at 32?
For me, it has to be Zico even more than Platini. Because of the loss to Italy, Zico lacks that tournament victory that Platini had in 84 and Diego had in 86. This was despite the fact that Zico was having an excellent tournament and even had a great game against Italy. In that same tournament, he did even better against Gentile than Diego did. But the fact that he lacks that iconic tournament victory means he is much less remembered among the 40 and under age groups. Because Platini had the Euros and Ballons as opposed to South American Footballer of the Year awards, Platini still has more presence in the greater media and consciousness than Zico.
I prefer Zico to Platini (although it's certainly fair to prefer Platini as I think they are virtually equal skill-wise just a little different playstyles). Flamengo still maintains he holds the record for most goals in a calendar year with 89 goals, he won 3 SA Footballer awards and probably should have won another one. For a few years, he was definitely the best player in the world before Platini could be said to have eclipsed him with that 84 Euros, only to be eclipsed himself by Maradona.
I also have believed that Zico's playstyle was really a prototype for how Messi plays with world-class goal-scoring, dribbling, and playmaking. I believe if you took Messi out of that Barcelona side and put Zico in, they wouldn't miss a beat in how that side played more than swapping Messi with other greats that are objectively considered above Zico (like Pelé).
I prefer Zico to Platini (although it's certainly fair to prefer Platini as I think they are virtually equal skill-wise just a little different playstyles). Flamengo still maintains he holds the record for most goals in a calendar year with 89 goals, he won 3 SA Footballer awards and probably should have won another one. For a few years, he was definitely the best player in the world before Platini could be said to have eclipsed him with that 84 Euros, only to be eclipsed himself by Maradona.
I also have believed that Zico's playstyle was really a prototype for how Messi plays with world-class goal-scoring, dribbling, and playmaking. I believe if you took Messi out of that Barcelona side and put Zico in, they wouldn't miss a beat in how that side played more than swapping Messi with other greats that are objectively considered above Zico (like Pelé).
Another man who recognizes zico's greatness.
I have no doubts that he would have been a contender for Pete's place as the greatest Brazilian of all time had he not been unfortunate in his international career Althouse pele would still prevail.
To go out without a loss (and to be fair under suspicious circumstances) in the 1978 WC and incur that unfortunate fate in the 1982 edition must sting.
Agree with the OP.
Platini is underrated; Zidane is overrated.
Platini is underrated; Zidane is overrated.
People have been salivating over Messi's performance in this WC. While at relatively the same age, Zidane put in twice as good in 2006 WC.
2 pages in and not a single highlight reel.
As some already know, I am a huge lover of Zico, Sócrates and that entire era of Brazil!
Twice as good, I am not sure about that. Just in the final alone, that red card shows a mental weakness IMO. Getting put on tilt that much by a defender doesn't ultimately benefit the team. I can't imagine, for one example, that Zico would ever have let Gentile put him on tilt that much (having had a brother thrown in jail by the junta kinda keeps footballing wind-ups in perspective). Zidane was immense in 2006 but I don't think you can say it was twice as good or even just better.
What a great team that was!As some already know, I am a huge lover of Zico, Sócrates and that entire era of Brazil!
Twice as good, I am not sure about that. Just in the final alone, that red card shows a mental weakness IMO. Getting put on tilt that much by a defender doesn't ultimately benefit the team. I can't imagine, for one example, that Zico would ever have let Gentile put him on tilt that much (having had a brother thrown in jail by the junta kinda keeps footballing wind-ups in perspective). Zidane was immense in 2006 but I don't think you can say it was twice as good or even just better.
To add to your point wasn't his shirt basically ripped off from his back in that infamously Italy game?
That is extremely hyperbolic.
You can prefer Zidane, but he was not twice as good as Messi in this WC. And Zidane has to be criticized for getting a red card in a WC final.
Injuries (he had a persistent groin one in his last two seasons which hampered him a lot) and the fact that he wasn't enjoying football anymore. If I recall it correctly, he was tired of the professional football life, being constantly on the road, and wanted to spend more time with his family.
Here's what he said after his last game for Juventus against Brescia in May 1987 which they won 3-2, but still lost the title to Maradona's Napoli with a 3 points difference. It was a great team with the likes of Scirea, Cabrini, Favero, Mauro, and Laudrup who was bought to take Platini's mantle but failed to do so.
"It's over, it's over... Three little words that seem simple but for me mark the end of an era.
Today, I have decided to leave football but I can't hide my sadness. The matches, the team, the fans, the ball, the shivers one gets before going onto the pitch, I will certainly miss all that. But I cannot continue because the pleasure is gone. I don't have any more will to suffer. I began considering this decision last September at the start of the season. I'm leaving because I know that tomorrow I'll never be better than I am today.
There will always be friends who will find a little place for me on a patch of grass".
Reading it made a deep impression on me at the time even if I was still young, and I remember the two bolded sentences to this day.
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I don't know what Zico has to do with this, but I'm fairly convinced that Zidane had much better 2006 WC performance than Messi's 2022 WC at similar age. Probably not twice as good, but definitely better, imho. @Eddy_JukeZ @oneniltothearsenal
I think Platini also suffers because his peak as a player widely viewed to be at the top of the game was so short. He was a top player in France but that league was a bit of a backwater and he never really played in the European Cup while there. He then has four fantastic years at both club and international level, beginning with the 1982 WC and move to Juve that summer, and is essentially done after that.
Nope, Euro 2000 was easily his best tournament performance and worthy of all the accolades. 1998 and 2006 tend to be blown way out of proportion for various reasons.
I don't know where you get that from.
Zidane's performances in first two games were fairly anonymous and I remember people saying that he truly was finished. He only really started to shine when they played against Spain. He was extraordinary against Brazil, very good against Portugal, again great against Italy, until he completely lost the plot and was sent off. His team was also absolutely stacked when you compare it to Messi's Argentina in this WC. They were both the stand-out players and leaders for their respective teams, the latter being something both weren't known for, and fully deserved their Golden Ball award. However I can't see how you can say that Zidane's performance was better than Messi's.
Messi also won it, while scoring two crucial goals, which edges it in his favor.
A majestic footballer but a corrupt shitweasel as a person.
He is a bit like Baggio, everyone agrees he was absolutely brilliant but their names get pushed down the greats list a bit faster than deserved.
I think Zidane was great, but he was better in the 2000 Euros as someone pointed out. He also looked poor in the group stages in 2006 and you have to dock him some points for picking up a red card in the final itself.
I personally think Messi was clearly better. He was much better in the group stages. His 1 substandard game vs Saudi Arabia was better than Zidane's worst games back then. He was monumental in every single KO game and had a much better final(I say much better, because you can't ignore Zidane getting a red card).
I've pretty much said the same thing on another United forum. Zidane has somehow become a better player since retirement. Go back to 2006 (when he retired) and Maradona and Pele were held up as the ultimate 2; you then had a plethora of players who could all be in the 3 - 10 spots if you were making a top 10 list, though Cruyff was the one most generally accepted as the "best of the rest". Platini was right up there too, along with Best, Ronaldo (R9), Charlton, Garrincha, Beckenbaeur, Puskas, Di Stefano, etc.
Now, it's seemingly universally accepted we have a 'Big 5" of Messi, Ronaldo, Maradona, Pele and Zidane. I don't see how he could have gotten better without kicking a ball?
But yes, Platini was exceptional, and the greatest ever French player for me.
Just on a sidenote, the most disregarded of the greats for me though, is Van Basten. Absolutely genius footballer, but very rarely mentioned these days.
Now, it's seemingly universally accepted we have a 'Big 5" of Messi, Ronaldo, Maradona, Pele and Zidane. I don't see how he could have gotten better without kicking a ball?
But yes, Platini was exceptional, and the greatest ever French player for me.
Just on a sidenote, the most disregarded of the greats for me though, is Van Basten. Absolutely genius footballer, but very rarely mentioned these days.
The feck he did. Zidane had a total of 1 great games in that tournament. Before and beyond that he was unremarkable. I'll reiterate, the most overrated footballer of his generation.
The feck he did. Zidane had a total of 1 great games in that tournament. Before and beyond that he was unremarkable. I'll reiterate, the most overrated footballer of his generation
Zidane was poor in the group stages ,unremarkable in the semi vs Portugal (despite the penalty) and in the final vs Italy regardless of the red card.
I think a better word than "disregarded" may be "forgotten". Less and less people are of age to have seen him, or to even have heard of him. Recency bias is huge. Platini was truly great as a player, no doubt about that.
No Zidane was not good vs Portugal or Italy. He was great vs Brazil and good vs Spain. That's it.