Isn't it time we moved away from 'the United way'?

wolvored

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This romanticism about the utd way is the reason we are in the throes of an ex player managing and ex players coaching or running the club. Apart from 2 managers who were part of the furniture for so long, we have performed poorly, trophy wise over the seasons. Ole is trying to turn the clock back to a time that has past and everyone else has moved on. When you get Brentford and Brighton playing to a better style of football than we show, isnt it time we moved on and left the past in the past?
 

roonster09

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I'm not sure how people talking about "The United way" has anything to do with how we play or our inability to win trophies. It's like people want to focus on so many other things instead of talking about actual problem.
 

Manny

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We moved away from the United way under LvG and Mourinho. No one looks back on that too fondly.
 

KeanoMagicHat

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We moved away from the United way under LvG and Mourinho. No one looks back on that too fondly.
Yeah, I think the style that Ole tried to play is as close to what most United fans would like to watch. It just requires a bit of refinement and finesse, maybe a more experienced coach.

Contrary to popular belief, we’ve scored by far more goals under Ole than those two managers and had some great moments. If it goes sour in the end, I think he still did a good job overall as I think he would have left the club in better shape than he left it if we decide to go with a more experienced head.
 

BrilliantOrange

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Sounds like you are suggesting to be ok with playing unattractive football and becoming a second-tier club...
 

RUCK4444

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There are things that set this great club apart from the rest. Ole being manager regardless of results is NOT one of these contrary to popular beleif.
 

charlenefan

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Yeah, I think the style that Ole tried to play is as close to what most United fans would like to watch. It just requires a bit of refinement and finesse, maybe a more experienced coach.

Contrary to popular belief, we’ve scored by far more goals under Ole than those two managers and had some great moments. If it goes sour in the end, I think he still did a good job overall as I think he would have left the club in better shape than he left it if we decide to go with a more experienced head.
Spot on
 

ROFLUTION

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Not in a million years would I go back to styles like Van Gaal or Mourinho. At least now we are entertained.

An updated version of the United-way with a system that can play entertaining and dominate is more important.
 

klsv

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Our issues have nothing to do with doing things "The United Way", so moving away from it won't help us. United way is promoting the youth and playing attacking football.
 

sullydnl

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"The United way" is too vague a concept to be incompatible with the sort of good football other teams play.

For example, here's a description from a Forbes article of the way Ten Hag plays (from when he was being linked to Spurs):

Ten Hag very much fits the attacking manager template that Levy is reportedly following in the search for Mourinho’s replacement. Unsurprisingly, given the club he represents, Ten Hag is very much committed to a high-pressing, quick-passing, possession-heavy style of football based upon the ideas espoused by Johan Cruyff and his natural heir Pep Guardiola, with whom Ten Hag worked in his capacity as Bayern Munich reserve team boss from 2013 until 2015.

Importantly, though, Ten Hag’s Ajax have never had only one way of playing. In the Dutch league, when faced with sides that sit back and defend, Ten Hag will encourage his team to use the wide men, generating two-on-ones down the flanks by pushing his full-backs up the pitch. In European football, when playing teams that come onto them and leave space in central areas, they look to play with combinations through the middle, as they did in the 2018-19 Champions League campaign with the fantastically talented midfield of Donny Van De Beek and Frenkie De Jong.

Unlike Mourinho, Ten Hag also has a very clear strategy in attack. He sets out specific patterns and works on pre-determined passing movements that will help his players advance the ball on the pitch. That is something that the players would likely welcome after the give-it-to-Harry-or-Son-and-hope attacking plan that predominated under the Portuguese coach. In true Dutch style, Ten Hag also encourages his players to swap positions to draw markers and create space, whether they are wide or central.

Despite being very much a heir of the Dutch possession school of football, nothing there contradicts "the United way" which as far as I can see just means attacking football, using wide players (sometimes) and using young players.

If Ten Hag's football was succesfull here, we'd claim it as being in line with the "United way". The same with, say, Klopp's different brand of football. And really the same with pretty much any other attacking approach.
 

Skills

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There's no such thing really. If there is by the end of Ole's tenure, it will have died in his hands.
 

elmo

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This romanticism about the utd way is the reason we are in the throes of an ex player managing and ex players coaching or running the club. Apart from 2 managers who were part of the furniture for so long, we have performed poorly, trophy wise over the seasons. Ole is trying to turn the clock back to a time that has past and everyone else has moved on. When you get Brentford and Brighton playing to a better style of football than we show, isnt it time we moved on and left the past in the past?
The United way has always been about giving the youths a chance to play and play attractive football.

Being an ex player has nothing to do with the United way. Sir Matt and Sir Alex didn't play for us at all and their reigns embodies the United way.

Ole's reign isn't really the United way at all. Only Mason is actually breaking into the first team after nearly 3 years here and our football is shit on a stick most of a time. Just because it's more entertaining than Van Gaal and Jose doesn't mean we're actually playing attractive football.
 
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TrustInJanuzaj

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I believe the Utd way means:

- Playing with passion and a never die attitude (I think Ole has done brilliantly in this department).
- Playing or at least attempting to play an entertaining and positive style of football. (Ole has done this better than his predecessors but still not top-level).
- Utilising Youth and maintaining our academy traditions (despite popular belief I don't think Ole has done a great job in this department, he's a little risk-averse for me overall).
- Conducting ourselves with class at all times and truly understand what United's History is all about. (Ole gets this above all else).
- Operating with the right level of talent for a top club. (kind of goes without saying at a club our size.)

Now I appreciate some of those points are a little vague but personally they are the very fibre of the club I love. Whichever manager we get should at the bare minimum understand and implement the above and it's why for me personally Ole has been by far the best manager post-Fergie, regardless of the lack of trophies. For me 'trophies' isn't that important, primarily I watch the game to be entertained and to derive hope and joy, when that leaves (under Mourinho and LVG) there's nothing left. I also believe if you nail all of the above points, trophies are not far behind. Get the attitude, talent and performances right and the results will speak for themselves.
 

OleBoiii

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Yet another thread that is purely about whether or not we should sack Ole ASAP...

Ole is still around because he has more or less delivered based on expectations.

1. When he was an interim manager, his job was to stabilise the ship and maybe add some positivity. He succeeded.
2. In his first full season his task was to get CL football. He succeeded despite having to use Pereira and a depressed Lingard as our creators for half the season.
3. His second full season is a weird one. It's hard to know what the demands were, but seeing as we didn't sign a single starter I really doubt anyone expected much more than a slight improvement. He succeeded(3rd to 2nd, 66 points to 74 points).

While doing this he's also rebuilt the team well. Almost every signing has worked out relative to expectations. Every player who was here before Ole's arrival who's in(or close to) the starting XI is better than before. He's also been a rock in terms of dealing with the press.

Results: B minus
Transfers: A minus (no manager has a 100% success rate, but I'm deducting points for not addressing the CM/DM position)
Dealing with the media: A (no need to improve anything, imo)
Entertainment: B (yes we're scrappy, but we also have a lot of comebacks and beautiful goals).
 

Bebestation

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The thing is that people act like they didn't cry out for Van Gaal and especially didn't cry out for Mourinho.

They ruined this club and then pretended like it didn't happen. Like they didn't do it.

If your not interested in the United way then there's plenty of clubs in the league that have a way of their own.
 

Sky1981

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"The United way" is too vague a concept to be incompatible with the sort of good football other teams play.

For example, here's a description from a Forbes article of the way Ten Hag plays (from when he was being linked to Spurs):

Ten Hag very much fits the attacking manager template that Levy is reportedly following in the search for Mourinho’s replacement. Unsurprisingly, given the club he represents, Ten Hag is very much committed to a high-pressing, quick-passing, possession-heavy style of football based upon the ideas espoused by Johan Cruyff and his natural heir Pep Guardiola, with whom Ten Hag worked in his capacity as Bayern Munich reserve team boss from 2013 until 2015.

Importantly, though, Ten Hag’s Ajax have never had only one way of playing. In the Dutch league, when faced with sides that sit back and defend, Ten Hag will encourage his team to use the wide men, generating two-on-ones down the flanks by pushing his full-backs up the pitch. In European football, when playing teams that come onto them and leave space in central areas, they look to play with combinations through the middle, as they did in the 2018-19 Champions League campaign with the fantastically talented midfield of Donny Van De Beek and Frenkie De Jong.

Unlike Mourinho, Ten Hag also has a very clear strategy in attack. He sets out specific patterns and works on pre-determined passing movements that will help his players advance the ball on the pitch. That is something that the players would likely welcome after the give-it-to-Harry-or-Son-and-hope attacking plan that predominated under the Portuguese coach. In true Dutch style, Ten Hag also encourages his players to swap positions to draw markers and create space, whether they are wide or central.

Despite being very much a heir of the Dutch possession school of football, nothing there contradicts "the United way" which as far as I can see just means attacking football, using wide players (sometimes) and using young players.

If Ten Hag's football was succesfull here, we'd claim it as being in line with the "United way". The same with, say, Klopp's different brand of football. And really the same with pretty much any other attacking approach.
This part is not the united way, the united way that's boggling the team down is "one manager show" legacy.

Nothing wrong with attacking football, that's not privy to United. Most big clubs prides themselves in their attacking football and defensive football could lead to sacking in most clubs. Youth? We're not the only one who does that. Many teams have more youth on their lineups, depending on the 10 years lottery of golden generation.
 

Adam-Utd

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Yes.

The only thing we should keep is the youth system flowing.

This over reliance on ex players being involved with the club is holding us back and making us too sentimental.

It's the same with the playing staff. We seem to give players WAY longer than they should have. So many unlimited chances where as other teams are more cut throat and held to higher standards.

What other top club in the world follows the same mantra? Chelsea tried it with Lampard and swiftly realised it was a failed experiment and got rid of him fast - then they won the CL.
 

wolvored

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Perhaps I haven't made myself clear what I meant. I was trying to say breaking links with the past. Not having old players or coaches and going with a new template. Moyes VG Mourinho all had links with old players on their coaching team. Someone to come in with their own team to manage and not being influenced by what Fergie did. His time was a brilliant time and will never be repeated. So why try?
 

hammerfadl

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I always understood "the United way" to be just as much the philosophy/mentality of approach compared to a specific way of playing?

LIke, dare to go at your oppositions throat and dictate the way the match is unfolded.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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The United way is promoting youth, playing exciting or attacking football and of course winning trophies. That's literally it.
 

Born2Lose

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The way the club is run now has nothing to do with the United way. We're run exactly as you'd expect it to be run by Owners who've no idea about football and who have more money than sense.

Keeping past it never was players like Mata and Matic and consistently inconsistent players like Martial around tells you everything about the apathy at the club currently.
 

McGrathsipan

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The United way is for off the pitch

On the pitch its simple- we need to score goals one end and keep them out the other. However the team is set up to do that is on the manager and should be based on the modern game and the best coaching methods regardless of where they sit in comparison to any "United Way"
 

DickDastardly

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The United way is plain and simple - winning trophies. Sometimes it's boring, sometimes it's fun, but, at the end of the line, we're the ones lifting that silver.

By that rationale, we're miles away from playing the United way.
 

Rozay

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I get what the OP means. Many are saying that the United Way is fine as it is simply attacking football and youth promotion, but that isn’t specific enough.

To me, the United Way has always been more about ‘spirit’ than strategy. The time for that has long run out. We cannot neglect the strategic or tactical refinement and rely solely upon going out and giving everything. It seems the blueprint for other top teams at the moment isn’t just to attack, but also a fecking clue of how they are going to attack. The spirit of the United Way is fine, but we need to move away from the principle that it is the right attitude that will bring trophies and become far more deliberate in our approach.

Ole clearly thinks he is restoring us to our traditions by telling players to run more and never give up. That will not work, and even the Fergie of 10 years ago would not beat the Pep of today either IMO, the bar has been raised and he would have needed to adapt to meet it.
 

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United way went to sh1t when we hired Mourinho. That was a disastrous move. That guy literary shat on us and mocked us while actively being the manager of this team. We sort of tolerated it...
There was no United way. There was Ferguson way and it worked under him. It worked under him in England however. In Europe we won only 2 UCLs under him, and it is hard to deny that we weren't lucky each time. We have also had some performances under Ferguson in Europe that match our performance last year under Ole.

We need to find a new way. I was hopeful Ole will get it, but he seems too passive, too nice, too weak. He does not seem to handle media well and does not seem to be able to make hard decisions. It is evident that Pogba stinks. He never reached 1/3 of what we need from him. That is a hard decision that needs to be made.
 

Chairman Steve

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I’m not a fan of this cliche of ‘the *insert team here* way’. It feels like every teams way is to play exciting attacking football? Because what kind of people want their team to play dreary football?

I suppose if anything the ‘United way’ is actively incorporating youth, but if our academy is hypothetically going through a lull of talent then it would seem stupid to just shoehorn them in for the sake of it.

OGS’ football can be entertaining but only from a counter-attacking perspective. The majority of teams are happy to let us have possession and sit deep because they know despite the individual firepower we have, the on-field chemistry between them all is really mediocre. OGS could succeed by just having so many ridiculously good individuals upfront that it’s not possible for the opposing team to mark them all, but we play so fecking slow a lot of the time that it gives them that vital few seconds to regroup and know what we’re going to do. That’s the key to breaking down these defensively set out teams… Quick passing and thinking to pull their players out of place, confuse them, get them booked so they have to be careful, run them ragged etc. OGS hasn’t been able to get that going for us in the almost 3 years he’s been here and he’s had ample time to change the coaching staff since one of the excuses I’ve seen is ‘get him a top attacking coach’.

Firstly I don’t think OGS has that much pull to get someone like that and secondly, I think that person will turn around and think I may as well have OGS’ role.

I want Utd to be with the modern times with an exciting coach with potential. We don’t want outdated dinosaurs or guys who have just gone over the hill like Jose Mourinho was when we took him on. If we’re going to get a pragmatic manager then he better win a considerably large amount of the games to keep people happy, to offset the average football.
 
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Maticmaker

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The term 'the United Way' has almost become an embarrassment, a euphemism, in the way its used by some people, when in reality it means different things to different people.

For me it encompasses many things, specifically the clubs adventurous approach to football and in a way it was first underlined when Sir Matt Busby, in the late 1950's defied advice (and pressure) from the English League President and took United, as Division 1 winners into the European Cup Competition (now the CL); how the club has always sought to produce young players from within its own Youth system as well as pursuing top players through transfer activity, many times breaking the UK transfer record. On the pitch Sir Matt did allow the top players to 'play their own game', but to the more journeyman-type players he always gave instructions, perhaps the most famous one attributed to Sir Matt being when he told Nobby Stiles, "Nobby you win the ball son... then give it to Bobby".

SAF added to that 'United Way' ability to entertain a crowd, by instilling a winning mentality in all his teams, he not only praised them, he also goaded them when necessary, to get a result. When the media was 'having a go' he reputedly stuck the offending newspaper article on the inside of the dressing room door, saying "look lads that's what they think of you "... some said that sometimes that was the extent of SAF's pre-match team talk!

There is of course OT itself, yes its now becoming somewhat dilapidated, but as we saw against Villarreal... its still the 'theatre of dreams' sometimes when I witnessed late goals like that, magnificent comebacks, etc I really do think the place is enchanted.

This for me is 'the United Way', Busby started it, SAF made it world famous and successful by adding to the entertainment value a 'will to win' mentality, Ole now has to develop 'finding a way to win' for me that means not just entertainment, not just a winning mentality, but a methodology that carries this forward in a world where discipline and game management on the field are just as important as anything taking place off the field, that includes player rotations, substitutions, what to do when you go down to ten men, etc.

SAF said it took him a number of seasons to realise that he had to adjust things to become successful in Europe. Hopefully Ole will pick up that baton and apply it in the PL as well...that for me would be evidence that 'the United Way'was still viable...and necessary.
 

el3mel

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Are we even following the United way currently? We don't play good football, win no trophies and beside Greenwood, I don't see the club developing that many youngsters in the team easier. Having an ex legend in charge doesn't mean we're following "the United way". SAF wasn't an ex United legend when he was hired.

It's currently just a vague term used by those who want to defend the current manager but the reality is if you want to define it by "good football.. Trophies.. Developing youngsters" then the current team doesn't follow any of these.
 

The Firestarter

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Are we even following the United way currently? We don't play good football, win no trophies and beside Greenwood, I don't see the club developing that many youngsters in the team easier. Having an ex legend in charge doesn't mean we're following "the United way". SAF wasn't an ex United legend when he was hired.

It's currently just a vague term used by those who want to defend the current manager but the reality is if you want to define it by "good football.. Trophies.. Developing youngsters" then the current team doesn't follow any of these.
Don't think trophies have anything to do with the notion, since the goal of every club is to win trophies. It's more about attitude and conduct.
 

RedSky

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I believe the Utd way means:

- Playing with passion and a never die attitude (I think Ole has done brilliantly in this department).
- Playing or at least attempting to play an entertaining and positive style of football. (Ole has done this better than his predecessors but still not top-level).
- Utilising Youth and maintaining our academy traditions (despite popular belief I don't think Ole has done a great job in this department, he's a little risk-averse for me overall).
- Conducting ourselves with class at all times and truly understand what United's History is all about. (Ole gets this above all else).
- Operating with the right level of talent for a top club. (kind of goes without saying at a club our size.)

Now I appreciate some of those points are a little vague but personally they are the very fibre of the club I love. Whichever manager we get should at the bare minimum understand and implement the above and it's why for me personally Ole has been by far the best manager post-Fergie, regardless of the lack of trophies. For me 'trophies' isn't that important, primarily I watch the game to be entertained and to derive hope and joy, when that leaves (under Mourinho and LVG) there's nothing left. I also believe if you nail all of the above points, trophies are not far behind. Get the attitude, talent and performances right and the results will speak for themselves.
Solid summary. Agree with every word.
 

duffer

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I've never associated "the United way" with having ex players as managers. Don't most Man United fans consider it to be bringing through youth players and playing exciting football?

This is Greenwood's 4th season as a pro (3rd as a regular starter). Is there anyone close to being next as even a semi-regular a first teamer?

This isn't a dig, Man United's record bringing through kids is incredible and something to really be proud of but if Ole doesn't bring anyone through in the next couple of years, will people be that bothered?
 

MrBest

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The United Way statement implies that we must be how we was at every successful point in time. I see it more as a philosophy or values whereby we invest in youth, give them chances and have a preference to attacking football. Should our club have values, absolutely. Is it directly correlated to how Ole is performing on the pitch, no way. If anything, Ole has done an exceptional job in re-asserting our club values. The pressure we now see on Ole is not a ploy that he does not do it the 'the United way', if anything he has shown more about our values than any manager since Fergie. The pressure on him is that he should be doing so much better with the squad he has and he needs to implement a style of play on a consistent basis.