He should be getting more action in our team next season, but I don't think Ole will trust him. If that was the case, try get him a loan for another year. Mount did two loans before Lampard started playing him.
James Garner
- Thread starter RussellWilson
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Good parenting.
He should 100% be going out on loan again next season - Nottingham again seems ideal as he's settled in well, plays regularly and they've been picking up good results.
He's a good player but still very young - especially for a midfielder. Another season of playing every week will do him a lot better than occasionally sitting on the bench for us, or playing as a sub for a lower premier league team. He has plenty of time for bigger teams - he needs regular minutes right now to improve.
The mount comparison above is good - 2 very good loans at Vitesse and Derby. A comparison is Billy Gilmour - highly rated, same age as Garner, but only 8 odd appearances this season, a lot of them probably as a sub. That neither benefits him nor Chelsea.
He's a good player but still very young - especially for a midfielder. Another season of playing every week will do him a lot better than occasionally sitting on the bench for us, or playing as a sub for a lower premier league team. He has plenty of time for bigger teams - he needs regular minutes right now to improve.
The mount comparison above is good - 2 very good loans at Vitesse and Derby. A comparison is Billy Gilmour - highly rated, same age as Garner, but only 8 odd appearances this season, a lot of them probably as a sub. That neither benefits him nor Chelsea.
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I highly doubt it. In order to counter press you have to actually press not merely defend space. They actively squeeze out passing lanes. the forwards are just the first line of the pressing tactic. That is why once most of the midfield was withdrawn to the defence, even the forwards ceased to be effective with their pressing
You can doubt it all you want, thats how it works. You cant just have everyone pressing, your team would all end up on the same side of the pitch with huge areas where 1 pass from the team over the top gets them in on goal. Liverpool's attackers press, their fullbacks are fulltime wingers so their midfielders need to fill the many spaces left behind when they lose the ball. You cant just have everyone in attack and on top of the ball.
It's hard to really determine what Garner can or can't do simply because Forest are so poor in attack.
O please. I know precisely how it works. The fact you believe gegen pressing involves mere defending space means you don't understand it as well as you think you do,
That's bolded bit is the problem right there. You wrongly assume pressing is merely going where the ball is when it is anything but:
The tactic Liverpool employs works in 4 phases
1. The forward line initiates the press, pressing the defenders, keeper and dm or man directly on the ball.
2. The midfield as a compact triangular trio, press the space for passing lanes in the second phase, squeezing the area the opponent can play in and into
3. The center defence push up to the center line ready to get any attempts at a ball over the top. Further compressing the play.
4. The fullbacks lurk on the flanks to received an out ball from the balls robbed off forcing the opponents mistakes from the compressed space to play and closed off passing lanes to increase attacking pressure on the opponent
Passing strength is not remotely a requirement for Klopp's tactic to work. Its the ability for the midfield to press and harass relentless as a compact trio
That is why the moment all pool's cb's got injured. and 2 of the 3 best pressing midfielder were with drawn to defence. Liverpool became the Liverpool we have seen this season overnight....
The entire team is involved in the press. If the midfield as just defending space. The loss of the center halves would never have affected the entire team[/QUOTE]
Need another loan at a top championship side.
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He’s pretty darn good at cutting out a pass.
Always very difficult to judge based on a compilation video but looked too notch in that. Anyone been bothered to look at the Notts forum to gauge their opinion?
I remain of the opinion that he’ll be part of the first team squad next year and for very good reason I’d say.
I like how progressive he is with his choice of passing, something our midfield certainly lacks. He reminds me of Carrick in the way in which he recycles possession, once it comes back to him or he wins it back, he plays it forward again and get the team back on the front foot.
He is having a successful time at Forest and is gaining the experience in a tough league while getting better and used to first team football. I have hopes he will succeed here but I don’t think he should be thrown in next season and feel a lon to mid table PL will be the best option. He has the attributes to make it here
Is he the replacement to Pogba?
To me Pogba is a quality player but he doesnt add much more than a significant level of creativity from deep plus some extra goals.
If Garner can cover his passes then it would save us some hassle (even if he is too young).
To me Pogba is a quality player but he doesnt add much more than a significant level of creativity from deep plus some extra goals.
If Garner can cover his passes then it would save us some hassle (even if he is too young).
Is this not a bit hyperbole ? When we hit top of the league Pogba was pulling us through, yes he has been underwhelming overall but this is why we will never challenge for the league if you think we should replace Pogba with a player that’s only professional football is playing half a season in the championship.
I see you have high hopes for Garner as so do I. Think he will make it here since I first seen him in the youths but he is not ready to be starting every game nevermind trying to be one of our main men in a team challenging for the PL
Matic hasn't been stunning in his limited capacity. Is it out of the question that Garner can at least equal Matic's current standard? If so, then is it beyond the realm of feasibility that he'd get some rotation minutes for us next season?
He doesn't have to displace a first teamer, but he's definitely good enough to get Matic's minutes.
He doesn't have to displace a first teamer, but he's definitely good enough to get Matic's minutes.
Garner is praised madly by the Forest-fans - and that in a game where he wasn't even near his best (apart from the neatly taken goal)
"Brilliant performance from deeper in midfield, controlled the middle of the park and scored a superb goal with an exquisitely timed run into the box.
Really enjoying watching him, he’s too good for this level. Forest are lucky to have him, and I’d hope at least, the club are asking the question about next season "
" It is little things with him that make a huge difference. His first touch is so good and buys himself space or finds a pass, and it means the next battle is higher up the pitch than someone like Colback or Arter would do. We're always either on the front foot or in less danger after he has a touch. He's always in the right place to help someone else out as well "
" Whats really interesting is his tidiness, positional sense and solid no nonsense distribution highlights the deficiencies of so many of our own players. He picks the ball up and recycles it effortlessly and like all good CM players seems to appear on the shoulder of opposition players just when attacks are brewing, either dispossessing or slowing the attack sufficiently to let the team regroup "
"Brilliant performance from deeper in midfield, controlled the middle of the park and scored a superb goal with an exquisitely timed run into the box.
Really enjoying watching him, he’s too good for this level. Forest are lucky to have him, and I’d hope at least, the club are asking the question about next season "
" It is little things with him that make a huge difference. His first touch is so good and buys himself space or finds a pass, and it means the next battle is higher up the pitch than someone like Colback or Arter would do. We're always either on the front foot or in less danger after he has a touch. He's always in the right place to help someone else out as well "
" Whats really interesting is his tidiness, positional sense and solid no nonsense distribution highlights the deficiencies of so many of our own players. He picks the ball up and recycles it effortlessly and like all good CM players seems to appear on the shoulder of opposition players just when attacks are brewing, either dispossessing or slowing the attack sufficiently to let the team regroup "
Weren't Mount's 2 loans under Lampard at Derby? I am sure Lampard trusted him because he knew him from Derby.
It's not that I'm rating Pogba low, its more that I value him as a very significant yet specific player in our squad.
He is more our world class deep lying playmaker type player rather than this player who has multiple abilities he uses to influence the game.
If he leaves then what I mean is that we need some player that can add that deep lying playmaker role.
It's why people want Rice if Pogba stays and wants a different type of CDM if Pogba goes.
All I ask is if Garner has that deep lying playmaker ability to replace what Pogba gives to us rather than being the direct replacement of quality.
Took the goal calmly. That's good to see as he seemed to have a goal in him at youth level. It would be disappointing if he lost that and just became a guy that passes it around. He looks to have a bit of everything in terms of working defensively to win the ball back, passing range, potentially productive in the final third.
Yes we really want somebody that can control things and offer us more in the build up but we don't want to be too reductive with how we see our midfield roles as hopefully this guy can be a good all round player.
It's like I'm looking at a younger version of Michael Carrick. Everything looks so similar, down to the passing technique. I also noticed his long balls are also very Carrickesque.
I still maintain the belief that he's 1 season away from being the finished product. Another loan at Forrest or an Eredevise side will do him a load of good. I would prefer an Eredevise side, just because they get better tactical coaching in the Netherlands. Good to see him doing so well.
Nottingham will most probably fight for promotion next season. It's not like you could send him to Bournemouth and think that they are a certain top team. It's such a difficult league to predict. Either back at Nottingham or a Premier League loan IMO, maybe as a replacement for Oliver Skipp at Norwich. Or back at Watford
Happy for him to stay another season at Forest as he has fit in well and is gaining in confidence every week, no way to be certain it would work out at another club. I also think Chris Houghton is a very good coach who for some strange reason gets slagged off for not being trendy. People continually cream themselves over Potter but honestly in 2 years he hasn't taken Brighton any further than CH did.
Agree with you. Gotta be Forrest if he goes back to the Championship. A couple of months ago he couldn't get a start at Watford, and now people on here think he's going to walk into any championship side. At this point, any youth player needs to play as much as possible, doubly so for a CM.Nottingham will most probably fight for promotion next season. It's not like you could send him to Bournemouth and think that they are a certain top team. It's such a difficult league to predict. Either back at Nottingham or a Premier League loan IMO, maybe as a replacement for Oliver Skipp at Norwich. Or back at Watford
Competing for stuff on loan is overrated. The winning mentality is instilled through the youth setup and the moment you arrive at your parent club. We've had a lot of players who came from mediocre clubs only to become legends here.
No I agree with your thinking it’s just I feel for Garner it’s too soon to be taking over the responsibility in a team that should be aiming for a title challenge. I said the championship be perfect for a loan to get him the experience of proper professional football and he has passed with flying colours so far. But I feel a loan to a Southampton/Brighton for a season would be the next step and see how he gets on before making him a starter/rotation here.
Though I’m in agreement I have such high hopes. He reads the game and has such a football brain mixed with the ability I would be surprised if he didn’t make it here but I think it’s too soon
He looks like he could develop into what we hoped McTominay would be
Honestly have to give you credit for managing to attempt to shite on one of our players whilst complimenting another.
Garner and McTominay have VERY little in common in their playstyle. Like negligible amounts.
It will depend on what people at the club think his ceiling is.
If they rate him high enough, his next phase of development should be in a team where he gets more responsibility on the ball.
If they rate him high enough, his next phase of development should be in a team where he gets more responsibility on the ball.
McTominay was being groomed to replace Matic and play as a 6. Its nothing to do with shitting on a player, hes clearly not a 6.
Honestly have to give you credit for managing to get your knickers in a twist and jumping to conclusions over an internet forum post.
What this loan is doing for Garner is showing him he will be a regular starter in at least a championship professional football team. If you think about how few players make it in pro football then think how few at premier league level then at a club like Utd. There must be part of all these young players who have seen so many not make it that they have doubts about how good they really are or will be. He knows now he will be a professional football player and that he isn't just dreaming. That takes some of the weight off his shoulders. When he got his chance earlier in the season he looked nervous and that is not good for a player who plays like Garner. He needs confidence on the ball to make the right pass selection and show what we have seen in the youth sides.
I think we have genuine player on our hands he looks better than championship to me and at this point the sky is the limit. Some times it takes a couple of seasons for players to put the final touches to their game but some times they hit a escalator and just pop. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he comes back for next season and starts to make people sit up when he has the ball. Fingers crossed as always with injuries and the off field stuff.
I think we have genuine player on our hands he looks better than championship to me and at this point the sky is the limit. Some times it takes a couple of seasons for players to put the final touches to their game but some times they hit a escalator and just pop. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he comes back for next season and starts to make people sit up when he has the ball. Fingers crossed as always with injuries and the off field stuff.
Mount had his first loan at Vitesse in Holland and the second loan at Derby in The Championship. He made the team of the season in Holland and won Vitesse player of the year but found it harder at Derby where he was OK overall.
Can anyone who’s been watching Garner shed light on his low pass completion, is it something to do with the style of football they play?
Good to see him adjust well and perform.
I hope he continues his development.
I hope he continues his development.
Presumably it's because he's asked to try and play it forward early? That and it seems their forwards aren't very good.
I think it also helps tremendously when the manager also praises and supports said player. I've always liked Hughton as a manager, and he seems to be getting the real Garner out now, whereas at Watford, like you say, he looked nervous, and he never seemed to be an integral part of their team, at Forest he's certainly come on leaps and bounds from the first couple of matches.
He also seems to have been fully accepted, and trusted, by the Forest players as well, and that is a big plus.
The pre season will tell Ole if he is ready, but I think he may need at least another half season loan to be ready for the Prem, after all, in the position he seems destined to play in, experience certainly helps a lot.
It is always a good sign, they are digging themselves out of the relegation battle and they are not a very able team. It means everything to them and they still give him the ball.
I agree in his position especially but you never know.
If there is a comparison with Matic you just have to ask yourself how dominant Matic would be playing for Forest and I think he would be their MOTM every game.
Mi
True, we don't really know, and nothing would please me more than Garner playing in United's first team next season, so I think the pre season will be very interesting, not only for Garner, but for a host of very promising young players coming through the academy. Wouldn't it be great to have over half the team academy graduates, and possibly in two/ three years time we may see that.
It would be fantastic and we could use them ASAP if we are honest.
It would. Personally I think Hannibal is the nearest to becoming part of the squad, but with kids you never know. I think next season we will see two or three given game time, but a lot depends on how many are out on loan. Interesting times ahead.
Trust me, I'm a massive fan of his. Always been the standout player at various age groups and now he physically in a better place, just like said I don't trust Utd and loaning young players.....our recent history is shocking yet when those have hug around the playing squad, its paid dividends.