James Maddison

Discussion in 'Transfer Forum' started by IrishRedDevil, Jun 3, 2019.

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  1. Jun 7, 2019

    JPRouve can't stop thinking about balls - NOT deflategate Scout

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    Thanks, so you have no worries from a defensive standpoint, he is a decent tackler and has no positioning issues?
  2. Jun 7, 2019

    Jimmy Skitz Full Member

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    he can improve but he doesn't shirk his responsibilities, he also wins countless free kicks in those positions to relieve the pressure when penned in
  3. Jun 7, 2019

    Eckers99 Michael Corleone says hello

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    So he's called McFadden and he played in the Championship last season. This thread has taught me that you don't need to know a single thing about James Maddison to have an opinion on him.
  4. Jun 7, 2019

    Andersons Dietician Full Member

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    I seem to recall that at the start of last season we played them early and I remember him being a nightmare that game to play against but I just don’t really see like a top top player in him. I think he’d be good and that is maybe what we need but I just don’t think he’d do well at a top flight club and we’d end up with effectively a Cleverley that we paid 50/60mil for.

    Worth noting that he was supposedly a right bellend when he was up on Loan at Aberdeen even if he did score a cracker of a free kick against Rangers.
  5. Jun 7, 2019

    JPRouve can't stop thinking about balls - NOT deflategate Scout

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    Thanks again. It may be a good idea to pry him away from your lot then.:)
  6. Jun 7, 2019

    Ekeke Full Member

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    He's exactly the opposite of Cleverley though. Cleverley was fairly good at keeping the ball, always going sideways, backwards and rarely forwards. He was like a 2nd division Spanish player, could keep the ball and move it about but unable to create anything. And defensively he didn't do a lot either.

    Maddison isn't someone who plays that style of possession, he's more like a Fabregas than a Xavi, who will try to turn his receiving the ball into a counter attack or chance for a player, or will dribble past players to win a freekick and then put it in the back of the net.

    Other than being English CMs there arent many similarities with Cleverley and Maddison. Maddison is lots of end product, Cleverley is just keeping the ball a bit.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
  7. Jun 7, 2019

    Jimmy Skitz Full Member

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    he's already said he doesn't want to leave so I wouldn't bother given how hard we make it to buy from us
  8. Jun 7, 2019

    Andersons Dietician Full Member

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    You know somethings are just throw away comments like that one was like he’ll be highly touted like Cleverly was when he was highly regarded for what he was doing in the championship who even had some saying he’d be the next Scholes and why did we even need someone like a Pogba when we had the English Iniesta out on loan.

    I was simply pointing out I think he’ll end up as a guy who didn’t quite make it at a top club “Danny Drinkwater” and end up playing for one of the more mid-table teams but the way we are heading that could be us soon enough so maybe he will be a great fit after all.

    I wasn’t making a direct comparison in terms of their ability and style of play.
  9. Jun 7, 2019

    Ekeke Full Member

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    Cleverley never did anything to suggest he can be a player on Maddison's current level let alone if he improves on it. Maddison made more chances than any other player in the league. Cleverley didnt even manage the most sideways passes of players in the league.

    So Maddison is already proven on a premier league level, something Cleverley is still trying to do
  10. Jun 7, 2019

    Andersons Dietician Full Member

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    Straight over your head really wasn’t it. Ok nevermind.
  11. Jun 7, 2019

    Ekeke Full Member

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    No you just dont have a point. Cleverley did nothing to be rated, other than being a young midfielder at United. He could keep the ball a little bit. Thats it. Thats everything.

    Maddison created more chances than the foreign players in the premier league, which is where the 4 teams in the europa and champions league finalists, all 4 of them, came from. And he created more chances than those players. He's in a different league to Cleverley even if Cleverley had fulfilled his potential.
  12. Jun 7, 2019

    Andersons Dietician Full Member

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    No there was a point you just chose to ignore and get on your high horse because you misinterpreted the meaning of my first post and have made a mountain out of a mole hill because you feel in some way I’ve offended you because I made a throw away comment that I think he’ll end up in the long run failing and ending up at a Cleverley level.

    Who by the way was really well thought of at the time of his coming through and to some was playing really well. Never saw it myself but trust me there was a lot of love for him back in the day and if I recall he was scoring a few when he was out on loan.

    Anyway end of discussion, not that it ever really was. I hope we don’t sign him.
  13. Jun 7, 2019

    Ekeke Full Member

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    Yes, united fans overrated a youngster, it happens all the time. Nothing to do with a player excelling for another club in the premier league, creating more chances than any other player in the premier league.

    You could compare Cleverley with Chong. Not with Maddison
  14. Jun 7, 2019

    golden_blunder Site admin. Manchester United fan Staff

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    Hmmm wasn’t the best comparison fella
  15. Jun 7, 2019

    bond19821982 Full Member

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    Not sold on Fernandes. Also think this spurs,city links are nonsense so that we pay over the odds.
  16. Jun 7, 2019

    amolbhatia50k Sneaky bum time

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    Yeah same here. Genuinely believe we need to prioritize players with terrific technical ability who can help us control and playmake. Maddison may not be a true playmaker but his technical game seems really really strong to me. At 22 I think he'd be a terrific addition.
  17. Jun 7, 2019

    -Supreme- New Member

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    Really like the look of him, reminds me of Eriksen with his passing ability and set pieces.

    60m is really good value for money considering PL proven full back is 50m minimum.
  18. Jun 7, 2019

    Cliche Guevara Full Member

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    That’s bizarre. That’s who I was thinking of when I was watching him.
  19. Jun 7, 2019

    Dante Bang Average but can post Blindfolded for 15 secs

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    Have you got the figures for chances created/key passes in open play? Maddison is obviously a brilliant free kick taker, but it's ability the rest of the time that's most important.

    EDIT: I've answered my own question:

    [​IMG]

    His chance creation is good, but padded signficantly by his corners.

    Though Maddison has been better than Pogba (whose own stats are misleading due to his penalty taking), it's Tielemans who's the most impressive here.
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2019
  20. Jun 7, 2019

    Yagami Full Member

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    The thing thAt sets him apart from Eriksen - and why I prefer Maddison over him - is that along with those two qualities he is a good dribbler and is fantastic at shielding the ball under pressure, which are things Eriksen lacks.
  21. Jun 7, 2019

    2 man midfield Incestuous Modern Woman (Dumper!)

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    So is he the backup to Fernandes then? Surely we wouldn’t get both?
  22. Jun 8, 2019

    UNITED ACADEMY Full Member

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    He would have been considered to be top player if he’s consistent. But two months isn’t too bad compared to some of our supposedly top players dropped off for 6 months or more.

    What makes you think he will stay and you won’t sell anymore bar Maguire? Curious
  23. Jun 8, 2019

    Dahnsouff New Member

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    It’s a not a certainty, but there seems to be only one "star" allowed to leave each season unofficial policy. Kante went and then only because he had a release clause, Mahrez took 2 seasons to force his move. As everyone knows, the league is so rich that the days of a big club cherry picking players at will with large transfer fees has lessened. This does ripple down to a lesser degree with teams such s Leicester buying from the Championship and below.

    As a club further down the pecking order, Leicester are seen as fodder for historic bigger clubs, the media linking half our first team with moves (Ricardo, Maddison, Chilwell, Maguire, etc) the only exception and I suspect that will soon come, is N’Didi.

    Most stories are easy to write for journos and are just click-bait.
  24. Jun 8, 2019

    Andersons Dietician Full Member

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    Well since it seems you want to compare them in the season before there move to the prem Cleverley had scored 11 goals, had 5 assists in 33 games for Watford. Maddison had 14 goals and 8 assists in 44 games.

    Cleverley in his younger days was an attacking midfielder who scored and created goals, hence why he had fans, media, pundits up in a tizzy about his prospects. Now look how his career panned out. To add it in again I wasn’t one of them as I always thought he was lacking elsewhere.

    Again my point wasn’t a direct comparison of their playing styles but to make the point I don’t think Maddison is a good idea, not for 60 mil and that eventually he’ll find himself at the same level of influence or going down the same career path as Cleverley ending back at a mid table club because he couldn’t hack it at a big club.

    What you did with that from there on out was your own doing.
  25. Jun 8, 2019

    Classical Mechanic Full Member

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    Maddison has a totally different level of ability to Cleverley though.
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2019
  26. Jun 8, 2019

    Ekeke Full Member

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    So you completely ignored the fact Maddison was one of the best attacking midfielders in the premier league last season, again. Did you skip last season?
  27. Jun 8, 2019

    Mcking Full Member

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    What of the Premier League part though?
  28. Jun 8, 2019

    Classical Mechanic Full Member

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    Not least that Cleveley has failed to winning a starting spot at any of the Premier League clubs he's been at.
  29. Jun 8, 2019

    Andersons Dietician Full Member

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    That has nothing to do with it though. He was great last year. There have been many players that have a great year or 2. My point still is that I personally don’t think he’ll hack it at a big club and he’ll end up back at a mid level club.

    To think you made all this from a clearly hyperbole comment of “ I don’t think he’d hack it and we’d effectively end up with a 60mil Cleverley” ie a mid level player sitting on the bench who cost us 60 mil.

    You’re trying to take it off in different directions now which I’m not sure what for other than the sake of arguing because you don’t like that someone doesn’t think he’ll pan out or be good enough?

    I’ll finish with I hope we don’t sign him but if we do I hope he continues the form he has shown this year and continues doing it for many a year. However I just don’t see it and especially not in any set up we would play.
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2019
  30. Jun 8, 2019

    Adam-Utd Part of first caf team to complete Destiny raid

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    I would suggest those stats are also misleading.

    David Luiz doing more through balls than Pogba, Eriksen and Tielemens? I'm not sure they've really established what a "through ball" is. Luiz is probably punting the long ball over a defence and somebody is running onto it - they're classing that as a through ball. Not really what we're trying to look at here.
  31. Jun 8, 2019

    Ekeke Full Member

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    What do you mean nothing to do with it? You made some random comment about him being like Cleverley and wont end up a top player, but hes already in the bracket of being a player who if he improves any on last season he'll be there.

    Cleverley hasnt even proven that he's a top 6 club player let alone a star

    You just attatched his name to Cleverley's because you dont like Maddison and wanted to make out that he isnt already a really good player. If you had compared them last summer when he signed for Leicester from Norwich then fair enough, Maddison's stats were a little similar to Cleverley in the championship. But now that you're using them in the same breath after what Maddison done this season at Leicester its a joke
  32. Jun 8, 2019

    Classical Mechanic Full Member

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    A lot of Pogba's through balls are similar to what you describe though. Like it or not but Luiz is probably the best defender about at playing through balls from defence.

    He's also up there with big chances created

    https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/big_chance_created
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2019
  33. Jun 8, 2019

    Needham Full Member

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    No one's bothered by the fact that one of this guy's ex-girlfriends was on Love Island?
    Me neither.
  34. Jun 8, 2019

    Adam-Utd Part of first caf team to complete Destiny raid

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    Yeah I'm not having that. You're telling me Pogba/Eriksen/maddison etc have made less defence splitting passes than David Luiz across a season?

    Yes Luiz is very good at playmaking from defence but it's a completely different style of passing, and it just shows stats can be misleading if not taken with a pinch of salt.
  35. Jun 8, 2019

    Classical Mechanic Full Member

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    An individual stat can be misleading indeed but Maddison is at the higher end of every single stat relating to chance creation.

    Can you have that?
  36. Jun 8, 2019

    Adam-Utd Part of first caf team to complete Destiny raid

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    Well yes, because he plays in a position that is mainly creativity based. You'd expect him to have higher stats in those departments.

    If Maddison had more interceptions and blocks than Luiz i'd also question things.
  37. Jun 8, 2019

    Ekeke Full Member

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    "Other" refers to normal key passes that arent balls behind the defense.

    [​IMG]

    So once again, Tielemans was trying to play balls in behind the defense at a higher rate than Maddison but Maddison created far more chances from general play. Add the set pieces on top and its the combination that led to him creating the most chances in the league
  38. Jun 8, 2019

    Classical Mechanic Full Member

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    A lot of Pogba's through balls are similar to David Luiz's though. Long raking passes that are more difficult to control.

    Not every through ball can be geometrically beautiful like these



  39. Jun 8, 2019

    Beaucoup Full Member

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    You don’t need stats to actually see that Maddison is a top footballer and exactly the type of player we need. If the club are serious about bringing in top young English talent with potential to Improve then Maddison and Sancho should be at the top of the list.
  40. Jun 8, 2019

    KW2006 New Member

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    He looks like a more natural playmaker to me than Bruno Fernandes. I would rather have him.
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