Maguire needs to be replaced

[Paxi]

@kouroux microanalysis being the key word here mate.

Would one not agree that it’s best to keep ones head down when one is under intense scrutiny?

I absolutely give zero fecks about England and what they do as long as they don’t win another international trophy whilst I’m alive. However, when a captain of my club starts giving it the fecking big’un — well I’ll comment on it.

 

[glazed]

IF we hire new manager who will want to play attacking football with high back line, Maguire will be a problem.

Along with half the squad. Which is why this is unlikely to happen.

 

[Ludens the Red]

We came 2nd last year in the toughest league in the world.

You know what the problem is? We have a load of spoilt, nostalgic fans who think just banging on about "high-standards" is enough to win Premier League titles.

Finishing 2nd to a City side who have had £5BN artificially poured in and every advantage in football does not make the players failures or disgraces.

We might not be THE best side around at the moment, Maguire might not be THE best centre half....but we are a very good side and Maguire is a very good centre half.

Nobody has a God-given right to win anything. The way the game is going, there's a possibility we never win a major trophy again. For most clubs, that's already a reality. You can either spend every minute whining about it, or just enjoy it for what it is.

Personally, I am lucky. I have seen United win every major trophy there is to win, and attended 99% of the home games during our period of dominance between 2005-2010. We're certainly never again going to be able to exert that level of dominance, it's over. Football as we know it/knew it is over. The game now is about who has the biggest resources and spending power. Look at the CL semi-finals last year...three plastic, oil clubs who without their billionaire owners would be lucky to win a pre-season tournament. Wait until Newcastle get going. I made my peace with that a long time ago.

I would suggest there's a few hundred on here need to sit down and reflect - "Am I enjoying this?", "is it healthy to be furious all of the time?", "is it healthy to 'hate' our players?", "is it healthy to want the team to lose so a former player is sacked as manager?", "is it healthy to be triggered by our captain celebrating a goal?".

Just try and enjoy it, its meant to be fun.

Not sure why there’s been so many liking this post and calling it a great post. It isn’t at all. It’s rehashed nonsensical ramblings that don’t seem to understand the basic concept of tribalism and football.
It’s basically asking why are football fans being football fans? Why are football fans getting emotional over their football club? Why do football fans want their team to do well?

To start with it would help if we hadn’t spent about a billion in transfers and wages since Fergie left and have feck all to show for it.

United fans on here, even the biggest moaners do not demand United win everything. They want to see some decent football, yearly progress and competing, which should be the bare minimal with the amount of money we’ve spent. None of these things have happened since 2013. To call our fans spoilt for whinging about this is idiotic.

The idea that we should all just smile and trod along because ten years ago we won stuff is strange and completely senseless in the world of being a football fan.
Most football fans all have an expectancy and desire to see their team succeed on some level and play good football. That is what being a football fan is about. Who are these football fans trodding along being happy go lucky telling themselves “oh city , PSG and Chelsea have billionaires, whats the point?”… this sort of attitude is a complete contradiction of the basic premise of sport and being a sports fan.

I assure you the problem with Man United isn’t our fanbase’ supposed high expectancies. If anything the downturn in results on the pitch can be slightly attributed to a match going fanbase who are relatively patient and don’t show too much distain.

I really hope our players don’t feel the same way. I hope they continue to want to succeed and get better and don’t give up and accept things because “city, PSG and Chelsea spend some money” because god help us if they have your attitude and that of the folk replying to you with “top post”.

 

[TrueRed79]

Best post I have seen in a long time, people really should sit down and reflect on their emotions and reasons for watching the game every week.

That being said, I shall do the same in regards to the CAF, this place has become a toxic environment, full of absolutist opinions and extreme reactionary viewpoints.

I was so happy to become a full member after loitering for years on this site, now I think I will just delete my account and watch Utd without the additional noise from the CAF.

All the best everyone.

Off you go chief. It's people like you that bring the tone down. This is a forum for discussion and opinions. Absolutely nobody has to agree with any other posters opinion. When we were winning leagues back in the day everything was harmonious around here 90% of the time. When the team you support have been shite for nearly ten years, you have every right to be frustrated. Lentwoods post had a few valid points but i'd disagree with most of it. We have spent shitloads of money, but have spent it terribly. Not to mention hiring all the wrong managers. I absolutely cannot stand it when people who moan are called spoiled. It's the most ridiculous notion bandied about around here. Everyone knew what Maguire's celebration was about.

 

[FreakyJim]

Not sure why there’s been so many liking this post.
It’s basically asking why are football fans being football fans? Why are football fans getting emotional over their football club? Why do football fans want their team to do well?

To start with it would help if we hadn’t spent about a billion in transfers and wages since Fergie left and have feck all to show for it.

United fans on here, even the biggest moaners do not demand United win everything. They want to see some decent football, yearly progress and competing, which should be the bare minimal with the amount of money we’ve spent. None of these things have happened since 2013. To call our fans spoilt for whinging about this is idiotic.

The idea that we should all just smile and trod along because ten years ago we won stuff is strange and completely senseless in the world of being a football fan.
Most football fans all have an expectancy and desire to see their team succeed on some level and play good football. That is what being a football fan is about. Who are these football fans trodding along being happy go lucky telling themselves “oh city , PSG and Chelsea have billionaires, whats the point?”… this sort of attitude is a complete contradiction of the basic premise of sport and being a sports fan.

I assure you the problem with Man United isn’t our fanbase’ supposed high expectancies. If anything the downturn in results on the pitch can be slightly attributed to a match going fanbase who are relatively patient and don’t show too much distain.

Yep. Imagine Fergie with "oh well, it's only football, we don't have the god given right to win games. Let's just enjoy being on the pitch, kicking the ball around" attitude.

Thankfully there were people in United's history that wanted to see the club elevated above the rest.

 

[van Nistelrooy]

I don't have any issue with him celebrating the goal regardless of who it was against etc. It was simply the cupping of the ears followed by putting his fingers in with that arrogant face of his. It was purely aimed at the noise around criticism of himself and the club over the past few weeks.

When the criticism is well justified, Maguire has nothing to complain about. As United captain, I expect him to take it on the chin, keep his head down and redeem himself with decent performances for the club. Remarkably, he has tried to brush the celebration under the carpet saying it was just a "knee slide" despite it being captured on camera.

We have Pinocchio as captain!

 

[kouroux]

@kouroux microanalysis being the key word here mate.

Would one not agree that it’s best to keep ones head down when one is under intense scrutiny?

I absolutely give zero fecks about England and what they do as long as they don’t win another international trophy whilst I’m alive. However, when a captain of my club starts giving it the fecking big’un — well I’ll comment on it.

Making a comment about it and shitting on the player for celebrating like that are two different things for me. Like I said, there is enough stuff football related with Maguire to give him fair criticism for, I don't put how he celebrates a goal for England in that category. It doesn't bother me how he did it.

I don't have any issue with him celebrating the goal regardless of who it was against etc. It was simply the cupping of the ears followed by putting his fingers in with that arrogant face of his. It was purely aimed at the noise around criticism of himself and the club over the past few weeks.

When the criticism is well justified, Maguire has nothing to complain about. As United captain, I expect him to take it on the chin, keep his head down and redeem himself with decent performances for the club. Remarkably, he has tried to brush the celebration under the carpet saying it was just a "knee slide" despite it being captured on camera.

We have Pinocchio as captain!

Yes but obviously he also received more than "fair criticism". These guys get abused on their social platforms every single day. Some of them are strong enough to get over those things and some of them react in their own way (like the way he celebrated). I think this is an aspect that gets forgotten. If you read insults about you constantly, it can affect you.
I'm sure they're told to avoid social media during bad periods but I have no doubt they follow what's being said about them

 

[Paxi]

You are the one with delusion. Not you personally, but spoilt fans like you.

Spoiled fans like him? You realise he’s Egyptian right? It would be so easy for him to just go and follow Salah right now.

You and anyone like you need to shut the feck up already. You’re not a better fan for sticking with the team and the manger — you’re just not!

There is more than one way to skin a fecking cat mate and if fans aren’t happy, you’d be more of a top red if you actually appreciated their opinion rather than being a mental fecking eejit banging your own head against a brick wall.

Stop it.

 

[Garethw]

Southgate’s England bore me to tears, but they are well drilled and tactically very well setup hence why the concede very little and don’t lose often.

His Natural inclination to setup so defensively drives me mad and I’d hate to see him at United.

 

[Andycoleno9]

Along with half the squad. Which is why this is unlikely to happen.

I don't think so. I rate highly our squad. Don't judge our players based on how they play right now (basically without manager's influence). With proper manager who knows how to implement system, we can be on par with City, Chelsea and Liverpool.
Only players who will strughle under new manager are maybe Harry (but he has quality to adapt), AWB and Mct. Awb and McT are just awful football players and they can't be a part of attacking minded team.

 

[Paxi]

Southgate’s England bore me to tears, but they are well drilled and tactically very well setup hence why the concede very little and don’t lose often.

His Natural inclination to setup so defensively drives me mad and I’d hate to see him at United.

Yeah I shouldn’t have been so fecking rude. The thought of Southgate actually makes me sick though.

He’s alright tactically but not amazing.

Right, my team is Russia and we always had fairly technical players. Why is it Hiddink could make us play beautiful and at times unplayable football - far more than sum of its parts — yet someone like Southgate would be hopeless? I think it’s down to coaching.

 

[Lentwood]

Not sure why there’s been so many liking this post and calling it a great post. It isn’t at all. It’s rehashed nonsensical ramblings that don’t seem to understand the basic concept of tribalism and football.
It’s basically asking why are football fans being football fans? Why are football fans getting emotional over their football club? Why do football fans want their team to do well?

To start with it would help if we hadn’t spent about a billion in transfers and wages since Fergie left and have feck all to show for it.

United fans on here, even the biggest moaners do not demand United win everything. They want to see some decent football, yearly progress and competing, which should be the bare minimal with the amount of money we’ve spent. None of these things have happened since 2013. To call our fans spoilt for whinging about this is idiotic.

The idea that we should all just smile and trod along because ten years ago we won stuff is strange and completely senseless in the world of being a football fan.
Most football fans all have an expectancy and desire to see their team succeed on some level and play good football. That is what being a football fan is about. Who are these football fans trodding along being happy go lucky telling themselves “oh city , PSG and Chelsea have billionaires, whats the point?”… this sort of attitude is a complete contradiction of the basic premise of sport and being a sports fan.

I assure you the problem with Man United isn’t our fanbase’ supposed high expectancies. If anything the downturn in results on the pitch can be slightly attributed to a match going fanbase who are relatively patient and don’t show too much distain.

I really hope our players don’t feel the same way. I hope they continue to want to succeed and get better and don’t give up and accept things because “city, PSG and Chelsea spend some money” because god help us if they have your attitude and that of the folk replying to you with “top post”.

Think you are missing the point mate. I want United to win as badly as anybody, but I am critical of the people who go to the extreme every single time. Calling players a disgrace because they had a bad game, criticising players for celebrating goals, hoping we lose so the manager gets the sack.

All of those things, in my opinion, are childish, over the top, and actually, more importantly, my point is really if you stop getting so wound up about it and just take the good with the bad, you will enjoy it far more, which is what it's supposed to be about.

I don't care what you think of my "mentality" with regards United. I look after the things in my life I can control. I can't control what United do, who they buy, how they play, who the manager is...following United is a hobby, a recreational activity.

Tell you another thing as well...its too much media/news and round the clock coverage that is winding people up. It's designed to keep you angry, to keep you watching/clicking. Just turn it off.

 

[red4ever 79]

I go back a few years ago when everyone said the squad wasnt likeable, well here is another unlikeable chap.

 

[Zoo]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

 

[Zen86]

Think you are missing the point mate. I want United to win as badly as anybody, but I am critical of the people who go to the extreme every single time. Calling players a disgrace because they had a bad game, criticising players for celebrating goals, hoping we lose so the manager gets the sack.

All of those things, in my opinion, are childish, over the top, and actually, more importantly, my point is really if you stop getting so wound up about it and just take the good with the bad, you will enjoy it far more, which is what it's supposed to be about.

I don't care what you think of my "mentality" with regards United. I look after the things in my life I can control. I can't control what United do, who they buy, how they play, who the manager is...following United is a hobby, a recreational activity.

Tell you another thing as well...its too much media/news and round the clock coverage that is winding people up. It's designed to keep you angry, to keep you watching/clicking. Just turn it off.

I wonder why some people even watch football. They quite clearly get very little joy out of it and we’re never again going to have a period of such prolific success. Everyone wants to see us win, but if that’s what people expect then they’re in for a rough ride.

 

[Garethw]

Yeah I shouldn’t have been so fecking rude. The thought of Southgate actually makes me sick though.

He’s alright tactically but not amazing.

Right, my team is Russia and we always had fairly technical players. Why is it Hiddink could make us play beautiful and at times unplayable football - far more than sum of its parts — yet someone like Southgate would be hopeless? I think it’s down to coaching.

I think it’s down to the mindset of the coach as well mate. LVG was a masterful coach and tactician but his style of play bored me to tears.

Southgate is far too negative with his tactics for my liking. A more progressive coach would have had England winning that Euros final rather than trying to park the bus for 80 fecking minutes.

 

[Paxi]

I think it’s down to the mindset of the coach as well mate. LVG was a masterful coach and tactician but his style of play bored me to tears.

Southgate is far too negative with his tactics for my liking. A more progressive coach would have had England winning that Euros final rather than trying to park the bus for 80 fecking minutes.

To add to that. LvG was never going to succeed in England. As Dutch as he was, he was way too conservative for the pace of the league. I’m not sure how he would have faired when he took Ajax to CL though.

 

[Mainoldo]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

It’s not hiding. It’s being sensible about your body. He should of said no.

 

[Gazautd18]

Never used to bother me but after last night he's proving to be a very dislikable character

 

[Shane88]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Nonsense. Rushing back and playing unfit just causes more problems for the club as seen with all the goals he has cost us.

It's the ego of wanting to be a "big man" and nothing more.

 

[Skills]

Gareth making a play for the United job by throwing Solskjaer under the bus

 

[red4ever 79]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Ye really helps the club playing when not fit ahead of a CB who was fit and costing us goals.

 

[RUCK4444]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

In fairness to Southgate he has a point, no excuse for Harry being as bad as he has but there are plenty of players that will gladly sit out with a ‘knock’ when the going gets tough.

At least he has a bit of balls about him to turn it around and take the flack in the meantime. He doesn’t pick who starts each match.

 

[Godfather]

You are the one with delusion. Not you personally, but spoilt fans like you.

Tell your father he sucks as a manager.

 

[Judas]

SadCafe really living up to its name. I can't pretend to be surprised to see this level of frothing at the mouth.

The biggest problem with Maguire has been poor form and being rushed back from injury time and time again, he's not the only one either, shit leadership not being strong enough to say "you're not playing". Seen it so much over the last few years. Desperation in management is a disaster.

 

[Conor]

Yes but obviously he also received more than "fair criticism". These guys get abused on their social platforms every single day. Some of them are strong enough to get over those things and some of them react in their own way (like the way he celebrated). I think this is an aspect that gets forgotten. If you read insults about you constantly, it can affect you.
I'm sure they're told to avoid social media during bad periods but I have no doubt they follow what's being said about them

It says a lot about his character that he thinks that scoring a goal in a thrashing of a shite team has countered this abuse you talk about.

 

[Fridge chutney]

We came 2nd last year in the toughest league in the world.

You know what the problem is? We have a load of spoilt, nostalgic fans who think just banging on about "high-standards" is enough to win Premier League titles.

Finishing 2nd to a City side who have had £5BN artificially poured in and every advantage in football does not make the players failures or disgraces.

We might not be THE best side around at the moment, Maguire might not be THE best centre half....but we are a very good side and Maguire is a very good centre half.

Nobody has a God-given right to win anything. The way the game is going, there's a possibility we never win a major trophy again. For most clubs, that's already a reality. You can either spend every minute whining about it, or just enjoy it for what it is.

Personally, I am lucky. I have seen United win every major trophy there is to win, and attended 99% of the home games during our period of dominance between 2005-2010. We're certainly never again going to be able to exert that level of dominance, it's over. Football as we know it/knew it is over. The game now is about who has the biggest resources and spending power. Look at the CL semi-finals last year...three plastic, oil clubs who without their billionaire owners would be lucky to win a pre-season tournament. Wait until Newcastle get going. I made my peace with that a long time ago.

I would suggest there's a few hundred on here need to sit down and reflect - "Am I enjoying this?", "is it healthy to be furious all of the time?", "is it healthy to 'hate' our players?", "is it healthy to want the team to lose so a former player is sacked as manager?", "is it healthy to be triggered by our captain celebrating a goal?".

Just try and enjoy it, its meant to be fun.

Fantastic post.

 

[Fridge chutney]

Wow. Some of these reactions for his celebration are either crazy or tragic. Do fans have to moan about every single thing now ?

It's so true. Weird to see so much hate and vitriol directed towards our own players for something relatively innocuous. With fans like ours, we don't need rivals.

 

[Rightnr]

I can see the typical backpeddling is already happening in double-quick time when Maguire inevitably fecks up something on or off the pitch.

Look at the rowing back from himself, England's Ole and his family. It's clear what was meant by that joke of a celebration and anyone who cannot see why it makes a mockery of fans of United (who pay his exorbitant wages) needs to think again.

The guy has a thin skin, he's bang average and generally does not act like a United player, let alone captain. He just cannot take the pressure.

 

[NK86]

Top post.


Expect someone to tell yourself you have lowered standards and that is why the club is in the state it is on the pitch at the moment, because you aren't crying enough and depressed enough and wanting them to lose every match

As opposed to him saying "entitled fans" are the issue here? How he must have wished that Fergie was not such a driving force amd we were relatively crap throughout, just so he could come out saying "well we did win under Sir Matt, just enjoy us being shite and directionless."

Some of the lot on here saying fans are the issue are living in a world where the likes of Madrid and Barca don't exist. Our fans are so tolerant. Anywhere else at a big and we would have had major issues with Ole dragging us out. But I guess he and you think we are no longer a big club and should just be happy to be also-rans.

 

[Florida Man]

The top red stuff is almost as cringeworthy as Maguire’s celebration. Welcome to sports fandom where fans have been toxic and overreacting for decades. The Caf has had out of order comments since I’ve started lurking here in 2010. What’s new about that?

 

[Rolaholic]

Not sure why there’s been so many liking this post and calling it a great post. It isn’t at all. It’s rehashed nonsensical ramblings that don’t seem to understand the basic concept of tribalism and football.
It’s basically asking why are football fans being football fans? Why are football fans getting emotional over their football club? Why do football fans want their team to do well?

To start with it would help if we hadn’t spent about a billion in transfers and wages since Fergie left and have feck all to show for it.

United fans on here, even the biggest moaners do not demand United win everything. They want to see some decent football, yearly progress and competing, which should be the bare minimal with the amount of money we’ve spent. None of these things have happened since 2013. To call our fans spoilt for whinging about this is idiotic.

The idea that we should all just smile and trod along because ten years ago we won stuff is strange and completely senseless in the world of being a football fan.
Most football fans all have an expectancy and desire to see their team succeed on some level and play good football. That is what being a football fan is about. Who are these football fans trodding along being happy go lucky telling themselves “oh city , PSG and Chelsea have billionaires, whats the point?”… this sort of attitude is a complete contradiction of the basic premise of sport and being a sports fan.

I assure you the problem with Man United isn’t our fanbase’ supposed high expectancies. If anything the downturn in results on the pitch can be slightly attributed to a match going fanbase who are relatively patient and don’t show too much distain.

I really hope our players don’t feel the same way. I hope they continue to want to succeed and get better and don’t give up and accept things because “city, PSG and Chelsea spend some money” because god help us if they have your attitude and that of the folk replying to you with “top post”.

Spot on, hardly even any 'glory hunters' left in the fanbase after almost a decade of not coming close to challenging for the biggest prizes so it's insulting seeing other fans have a go at others for not being satisfied with having a club structure stuck in the 20th century while still masquerading as a big club in the 21st century as all of our contemporary big clubs have evolved and left us behind.

It's the apologists who make it so that the club never ever feel any real pressure to adapt and evolve because they're willing to lap up and applaud whatever forms of shit we get served up on the pitch, the only major fanbase in the world that does so unconditionally and our owners continuously feck the club over because of that false sense of moral superiority and being somehow better than other fanbases.

It'd be one thing to have that 'its just football, we have no right to win anything' sentiment if the product on the pitch was half decent but the football has been consistently terrible so even the romantics of the sport can't simply enjoy just watching the team like that anymore. Especially while our biggest rivals are playing some of the best and most exciting brands of football in the continent at the same time

 

[Ixion]

We came 2nd last year in the toughest league in the world.

You should go check out that press conference Ole did when he was at Molde where he said United finishing 2nd under Mourinho was not good enough

 

[HailtotheKing]

I think his post match words are more worrying than the celebration. And he’s acted like this a few times. He said “you’re always going to get criticism as Manchester United captain when your teams playing badly”

No Harry, it’s not just because you’re the captain it’s because YOU are playing badly.
And YOU are responsible for a lot of the goals that are causing the team to play badly.


He just doesn’t seem to take any selfresponsibility. I’ve heard him say stuff like that a few times after defeats. What he should have said is, I’ve been going through a tough time, haven’t been playing as well as I can for Manchester United, the emotions got to me for a minute but I hope this can be a turning point to getting back to how I played last season.

Then this whole celebration crap would’ve died down. But it appears he’s delusional about his form and carries little self responsibility. Worrying for your captain but a nice reflection of Ole. No wonder he made him captain.

 

[Rolaholic]

You should go check out that press conference Ole did when he was at Molde where he said United finishing 2nd under Mourinho was not good enough

Unfair to use the managers own words against him as we all know the goalposts are always moving under him

 

[Devil’s Trident]

We came 2nd last year in the toughest league in the world.

You know what the problem is? We have a load of spoilt, nostalgic fans who think just banging on about "high-standards" is enough to win Premier League titles.

Finishing 2nd to a City side who have had £5BN artificially poured in and every advantage in football does not make the players failures or disgraces.

We might not be THE best side around at the moment, Maguire might not be THE best centre half....but we are a very good side and Maguire is a very good centre half.

Nobody has a God-given right to win anything. The way the game is going, there's a possibility we never win a major trophy again. For most clubs, that's already a reality. You can either spend every minute whining about it, or just enjoy it for what it is.

Personally, I am lucky. I have seen United win every major trophy there is to win, and attended 99% of the home games during our period of dominance between 2005-2010. We're certainly never again going to be able to exert that level of dominance, it's over. Football as we know it/knew it is over. The game now is about who has the biggest resources and spending power. Look at the CL semi-finals last year...three plastic, oil clubs who without their billionaire owners would be lucky to win a pre-season tournament. Wait until Newcastle get going. I made my peace with that a long time ago.

I would suggest there's a few hundred on here need to sit down and reflect - "Am I enjoying this?", "is it healthy to be furious all of the time?", "is it healthy to 'hate' our players?", "is it healthy to want the team to lose so a former player is sacked as manager?", "is it healthy to be triggered by our captain celebrating a goal?".

Just try and enjoy it, its meant to be fun.

What an absolute pathetic post full of insolence , out of context and lies getting praised by many . It can be torn apart bit by bit easily, every lie and every accusation but then how will one enter the top reds folklore ?

 

[Rightnr]

Imagine your most successful/legendary manager being known for wanting to 'knock Liverpool off their fecking perch' and trying to claim those same fans that retain and demand that same standard, after 10 years of shite, are entitled.

And then to be congratulated for making sense. Absolute levels of cultism and worship of a narrative created by American leeches, so they can keep draining the club.

 

[JebelSherif]

Can't wait for the bellend to Lord it over San fecking Marino!Should relinquish the captaincy on his return to OT and hopefully be sold asap.

But to whom, I can’t think of any big characters at Utd. anymore.

 

[kouroux]

over those things and some of them react in their own way (like the way he celebrated).

It says a lot about his character that he thinks that scoring a goal in a thrashing of a shite team has countered this abuse you talk about.

That's the thing I don't get, you guys are assuming the exact true meaning of the celebration, like you are privy to Maguire mental's state. His football is average enough to be criticized, I don't need to psychoanalyze his goal celebrations.

 

[kouroux]

It's so true. Weird to see so much hate and vitriol directed towards our own players for something relatively innocuous. With fans like ours, we don't need rivals.

International football should also be used for fans as a way to take a step back from the constant criticism. Things are shit at the moment at Man Utd, do we really need to be pissed off at Maguire's stupid celebration ?