Wing Attack Plan R
Full Member
Out of the three who play regularly (him, Varane, Lindelof), he certainly is.Plays in front of an offensive goalkeeper for England.
He's literally not even the most "error-prone" centre back in the team.
Out of the three who play regularly (him, Varane, Lindelof), he certainly is.Plays in front of an offensive goalkeeper for England.
He's literally not even the most "error-prone" centre back in the team.
Lindelof is definitely at fault for more goals & chances then Maguire. Maybe you could argue it’s because he is easily bullied rather than making “errors” per se but generally speaking he’s nowhere near Maguire’s level.Out of the three who play regularly (him, Varane, Lindelof), he certainly is.
This is false, and an effect from your bias against Lindelof. I get it: you like Maguire and don't like Lindelof, that's a personal opinion and you're entitled to it.Lindelof is definitely at fault for more goals & chances then Maguire. Maybe you could argue it’s because he is easily bullied rather than making “errors” per se but generally speaking he’s nowhere near Maguire’s level.
Firstly, no idea where you've got the idea I don't like Lindelof from, I have never said any such thing. He's a good player and I do like him, he's not one I'd be looking to move on but the fact is once Maguire gets into form he is on a different level to Lindelof. And secondly, I said "at fault for" which is quite clearly different to mistakes (for example, West Brom's goal last season wouldn't technically count as an "error" but was horrendous defending). It's a bizarre article to claim Maguire was "calamitous" on Sunday (he was) but saying nothing about Lindelof who was no better, I guess they were both fortunate that Luke Shaw was one the pitch because otherwise they both would've been down for 0/10.This is false, and an effect from your bias against Lindelof. I get it: you like Maguire and don't like Lindelof, that's a personal opinion and you're entitled to it.
From the Guardian today:
When Harry Maguire is good he is excellent and when bad he can be amateurish in a way the very best centre-backs never are. Think Liverpool’s Virgil van Dijk or Manchester City’s Rúben Dias, whose errors are collectors’ items, and who are yet to be witnessed in farcical defensive mode when it really counts, as Maguire was in his calamitous outing against Liverpool on Sunday. In 7,164 minutes of Premier League play since joining in summer 2019 the (supposed) defensive linchpin has the highest error-leading-to-chance tally of Manchester United’s outfield players: seven. The maligned – and dropped for Raphaël Varane – Victor Lindelöf is not in the top four, and Maguire’s two mistakes leading to goals is again the most of any non-goalkeeper. Last term Maguire was a model of consistency. But this season he is back to the Maguire of his opening campaign: inconsistent on a consistent basis. Maybe Ole Gunnar Solskjær should consider that a match or two out of the XI would shake Maguire up.
Maguire makes FAR more mistakes than Lindelof. As you said, when Maguire is bad he is, really really bad. But at the same time some like to claim, when he's good, he's really really good. He isn't. He's been average to poor throughout his time at United. Only more recently are his mistakes becoming more glaringly obvious due to the whole team being poor but even in his first 2 seasons with United there have been so many things wrong with his performances that go unnoticed by many. He consistently lets balls come across the box when he should cut it out. He's always caught in no mans land, doesn't know when to attack the ball or stand off. He consistently steps out of defence in an attempt to win the ball, miss times his challenge and the attacker is straight past him leaving us wide open. He has to be the slowest CB in the league, he can never recover his position quick enough if a player does pass him. He's constantly out of position meaning Shaw or Lindelof/Varane have to cover the space and leave their own position. It's been painful to watch and more often than not we got away with it last season but he's finally now really being found out. He should be nowhere near the first 11.Firstly, no idea where you've got the idea I don't like Lindelof from, I have never said any such thing. He's a good player and I do like him, he's not one I'd be looking to move on but the fact is once Maguire gets into form he is on a different level to Lindelof. And secondly, I said "at fault for" which is quite clearly different to mistakes (for example, West Brom's goal last season wouldn't technically count as an "error" but was horrendous defending). It's a bizarre article to claim Maguire was "calamitous" on Sunday (he was) but saying nothing about Lindelof who was no better, I guess they were both fortunate that Luke Shaw was one the pitch because otherwise they both would've been down for 0/10.
The issue you have with is this, when Maguire is bad, he is really, really bad. And he has been dreadful since coming back from injury. I don't think anyone disputes that he shouldn't have been rushed back but that is more of a sign of the lack of trust the manager (rightly) has in Bailey/Lindelof as a pairing. Despite that article claiming he was a "model of consistency" last season, he started the season terribly and had to play himself into form. That's looking to be the case this season. He has a terrible relationship with the goalkeeper too which compounds matters.
Another person who doesn't understand the difference between "at fault for" and mistake/error despite it literally being explained in the post they have quoted.Maguire makes FAR more mistakes than Lindelof. As you said, when Maguire is bad he is, really really bad. But at the same time some like to claim, when he's good, he's really really good. He isn't. He's been average to poor throughout his time at United. Only more recently are his mistakes becoming more glaringly obvious due to the whole team being poor but even in his first 2 seasons with United there have been so many things wrong with his performances that go unnoticed by many. He consistently lets balls come across the box when he should cut it out. He's always caught in no mans land, doesn't know when to attack the ball or stand off. He consistently steps out of defence in an attempt to win the ball, miss times his challenge and the attacker is straight past him leaving us wide open. He has to be the slowest CB in the league, he can never recover his position quick enough if a player does pass him. He's constantly out of position meaning Shaw or Lindelof/Varane have to cover the space and leave their own position. It's been painful to watch and more often than not we got away with it last season but he's finally now really being found out. He should be nowhere near the first 11.
So it’s DdGs fault his crap?Another person who doesn't understand the difference between "at fault for" and mistake/error despite it literally being explained in the post they have quoted.
Bolded - as I've said multiple times, zero relationship between him and DDG. Watch the instinctive look to the goalkeeper when those balls come into the box, this is not something unique to Maguire by the way. There is a reason he is far better in front of Pickford, Henderson, Schmeichel etc and it is painfully obvious that he will needs an offensive goalkeeper behind him both in and out of possession.
As for the other points, it's pretty clear you have your opinion and it's not going to change. I'm so glad our results have been so strong when he's dropped out of the team over the past couple of years to support your viewpoint that he is the root of all our problems.
Not this season he's not.Lindelof is definitely at fault for more goals & chances then Maguire. Maybe you could argue it’s because he is easily bullied rather than making “errors” per se but generally speaking he’s nowhere near Maguire’s level.
Not at all. He has been shite this season as I’ve said multiple times. I don’t think we will see the best of him in front of DDG personally because of the reasons I’ve explained but that’s no defence of the performances this year. I don’t think he should be playing as he still looks miles away from fitness but again, that circles back to Oles lack of faith in Bailey/Lindelof as a pair.So it’s DdGs fault his crap?
Defensive structure starts with the keeper and works it's out the pitch. DDG should be controlling the be back 4 and Maguire should be marshalling the defence and the players in front of him. It's pretty much both their fault the whole defence is crap.So it’s DdGs fault his crap?
Stop compare England and United! Jesus. And he playes with two other DC and two dm. Everyone can look good for their national teams!Another person who doesn't understand the difference between "at fault for" and mistake/error despite it literally being explained in the post they have quoted.
Bolded - as I've said multiple times, zero relationship between him and DDG. Watch the instinctive look to the goalkeeper when those balls come into the box, this is not something unique to Maguire by the way. There is a reason he is far better in front of Pickford, Henderson, Schmeichel etc and it is painfully obvious that he will needs an offensive goalkeeper behind him both in and out of possession.
As for the other points, it's pretty clear you have your opinion and it's not going to change. I'm so glad our results have been so strong when he's dropped out of the team over the past couple of years to support your viewpoint that he is the root of all our problems.
Bailly and Lindelof were fine in the EL final overallI think people over react either way when it comes to him. Truth probably lies in the middle
He was missed for us at the end of last season and especially the final
However rushing him back was a move that has back fired immensely on Ole. Was this done due to varanes injury? Guessing Ole didn't trust bailly at all that he would rather a half fit Maguire?
Stinking up the place? Rashford was our second top scorer last season and it was his second straight season scoring 20 or more goals in all competitions. He also got 11 assists. No one has scored more than him under Solskjaer's reign, over 50 goalsI don't recall people wanting Pogba to fail...I was at his 2nd home debut, crowd absolutely loved him.
Plus...relegation fighting Leicester? Not whilst Maguire was in the team
Also, how come when Rashford stinks the place out for best part of 18 months, it's because he has been "carrying a knock" and we're wrong to criticise him. Maguire soldiers on with a calf injury, clearly not fit, in a suicidal tactical set-up and it's "Maguire needs to be replaced". It baffles me. If I was Maguire I would be tempted to do what most players would do and sack it off, "sorry boss, I'm injured"...let's see how much better we do with Bailly and Lindelof
Glad we're on the same page buddy.Desert Eagle. Yes. Great. Maguire, the new scapegoat. Fantastic. Obviously no scarcity of imaginative ideas in your department. Where would the Caf be without posters of your calibre?
And to top it all off we made him captain almost immediately.We spent £80m on a player with one of the worst CV's in football.
Relegated 4 times as a player - 3 of those with league-high goals conceded. He's lost 7 semi-finals, conceding 22 goals and scoring 2 own goals. The only time a club he's been with has won a semi-final has happened with Maguire warming the bench.
Since he came here we've set records for most goals conceded in a season at home in the PL era, longest run without a clean sheet in 48 years (Dec 2019), longest home run without a clean sheet in 50 years (currently ongoing) and most goals ever conceded in a CL group stage.
He has glaring athletic weaknesses which will only get worse, and he'll be 29 in a few months. His 'window' is fast running out.
Any way you look at it, it's one of the worst transfers in football history.
Well he’s improved his league position every season and got two consecutive top 3 finishes something we haven’t done since SAF left.defence conceeded more than Arsenal and Liverpool. didn't win any individual awards and never properly organised the defence. we conceded most from set pieces in the league. What did he do well?
literally the worst captain. does not lead by example nor inspire the team or defence. Looks as lost as the others when we need someone to turn to. The role is too big for him. Fails to organise the defence and crashes into teammates. Too soft
You can't play a high line without a keeper that sweeps up.I'm not sure you can press the way a top team needs to press these days with Harry Maguire. Can't play a high line with him in the team.
oh please. 66 pts and 74 pts is nothing to write home about and shows a lack of real comp (in normal seasons that would get anywhere from 6th-3rd). we got more points and conceded less goals in both Jose full seasons (2017,2018). This was false hope and people underestimated the COVID impact, lack of fans and our actual poor performances. We also crashed out of our CL group. It was only a matter of time for the chickens to come home to roost as our rivals would bounce back to being 90+ point teams which we were far from.Well he’s improved his league position every season and got two consecutive top 3 finishes something we haven’t done since SAF left.
Our spoilt fans won’t recognise this.
This season it’s not good enough, a resolution must be found, I actually think we will improve. He needs to find big big balls though.
I know the difference, and Maguire is 9 times out of 10 at fault and they are his errors. When I speak of Maguire letting balls across the box, in the majority of cases it's low balls and balls at the near post, absolutely nothing to do with the goalkeeper. These are balls that should be cut out before the goalkeeper is even contemplating any involvement.Another person who doesn't understand the difference between "at fault for" and mistake/error despite it literally being explained in the post they have quoted.
Bolded - as I've said multiple times, zero relationship between him and DDG. Watch the instinctive look to the goalkeeper when those balls come into the box, this is not something unique to Maguire by the way. There is a reason he is far better in front of Pickford, Henderson, Schmeichel etc and it is painfully obvious that he will needs an offensive goalkeeper behind him both in and out of possession.
As for the other points, it's pretty clear you have your opinion and it's not going to change. I'm so glad our results have been so strong when he's dropped out of the team over the past couple of years to support your viewpoint that he is the root of all our problems.
Low balls inside the 6 yard box & near post balls are absolutely the responsibility of a goalkeeper.I know the difference, and Maguire is 9 times out of 10 at fault and they are his errors. When I speak of Maguire letting balls across the box, in the majority of cases it's low balls and balls at the near post, absolutely nothing to do with the goalkeeper. These are balls that should be cut out before the goalkeeper is even contemplating any involvement.
Where did I say inside the 6 yard box? Stop twisting what people say to suit your argument. Maguire is absolutely woeful and we'll never win anything with him as our captain and him at CB.Low balls inside the 6 yard box & near post balls are absolutely the responsibility of a goalkeeper.
Lindelof, Bailly, literally ay CB at the club is better. It's a farce he still plays at this point. We only need 5 at the back BECAUSE of Maguire being so poor and constantly being caught out of position.I’m not sure he needs to be dropped as a permanent starter, cause I don’t see anyone aside from Varane that is all around better than him.
However, it does seem that he needs to be carried, currently playing with 2 CB partners and 2 holding midfielders to protect his deficiencies.
It’s pretty dire for an “elite” CB.
I think the quicker we accept that he is not elite and take him for what he is (above average defender who can have good spells and really bad spells) the quicker we can move forward as a team.