Jones, Smalling and Rojo are all sicknotes. KDB/Sane/Sterling/Silva aren't. There was a definite need for Lindelof for us.
Manchester City under Pep Guardiola | Pep on City v Liverpool ref: "He likes to be special"
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And Van Gaal didn't? Outcome is different to intention.
We were in the EL because the previous manager failed. You win what in front of you. EL schedule hinder league progress that has always been the case. So at one time during last season, challenging for the league was not possible, so trying to win the trophy is better option than other CL qualification position trophy. Embarassment is reserved for those who see the competition under them, yet winning nothing. Embarassment is reserved for who keep their strength for other competition yet in those competition they're still far from challenging for anything.
If winning EL was so easy why Tottenham went out to that Belgium club?
Pelegrín final season went to semi final in CL and lost to the eventual winner. In a sense that City team is not far from getting there. And this so called upgraded Pep team actually regressed. So the previous manager failed to give Mourinho a better position to start, while Pellegrini succceeded. Mourinho made his success however you downplaying it.
It's been rich to use this window rate for last summer window, when Pogba got bashed all season for his price despite it's relative good price now. 16m for Bravo was expensive as he was in top 5 most expensive GK IIRC when he moved. So after a year, that expensive GK failure is being swept under the carpet as not that expensive, with a record fee for another GK. That position #1 City spend the money 2 times under Pep. Nolito flopped, now City adding Bernardo Silva for that creative dribbling attacker position after a year. That's #2.
How do people expect a player to justify the fee in one (first) year? Let take Ronaldo to Real Madrid as example. His transfer broke the previous previous record fee significantly. He didn't exactly improve the team achievement, position in his first year. Individually he was way overshadowed by Messi. Did he improve the team? Yes. Did he perform well? Yes he did. Just that people expected something impossible for one player to do since the competition is team(s), not individual in same team. Over his initial contract with Real Madrid, he eventually justified his fee, despite he didn't win CL during those years. For those who advocate for league is better measurement for team consistency, then those should take heed wha they write that winning La Liga like that against Pep Barcelona is tougher than winning the CL, right?
Pogba may not meet impatient expectation for somebody, but was he that bad? He did improve the team, and the team did achieve however, somebody try to downplay. He was paid for the length of the contract. The club didn't pay more for first year!
So go full circle, you brought up Lukaku deal this summer which has to go with current market rate. If we were to buy Lukaku last summer for this same fee, then that's different story. Remember we rid Rooney to Everton as part of the deal. The guy just helped took 2 point of City. Rooney wage was off loaded, so lessen part of Lukaku fee too.
You seem to have a habit of biting your own ass didn't you? LVG got undone by West Ham. LVG United in that same season for most part was around the similar position to West Ham. that West Ham was not all that bad. Mourinho pretty had to built up from that level.
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Because neither team really played to win it. You guys only really took it serious when you got to the last 8 and your league season started to slip away. Still I'm pretty sure I said while being in it is a failure, you will look back on it not only as a low point but as the start of Jose fixing things no? The last line of your post makes no sense... do you understand the word embarrassment? An embarrassment is something you feel shame over. Having a club thats above the europa league is not an embarrassment, unfortunately in England there are 6 clubs who should be in CL but for 2 of them that shame is coming every season.We were in the EL because the previous manager failed. You win what in front of you. EL schedule hinder league progress that has always been the case. So at one time during last season, challenging for the league was not possible, so trying to win the trophy is better option than other CL qualification position trophy. Embarassment is reserved for those who see the competition under them, yet winning nothing. Embarassment is reserved for who keep their strength for other competition yet in those competition they're still far from challenging for anything.
If winning EL was so easy why Tottenham went out to that Belgium club?
Pelegrín final season went to semi final in CL and lost to the eventual winner. In a sense that City team is not far from getting there. And this so called upgraded Pep team actually regressed. So the previous manager failed to give Mourinho a better position to start, while Pellegrini succceeded. Mourinho made his success however you downplaying it.
It's been rich to use this window rate for last summer window, when Pogba got bashed all season for his price despite it's relative good price now. 16m for Bravo was expensive as he was in top 5 most expensive GK IIRC when he moved. So after a year, that expensive GK failure is being swept under the carpet as not that expensive, with a record fee for another GK. That position #1 City spend the money 2 times under Pep. Nolito flopped, now City adding Bernardo Silva for that creative dribbling attacker position after a year. That's #2.
How do people expect a player to justify the fee in one (first) year? Let take Ronaldo to Real Madrid as example. His transfer broke the previous previous record fee significantly. He didn't exactly improve the team achievement, position in his first year. Individually he was way overshadowed by Messi. Did he improve the team? Yes. Did he perform well? Yes he did. Just that people expected something impossible for one player to do since the competition is team(s), not individual in same team. Over his initial contract with Real Madrid, he eventually justified his fee, despite he didn't win CL during those years. For those who advocate for league is better measurement for team consistency, then those should take heed wha they write that winning La Liga like that against Pep Barcelona is tougher than winning the CL, right?
Pogba may not meet impatient expectation for somebody, but was he that bad? He did improve the team, and the team did achieve however, somebody try to downplay. He was paid for the length of the contract. The club didn't pay more for first year!
So go full circle, you brought up Lukaku deal this summer which has to go with current market rate. If we were to buy Lukaku last summer for this same fee, then that's different story. Remember we rid Rooney to Everton as part of the deal. The guy just helped took 2 point of City. Rooney wage was off loaded, so lessen part of Lukaku fee too.
You seem to have a habit of biting your own ass didn't you? LVG got undone by West Ham. LVG United in that same season for most part was around the similar position to West Ham. that West Ham was not all that bad. Mourinho pretty had to built up from that level.
Do you really think Spurs took the EL seriously? Did you guys before the last 8.
Bravo's deal has not been swept under the carpet, I think you'll not find a single person who said anything other than he was a flop, but you can say what you want the fee was sweet feck all in the modern market. If you think Bernado Silva is a replacement for Nolito than eh.. you know sweet feck all about football. Nolito is a left winger, Silva plays on the right or as a no.10. I think you'll find Silva is in the squad in a completely different role and position but given some of your logic I hope you can understand instead of making stuff up.
Plenty of players have justified their fee in the first year (Lukaku for example is off to a good start, KDB, Martial, Bailly, Jesus) and plenty haven't. I think you'll find that whole paragraph you typed on Pogba is pretty much what I said if you actually paid any attention while reading. My almost exact words (Last season he didn't justify his price but he's showing signs he will and if he stays with you for many years he will. So your idiocy is you arguing with me by agreeing with me? Really, hows that work?
Are you actually really comparing Pogba's first season at United to Ronaldo's at Madrid? Really? Ronaldo scored 33 goals in 35 games. He hit the ground running, he totally justified his fee (now your beating yourself with your own stick). If you think Ronaldo needed years to justify his fee, well you should give up on watching football. Just because he was overshadowed by Messi doesn't mean he didn't justify his fee.
Who said the club paid for his first year or he played bad? Now you are making stuff up completely. I simply said Pogba didn't justify or look a £90m player last season, but I also said he would and the deal would look cheap. So you obviously didn't read what I said and spent 3 paragraphs ranting shite while trying to argue with me to defend your player by agreeing with exactly what I said.
The Lukaku argument lol. Your moving goalposts, so you're making one excuse for £90m Pogba and another for potentially £85m Lukaku. The reality is they are both good footballers like every other other footballer who went for crazy prices not a United problem or even a mistake as I said so I don't know what you're trying to defend. No one criticised United for it, I simply said whether these players turn out to be value for money or not will be decided in the future by how they perform which was only backing up what I said about Pogba.
Again not a criticism but your inability to read apparently turned that into something you were trying to justify, what doesn't that logic apply to Bernado Silva, lets see he cost half a Lukaku and came in on the same wages as Jesus Navas who he actually replaced.. but your logic on that one only applies to United when justifying high fees right?
Biting your own ass, what does that even mean. Given that comment and your lack of understanding of plain english and the fact your spent 3/4 of your post arguing with something I didn't say or soemthing your agreeing with plus the United bias I'd say this suggests your about 12.
LVG got done by West Ham, Jose had to build from there? Are you really saying United were on a par with West Ham? I'm pretty sure ye finished the season 5th and only lost out to City on goal difference. Jose had to build off a 5th place team with 66 points, Pep off a 4th place team with 66 points. I swear that was probably the dumbest post I've ever responded to on here. Heres a quick summary..
1 - You don't understand the word embarrassment
2 - Spurs tried to win the EL
3 - You argued with me by agreeing with me for 2 paragraphs.
4 - You argued with me about something you imagined I said or misread.
5 - You wrote "biting your own ass"
6 - You said Man United team who finished with 66 points were on a par with West Ham.
7 - Man United and West Ham ffs....
8 - I'm still in shock over West Ham
9 - Yet you somehow believe a City team who scored only the same number of points should do better? Logic...
Don't want to take part in all the rambling as it's too huge to read but Spurs took it seriously and you can check the teams that started in both games against Gent.
Come on. Spurs did field a good XI but anyone who watched a single game could tell they put sweet feck all into it. Btw I'm not criticizing you for winning it, I'm just saying even you guys didn't take it seriously until near the end. Even after the 0-0 at the Etihad, you were in a position to finish above Liverpool and most people on here wanted to focus on the prem. That was match day 32 or 33 if I'm not mistaken, and it was only really after that you guys gave up on the prem and turned your focus to it.
Had they progressed to the business end like you did I have no doubt they'd have played to win it like you guys. But can you honestly say it was of any importance to you at the start? You played strong teams too yet you lost to Feyenoord and came 2nd in a group to Fenerbache. What would happen if you ever had a CL group with the same teams? You'd top that group with 0 losses and your players would be alot more invested in it.
Spurs took it seriously otherwise they would have played youngsters. Alli even acted like cnut.
They didn't and neither did you but we'll have to agree to disagree. Its a competition English clubs in particular played half hearted imho and don't care about and I'll never be convinced on anything else. Alli always acts the cnut, I'm pretty sure he'd act that way playing with his grandma in the back garden as would most footballers.
Yeah didn't take seriously do they played their first team rather than youngsters. ManUtd didn't take seriously but still played full strength team from first KO round. You are just trying to rewrite history.
Theres alot more than just the names of the XI on the pitch to consider, the actual effort they put in being another thing. I'm not rewriting anything I'm simply calling it as I saw it. The Europa only became important towards the end. It's not rewriting anything, to say Jose or Poch were all about winning it is no possible to prove but I'll judge off the performances I witnessed and what the team s are capable of.
I mentioned it last season and it's still a case for me - I feared Pellegrini's City more than Pep's.
Yeah managers just name their first 11 for fun isn't it where there is a risk of injuries and fatigue.
There was a time under Mancini when City's team was nowhere near as good on paper as it is today but they were so bloody hard to beat. That defense would soak up anything thrown at it and they'd score a decent amount of goals.
PL should have 6 teams in CL. Having a laugh? 3 of them never lifted the trophy for once and 2 of those seems like never try to go all the way. That's is embarassment right there. Tottenham rested players for the game with Chelsea. Sure their chance to progress was narrow, but it's telling their ambition. That's embarassment right there. Robbed and other Bayern players remark when Bayern having Arsenal as their opponent. Arsenal is a joke of a CL club for them. That's embarrassment right there. Are you sure you know what embarrassment is? Genuine question.
@roonster09 already have answer for you for this part about Tottenham fielding their strong team, yet got kicked out. It was not easy after all. Always the same downplaying whenever our club achieved something. Just how RAWK had a their annual worst PL season whenever United lifted the trophy under SAF...
Before calling out other about not knowing football, then just go by mere position, not role, you exposed yourself knowing nothing. Bernardo Silva & Nolito are both players who attack/exploit the pocket of space. They may not start same role, but has the same role with other player to stay more wide. Trying to downplay Bravo fee when he initially moved using this summer rate is sweeping under the carpet, mate. Clubs must have been ripped off for years with previous world transfer fee since they could have got more like 200+m nowadays. There were better players than Neymar in the past surely?
You must not be serious if you took Ronaldo example I made as like for like comparison?! Please read along the lines, mate. Ronaldo scored that good amount of goal but what Real Madrid achieved that season more than the previous one without Ronaldo? That season Ronaldo was labelled as flat track bully and big player in small games for a reason. Even Messi divided opinion that season since people argued Sneijder, Xavi, Iniesta contributed more for their club & their national teams, let alone Ronaldo was convincingly beaten and schooled in You seem like all caring about mere numbers/stats and hardly touched on the context of the situation. Bravo was first and now this. My point with Ronaldo case was he didn't justify his fee. The team position didn't improve. Still miles off Barcelona in La Liga. Same old humiliatingly got knocked off early in CL. He couldn't score more because the team ain't progressing that much in Cup competitions. Ronaldo won Best Player award before, but ended up miles off in Best player award (not even made top 3) after the first season. Let me remind you again Ronaldo transfer fee in context was significantly more expensive than previous one. The expectation at the time was much more than the revisionism now. People were writing off Ronaldo transfer as stupid as he ventured too close to Messi and would never see the sun light (of winning Best Player award) again.
How on earth Jesus & Bailly justified their fee but not Pogba? Here relation between expectation with the fee. Since you love isolated off context numbers so much, let check KDB first season at City: 10 goals & 9 assists in PL & CL playing in an attacking position. Pogba yielded 8 goals and 4 assists in PL & EL in position where he does more defensive work. Without context, look like KDB was superior player right like you want to think right? Pogba had 9 MOTM compared to KDB's 5 (Stats from Whoscored). Hmm, seems like just because Pogba was world record, then there seems to be different parameter to judge him.
Martial had a great first season, but meh second one. So what was your point again? First season in the contract should be judged harshly because of the fee? Was not my point was about the fee should be justified over the course of the contract length?
Bernado Silva half the price, and you told me I can't read
. Everyone know English media didn't report the addon for Bernado Silva while adding every fine line into certain deal. Perhaps, I can't read with one eye closed. I give you that.Moving goal post between Pogba and Lukaku fee?
One was the most expensive player the year before. One was not even half the fee the current most expensive player...City was in CL semi, playing against a top top team, and was in CL qualification positions all season (never once got out top 4). Just because one team was always in control and could afford slow down and doesn't mean there was competitiveness. Same season, Arsenal finished above Tottenham despite Tottenham was supposed to the team to chase Leicester, and Arsenal fan had meltdown after meltdown. Again you always tried to avoid context.
You tried to be ignorant to miss the point on purpose, didn't you? You know clearly I am talking about LVG failure that we were stuck around West Ham (in a good season) level all season. In the end, LVG missed out CL football for EL which West Ham also got qualification for. Try to avoid context as you can. GD can separate a Champion from challenger, of course it could separate CL qualification from EL qualification. It's clearly showing how much LVG failed that season. Playing in CL is differently better than playing in EL, that's not even a debate. Don't move the goal post mate. Heed what you preach.
The same old "age" & "language" insult.
Someone need to grow up.
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Pellegrini had peak Yaya Toure, who was an absolute machine. In 13/14 he scored 20 league goals and provided 9 league assists from central midfield.
Not to mention younger Kompany, Aguero and Silva, etc.
You're just proving his point.
I think this City has the capacity to be devastating if it all clicks, I'm honestly not sure if Pep will do it though.
Bournemouth 1:2 Man City
His antics on the sidelines, constant whingeing and sarcastic interviews show that he's cracking up. He's under immense pressure to deliver this season. He's a man on edge.
I refuse to accept him as some sort of footballing genius. He's been exposed in this league. He's nowhere near the manager he's made out to be.
Utterly classless from him goading Howe at the end as well.
I doubt the FA will do anything about him barking at the fourth official all day, because its Pep.
I refuse to accept him as some sort of footballing genius. He's been exposed in this league. He's nowhere near the manager he's made out to be.
Utterly classless from him goading Howe at the end as well.
I doubt the FA will do anything about him barking at the fourth official all day, because its Pep.
He was a Barca man his whole live, and ended up walking away because he lost his bottle. Shows the character of the man. He's the type of cnut who rage quits on Fifa.
It's hilarious seeing Man United fans criticize City/Guardiola for winning games with a last minute goal when you trademarked Fergie Time 
Taunting Howe after the winner, pure lack of class.
What a cnut.
They do not look impressive. I'm not scared of them in the slightest at present though I do suspect they'll improve soon.
Why does he keep playing De Bruyne deeper? The guy is devastating in the oppo's final third.
Pep acted like a complete twat, Howe is a very nice manager, lot of potential as well as being very frank in his interviews. Overall, I like him a lot.
That is not why people are criticizing him.It's hilarious seeing Man United fans criticize City/Guardiola for winning games with a last minute goal when you trademarked Fergie Time
But we have zero clue of what happened between them on the sideline do we? Whose to say Howe didn't start on Pep for nagging at the 4th official?
Saves the game and keeps restarting on auto play until he wins.
Their CB's are really suspect. Part of is down to the system, sure, but Kompany is a shell of himself whilst Otamendi/Stones are just not good.
It's a good job they have the footballing genius, Sterling!
I know he's fecking shite.
I know he's fecking shite.
Wrong try again.It's hilarious seeing Man United fans criticize City/Guardiola for winning games with a last minute goal when you trademarked Fergie Time
When you consider his antics on the touchline, Pep seems to be immune to criticism
They're not playing particularly well but 7 points in 3 games is not a bad haul. The team has too much talent not to click and go on a run at some point. City will be thereabouts at the end of the season.
I'm seeing upset Man United fans all over Twitter and reddit. It's not in my head
I'd be very upset if I was a Bournmouth fan.
Pep = Classless
Howe has more credibility in his left elbow than Pep possesses in his entire privileged managerial career.
Pep = Classless
Howe has more credibility in his left elbow than Pep possesses in his entire privileged managerial career.
He seems to have attained a certain level of protectionism from the press that has only historically been awarded to the entire Liverpool football team, their managers, fans and players past.
By that reasoning, there is no need for fans to ever give an opinion, as they usually have no clue about many things that happen during the game.
In the end, we can only comment on what was seen, and Pep was acting like a twat. I am not being biased either, if Mourinho had done that, I would have called him out for being a twat as well.
Context is everything, those goals were celebrated because we were usually involved in a title challenge and would help us take a step closer to that goal. Not a last minute goal against relegation threat Bournemouth 3rd game of the season.It's hilarious seeing Man United fans criticize City/Guardiola for winning games with a last minute goal when you trademarked Fergie Time
Pep was being a twat indeed, but so was Howe. Just because Howe is usually a nice guys doesn't mean he was in this situation. Its was a very dirty natured game in reality, some nasty goings on. I'd say they were both wound up and was I in Howe's shoes and the other manager constantly at the 4th official I'd feel like hitting him (I often do with Jose) but that would still be me starting the aggro between myself and the other guy. The 4th official was well able to handle Pep.
Who caused it? I don't know but Pep was indeed being a cnut today.
Is there a video of Pep goading Howe?
Yep, that's all I was pointing out. No idea who started it, but Pep looked to be in a bad mood.