Hammerfell
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You adore Mourinho, don’t you?Sounds like José has lost another friend.
You adore Mourinho, don’t you?Sounds like José has lost another friend.
Big fan.You adore Mourinho, don’t you?
This does my absolute head in. It came when he was in charge; he was working with Giggs and keeping an eye on the reserves - managing to go for a winger & playing him as a St who was scoring crazy consistent in his first games.LVG indeed got us Martial, but I wouldn't be so quick to credit him for Rashford. It's not like he took a chance and played some kid out of the blue. Everyone was injured. His hand was forced to bring up someone from the reserves. It had gotten so bad that the game before Rashford was brought up Depay was our starting striker. But that's going to happen when the only strikers in the team at the time were Rooney and Falcao. LVG got rid of RVP, Welbeck and Chicharito as well as sending Wilson out on loan. So with Rooney and Falcao out he had to call up someone...
Agreed, I don't have a problem with crediting LVG with some things and don't see why others can't do likewise while still disliking the football he produced in those two years and being glad he's gone.This does my absolute head in. It came when he was in charge; he was working with Giggs and keeping an eye on the reserves - managing to go for a winger & playing him as a St who was scoring crazy consistent in his first games.
LVG cpuld have played anyone there but he didn't okay? He picked Rashford & deserves some respect for that.
I bet he's losing a lot of sleep over it.Sounds like José has lost another friend.
You are joking, but I am serious. They used to be friends.I bet he's losing a lot of sleep over it.
I don't know who these "vast majority" are but IMO the only boring football I know is parking the bus and hoofing it long without having any plan for a decent counter attack.We were much more boring to watch during his tenure at the club and he knows it. Ask any fan out there to tell you what he considers to be boring football and the vast majority will tell you that it is synonymous to utter incompetence in the final third.
It was disrespectful but it also the hard truth. LvG had an awful effect on some of our players, he drilled in his philosophy so much like for example telling our attackers to always take a touch before shooting and he gave Herrera a bollocking for bombing forward and scoring a goal. Mourinho said when he first arrived that he would've rather have worked with a blank squad that hadn't been giving strict instructions for two years and basically the squad was low on confidence. I think any manager would've felt the same. I like LvG had some good laughs with him as manager and we won our first post Fergie trophy under him but in the end he did a lot of damage that was always going to take time to fix. I doubt Mourinho meant to hurt him with them comments he was just being too honest and was probably frustrated with what he was left with. And I doubt he really cares what LvG thinks. People have said worse things about each other.You are joking, but I am serious. They used to be friends.
I don't know obviously, maybe this means nothing and they're completely fine behind the scenes. But I feel as if this public barb by LvG would not happen without the things Mourinho said when he took over Utd, which were pretty disrespectful towards van Gaal and suprisingly so given the good relation between the two.
If you believe that we have scored 36 goals in 16 league games and 53 goals in 24 matches thus far in the season by just hoofing the ball, i have nothing more to tell you. There are full matches available on YT and other sites from the LvG era. Feel free to watch them since you find them more entertaining.I don't know who these "vast majority" are but IMO the only boring football I know is parking the bus and hoofing it long without having any plan for a decent counter attack.
I am biased towards LVG because I saw the things the way you saw it & your post is great. It was hard to see but he was defending as a team mostly by possession & attacking was the final thing supposed to be done in the same way.Don't think lvg deserves the criticism at all really.
It was nice for once to watch a United team who could pass the ball around and control the game. I mean im sorry but we could barely string a few passes together on Sunday it was quite sad. The downside was that to completely change to a pass and control heavy "philosophy" it takes a good amount of time to break down habits and learn new ones. I still maintain he was on the right track and was closer to it all coming together than most people give him credit for. We were in the top 3 best defenses in the PL if not the very best can't remember. Our record against the top teams was superb.
The only thing lacking was the goals and attacking consistency. To me this was the final part of philosophy and hardest to get right and implement. I remember those years quite clearly and although we didnt create a huge volume of chances, clear cut chances were created every game and we failed to take advantage. Our finishing was diabolical really. Not sure what went on behind the scenes in regards to the striker position but it would have been nice to get a Lukaku type player then. We took a calculated gamble on Falcao (which any manager would have done) and it didn't come off, made Di Maria a huge signing and he wasn't up for it and Rooney and RVP continued to regress. Marcus and Martial were just too raw to be the focal points yet. I was mad at first about the Welbeck sale but its looking more like it was the right move. I certainly wasnt mad about Hernandez going. I guess that would be my biggest criticism of LVG that he didn't get an established big name striker in to bang in the goals against the average teams we couldn't beat. Still think he was a fantastic coach and was kind of sad to see him go.
Yeah, maybe a bit tongue in cheek - but 35% possession against City at home with one real chance in the game is disappointing. And this is no one-off. LVG had his moments as well and his results against the bigger teams was very good.Are you kidding? Do you remember playing League 1 Sheffield United at home and people cheering for Memphis' shanked shot after 70 odd minutes because nothing else had happened all match?
Under Van Gaal we would go HOURS without any goals. Without even any shots at goal. There were a string of 0-0s in December 2015. It was the most tedious football I've ever seen.
Jose's a counter attacking manager, he does surrender territory and try to hit on the break. He ain't that though. That was mind numbing.
I don't think anyone is making out we played wonderfully on Sunday, just that Van Gaal criticising Jose for boring football is like the sea calling a river wet. Its laughable.Yeah, maybe a bit tongue in cheek - but 35% possession against City at home with one real chance in the game is disappointing. And this is no one-off. LVG had his moments as well and his results against the bigger teams was very good.
No way - I don't like bigging up Pep; but his intent on possession, passing & positioning is not that different to LVG's & when he wanted the players to take a touch before passing was restricting individual movement for the benefit of movement as a team & gaining the right positioning as a team as well.It was disrespectful but it also the hard truth. LvG had an awful effect on some of our players, he drilled in his philosophy so much like for example telling our attackers to always take a touch before shooting and he gave Herrera a bollocking for bombing forward and scoring a goal. Mourinho said when he first arrived that he would've rather have worked with a blank squad that hadn't been giving strict instructions for two years and basically the squad was low on confidence. I think any manager would've felt the same. I like LvG had some good laughs with him as manager and we won our first post Fergie trophy under him but in the end he did a lot of damage that was always going to take time to fix. I doubt Mourinho meant to hurt him with them comments he was just being too honest and was probably frustrated with what he was left with. And I doubt he really cares what LvG thinks. People have said worse things about each other.
Yeah I can understand. Its damn difficult to close a 11 point gap and that too when city know how to win ugly. But what we don't know is how will they handle a loss. Lets see how they will play against Spurs and Liverpool away.Too late now. They can lose three in a row before they're under any pressure. It's over. We had a chance on Sunday, even without Pogba, and fluffed our lines.
I agree with pretty much all of this. For your reference it’s spelt Midtjylland and I’m pretty sure Will Keane was supposed to start but got injured in the warm up.Again, we had 2 strikers. That's it. And they were both hurt. And before he decided to give Rashford a call he did exactly what you said other managers would do and played an experienced player ahead of him. Rooney and Falcao were out so he played Depay as a striker. That didn't work, so we then had a game against Mitijhad (spelling?) in the Europa League where Martial was lined up to start up front and he got hurt too. So LVG had no choice but to start Rashford and he scored twice. We played Arsenal a couple days later and with everybody out and Rashford doing so well in his debut that he was forced to start in, it was a no brainer to start Rashford again. But don't think for a second that if it weren't for the injuries that Rashford still would have gotten his chance. LVG was very willing to start youngsters at FB. We saw a bunch of kids play there. But not at other positions. His hand was forced here, but he will be the first person to take credit for Rashford...
Tactically, perhaps not. But he would still have gone on to break the bank in order to buy a proper midfield, ball playing centre-halves and full-backs that can contribute in the attacking half. After all, LvG himself claimed in his comments that he had reached this squad's ceiling and that this was as good as it would get with them and this particular style of football.No way - I don't like bigging up Pep; but his intent on possession, passing & positioning is not that different to LVG's & when he wanted the players to take a touch before passing was restricting individual movement for the benefit of movement as a team & gaining the right positioning as a team as well.
You go back to what Henry said half way through our game; it was obvious that City did that & valued being in the right position & to attack in a formation.
Pep would have undone the unnecessary restrictions & kept the most important parts of it the same. Coupled with things like inside forwards playing as strikers - the movement & play of sterling, jesus & sane won't have been too hard to replicate here with Rashford, martial & possibly Lingard whilst adding some of his own players too.
Pep wouldn't have preferred a blank canvas over LVG's left overs.
Football is getting boring, saying that United are one of the more boring sides.LVG's United was boring and Mourinho's United is too, not to the same extent but United's fans aren't given a great time.
PS: It might be me though because in 2017 I have been bored by almost every teams.
Keep hearing this. The only reason LvG got results against the top 5 was when they were weak. Like Liverpool when Rodgers was under pressure, an underperforming City that did their best to bottle Top 4 and failed only because we were worse and so on. A deflected lucky goal against Klopp's Liverpool in the league. Draws with a Chelsea team in free-fall in 2015/16.LVG had his moments as well and his results against the bigger teams was very good.
Unlike Jose, who loses all the Big Games.Say what you want about the guy, he had a cracking record again the top teams.
Moyes was just out of his depth managing a club the size of Manchester United.And LVG got us Martial and promoted Rashford.
I would argue it was Moyes' lack of decision making and not taking advice, plus his negativity that's set us back. Even Jose is finding it difficult to some extent. It's not easy coming out of the slump that Moyes put us in. Yes, LVG didn't work out, but there's no way he was as bad as Moyes.
Also, most fans wanted us to have a clear out and LVG did it. Can hardly throw that in his face. You can only blame him for some of his signings and his crazy Rooney obsession, and rightly so.
Yep. Pretty much the only good thing about his tenure aside from an FA Cup, bringing through Rashford and signing Martial.Say what you want about the guy, he had a cracking record again the top teams.
But can't you see? The "intent" was there, if he could change about 1 million little details we would be as entertaining as City are now. Because... philosophy. It's strange reading this thread. I wonder were some of our fans on here were when KinderBueno, Cadbury, or whatever his username was, was fighting a lonely battle on this forum back in December of 2015.Tweet
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