Gaming Matchmaking in some games

[Solius]

Does anyone find it to be really annoying? I’m never the best player in the world of course but when I play any game online they all seem to follow the same path.

1. New to the game/haven’t played in a while

In this stage everything is fine. Everyone is learning. If you make mistakes it’s fine.

2. Getting used to the game.

Decent at it. Actually really fun and enjoyable. This is the sweet spot. Treasure it.

3. The game has decided to pool you in with all the nerds who play it 24/7

Without warning that sweet spot is gone and you’re suddenly being matched with elite players who do things you didn’t even realise were possible in the game. It’s now completely unenjoyable and all the fun is sucked out as people play like dicks because winning is all that matters. Even on casual modes.

I’ve had this with three games recently and the more you win the more you play against better players until it just isn’t fun anymore. On fifa it’s the divisions where everyone spams Mbappe, on Dead By Daylight I suddenly started playing against players with paid for outfits and perks who just looped all game and teabagged. Now after getting back into Rocket League and enjoying it for a bit it’s become so dull because everyone’s suddenly flying through the air like planes and are equipped with paid for goal celebrations and decals.

It’s so boring. Every game just gets ruined and you don’t want to have to lose a load of times for the game to lower your skill level. I always opt for casual modes but I cannot escape it.

 

[Deery]

Like me on call of duty, thought I was getting better getting about 3-4 kills a game, was like alright this isn’t so bad, then I get thrown in with gamers the last 2 months and thinking what’s the point..

 

[Solius]

Like me on call of duty, thought I was getting better getting about 3-4 kills a game, was like alright this isn’t so bad, then I get thrown in with gamers the last 2 months and thinking what’s the point..

Yeah had similar on Warzone now I think about it. One day it’s just not fun.

 

[Cheimoon]

Does anyone find it to be really annoying? I’m never the best player in the world of course but when I play any game online they all seem to follow the same path.

1. New to the game/haven’t played in a while

In this stage everything is fine. Everyone is learning. If you make mistakes it’s fine.

2. Getting used to the game.

Decent at it. Actually really fun and enjoyable. This is the sweet spot. Treasure it.

3. The game has decided to pool you in with all the nerds who play it 24/7

Without warning that sweet spot is gone and you’re suddenly being matched with elite players who do things you didn’t even realise were possible in the game. It’s now completely unenjoyable and all the fun is sucked out as people play like dicks because winning is all that matters. Even on casual modes.

I’ve had this with three games recently and the more you win the more you play against better players until it just isn’t fun anymore. On fifa it’s the divisions where everyone spams Mbappe, on Dead By Daylight I suddenly started playing against players with paid for outfits and perks who just looped all game and teabagged. Now after getting back into Rocket League and enjoying it for a bit it’s become so dull because everyone’s suddenly flying through the air like planes and are equipped with paid for goal celebrations and decals.

It’s so boring. Every game just gets ruined and you don’t want to have to lose a load of times for the game to lower your skill level. I always opt for casual modes but I cannot escape it.

#3 is also standard fare for any game that has been around long enough. Well, if it's really big, it will always also have new players; but at some point what's left are hardcore players that have been around forever and there is just no reasonable matchmaking left for you.

 

[Zarlak]

I haven't seen any game yet where a non elite player is matched with an elite player, that'd be a dumbass business model. You get matched with someone at your skill level. If your skill level is nerds that play 24/7 then take it as a compliment. Lots of complaints on CoD about this, because people can no longer dominated noobs to make themselves feel good. When you were in lobbies calibrating your skill level and where you were doing well, the person you were killing over and over had the same complaint you do now, that you are a nerd who plays 24/7 compared to them.

 

[Deery]

I haven't seen any game yet where a non elite player is matched with an elite player, that'd be a dumbass business model. You get matched with someone at your skill level. If your skill level is nerds that play 24/7 then take it as a compliment. Lots of complaints on CoD about this, because people can no longer dominated noobs to make themselves feel good. When you were in lobbies calibrating your skill level and where you were doing well, the person you were killing over and over had the same complaint you do now, that you are a nerd who plays 24/7 compared to them.

I don’t know if that’s true last week I was teamed up with two guys that got 25 kills each I got a big fat 0, I’d say they were pretty elite compared to me. Worst of all the started shouting obscenities at us because we never won..

 

[Solius]

I haven't seen any game yet where a non elite player is matched with an elite player, that'd be a dumbass business model. You get matched with someone at your skill level. If your skill level is nerds that play 24/7 then take it as a compliment. Lots of complaints on CoD about this, because people can no longer dominated noobs to make themselves feel good. When you were in lobbies calibrating your skill level and where you were doing well, the person you were killing over and over had the same complaint you do now, that you are a nerd who plays 24/7 compared to them.

I guess the difference is I can have a match on rocket league where I'm class and score 5 goals but then equally in the next match I can do the dumbest shit. I'm just a casual player and I'm happy to lose a few times if every now and then I'm playing against similar people but it just seems like I'm surrounded by experts now. Cannot find a game where people aren't flying through the air hitting the ball before it can even reach the ground.

 

[Vidyoyo]

Strongly agree with #3 and it's worse I think because games seem designed to push you quickly but not pull you down at the same rate.

I got catapaulted up the rankings in Rocket League as I played a lot with a mate who did nothing but pwn all day. The game clearly thought I reigned supreme, which sadly I did not.

More games need lobbies. They were fun.

 

[Cheimoon]

Strongly agree with #3 and it's worse I think because games seem designed to push you quickly but not pull you down at the same rate.

I got catapaulted up the rankings in Rocket League as I played a lot with a mate who did nothing but pwn all day. The game clearly thought I reigned supreme, which sadly I did not.

More games need lobbies. They were fun.

Someone I know is a game developer and they had that issue with one game they published. The problem is that rankings tend to stabilize quite quickly, meaning that once you've found a spot your unlikely to budge much, either up or down. If that spot is too high because of some luck at the start, your screwed subsequently. After all kinds of attempts at tweaking the ranking system, their solution in the end was to completely reset the rankings each month. That creates a day or two of mayhem at the start of a new 'season' but did improve the overall experience.

 

[Bosws87]

Skill Based matchmaking, it's the new norm you are purposely placed in a level where your win rate isn't very high as you are all within a similar skill range.

It does cause a few more problems as you will get people who will constantly make new accounts to play at a lower level so they can stomp everyone.

 

[Zarlak]

I guess the difference is I can have a match on rocket league where I'm class and score 5 goals but then equally in the next match I can do the dumbest shit. I'm just a casual player and I'm happy to lose a few times if every now and then I'm playing against similar people but it just seems like I'm surrounded by experts now. Cannot find a game where people aren't flying through the air hitting the ball before it can even reach the ground.

But in that game where you were class, your opponents had a shitty experience and thought you were a nerd who plays 24/7. The only real fair way is to just make it fair and match people equally which is what these systems seek to do.

 

[Zarlak]

I don’t know if that’s true last week I was teamed up with two guys that got 25 kills each I got a big fat 0, I’d say they were pretty elite compared to me. Worst of all the started shouting obscenities at us because we never won..

If that was Warzone they were likely cheating. Even those with aimbots get about 15-20 kills each a game - but Warzone has very well documented skill based matchmaking trying to force you to a 1 KDA. Anecdotal experiences aside, they don't generally put you in lobbies where you purposely get obliterated.

 

[Cheimoon]

Also, if anyone is interested in a game developer's perspective in matchmaking (from the viewpoint of a relatively small game), here are some blog posts on the topic by that guy I mentioned previously:

• The Awesomenauts matchmaking algorithm
• Beginner balance versus pro balance
• Five important realisations about game balance (point 4 is about balance becoming worse over time)
• The psychology of matchmaking

 

[Bosws87]

Also, if anyone is interested in a game developer's perspective in matchmaking (from the viewpoint of a relatively small game), here are some blog posts on the topic by that guy I mentioned previously:

• The Awesomenauts matchmaking algorithm
• Beginner balance versus pro balance
• Five important realisations about game balance (point 4 is about balance becoming worse over time)
• The psychology of matchmaking

There's a paper on EOMM matchmaking which EA have been researching into, which they believe maximises game time and spending money within the game, not sure if its been implemented in any yet.

https://arxiv.org/pdf/1702.06820.pdf

 

[nimic]

I haven't seen any game yet where a non elite player is matched with an elite player, that'd be a dumbass business model. You get matched with someone at your skill level. If your skill level is nerds that play 24/7 then take it as a compliment. Lots of complaints on CoD about this, because people can no longer dominated noobs to make themselves feel good. When you were in lobbies calibrating your skill level and where you were doing well, the person you were killing over and over had the same complaint you do now, that you are a nerd who plays 24/7 compared to them.

I think in general this is the truth. I'm sure some games just have bad matchmaking, but if it's good matchmaking then it will match you up with players the game thinks are roughly as good as you. Of course, if you don't play a lot, then your MMR might take quite a jump, but that's just because the game doesn't know how good you are and is trying to figure it out.

@Solius what are your win rates in those games? Are you losing most games?

 

[Jack-C20]

I got a PC last year and the first thing I tried was CS:GO which I’ve watched for years. I’ve not even played a ranked match as I simply don’t have the time to put into it and I honestly can’t be bothered to deal with toxic people in ranked. As a result, I only play casual. This was great at first as you’d get the odd smurf who would dominate the lobby but generally we were all pretty useless. Now I keep getting put in games with players that are clearly a level above. I can quite often just about go positive but my play style is to sit in a corner and surprise people. I literally have to keep looking a what key I’m pressing. It’s made it a lot less enjoyable and I’ve been looking into resetting my account somehow. Not found a way yet so I’ll carry on being a clunky jack in the box until I do.

I play loads of Rocket League but again it’s generally casual only. I’ve found the matchmaking fairly decent in fairness. My one issue is that I wish you could search for solo trios in casual. I generally play alone and if I run into a party of three they’re much more likely to be an instant loss for me. You either play ranked and deal with the saltiness or you play casual and deal with people rage quitting at 1-0.

 

[Cheimoon]

I think in general this is the truth. I'm sure some games just have bad matchmaking, but if it's good matchmaking then it will match you up with players the game thinks are roughly as good as you. Of course, if you don't play a lot, then your MMR might take quite a jump, but that's just because the game doesn't know how good you are and is trying to figure it out.

@Solius what are your win rates in those games? Are you losing most games?

But even if you're losing most games - if that's mostly against players ranked above you, then it may not affect your ranking.

 

[nimic]

But even if you're losing most games - if that's mostly against players ranked above you, then it may not affect your ranking.

Yeah, but if you're playing against lots of players ranked above you, the game probably thinks you deserve to be at that rank. Probably because you've been winning more than you've been losing. If you've been winning a lot more than you've been losing, then the system might overcompensate, to avoid a situation where you're stuck playing worse players for too long. You won't ideally have to loose to many games before the system realizes you're not quite that good.

Any good matchmaking system is designed to have you at a 50% win rate (or probably something that is the equivalent of 1 kill-death ratio if it's that kind of game). Bad ones might have that goal too, just be too elastic, or not elastic enough.

 

[nimic]

I got a PC last year and the first thing I tried was CS:GO which I’ve watched for years. I’ve not even played a ranked match as I simply don’t have the time to put into it and I honestly can’t be bothered to deal with toxic people in ranked. As a result, I only play casual. This was great at first as you’d get the odd smurf who would dominate the lobby but generally we were all pretty useless. Now I keep getting put in games with players that are clearly a level above. I can quite often just about go positive but my play style is to sit in a corner and surprise people. I literally have to keep looking a what key I’m pressing. It’s made it a lot less enjoyable and I’ve been looking into resetting my account somehow. Not found a way yet so I’ll carry on being a clunky jack in the box until I do.

If you usually go positive, then the players aren't clearly a level above you. They might have better aim than you, or better control, or whatever, but the matchmaking system doesn't take any of those things into account. It just tries to see if you're holding your own, which you seem to be doing. Ambushing people who have worse map awareness than you is also a skill!. And you were probably better than the players you were getting matched with before, if you're really being matched up against better players.

You can't reset your account, but you could just make a new one. CS GO is free, so you could make as many as you want. Though it's possible you're better than you think, and now you'll be the smurf who makes someone feel bad, even if you don't realize. I don't know, I can only go off what you're saying.

Most of my fun in CSGO always came from playing with a regular bunch of people, have you got anyone you can play with? That can make up for feeling outmatched skillwise. If you don't have any friends who play, I am sure there are communities out there where you can find people to play with. Probably has a subreddit, and a Discord too.

 

[do.ob]

It's not some games, it's every game and it's not matchmaking it's meta gaming. At some point every FIFA team looks the same, because everyone agrees that these players are the best. Even in chess you have this problem to a degree.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

Am I the only one who thought this would be about finding love through online gaming?

 

[Cheimoon]

Yeah, but if you're playing against lots of players ranked above you, the game probably thinks you deserve to be at that rank. Probably because you've been winning more than you've been losing. If you've been winning a lot more than you've been losing, then the system might overcompensate, to avoid a situation where you're stuck playing worse players for too long. You won't ideally have to loose to many games before the system realizes you're not quite that good.

Any good matchmaking system is designed to have you at a 50% win rate (or probably something that is the equivalent of 1 kill-death ratio if it's that kind of game). Bad ones might have that goal too, just be too elastic, or not elastic enough.

In principle, yes, and a game like Rocket League should have a big enough player base to make that work; but it's hard, and especially casuals who don't really have a fixed standard of play can suffer from having a poor day or just being out of touch with the current meta. (Or being faced with a different meta from one game to another.) That should make you drop, but after a certain number of games, your ranking might be too fixed because, say, five new games don't make a dent into your full ranking history anymore.

I'm probably thinking too simplistically, since a big game that's been around for a while should have figured out and fixed most of this by now; but clearly something is going wrong cause Solius is actually having the issue.

Am I the only one who thought this would be about finding love through online gaming?

You're clearly not nerd enough for this thread.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

You're clearly not nerd enough for this thread.

I'll take it!

 

[Solius]

I think in general this is the truth. I'm sure some games just have bad matchmaking, but if it's good matchmaking then it will match you up with players the game thinks are roughly as good as you. Of course, if you don't play a lot, then your MMR might take quite a jump, but that's just because the game doesn't know how good you are and is trying to figure it out.

@Solius what are your win rates in those games? Are you losing most games?

Currently or before? I think my stats were roughly 300 games played and 210 won. Team games of course. I often get paired with two randoms And we’ll be vs a clan.

 

[Jack-C20]

If you usually go positive, then the players aren't clearly a level above you. They might have better aim than you, or better control, or whatever, but the matchmaking system doesn't take any of those things into account. It just tries to see if you're holding your own, which you seem to be doing. Ambushing people who have worse map awareness than you is also a skill!. And you were probably better than the players you were getting matched with before, if you're really being matched up against better players.

You can't reset your account, but you could just make a new one. CS GO is free, so you could make as many as you want. Though it's possible you're better than you think, and now you'll be the smurf who makes someone feel bad, even if you don't realize. I don't know, I can only go off what you're saying.

Most of my fun in CSGO always came from playing with a regular bunch of people, have you got anyone you can play with? That can make up for feeling outmatched skillwise. If you don't have any friends who play, I am sure there are communities out there where you can find people to play with. Probably has a subreddit, and a Discord too.

I get what you’re saying and I can’t expect matchmaking to be some sort of AI super computer that takes everything into account. However I only manage to go positive by using my incredibly all in tactic. The spots I sit in people don’t expect people to be there. I’ll get my kill but then get immediately traded when it’s a straight aim duel with his teammate. In the lobbies I was in before it was a lot more forgiving so I could dare to peak out every so often and take a fight with someone. The matchmaking has forced me to use a boring tactic.

I’d honestly prefer an option where there was no matchmaking at all. Yes I’d run into the freaks that are way better than me but I’d also run into people just like me. And no I play alone. I used to have a group I played with on PlayStation (different games). I often found myself just wanting to chill on my own and them pestering me into playing with them. I guess I’m in that stage of just leaving a relationship and really enjoying being on my own for a bit

 

[Solius]

I get what you’re saying and I can’t expect matchmaking to be some sort of AI super computer that takes everything into account. However I only manage to go positive by using my incredibly all in tactic. The spots I sit in people don’t expect people to be there. I’ll get my kill but then get immediately traded when it’s a straight aim duel with his teammate. In the lobbies I was in before it was a lot more forgiving so I could dare to peak out every so often and take a fight with someone. The matchmaking has forced me to use a boring tactic.

I’d honestly prefer an option where there was no matchmaking at all. Yes I’d run into the freaks that are way better than me but I’d also run into people just like me. And no I play alone. I used to have a group I played with on PlayStation (different games). I often found myself just wanting to chill on my own and them pestering me into playing with them. I guess I’m in that stage of just leaving a relationship and really enjoying being on my own for a bit

This is what I want. A lot of the time I’m thinking why are this micced up clan with paid for extras playing casual mode? Go play ranked if you care that much.

 

[Jack-C20]

This is what I want. A lot of the time I’m thinking why are this micced up clan with paid for extras playing casual mode? Go play ranked if you care that much.

That’s one of my biggest gripes with Rocket League. I try to remind myself that it’s probably just three guys chilling out and not wanting to ruin their rank but I just don’t want to be running into them. Six solos playing 3 vs 3 is generally a 50/50 game. Three solos playing a party of three and that easily turns into 20/80 in my experience. It’s probably why the mode I achieved my highest rank in was solo 3s. Well, apart from Rumble maybe

 

[KirkDuyt]

Try playing fighting games in any sort of competitive environment. The higher you go the greater the amount of twelve year olds claiming to have had sex with my 82 year old mother after you beat them.

I do really love receiving hate mail after beating someone. It's a completely onlosable argument.

I never send hate mail myself, I just thoroughly destroy my controller after deciding my oppo was a spamming piece of shite and I deserved to win.

 

[nimic]

I’d honestly prefer an option where there was no matchmaking at all. Yes I’d run into the freaks that are way better than me but I’d also run into people just like me. And no I play alone. I used to have a group I played with on PlayStation (different games). I often found myself just wanting to chill on my own and them pestering me into playing with them. I guess I’m in that stage of just leaving a relationship and really enjoying being on my own for a bit

I haven't played CS in a bit, but aren't there custom servers, with the server browser? Of course, those don't usually have the usual 5v5 format, and you might run into players who are waaaay better than you, but there might be "noob servers" or something. At least friendly servers, I bet.

 

[nimic]

Currently or before? I think my stats were roughly 300 games played and 210 won. Team games of course. I often get paired with two randoms And we’ll be vs a clan.

So your win rate is almost 60%, that's pretty damn good. It'll also be why you're getting matched with people who you feel are better than you. The game sees you winning most of your games, and thinks that you must be better than the players you were getting matched with before. The clan thing I assume is because it's pretty common for groups of 3 to play together, so you might always be a bit extra disadvantaged because of that. I don't know much about Rocket League, and I don't know anything about whether or not the matchmaking takes that into account in any way.

 

[Solius]

So your win rate is almost 60%, that's pretty damn good. It'll also be why you're getting matched with people who you feel are better than you. The game sees you winning most of your games, and thinks that you must be better than the players you were getting matched with before. The clan thing I assume is because it's pretty common for groups of 3 to play together, so you might always be a bit extra disadvantaged because of that. I don't know much about Rocket League, and I don't know anything about whether or not the matchmaking takes that into account in any way.

Yeah I know why it’s happening but it just feels like the step up has taken the fun out of it. You can boost in the game and use it to fly through the air briefly but some people have absolutely mastered it. It almost feels like I’m suddenly playing a completely different game.

 

[nimic]

Yeah I know why it’s happening but it just feels like the step up has taken the fun out of it. You can boost in the game and use it to fly through the air briefly but some people have absolutely mastered it. It almost feels like I’m suddenly playing a completely different game.

You must be doing something right. Maybe they're Gabriel Obertan and you're Roy Keane.

 

[Pexbo]

This is all just one big flex @Solius

 

[Solius]

You must be doing something right. Maybe they're Gabriel Obertan and you're Roy Keane.

Well then I want to go back to Bordeaux

 

[Solius]

This is all just one big flex @Solius

It’s not. I’m getting absolutely rinsed online now.

 

[Pexbo]

It’s not. I’m getting absolutely rinsed online now.

Personally I just think that anyone that beats me is obviously cheating or the game is scripted.

 

[altodevil]

Multiplayer sucks now

 

[Solius]

Personally I just think that anyone that beats me is obviously cheating or the game is scripted.

Oh for sure. Every time I win I deserved it through skill and anyone who beats me is a try-hard loser who fluked it.

 

[hobbers]

Multiplayer was best in the days where there weren't enough players to even have matchmaking.

 

[Ajr]

Best matchmaking is third party services on csgo/faceit