Jesus Christ FECKING MURDER with words.
Him raising your level I agree with completely. So fair point there.
I bow to your rainmancrush memory of Ronaldo's career brother - I don't even have that sort of encyclopaedic knowledge of my own life but I will say that Ronaldo's consistency/longevity is legendary, while I disagree with that his international performances on an individual level are that much better than Messi's, even if he has got a Euro to his name.
I’ve seen all Portugal matches in tournaments at least twice, even from 1966. There was a series on Portuguese TV. I couldn’t tell you what I had for dinner yesterday but I could pretty much tell you all goalscorers and minutes of the goals in those matches.
That involved a De Gea blunder, a dubious foul, and the worst Spain side of the last 15 years.
It was a good hattrick though.
This is indeed a very good point.
When your objective is only to undermine this is the type o post you should do. The negotiation is so great. hahahah
It’s not remotely comparable, Ronaldo led Portugal to their first and second ever international trophy.
I laughed at the idea that Messi was COMFORTABLY the best player in the CL, spot the differenceIt takes luck to win the thing, it doesn't take luck to perform there.
Funny how you go from laughing at the idea of Messi being the best player in the CL to saying he was one of the best in about 8 seconds. Name 5 players who were better than him in the CL this season and prepare for everyone to laugh at you without having to immediately backpedal.
Never mind the fact the Euro has many more teams
You probably watch him score a hat trick and think, anyone could have done that
of course it's comparable since your only point was that Portugal improved with him in team. well, Argentina did too with Messi. they were literally nowhere ever since Maradona days, always losing in quarters or not even going past the group stage for about 30 years in both Copa and WC. and they ALWAYS had amazing attackers, even better than the ones they had in recent times. yet strangely, they never got to so many finals in such a short period like they did during Messi's peak years. people who honestly think that's going to continue without Messi are deluded or simply - haters.
There we go again with the Portugal would have been put in the Euro point again.My original post was that both Messi and Ronaldo have been relatively poor for their national team. Relatively being the key word. Surely you can admit that Ronaldo's greatest achievements are from his club career? He didn't play the final in 2016 and in any other tournament in history they would've been out at the group stages. That's hardly rivalling Maradonna in 86. No one's saying Ronaldo has been shite for Portugal (Admittedly I did a bit to wind you up in my last post), but he hasn't won as much as he could have. and it's great that he's had many good games, but without cups that doesn't count for anything. Or do you think Messi has had a great international career for making so many finals and being so close to winning trophies and even being voted player of the tournament in 2014? No, you don't think so, so why change the metrics for Ronaldo.
And he is being judged as a Portugal player, because no player in Brazil or Germany would ever be considered a national team legend without winning any honors as Ronaldo apparently was from 2006-2016. They would be considered failures. Argentina is also a giant in international football, but currently nowhere near a top 5 side. Better than Portugal perhaps, but that's also why I think Messi's career has been worse than Ronaldo's. That's the funny thing, I actually agree that Ronaldo is more successful than Messi, but anything other than absolute acknowledgement is met with a barrage of hyperbolic outrage and
Also, yes, I'm also biased, everyone's biased, difference is that I actually realize and admit to it. If only you lot in here would do the same the conversation wouldn't be so fecking hostile and laden with endles statsheet to prove the objectivity of posts.
Ronaldo has 88, Messi has 68. Almost the same
Messi’s CL also involves a De Gea blunder and the worst United side in years
That may have a lot to do with the Copa wasn’t played anywhere as often as 4 in 6 years before.
but not at all with the simple fact that they weren't good enough to win something in 30 years?
This united side was still better than any of the other united sides outside of mourinho in recent years
They still haven’t won anything.
Not true, United finished 6th, worse than any LVG season and only matched by the hapless Moyes
nope, but they improved immensely which was the main point in your original post.
After the Maradona inspired WC in 1986, they have finished 2nd, R16, QF, Group until 2006.
trying too hard, dude. if you're trophyless for 30 years in both competitions and you're suddenly playing 4 or 5 finals during the peak years of one player, yes, it's a massive improvement. if you're trophyless for 30 years and people still rate you as world class/tier 1 team despite beng nowhere for so long just because you have certain player, that's actually the biggest compliment you can give to Messi and the funny thing is, you aren't even aware of that.
Maradona was 29 years old when Argentina finished second, he said after Maradona.
Absolutely spot on
Oh I don't blame him for not leaving. Why would he? He's paid a fortune won / wins stuff and is a hero. he must be very comfortable.
The other 20 were irrelevant so they don't count.Ronaldo has 88, Messi has 68. Almost the same
But doesn't it depend on the team and system. For a City or a Barca with the way they play, wouldn't Messi be the better pick. For a less complex and more direct team like Atletico, Cristiano would surely be better as the team needs less solutions to score (Simeone words).
That's kind of my point though I think Ronaldo would. I think you put a 25 year old Ronaldo into that Barca or this City team and he'd completely tear it apart. His numbers on both goals and assists would have been nuts (As were Messi's anyway). I believe he is more flexible to systems and environments. We will obviously never know this for sure but his movement is out of this world so in a Barca or a City he would be brilliant but he can also play direct counter attack because of his brain and his physicality.
In those trophyless years from 1987 onwards, Argentina made the WC final in 1990 and Copa final in 2004 before Messi. They have not bettered those since he started with the national side.
it may not be amazing to you since you're hater, but when you're trophyless in both competitions since Maradona glory days or more precisely, since 1993., that string of finals in such short span is good improvement regardless. they've had much better midfielders/strikers/defenders before him yet they did nothing. with Messi they underperformed by going further than those generations. I suppose that's your way of showing how highly you actually rate him
I've said many times I think he's the 2nd greatest player ever.it may not be amazing to you since you're hater, but when you're trophyless in both competitions since Maradona glory days or more precisely, since 1993., that string of finals in such short span is good improvement regardless. they've had much better midfielders/strikers/defenders before him yet they did nothing. with Messi they underperformed by going further than those generations. I suppose that's your way of showing how highly you actually rate him
then the same goes to Ronaldo. lost every match against top national teams in recent tournaments except the one he didn't participate in and even then Portugal needed the easiest draw possible (something you think Messi benefited from in this year's CL) = anomaly, fluke.
Except for the remarkable improvement of Portugal's fortunes with Ronaldo.
with this you basically said Portugal were also good even before he peaked. 2000 SF - good. 2004 final as hosts - great. which means the quality was already there.
One man made more difference to Portugal than the whole golden generation of Rui Costa, Sousa, Figo, Fernando Couto & co.
yes, and his name is Ederzito António Macedo Lopes
He wouldn't even get to play in that game if it wasn't for Ronaldo.yes, and his name is Ederzito António Macedo Lopes
