I understand your reasoning and at least you recognize that he could get another job in the PL. he’s better than just a Molde manager and like Moyes he will find his level some day
Not sacking managers early enough
- Thread starter R.N7
- Start date
And I think many of our fans have no idea how football works
off course he could get a PL job again after United, let’s not get silly. Thats hyperbole
Totally agree, a complete rewrite of history from the OP
I mean to suggest Jose (or OLE) should have been sacked the summer after finishing 2nd is completely mental
I'm happy with giving managers every opportunity to get through runs of bad form and generally against sacking midseason - only when it's clear that a season is a write off or the players no longer believe in a manger should they be sacked
It's quite obvious that our poor structure off the field in terms of recruitment etc was the problem rather than any individual manager anyway - a lot has been done to address this under Ole (but still not enough) so hopefully things will be better in the long term
Depends what you mean by decent job. He might get a lower end job Cagliari something like that, but no 'top' team will hire him and I cant see a Premier team hiring him either.
At the moment Ronaldo is bailing him out and I dont believe he was an Ole signing. He was bought by the board to stop City having him and for his sellability, like Beckham to Madrid. Thats why £74 million Sancho sits on the bench after being chased for 2 seasons.
I think the problem is Fergie to be honest. Or at least the spectre of his achievements, the board seem hell bent on making it work with Ole Gunnar Southgate because Fergie was given time as well.
The problem being Fergie was a true one-off who had brought a European trophy to Aberdeen, and broken up the Old Firm monopoly in Scotland, to act as credit in the bank.
Ole Gunnar Southgate has nothing like that on his CV, plus what worked almost four decades ago is not necessarily a blueprint for the future of a modern thinking football club.
The problem being Fergie was a true one-off who had brought a European trophy to Aberdeen, and broken up the Old Firm monopoly in Scotland, to act as credit in the bank.
Ole Gunnar Southgate has nothing like that on his CV, plus what worked almost four decades ago is not necessarily a blueprint for the future of a modern thinking football club.
Why do a portion of United fans think ole wouldn’t get another PL job after United? It doesn’t make sense
Honestly, you might need to talk with some non-United fans about the reputation of Ole. Let's say it nicely, it is not that high. By that I mean, they kinda think that he is really shit (by them, I mean, literally anyone I talked to, coming from fans of clubs of different leagues). Even Moyes, a total joke, has a much higher reputation.
United job is the easiest managerial job in the world. You are close to unsackable. Take Ole for example, 450m spent (more than any other manager in the same time, also the highest wage bill in the world, and the highest net transfer in the world), no challenge for one of the big two trophies, not winning a tinpot trophy, get trashed 0-5 to Liverpool, and is completely safe. How on Earth is this one of the toughest job in the world? As long as you don't both totally suck and don't totally lose the dressing room, you are fine.
As for another example, take Moyes vs Gasperini vs Lopetegui. Three managers who had a high reputation before joining one of the biggest clubs in their country. All three of them sucked in their job at United/Inter/Madrid. Gasperini got sacked in September. Lopetegui got sacked in October. Moyes got sacked in April, so he survived 7 months more than the former, and 6 months more than the later.
United's job is the best job in football. Do the bare minimum and they will worship you and give a new contract. Don't even do that, and they will still worship you.
Hes a checkbook manager who has had a fortune to spend and won feck all. The football style is all over the place. No top team will hire him, and the lower teams couldnt afford to bankroll him.
So he would be under more pressure managing Verona as opposed to managing Manchester United?
The shit you read on here.
Maybe we should just pay them a weekly wage and not go along with these contract shenanigans!
Then if we have a bad result on the weekend we can give a weeks notice to the manager and get someone else a week later; That should keep the fan base happy as no manager will be here long enough to really get pissed off with.
Then if we have a bad result on the weekend we can give a weeks notice to the manager and get someone else a week later; That should keep the fan base happy as no manager will be here long enough to really get pissed off with.
Ole Gunnar Southgate is the poster boy for being in a job you are not capable of doing and getting away with it because you are a nice guy.
He's failed on every credible level but remains in place three years later - why on Earth anyone would expect him to land a top job after us is beyond me.
He's failed on every credible level but remains in place three years later - why on Earth anyone would expect him to land a top job after us is beyond me.
Easiest job in football. Or at least form the big clubs.
There is no other big club that would have tolerated a manager spending as much as Ole, winning nothing, not challenging for the big trophies, playing shit football, losing 0-5 at home from the biggest rivals, and still being in the job. None.
Just check Koeman, another legend who scored a goal for that club in the UCL final. Won Copa del Rey last season, finished third in the league (7 points below the champions), lost Messi and Griezmann, and lost only 1-2 to Madrid. Sacked immediately and got assaulted by the fans.
The Glazers are hoping that a manager will come up trumps and be a mini Fergie because to them its the cheapest option. Look how much they have to keep putting in to buy a team (clubs money, but thats another argument), compared to when Fergie was manager. Its obviously not for football reasons. Its like the emporors new clothes with Ole to them. Hes a legend, his coaches are Utd men, the United Way etc. Until its going to cost them Champions League money Ole will still be here.
I won’t be responding to any more of your posts
easiest job in football? With support from fans like you?
He wouldn't have all his friends in media protecting him, for a start.
There has been no pressure on Ole before Liverpool's trashing. It was all about the good job he has done and the cultural reboot. Imaginary stuff. No 'why he is not challenging', 'why he hasn't won a trophy'.
Who’s talking top jobs? I’m not. I’m saying he will get another PL job if he wants.
Italian coaches would make him look embarassing on a weekly basis. No chance.
What part of football don't I get?
The likes of Sam Allardyce with years of PL pedigree have now been filtered out of the league. Moyes struggled for a PL job after he left us and was only reluctantly hired by West Ham. These guys have a much higher degree than OGS
When a far better manager (Tuchel) was available! Should have been a no-brainer. Chelsea had the sense to do it even though they were doing ok with Lampard. They were similar to us under Ole, inconsistent and underwhelming but haven't looked back since bringing Tuchel on board.
Because he has naused it up spectacularly.
GIve me a single example in the last 10 years of a manager who spent so much, won nothing, didn't challenge for the league/UCL, got humiliated from their biggest rivals at home, and still was perfectly safe.
I've been clear for a couple of years that I am not a fan of Ole, or any manager. I am a fan of the club though.
And look at the job Moyes is doing now.
Highly unlikely he would get another EPL job and even if he did I think he would lose it very quickly. He’s been blessed with a huge budget and individuals who can mask his lack of acumen to a degree but that would not be possible at a smaller club in a competitive environment such as the EPL.
I also agree that the United job on the elite end is one of the most easiest in terms of avoiding the sack but in terms of the overall project to turn it into a success - it is not easy because so much needs to be done to transform this clubs mentality and amateur approach behind the scenes. The fact we need to celebrate each time we seemingly do something to modernise tells you all you need to know about this dinosaur club.
So progressing the team from 6th, to 3rd, then 2nd is "failing on every credible level" is it?
Granted, this season we have gone backwards and his job is rightly under scrutiny, but recency-bias of simply forgetting what he did do in previous seasons is ridiculous.
That's not really answering the question mate though is it.
Would he be under more media pressure managing any mid-table team in Italy vs managing Manchester United?
No is the answer. And there's a case to be made that there's more pressure managing United than any team in Italy.
The United job is one of the hardest jobs, not only because of what is done but also because of the stress involved and the level of expectations from fans and the media. And I’m not just talking about expectations of winning. I’m talking also about how staff are perceived in public. Rashford can’t take a fart in public without there being a write up in the rags
See this post shows logic which many seem to have left out of their brains in this thread
He has not been under any media pressure. Neville, Rio etc haven been defending him, and are still doing so. Only recently, the likes of Carragher and Souness have been attacking him.
The media has been supporting him, not attacking him. That wouldn't happen in any Italian club.
never heard it before but i like it.
Anyway I’m done in this thread
Good post.
I've asked the same question about when Ole should have been sacked. 2nd place finish, europa final, followed by good summer signings. You can't sack him afer that.
But Moyes has a much higher than pedigree than Solskjaer. Moyes wasn't hired by West Ham because he failed at United. His body of work at Everton is what got him a shot at the job
This is quite misleading.
Koeman's third place league finish was Barcelona's worst since 2007-2008. They were '7 points below the champions' but only 2 points above 4th place. Their Copa del Rey title was their fifth in seven seasons, and their sixth final out of the last seven. So he was objectively below par.
The 1-2 loss to Madrid was his third consecutive loss in the Clasico, and xth consecutive failure to win a match against a tough opponent. He didn't win against Madrid, didn't win against Atletico, didn't win against PSG, his only big win was a group stage game against Juventus.
He was, in fact, not sacked immediately after losing to Madrid. It took an additional, perhaps more embarrassing defeat against Rayo, to do it.
More importantly, he was not the president's signing. If he had been, he'd probably have stayed on longer.
Yeah Neville and Rio are the entire Britsh media
Solskjaer has been getting a rough ride from journalists from day one.Mate stop spouting absolute shite.
Yeah can't believe someone is really saying this shite. United is arguably the biggest job in football and certainly one of the worst in terms of pressure.
Finishing second or third when you are never in a title race, and are more than a dozen points behind the champions, is no achievement for a club of United's stature. It simply isn't. If that's what passes for progress then somebody shoot me.
There could well be some relegation threatened chairman who is taken in by his bluffer's bullshit.
I don't think it's a problem of not sacking them early enough rather giving out contracts when they did
Moyes - should have never been given the job. Given he was the first man after Fergie you can understand why he was given as long as he was
LVG - again should have never been given the job. Did he do enough to get a 2nd season? Probably not, definitely should have gone after the Stoke game but people will argue he did end up winning the FA Cup when he was allowed to finish the season
Mourinho - why was he given that contract extension half way into his 2nd season? Then the board didn't back him a few months later in the transfer window after what was a shit end to that 2nd season and then yeah he probably did go about the right time into the 3rd season
Ole - why was he given the full time job when he was? Why was he given a contract extension before the season started? This should be Ole's final season based on that first contract of which we could simply relieve him of his duties a few months early instead we've got to sack him (has to go if we lose to City) and give him a big pay off
Moyes - should have never been given the job. Given he was the first man after Fergie you can understand why he was given as long as he was
LVG - again should have never been given the job. Did he do enough to get a 2nd season? Probably not, definitely should have gone after the Stoke game but people will argue he did end up winning the FA Cup when he was allowed to finish the season
Mourinho - why was he given that contract extension half way into his 2nd season? Then the board didn't back him a few months later in the transfer window after what was a shit end to that 2nd season and then yeah he probably did go about the right time into the 3rd season
Ole - why was he given the full time job when he was? Why was he given a contract extension before the season started? This should be Ole's final season based on that first contract of which we could simply relieve him of his duties a few months early instead we've got to sack him (has to go if we lose to City) and give him a big pay off
First time: at the end of his first season. We finished 6th (same position as when Mourinho got sacked) having won only 2 points in the last 5 matches, so 2 out of possible 15 points.
Second time: covid time. We were in a very bad position in the table and he should have been relieved of duties. To be fair, his Bruno signing changed things and we finished in UCL zone, playing our best football under him, so in hindsight, it was the right decision to not have sacked him.
Third time: at the end of his previous season. Job done, but clearly he had reached his ceiling.
Fourth time: after Leicester match. All these spending, and going backwards.
Fifth time: after Liverpool match (when even some of the most loyal supporters of him changed their tune).
10/10 for "pestilence of sentimentality"