Best post in here by some way for a while.
Balanced, realistic, not deluded and most importantly - thinking more about what's best for the club rather than what's best for a personality that you love.
Ole Gunnar Solskjaer | W15 D2 L4
- Thread starter Tom Van Persie
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Balanced, realistic, not deluded and most importantly - thinking more about what's best for the club rather than what's best for a personality that you love.
Makes subs too late isn't something that's the difference between getting the job or not.
It wouldn't be getting carried away to appoint Ole right now, he's done really, really well since he's come in.
We look a completely different prospect, and the improvements on and off the pitch are there for all to see.
It wouldn't be premature to appoint a manager who has been with us longer than many 'permanent' managers last anyway.
The idea that giving a guy a job whose beaten the likes of Arsenal, Chelsea, Tottenham, PSG etc whilst also mostly brushing aside the lesser sides is 'getting carried away' is... Well, odd.
McTominay did enough whenever he got the chance to show that he has to take over from Matic.
OGS did a huge mistake starting 4 players coming back from Injury in the same match, away to a good side.
Stuff like that works in football manager, not in real life. Particularly if we’re talking about inconsistent players like Martial and Lingard.
Rookie mistake that.
OGS did a huge mistake starting 4 players coming back from Injury in the same match, away to a good side.
Stuff like that works in football manager, not in real life. Particularly if we’re talking about inconsistent players like Martial and Lingard.
Rookie mistake that.
Ok, you have your opinion I have mine and I stick to it even though I know people having slight concerns about Ole are not very popular here.
True. It's a major defect in the team's make-up that our midfield just doesn't have anyone who is creative with the ball. Also not helped when the forwards just stand around. There is nowhere near enough movement by the forwards making themselves available for passes. Doesn't help that there's no natural leader in the squad, either.
Watch City's or Liverpool'e forwards, they're always on the move. We're just too static when in possession.
Bad day at the office.
the reason ole should stay above all others is his vision for United matches with what the fans want. I know from his comments after the defeats that he's very aware our football is not at the required standards yet and I feel confident in the direction he wants to take us. he's already spoken about need to target longterm signings and players with a United personality which he will obviously know very well.
. he must get the pre season, build our fitness and buy 3/4 players and judge again next season. how can we judge him with another managers squad? we had real injury crisis because the level of fitness that our new style of play was demanding is very high . this has caught up with the squad in recent matches. he's shown enough to be given that opportunity imo regardless of if we finish top 4 or not, win CL or not.
. he must get the pre season, build our fitness and buy 3/4 players and judge again next season. how can we judge him with another managers squad? we had real injury crisis because the level of fitness that our new style of play was demanding is very high . this has caught up with the squad in recent matches. he's shown enough to be given that opportunity imo regardless of if we finish top 4 or not, win CL or not.
Did anyone think Ole could keep winning every game? Obviously being knocked out of the only competition we had a slight chance of winning Hurts, but the expectation to keep the momentum going no matter the state and quality of our squad is unrealistic. Honeymoon is over and I hope we make top 4 at the end of the season.
I'm not necessarily against Ole being offered the job, but if we were considering Poch, are you suggesting the latter doesn't have a vision for the club and an understanding of what fans expect?
You're ready to label a 17 year old a sick note?So after 2 games all season Greenwood went back to being unavailable again? And people slated me when I just mentioned some shades of Owen Hargreaves there.We surely don't want another case with a sick note/injury all year getting salary like a player who contributes week-in week-out, right?
It's all so pointless in the end. Had he started Fred, and Fred had a bad game, we'd be hearing people say: "I can't understand why he didn't start Herrera. Baffling decision..."
We got outplayed by Wolves, a mid table premier league club.
That will do alot with our players confidence. I really fear for Ole now, if players stops believing in him it's over.
That will do alot with our players confidence. I really fear for Ole now, if players stops believing in him it's over.
Just a bad day yesterday. I think really that Wolves set out to frustrate us and make us impatient and angry and it worked. They bullied some of our players.
Tbh I don't see a huge amount of alternatives. The name we all keep mentioning is Pochettino but even that's no guarantee. Solksjaer's certainly done a lot of really good things and the players seem to love him, which is half the battle.
If we do end up hiring him though, we should avoid the mistakes of the past and give him a short contract - two years would be fine. This could easily go either way and we need to protect ourselves if it goes badly.
If we do end up hiring him though, we should avoid the mistakes of the past and give him a short contract - two years would be fine. This could easily go either way and we need to protect ourselves if it goes badly.
I hope not. Our chances of beating Barcelona are slim, very slim.
Our chance to qualify to the semi finals of the FA cup was a great one.
I'm not "labelling" him as anything. But a 17 year old boy should be healthy and ready to run around most of the time. He got more unavailable days (Injured, being sick, etc...) than he should have at that age. And that concerns me. Phil Jones got slated for the exact same reason: Being unavailable more times than he should.
Yeah this is nonsense, I agree. The idea that OGS somehow 'gets' United and no-one else would.
What is there to understand? That we enjoy attacking football and want to see young players given a chance? Someone can grasp that in two minutes.
If we give OGS the job (and I personally think we should) it should be based on his qualities as a manager, not Some Liverpool-esque romantic crap about United being somehow unique.
If we're being honest, he's caused himself a bit of a 'problem' by setting standards that he was never going to be able to maintain. No one could. We were always going to have a drop off at some point - my own view is that we'll fall short of 4th place with a few iffy results - because, in the main, none of the issues that we've had for the last few years have been solved, only masked by good performances and a lot of players playing out of their skin. The season might end up having a slightly downbeat ending, when the reality is that he's done a fantastic job to even have us in the conversation for top 4.
BUT, I still hope the club are looking at alternatives as manager. I'm not saying I don't want him to be our manager - in fact, I'd likely choose him - but there are plenty of very qualified candidates out there with far better CVs than him and who have shown they have the ability, for example, to manage at an elite level over a long period. I appreciate that people want to rely on this nebulous idea of him 'getting' the club but it would be daft to ignore some of the things we do know about him just because they don't suit us. It's the usual one with caretaker managers. The job they do on an interim basis has to be almost viewed as an entirely separate thing from the full time job. Solskjaer has had the unique advantage of his performance and the mood around him always being compared to Mourinho. But soon he'll be judged on his own merits and he still have a squad of players who have, in some cases, been proven not to be good enough across the tenure of a few managers. It'd be negligent not to go away and speak to other candidates, IMO, albeit I think the job he's done so far should give him plenty of credit when it comes to deciding who gets the job.
BUT, I still hope the club are looking at alternatives as manager. I'm not saying I don't want him to be our manager - in fact, I'd likely choose him - but there are plenty of very qualified candidates out there with far better CVs than him and who have shown they have the ability, for example, to manage at an elite level over a long period. I appreciate that people want to rely on this nebulous idea of him 'getting' the club but it would be daft to ignore some of the things we do know about him just because they don't suit us. It's the usual one with caretaker managers. The job they do on an interim basis has to be almost viewed as an entirely separate thing from the full time job. Solskjaer has had the unique advantage of his performance and the mood around him always being compared to Mourinho. But soon he'll be judged on his own merits and he still have a squad of players who have, in some cases, been proven not to be good enough across the tenure of a few managers. It'd be negligent not to go away and speak to other candidates, IMO, albeit I think the job he's done so far should give him plenty of credit when it comes to deciding who gets the job.
http://www.squawka.com/en/news/tedd...dium=rss&utm_campaign=rss#dxy06QFk7wKkrOZr.97
Sherringham thinks Ole has got the job.
Sherringham thinks Ole has got the job.
Good post, but may I say, it is rather non-committal. Do you think Ole should be given the job or not? Try and answer that question, rather than purely, and quite fairly ok, suggesting the reasons not to appoint him.
Every potential candidate linked with Man Utd Manager post, will have some questions marks against them. But decisions have to be made, because there is a huge amount that needs to be addressed in this squad.
I love the guy, and I do feel that these recent results and aspects of recent performances will really show his talent and aptitude for the role. Note, we started sloppy against Arsenal, but should have won that with the chances we created... and yesterday, we were outplayed. But I do have concerns about the squad, and I worry about whether DDG and Pogs will stay unless we get some real stellar talent in there. They are wanted by everybody. Ole has to get rid of a fair few, buy well, and compete next season.
I had a little worry before the Arsenal game, he was asked about his team, and he said that both Matic and Pogs will come back in the team, and that Pogba returning to the team was a 'no-brainer...'. This was a little red flag for me, because I thought to myself, 'I hope he doesn't see things like that.. that's not what I want out of a United manager. It's a little lazy, and sends the wrong message'. It's ok saying we have good players, but, like some have said on here, we just need to see how he works that whole squad.. maybe just a little more. Remember, both Chelsea and Arsenal went on amazing runs of form this season...
I would give him the job though, because I think he knows what is expected of him, players, and coaching staff at Manchester United Football Club. He has earned the opportunity. But I do think he is ahead of some of the players there, because some are not going to cut it. No way.
I'm no doctor, but I would imagine it's not uncommon for young kids to have injuries as they grow into their bodies, so to speak. Phil Jones has injury for almost a decade - that's why he gets slated (actually I don't like how he gets slated, but I can understand the frustration.)
I think this is a very fair way to look at it. I'd love for OGS to get the job, but there is simply no reason to rush the decision. There are a few months left - let's see how it goes and then go from there. Whether it's Ole or someone else, this squad clearly needs upgrading.
this.Not sure we have the squad to compete on too many fronts. The only goal we should be focusing on is top four for me....
I mean you can’t simply throw away CL QF don’t be daft.
I think folks are forgetting this is pretty much a trial run, free hit...call it what you will.
When that clueless sh*tehawk left us where he did in 6th place there wasn't a happy supporter in our ranks, regardless whom they blamed. Ole and Mike have given us a miracle since December and any positive we get by the end of May is a bonus.
We gotta remember that Ole is a very young manager, still learning his trade and will of course make mistakes with regards tactics / subs and the like. Main thing for me personally is getting in that top 4. If he gets that I'm perfectly fine with him staying myself and let him have complete autonomy over squad rebuild.
When that clueless sh*tehawk left us where he did in 6th place there wasn't a happy supporter in our ranks, regardless whom they blamed. Ole and Mike have given us a miracle since December and any positive we get by the end of May is a bonus.
We gotta remember that Ole is a very young manager, still learning his trade and will of course make mistakes with regards tactics / subs and the like. Main thing for me personally is getting in that top 4. If he gets that I'm perfectly fine with him staying myself and let him have complete autonomy over squad rebuild.
I am genuinely ambivalent.
With my heart yes, I'd like to see him get the job and do well. But I guess the question is do I think Man united with all their power, and resources could find a better more experienced, and talanted manager?
I think they probably could, but again that too would be a gamble, with no guarantee it will pay off. The recruitment has after all, been pretty abysmal!
Pochettino, Zidane and many other big names don't convince me, any more than Jose did at the time tbh.
Pochettino would just be another appointment by media, and Zidane well, he's one of those guys whose done well, but has he really built anything himself? Brian Clough and Fergie, impress/ed me, because they built teams from scratch, and so maybe with a guy like Ole you'll get that same hunger to succeed.
United more than anything need a team, and team spirit, and I think with Ole you have a much better chance of getting that, than with the others, but I am interested to see where the team goes from here, and if now under pressure, (losing) the team, and players like Pogba in particular, are reverting back to how they were playing under Jose. Does Ole have enough authority, and respect to control a player like Pogba, or will his inexperience at the top level make him more at risk of losing the dressing room like Moyes (over chips apparently in his case!)?
Really, there is simply no way of knowing how good a manager Ole actually is. It's just too early to say, as that winning streak could have been down to his genius, but equally it could be down to any number of things.
Personally, I would certainly wait, and see if he gets united into the CL, and how things go in Europe and the rest of the season. Most important thing of all is can he get them playing as a team. That is more important than all the big name stars in the world, as wolves so clearly demonstrated.
But it's still going to be a bit of a gamble IMO.
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So why should he get to make them while managing Man Utd...?
If that's the level he's at, why can't he go and learn those things at a suitable club while we employ an actual Elite manager?
Ole will always want to manage Utd, it's an honour for him, obviously. But Utd should always, always employ the absolute best that they can in every position, including (and I'd argue, most importantly) the manager.
From the hiring of Moyes, I really don't understand this bizarre logic within our fanbase of letting managers 'learn on the job'. Man Utd isn't the place for that, it won't ever work out.
If a manager isn't ready to handle Utd, and the extremely high level of expectation that rightly comes with it, let them develop elsewhere while we employ the best.
But Ole’s the only one who seems ready to handle Utd after SAF, while the best wasn’t even close to do it.
At this point all I want is Ole to know how he wants to play and build accordingly.
Whether it’s the diamond or 4-3-3 or both as a solid plan a and plan b.
The last thing we need is him chopping and changing the next eighteen months trying to find a magic formula, and shoehorning our better players in.
Whether it’s the diamond or 4-3-3 or both as a solid plan a and plan b.
The last thing we need is him chopping and changing the next eighteen months trying to find a magic formula, and shoehorning our better players in.
The 'best' being a past it LvG and Mourinho...? And now Ole, of Molde and Cardiff is the 'only one' who can handle Utd?
No. I'm not having that.
To normalize the ridiculous managerial appointments made by the Glazers is doing Utd a disservice. They have made abnormally bad appointments at every juncture, to the level where the fanbase is so starved of the bare minimum that a club of Utd's size deserves that any kind of joy is greeted with delusional romanticizing and idealizing.
Ironically, as Ole has proven, there are many managers out there who could do a decent job at Utd if given the chance. And I'd imagine at least some of them are better coaches that OGS.
I love and hate his post match conference/interviews.
Love that he said it as it is without sugarcoating it nor making excuses eg. lack of urgency, Wolves deserved to win, etc etc.
Hate that he just gloss over this with statement like "well that's football, it's happen" (United team that play this way is normal eyh) nor acknowledging he and his coaches didn't do the right things which they either fail or delayed.
Hope they (Ole and co) learn from this but this 2 back to back matches is disappointing. It reminds me of LVG's philosophy and Mou's denial "my tactics is fine, nothing wrong with it, flawless, my players are the problem." in the specific sense not seeing any faults in their tactics nor players selections. Thing is, Ole's previous many games especially the earliest games, he and his 3 assistants are very lively and always make proactive tactical adjustments and encouraging players on the sidelines, even changes things around in the early first half, go back to that please.
Love that he said it as it is without sugarcoating it nor making excuses eg. lack of urgency, Wolves deserved to win, etc etc.
Hate that he just gloss over this with statement like "well that's football, it's happen" (United team that play this way is normal eyh) nor acknowledging he and his coaches didn't do the right things which they either fail or delayed.
- fail to motivate the players to have more urgency (maybe our coaches tried, are our players really that ego thick headed, geez).
- no immediate/proactive tactical adjustments, plenty of things just not working (they only did it with subs after Wolves scored, what happened to half time team talk, fts zero tactical changes).
- player start selection, ignoring match fitness + sharpness, gamble fail on experiences for midfield (thought the 4 returnees trained so well looking sharp, but I say performances in game showed they don't).
Hope they (Ole and co) learn from this but this 2 back to back matches is disappointing. It reminds me of LVG's philosophy and Mou's denial "my tactics is fine, nothing wrong with it, flawless, my players are the problem." in the specific sense not seeing any faults in their tactics nor players selections. Thing is, Ole's previous many games especially the earliest games, he and his 3 assistants are very lively and always make proactive tactical adjustments and encouraging players on the sidelines, even changes things around in the early first half, go back to that please.
It would be unusual for a manager to come out and say yeah I’m shit, in a post-match interview.
It’s easy to say LVG and Mourinho is past it now, but most people didn’t think so at the time either of them joined us.
I’m not saying he’s the only one, but he’s doing pretty well imo, and as of now I don’t see a better available candidate.
Pochettino has been at Spurs at what, 5 seasons? And the only thing he won is one league cup, hardly a winner to me.
Who would you want managing us?
You seriously think Ferguson was perfect immediately at United? He made his mistakes and had to learn his way through error at United as well. Took him 4 years to win a trophy and 6 for a league, how quickly some forget.
He had to adapt and learn his trade with regards European football too, we often got played off the park in those early years of the Champions League, I recall Barca absolutely thumping us 4-0 in 93-94.
He was certainly further along in his career of course than Ole currently is and still he was nowhere near the level you are expecting.
Regardless of who we played, Ole in his first league games won 10 drew 2 and lost 1. Correct me if i am wrong, but that is the best start of any premier league manager ever? Would Zidane have done the same? Jadrin, Conte, Simione? We will never know. Your point on honeymoon is over is bang on and i am glad it is over. The players have everything to prove, Ole has already proved his worth. Tactically he has gone great, opportunities to the youth, press talks, style of play. All this without a pre season or any signings. Pep's first year was hot and cold, Klopp in his first 8 months didnt get champions league football. Ole has every chance to build something great but along the way will be barriers such as the last two defeats. He is probably more hurt than any of the players with them two defeats. I do not think we should offer him the job now but it is clear to me he is leading the running and has demonstrated himself to be a serious candidate.
I completely agree with you. I was not taking a dig on Ole. It just to be expected that his near perfect run would end sooner or later. Zidane took over one of the best squads in the World. Conte took over a team of champions at Chelsea. Our squad is not rubbish, but we've been in the wilderness for 6 years and we don't have team of champions or serial Winners. I also want Ole to become our permanent manager. The fans love him, the players love him and he's still done an incredible job so despite our recent dissapointments.
If we are able to bring in the right players to take us to the NeXT level i'll be exicited, but most our transfer Windows post-saf have been dreadfull. I'm not really confident that the NeXT one will be a succes and there is a ton of competetion for the best players.
Regardless of what happens from now till end of the season he deserves the shot obviously. Next season, for me the acid test would be if he is able to improve the fitness of United players. For too long this bunch has gone by without exerting themselves to the fullest and getting satisfied with too little too soon and then start believing that wins will come in automatically.
That was the big mistake in the last two games, obviously some of them weren't available last week but I am sure you get the point
I really wish our board would back him to the tune of around £250m then maybe we will see some improvement in our overall performances, we seem to only really play well in patches but maybe that is just my opinion