Don't think Chelsea were 7-8 points off fourth at any point during that season, were they?
Opposition Fan's view - Jose Mourinho
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) was joined by comedian Ali Woods to look back at the best and worst moments of a rollercoaster season with the annual United Hour Awards.
Has Ten Hag been sacked yet? We're not sure and we hope not, but it's looking more likely as the days pass.
Who should replace him and why is it taking so long to make a decision?
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Don't recall exactly but I know we only finished 4 points behind City having beaten both them and Liverpool twice in the league, beating Arsenal twice I believe, and having the best record in the league against the better sides.
We were a very solid side that year. Got to the semi final of the CL and were knocked out by Diego Costa and Atleti, too.
It really isn't. Of course I don't like his record against Wenger but Mourinho's favoured game seems to have a way of troubling Wenger's favoured game, in the same way that Nadal's style had a way of troubling Federer's style.
The better reasons are that I dislike the way his teams play, I dislike his petulance, machismo and childishness and I dislike the way that those used to be hyped as mindgames by dim journalists. I dislike his homophobic slurs and his treatment of players, staff and rivals. I dislike his sourness (other managers aren't like that, except in the aftermath of defeat. It's Mourinho's default setting) and his ridiculous airs of injured innocence. I'm enjoying the fact that more people are seeing through his behaviour now. Until recently most Manchester United fans seemed to feel much the same.
And of course people care what opposition fans think - that's why fans get so pointlessly annoyed with one another.
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Absolutely no chance you win much, if anything at all if you're unwilling to spend. Mourinho seems to get beaten with this particular stick a lot, but to be successful you have to spend. Chelsea spent well over £100m, as did City. It's not really ever an question that Pep or Conte would have to face. The club are loaded, as are almost every other team in the league, and if the money wasn't spent then we'd be left behind even further.
Forgot they put out United, they were in a weak period though, so the point stands.Because it was only Arsenal fans who had responded since the latest bump. And it's clear that you would never get a fair appraisal of Mourinho from fans who despise him for the aforementioned reasons.
I see some of the other usually wrong suspects have decided to join in and prematurely write our obituary too.
No one could seriously watch United performances this season and legitimately say the team are performing poorly or that Mourinho's lost it. I would say performance wise the team is about 7/10, but results are about 2/10.
The only teams who have performed markedly better are Chelsea and Liverpool. I would compare Mourinho's first few months with Klopp's last year. There is a clear upward trajectory in performance but the results have not yet matched this.
Ultimately our opposition are taking a very respectful approach to us, playing every man behind the ball looking for a draw (including Arsenal). That says a lot. They're riding their luck though and I wouldn't expect this sequence of draws to continue, especially with some favourable fixtures in the short-medium term.
Not true. Before your post at least 4 non-Arsenal fans had responded.
Some United fans also posted. Well done.Not true. Before your post at least 4 non-Arsenal fans had responded.
I guess it depends what you mean by "lost it." Mourinho has one of the most incredible track records in football history. Critics will point to the money he spent or the players he had but I tend to believe that you can't be that successful for that long without being one of the best managers in the world, a guy who even among top-level managers was just a cut above and gave his clubs a little advantage over rivals who had good-but-not-great managers.
I don't think he is that guy anymore and I don't see anything about United's performances this season (or his last Chelsea tenure) to suggest it is still the case. In that sense, he has "lost it." That doesn't mean he isn't still a good manager.
Agreed. The point wasn't really about not spending. That is essential, it was more about spending for long term gain vs. Short term victory.
Bang on the money.
The issue with some modern day supporters, especially the type that post on internet forums; are impatient.
The matchgoing fans I know are more than happy with Jose and willing to let him have a few years to build his own side.
You can't base a fan's opinion on places like Bluemoon or RAWK either. They are asylums rammed with attention seekers who demand their opinions to be heard.
A bit like those awful YouTube fan channels with the Arsenal supporters freaking out whenever they don't win a match.
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I guess Pep Guardiola has lost it too. And Arsene Wenger. Even Pochettino. If we compare their current performance to what we've seen from them in their better seasons, they've all lost it.
The only managers performing at or ahead of expectations are probably Conte and Klopp. Everyone else has lost it. Obviously.
I just came in here to post the very same thing. Let's look at our rival's managers:
Spurs (Pochettino). Failed miserably in this season's CL group stages, failed to qualify for the next round with a game left to spare. Sitting in 5th place despite showing lots of promise last season. Have Spurs gone backwards? Probably.
Arsenal (Wenger). Arsenal have flattered to decieve in both the league and Champions League. Despite bringing through young players and buying established talented like Ozil and Sanchez, Wenger hasn't been able to deliver a league title since 2004 which is massively underachieving for a club like Arsenal.
Man City (Baldy). Spent a fortune on new players. City still look they'll concede at least two goals everytime they play, regardless of who the opposition is. Pep has an abundance of attacking quality available but has majorly buggered up letting Joe Hart go and replacing him with the mediocre Bravo.
Klopp and Conte are doing very well at their clubs.
i dont like him, never have and never will.
even if he were to come to Liverpool and win us our first PL era title i would still dislike him.
i'd be forever grateful but both his (**** of) personality and his managerial style grate with me.
his achievements speak for themselves, hes been immensely successful and won almost all there is to win (except the EC ?)
is he past it ? doubt it, but he's lost the shine and the new car smell. you're welcome to him as far as im concerned.
even if he were to come to Liverpool and win us our first PL era title i would still dislike him.
i'd be forever grateful but both his (**** of) personality and his managerial style grate with me.
his achievements speak for themselves, hes been immensely successful and won almost all there is to win (except the EC ?)
is he past it ? doubt it, but he's lost the shine and the new car smell. you're welcome to him as far as im concerned.
What a silly post. If Wenger ever had "it" in the way Mourinho used to (being clearly one of the very best managers in the world and even a cut above other top managers), he lost it a long, long time ago. Pochettino has never shown himself to have it.
Mourinho remains a top level manager but he is probably past his best and is no longer some kind of magic talisman who will give his club an advantage against almost all opposition and bring titles almost wherever he goes. He is one good manager among many, not a guy clearly on top of the heap.
Long time ago - no?
All very easy and brave things to say when he is going through a rough patch I suppose.
Even Fergie had dry years (sometimes several in a row). Opposition fans used to gleefully state he was finished too.
the big clubs still had chequebooks way back then
Bump.
Overall, this has gone a fair way more south than I imagined it would. I would even consider LvG a relatively better United manager, though that is mostly related to Jose being a noxious influence on the club itself.
Any review of opinions, other team supporters?
Overall, this has gone a fair way more south than I imagined it would. I would even consider LvG a relatively better United manager, though that is mostly related to Jose being a noxious influence on the club itself.
Any review of opinions, other team supporters?
The irony of all this is that he called Wenger a specialist in failure.
Yet it seems he has lost it like Wenger did. I wonder what's next for him.
First few pages read very different now than back then.
Real Madrid is just waiting for us to sack him.
The highs of LVG were most definitely more enjoyable than the highs under Mourinho - that's for sure. Can't be arsed with the back and forth about their respective reigns (results, goals whatever), I can only speak for my own personal enjoyment watching United.
That part and the fact LVG might as well be on a pedestal in terms of being a likeable/funny person compared to Moyes and Mourinho.
One of my best mates is a City fan. He wanted us to beat Newcastle last month & was happy when we turned it around, as he thought the loss would lead to Mourinho's dismissal. He said in our whatsapp group yesterday that he wants us to finish 4th so we keep him for next season. That says it all really.
I don't see it myself. Maybe Inter.
I thought he would get you a few trophies and back to fighting for the league after 2 or 3 transfers windows. With this job being the one he wanted for a long time, a big chunk of cash, i really thought he would change his way a bit and not antagonize everybody. Guess i was wrong and i have to say i'm absolutely loving it. As much as i want him to fail miserably and get booted out of England again, i think that if he manages to ride this season and clean your squad in the summer, there's still something to be done.
As a United fan, I can only imagine fans of other teams must hope he stays and drags United down even further, just waiting for games when the opposition fans start chanting "Mourinho must stay".
Said it for a while but he's the new Wenger in premier league.
A very glorious past but reality is at end of the season he'd have only won one league title since 2011 and very likely not won the CL since 2010.
Yes he still wins cups from time to time (just like Wenger with his 3 FA cups in last 5 years at Arsenal) but he's struggled to adapt his football at the top end of the league, again similar to Wenger from 2008 onwards.
Dosen't help aswell in the early part of this season he was harping back to his past achievements in one of the press conferences, again another Wenger trait in his final years at Arsenal.
I judge him more harshly than other managers around him in the league as likes of Pep, Klopp or Poch don't attack fellow managers for the lack of achievement/conduct during matches.
A very glorious past but reality is at end of the season he'd have only won one league title since 2011 and very likely not won the CL since 2010.
Yes he still wins cups from time to time (just like Wenger with his 3 FA cups in last 5 years at Arsenal) but he's struggled to adapt his football at the top end of the league, again similar to Wenger from 2008 onwards.
Dosen't help aswell in the early part of this season he was harping back to his past achievements in one of the press conferences, again another Wenger trait in his final years at Arsenal.
I judge him more harshly than other managers around him in the league as likes of Pep, Klopp or Poch don't attack fellow managers for the lack of achievement/conduct during matches.
So Chelsea in 2015 just did not happen in your world then? Klopp has not a CL ever but is that relevant ? We won a European cup 2 years ago.
Not sure we can call him a Wenger until he manages 10+ years without a league title
1) I would like to know the players who have improved under Mourinho according to you
2) Is Mourinho the only one man in charge of the recruitment?
2) Is Mourinho the only one man in charge of the recruitment?
Yes it’s why the Newcastle result didn’t do our long term future any good.
A top four finish would be bad if it means Jose stays another few years.
We won’t finish near fourth though thank god.
August 2011-present day so yes the Chelsea league title is one I counted.
Europa league is a bit of an anamoly. Not Mourinho's fault as he inherited team in that competiton but it's not a competition he's previously rated a huge amount in the past other than getting his career up and running at Porto.
Man. United got a kind run in the last rounds, was it Anderlecht, Celta Vigo, Ajax the run from semi finals? Little bit different to Atletico Madrid in the semi finals last year.
If PSG/Liverpool drop in then you could have them, Spurs, Arsenal and Chelsea all as potential semi finalists so much stronger field than 16/17.
Edit: Seems I got that one wrong. Always thought Real Madrid won the league in 10/11 but turns out it was 11/12 so rare second season success at at a club for Mourinho.
This makes no sense.
Porto: 2nd (complete) year - CL & League
Chelsea: League
Inter: Treble
Real: League
Chelsea: League
United: nothing
Seems winning in the 2nd year is the norm :P
European cup? Come on now.
It's a little harsh to suggest that he's the new Wenger. But stating the Europa League as evidence is like claiming LVG and Wenger weren't done as top managers because they won the FA cup. The league title of a few years ago is a better case to put forth.
Regardless I do believe he's no longer one of the best managers on the plent. He's not special anymore and he's been a disappointment for us.
You know my views on fandom & rivalries: I don't take it as seriously as 99.99% of posters on this forum, because I don't really care about that stuff. I used to watch United because they were entertaining - Team after team of genuinely exciting players, playing for the single greatest manager I've seen in my 25 or so years following the Premier League.
Now? Now you're no longer the main attraction when I do chose to watch a United game. I wasn't watching the game yesterday for United - I was watching it for City, the occasion, and then for United. There's more than a dozen teams across Europe I'd choose to spend my time watching before I decided to finish decorating the house or maybe practice some. After that, maybe I'll try catch up with some old friends. Failing that, if Mourinho's United are on, and I've nothing else to do, I'll sit through it.
The capitulation following SAF's retirement was entertaining for a while, but now it's just sad. I'm tired of it. I'm bored of it. I'm sick of watching Mourinho murder football, treating a bit of rain like something you should seek a fallout shelter for...
But you do turn it on at times, and that's the weird thing. Nowhere near enough to justify him keeping his position, mind.
Now? Now you're no longer the main attraction when I do chose to watch a United game. I wasn't watching the game yesterday for United - I was watching it for City, the occasion, and then for United. There's more than a dozen teams across Europe I'd choose to spend my time watching before I decided to finish decorating the house or maybe practice some. After that, maybe I'll try catch up with some old friends. Failing that, if Mourinho's United are on, and I've nothing else to do, I'll sit through it.
The capitulation following SAF's retirement was entertaining for a while, but now it's just sad. I'm tired of it. I'm bored of it. I'm sick of watching Mourinho murder football, treating a bit of rain like something you should seek a fallout shelter for...
But you do turn it on at times, and that's the weird thing. Nowhere near enough to justify him keeping his position, mind.
I honestly think Jose is past his sell by date, he is the new Wenger in many respects.
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