Osimhen v Kane

[Mcking]

are you from nigeria? whats your opinion on osihmen?

He is scintillating, and I'd have him here as our striker, but not over Harry Kane. He is not as polished as Kane as a striker imo, and I'm not going to get carried away by performances in the Serie A.

 

[Lost bear]

Agree with this. Kane is definitely slowing already. He’s not one for a pressing side, and would probably be way over priced. Like the look of Osimhen.

Yep. Both fine players, and I like the creativity that Kane brings, but on balance I’d go for Osimhen as the better mid to long term prospect. Especially with ETH’s coaching, the guy could become even better.

 

[Amarsdd]

The point is that you can't bank on any one year being the year you win the league, because the competition is too intense.

Whether we sign Kane, Osimhen or anyone else, the aim has to be to put us in position to compete for the title over multiple coming seasons, as that's the only way to put yourself in a good position to win it even once. If any signing involves hanging our hat on winning it next year specifically then that's a bad signing.

Liverpool are a case in point. Over five(?) seasons with players at their peak they were really competitive in three of them. And of those three seasons they won the PL just once. That's the reality facing us in terms of how difficult it is to compete in this league and against City particularly. It's simply a nonsense to say "with X player we'll win the league next season", as if signing one particular player makes it some sure thing, or even more likely than not. It wouldn't be at all, regardless of who we sign.

I was just making a point of the next year in response to the post I was replying to. But the point is making the most of our best players in their prime. For us, two of them are Casemiro and Varane for the next 3-4 years. What are the chances we'll have replacements for them after 3-4 years anywhere close to the quality of them? So why not go for it in those 3-4 years while planning for wha comes after. That's where I'd want Kane over Oshimen.

With Kane, we'll have a player in his prime with best chance of hitting the ground running immediately and for 3-4 years. Oshimen looks very good as well, but I just don't trust any attacking players looking great in the Italian league. I don't trust them if they are actually the quality that they are showing in Italy or will they be able to hit the ground running. Nevermind the fact that that he'll cost 1.5-2x more than Kane.

And also banking on the next 3-4 years doesn' mean we can't plan to keep us in position to compete for the title. Having a great spine in the team always provides a better opportunity for younger players to develop around them.

 

[pacifictheme]

May have said this before in this thread but Varane, casemiro, de gea and kane are all very late 20s to 30s. Don't want an entire spine of a team to need replacing at the same time. I don't see Kane having a prolonged career at the top into his 30s.

I would rather get the other guy.

 

[tjb]

May have said this before in this thread but Varane, casemiro, de gea and kane are all very late 20s to 30s. Don't want an entire spine of a team to need replacing at the same time. I don't see Kane having a prolonged career at the top into his 30s.

I would rather get the other guy.

This is my concern with Kane. It's not his age, moreso that he's already at various points shown signs of not being the type of player that can last that long. I worry he may be like Alexis or Ronaldo, in the sense that his poor performances would end up affecting the team as a whole, which would be detrimental to us at this stage.

We need to focus on signing the types of player that ETH would like as a no.9, not just the best available. From his signings, past and discussions on his perfect striker, Osimhen fits more of that mould.

However, a part of me feels that we would be better served getting Goncalo Ramos from Benfica. He also fits that mould, wouldn't cost as much as these two and we could still keep Martial as a rotation option.

Getting a partner for Casemiro, that can also deputise as a DM is also a priority imo. Getting Ramos would allow us have more money to do that.

 

[croadyman]

This is my concern with Kane. It's not his age, moreso that he's already at various points shown signs of not being the type of player that can last that long. I worry he may be like Alexis or Ronaldo, in the sense that his poor performances would end up affecting the team as a whole, which would be detrimental to us at this stage.

We need to focus on signing the types of player that ETH would like as a no.9, not just the best available. From his signings, past and discussions on his perfect striker, Osimhen fits more of that mould.

However, a part of me feels that we would be better served getting Goncalo Ramos from Benfica. He also fits that mould, wouldn't cost as much as these two and we could still keep Martial as a rotation option.

Getting a partner for Casemiro, that can also deputise as a DM is also a priority imo. Getting Ramos would allow us have more money to do that.

You do make a very good point about Ramos allowing us to spend on a quality backup DM and other positions,on the other hand also feel we really need a proven goalscorer so quite torn on what should happen this summer

 

[Ted Lasso]

I remember when there were serious doubts and even outrage at signing Robin van Persie.

In the kind of functional team ETH is building that's the level of impact I would expect from a striker of Kane's quality.

Also think it should be a case of signing both.

 

[Bebestation]

we will be buyng younger RCB & roaming playmaker this summer ~ so this ageing spine would really just be replacing casemiro & kane in 3 years time. Maguire, Mctominay, Elanga, Donny sales could really help us as geting a young cdm to replace mct & help Casemiro too.

 

[Giggsy13]

Osimhen is already on pace this season to have a more decorated career than Kane. Easy choice, take the younger player who isn’t a bottler.

 

[Red_Heisenberg]

This is my concern with Kane. It's not his age, moreso that he's already at various points shown signs of not being the type of player that can last that long. I worry he may be like Alexis or Ronaldo, in the sense that his poor performances would end up affecting the team as a whole, which would be detrimental to us at this stage.

We need to focus on signing the types of player that ETH would like as a no.9, not just the best available. From his signings, past and discussions on his perfect striker, Osimhen fits more of that mould.

However, a part of me feels that we would be better served getting Goncalo Ramos from Benfica. He also fits that mould, wouldn't cost as much as these two and we could still keep Martial as a rotation option.

Getting a partner for Casemiro, that can also deputise as a DM is also a priority imo. Getting Ramos would allow us have more money to do that.

Ramos would not be cheap at all. We'd be buying from a club who has received over 300 million on combined transfers of Enzo Fernandez, Darwin Nunez and Joao Felix.

He's on track to have a similar return as nunez did last season and they got over 80m for him, so this idea that Ramos will come cheap is severely misguided.

You only have to look at the list of their transfers over the last 5 years to know they're staunch negotiators.

 

[Pintu]

With Kane, we'll have a player in his prime with best chance of hitting the ground running immediately and for 3-4 years. Oshimen looks very good as well, but I just don't trust any attacking players looking great in the Italian league. I don't trust them if they are actually the quality that they are showing in Italy or will they be able to hit the ground running. Nevermind the fact that that he'll cost 1.5-2x more than Kane.

This is what made us go for PL-proven Lukaku for a record fee in 2017, while Pool were getting “Serie A fraud” Mo Salah for half the price (no need to go on about Maguire and other PL-proven scams we’ve endured)…. Recruitment has to be about the individual and his own abilities and how they‘d work in the system we want to play.

With your reasoning then Napoli should have tried to sign Immobile (scored 5 more than a still good Ronaldo that year) back in 2020 instead of “Ligue 1 merchant” Osimhen… Or even better they could have gone for the best league in the world the PL, 33 years-old Vardy won the PL golden boot that year followed by Ings and Aubameyang… In your logic any of these players would have been a better signing for Napoli, but look where they are now….

With your logic a top PL club should never go near Chiesa or Kvara, which is just so….

 

[AndySmith1990]

I think Kane would be a much better fit for the team and the way we play

 

[Rozay]

I think Kane would be a much better fit for the team and the way we play

We don’t need Kane in the team for the way we play, Bruno offers the things he does.I’d prefer a striker who wants to have the last touch, not the first touch in an attack.

 

[Raven]

We don’t need Kane in the team for the way we play, Bruno offers the things he does.I’d prefer a striker who wants to have the last touch, not the first touch in an attack.

I haven't seen much of Osimhen but from what I have seen, he looks technically weak and I don't want to end up in a situation where we play with 10 men until we hit the opposition box.

 

[Lecland07]

Osimhen is already on pace this season to have a more decorated career than Kane. Easy choice, take the younger player who isn’t a bottler.

Juventus's 15-point deduction helps a lot. They were storming up the league. It wouldn't have shocked me if they ended up catching Napoli.

 

[Lay]

Juventus's 15-point deduction helps a lot. They were storming up the league. It wouldn't have shocked me if they ended up catching Napoli.

They beat Juventus 5-1 a week before the points deduction.

 

[Pintu]

Juventus's 15-point deduction helps a lot. They were storming up the league. It wouldn't have shocked me if they ended up catching Napoli.

They were storming nothing. Just scraping 1-0 wins against the bottom half until Napoli crushed them…


Since coming back to Juventus Allegri has 2 wins in 22 games vs decent CL teams(including Serie A teams that took part in CL over the last 2 seasons). These 2 wins were both at home and also barely achieved. Chelsea last season and Inter this season.

Without the deduction they‘d be joint fifth with Milan ( Milan destroyed them 3-0 in the first leg)

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[Mainoldo]

I haven't seen much of Osimhen but from what I have seen, he looks technically weak and I don't want to end up in a situation where we play with 10 men until we hit the opposition box.

He’s exactly that which is also why I don’t want him.

But ETH wanted Nunez so maybe he things his work rate will give us more attacking openings.

 

[Rozay]

I haven't seen much of Osimhen but from what I have seen, he looks technically weak and I don't want to end up in a situation where we play with 10 men until we hit the opposition box.

He is technically weak. There is no striker who is strong, fast, skillful with great link up and guarantees 20+ goals so you are already in the game of making trade-offs.

Just as Osimhen is technically weak, Kane is slow, can’t press and wants to play the majority of the game in midfield.

 

[Raven]

He is technically weak. There is no striker who is strong, fast, skillful with great link up and guarantees 20+ goals so you are already in the game of making trade-offs.

Just as Osimhen is technically weak, Kane is slow, can’t press and wants to play the majority of the game in midfield.

I feel we'd be much better with a more technical striker who can bring the rest of the team into play. Don't want another Lukaku.

 

[Bebestation]

Osihmen hopefully has some more scoring CL performances before we spend 120+

 

[Sandikan]

Kane at 25 feels like the sort of signing Fergie would make
Kane at 30 feels like the sort of signing Woodward et al would make.

A huge call to make, but my gut feel is a younger player with potential to become top level, but who has years ahead of him is best.

 

[Rozay]

I feel we'd be much better with a more technical striker who can bring the rest of the team into play. Don't want another Lukaku.

I’d prefer a more technical striker too. But not a hypothetical one. The actual more technical strikers have valid question marks of their own I guess. As does Osimhen.

Ultimately, due to this pros and cons conundrum, I’d be able to see the merit in either signing. I do think Goncalo Ramos could be a good middle ground, but my preference would be to go for Benzema on a free which, due to age, would also allow us to buy the one option who does NOT require compromise in terms of skill set which is Sesko. Sesko has size, speed, technique, link play and arial ability. However, he’s not ready yet and Benzema could well bridge that gap.

 

[Doracle]

We don’t need Kane in the team for the way we play, Bruno offers the things he does.I’d prefer a striker who wants to have the last touch, not the first touch in an attack.

We definitely do need Kane for the way we play. He’s the ideal foil to link up with Bruno, who can then go past him, and benefit from Bruno’s passing ability. He will also link up fantastically with Rashford and Sancho/Antony. He’s basically a version of Martial who scores goals, is rarely injured and has even better link up play.

Osimhen is a risk because it requires a different style of play to the way we currently play and I’m not convinced he will technically be good enough to succeed in the premier league. It might work ok but it would be utter madness to purchase him if we have the choice of Kane or him.

 

[ole@thewheel]

I think we ever signed a Seria A player that would be considered success.

Osimhen for that price would be a huge risk. Between these two, I dont even know why this is up for discussion.

Kane would still have at least 3 years to play in top level, is proven quality and has still a lot to prove.

 

[Raven]

I’d prefer a more technical striker too. But not a hypothetical one. The actual more technical strikers have valid question marks of their own I guess. As does Osimhen.

Ultimately, due to this pros and cons conundrum, I’d be able to see the merit in either signing. I do think Goncalo Ramos could be a good middle ground, but my preference would be to go for Benzema on a free which, due to age, would also allow us to buy the one option who does NOT require compromise in terms of skill set which is Sesko. Sesko has size, speed, technique, link play and arial ability. However, he’s not ready yet and Benzema could well bridge that gap.

I'd definitely prefer Ramos to Osimhen. I'd be slow to go for another stop gap unless we're buying Sesko in the same window.

 

[Rozay]

We definitely do need Kane for the way we play. He’s the ideal foil to link up with Bruno, who can then go past him, and benefit from Bruno’s passing ability. He will also link up fantastically with Rashford and Sancho/Antony. He’s basically a version of Martial who scores goals, is rarely injured and has even better link up play.

Osimhen is a risk because it requires a different style of play to the way we currently play and I’m not convinced he will technically be good enough to succeed in the premier league. It might work ok but it would be utter madness to purchase him if we have the choice of Kane or him.

He’s also significantly less mobile than Martial, which can’t be overlooked.

And I don’t see how the ‘perfect foil for Bruno’ is another player who wants to be a #10. Closest thing as I’ve seen to the perfect striker for Bruno is Jamie Vardy in his prime. If Bruno had his way he’d swing the ball in behind with his first touch every time he gets the ball, wherever he gets it. Jamie Vardy can’t do anything else than that sort of game. Bruno likes to put it in behind and it certainly won’t be for Harry Kane.

I’d say the ‘way we like to play’ is quick transitions. If we were a team like Barcelona or City, I’d think Kane would suit perfectly (and Bruno less so). I don’t see the two of them being any sort of perfect match. Kane isn’t explosive and is a slow technician whereas Bruno is not a master technician who excels in the short game - he prefers open spaces and a longer game.

I don’t see Osimhen as the perfect striker either, for the record.

 

[sullydnl]

We definitely do need Kane for the way we play. He’s the ideal foil to link up with Bruno, who can then go past him, and benefit from Bruno’s passing ability. He will also link up fantastically with Rashford and Sancho/Antony. He’s basically a version of Martial who scores goals, is rarely injured and has even better link up play.

Osimhen is a risk because it requires a different style of play to the way we currently play and I’m not convinced he will technically be good enough to succeed in the premier league. It might work ok but it would be utter madness to purchase him if we have the choice of Kane or him.

I wouldn't take Martial as the prototype of the striker ETH would prefer just because he's been the most favoured of the very limited options ETH inherited in that position as part of a team currently playing a compromised version of the style of football he wants us to play.

We have the rest of ETH's time as a manager to look at too, where something like 90% of his games have featured players like Haller, Huntelaar, Dolberg, Lassina and Brobbey at CF. Then in the summer we were strongly linked with Nunez, Arnautovic and Sesko. And the one CF he has brought in so far is Wout Weghorst. These aren't stylistically identical players but they give you a better idea of the profile of CF he actually prefers. And I would say it's a lot closer to an Osimhen than a Martial and certainly not a group of players who tend to drop deep and create for others in the way Kane has in some recent seasons.

 

[Rozay]

I'd definitely prefer Ramos to Osimhen. I'd be slow to go for another stop gap unless we're buying Sesko in the same window.

This was my suggestion.

I’d possibly prefer Ramos to Osimhen too. But these things are not linear. Not even nearly. Harry Kane has significantly better link play and technical attributes than Erling Haaland, for example. Yet I’d take Haaland over Kane any day of the week, due to the fact that what he does excel at, he does to an extreme measure. It remains to be seen for sure, but there is a possibility that Osimhen is in a similar bracket in the sense that he is physically superior to most defenders he’d come up against and there’s a strong possibility that he’d also just score a shitload of goals. Ultimately, you are playing an actual footballer, not a list of attributes.

 

[Raven]

This was my suggestion.

I’d possibly prefer Ramos to Osimhen too. But these things are not linear. Not even nearly. Harry Kane has significantly better link play and technical attributes than Erling Haaland, for example. Yet I’d take Haaland over Kane any day of the week, due to the fact that what he does excel at, he does to an extreme measure. It remains to be seen for sure, but there is a possibility that Osimhen is in a similar bracket in the sense that he is physically superior to most defenders he’d come up against and there’s a strong possibility that he’d also just score a shitload of goals. Ultimately, you are playing an actual footballer, not a list of attributes.

Osimhen may well work for us but you can see how we struggle to get up the pitch already, adding a technically limited poacher is only going to make that worse.

 

[Rozay]

Osimhen may well work for us but you can see how we struggle to get up the pitch already, adding a technically limited poacher is only going to make that worse.

But I’m sure you would gladly take Haaland.

And I don’t see that we struggle to get up the pitch in any case, and even then, I’d expect that to improve with a quality midfield addition.

In the literal sense, a striker who can actually run and stretch opponents will always help get a team up the pitch. And I don’t see the team Osimhen currently leads the line for as struggling to get up the pitch either.

 

[Raven]

But I’m sure you would gladly take Haaland.

And I don’t see that we struggle to get up the pitch in any case, and even then, I’d expect that to improve with a quality midfield addition.

In the literal sense, a striker who can actually run and stretch opponents will always help get a team up the pitch. And I don’t see the team Osimhen currently leads the line for as struggling to get up the pitch either.

I'd take Haaland but he's not my preferred profile of striker.

 

[Amarsdd]

This is what made us go for PL-proven Lukaku for a record fee in 2017, while Pool were getting “Serie A fraud” Mo Salah for half the price (no need to go on about Maguire and other PL-proven scams we’ve endured)…. Recruitment has to be about the individual and his own abilities and how they‘d work in the system we want to play.

With your reasoning then Napoli should have tried to sign Immobile (scored 5 more than a still good Ronaldo that year) back in 2020 instead of “Ligue 1 merchant” Osimhen… Or even better they could have gone for the best league in the world the PL, 33 years-old Vardy won the PL golden boot that year followed by Ings and Aubameyang… In your logic any of these players would have been a better signing for Napoli, but look where they are now….

With your logic a top PL club should never go near Chiesa or Kvara, which is just so….

First of all, exception doesn’t prove the rule, so when you bring up Salah I can give you Lukaku coming from Inter, Higuain, etc and a ton more if we're talking about other than the Italian league. Second, you’re comparing Lukaku, Maguire vs Kane, not in terms of type of player, but the quality of player and also the state of the team they were/will be coming into? Third, I’m all for signing your 50-60m player who you can give time to bed in, but not a 120m+ player who we want to be the spine and the lynchpin of the team from get go as we have no one in his position.

Hey, I’m all for players like Kvara, who I don’t think will have the same pressure to perform right away given the cover we have in the wings.

 

[Rozay]

I'd take Haaland but he's not my preferred profile of striker.

Exactly, but you’d take him anyway because what he IS good at, he is good in the extreme. That is the argument with Osimhen too. As I said, you can’t have everything. If being a target to being others into play was all that mattered, you’d probably take Weghorst over Osimhen. But I doubt you would.

Osimhen is an option because he is Osimhen, not due to profile alone. If his strengths are so good, we may decide we are better off as a team playing to them. In an ideal world, I’d take a 25 year old Sesko who scores 20 goals. Which is basically what Martial is if he could be relied upon. Outside of that, it becomes a question of trade offs. Kane has hold up play and great goalscoring. He will likely have a great impact here. He’s also 30. And doesn’t press and limits our ability to stretch teams. So while good, not ‘perfect’. Osimhen has great speed and physicality and is also a goalscorer. Also presses very well. He’s probably get 20 here. But his touch is poor and will struggle to link with others. He’s a long term option.

There are others in between who have bits of everything, but possibly not enough of anything. Gabriel Jesus does everything brilliantly except score 20 a season. It’s all a question of trade-offs and compromises, and also availability.

I think I’d be content with any of the options mentioned, for different reasons. I don’t see Kane as the perfect choice, I don’t see Osimhen as the perfect choice. The only ‘perfect’ profile in my eyes is Sesko.

 

[Raven]

Exactly, but you’d take him anyway because what he IS good at, he is good in the extreme. That is the argument with Osimhen too. As I said, you can’t have everything. If being a target to being others into play was all that mattered, you’d probably take Weghorst over Osimhen. But I doubt you would.

Osimhen is an option because he is Osimhen, not due to profile alone. If his strengths are so good, we may decide we are better off as a team playing to them. In an ideal world, I’d take a 25 year old Sesko who scores 20 goals. Which is basically what Martial is if he could be relied upon. Outside of that, it becomes a question of trade offs. Kane has hold up play and great goalscoring. He will likely have a great impact here. He’s also 30. And doesn’t press and limits our ability to stretch teams. So while good, not ‘perfect’. Osimhen has great speed and physicality and is also a goalscorer. Also presses very well. He’s probably get 20 here. But his touch is poor and will struggle to link with others. He’s a long term option.

There are others in between who have bits of everything, but possibly not enough of anything. Gabriel Jesus does everything brilliantly except score 20 a season. It’s all a question of trade-offs and compromises, and also availability.

I think I’d be content with any of the options mentioned, for different reasons. I don’t see Kane as the perfect choice, I don’t see Osimhen as the perfect choice. The only ‘perfect’ profile in my eyes is Sesko.

Osimhen ain't Haaland though. Out of the options currently available, Kane wins hands down for me

 

[Rozay]

Osimhen ain't Haaland though. Out of the options currently available, Kane wins hands down for me

If Osimhen scores 30 goals a season then he’s effectively Haaland for us, whether Haaland scores 45 or not, matters little. The principle is the same. Osimhen is very similar to Haaland in many ways tbh, and we’ll see how many goals he ends up with this season.

 

[Raven]

If Osimhen scores 30 goals a season then he’s effectively Haaland for us, whether Haaland scores 45 or not, matters little. The principle is the same. Osimhen is very similar to Haaland in many ways tbh, and we’ll see how many goals he ends up with this season.

If he's as good as Haaland then fair enough, I just see that as extremely unlikely.

 

[Yorkeontop]

Get me the next coming of Drogba please.

 

[Rozay]

If he's as good as Haaland then fair enough, I just see that as extremely unlikely.

I don’t think he has to be, on the basis that the alternative also has question marks. If Kane was younger and faster, it wouldn’t even matter if he was as good as Haaland, Kane would be the obvious choice. We are weighing up a number of imperfect options. Osimhen has a few things that puts him in the convo for his own reasons, and Kane has different things that put him in it. There’s no option that takes away the conversation altogether though, unfortunately.

 

[Doracle]

He’s also significantly less mobile than Martial, which can’t be overlooked.

And I don’t see how the ‘perfect foil for Bruno’ is another player who wants to be a #10. Closest thing as I’ve seen to the perfect striker for Bruno is Jamie Vardy in his prime. If Bruno had his way he’d swing the ball in behind with his first touch every time he gets the ball, wherever he gets it. Jamie Vardy can’t do anything else than that sort of game. Bruno likes to put it in behind and it certainly won’t be for Harry Kane.

I’d say the ‘way we like to play’ is quick transitions. If we were a team like Barcelona or City, I’d think Kane would suit perfectly (and Bruno less so). I don’t see the two of them being any sort of perfect match. Kane isn’t explosive and is a slow technician whereas Bruno is not a master technician who excels in the short game - he prefers open spaces and a longer game.

I don’t see Osimhen as the perfect striker either, for the record.

He definitely isn’t less mobile than current Martial - who sadly looks like he is running through treacle after his various injuries - but still is good enough as a link man to work well for us. Kane is far more able to get around the pitch and probably has better acceleration now.

Kane is the perfect striker. I’d have preferred to have got him 2 years ago but he should have 5 years at top level left, so not a major issue. Benz and Lewa are the only comparable players in world football and they are 5 years older. We get Kane and it’s our best signing since Cantona.