I think Marco Rose will take it. Nagelsmann I'm not sure. He rejected Real Madrid
Our managers actually are being backed.
- Thread starter UnofficialDevil
- Start date
I believe Rose would take it too.
Honestly I believe nothing I read in newspapers regarding United . There are a few decent sources and apart from that it's a guessing game . We wasted another transfer window which we will continue to do while the people who run the club are there
Not really. Comparing Real's squad and our squad at that time? Comparing the strength difference between Real and the rest of La Liga and Man Utd and the rest of EPL?
Not to mention the strategic roles the players play and how the loss of the players impacts the strategy is totally different. Getting a target man and refusing to get a winger knowing your squad has no other winger is different from getting Jovic instead of Mbappe.
Each failure of the "structure" to recruit the right players has a bigger impact to us than any failure has to those other clubs.
For a young manager on the rise weighing the pros and cons:
Pros:
- One of the biggest clubs in world football
- Large war-chest and club appeal
- A squad of young players to be developed
- Extensive scouting network and strong staff
- The chance to take United to glory again
- Failure is relative and may not damage one's reputation entirely (Cautionary tale: AVB)
Cons:
- Suspisions of institutional failure within the organization, from the boardroom to the training pitch, that goes way beyond what a manager can fix
- Prospects of working under a banker incapable of roster management
- Track record of failing to back managers just before firing them
- Ownership concerned more with ads and dividends than operations, at the expense of player health and development
- Immense competition within the League that precludes guarantees of CL football
Zidane wanted Pogba to refresh a aging midfielder in Modric. Instead he had to promote a 21 year old Valverde.
It's exactly the same the difference is Madrid isn't our club but if they was you'd be moaning saying the board failed to deliver Zidane's top target and how is he suppose to win the league and Champions league with this.
Not just price of player but the wages to, Sanchez for starters which then leads to other players wanting higher wages.
That’s a very informative and intelligent comment
I’m pretty happy with the majority of Ole’s signing it’s the people higher up who negotiate fee’s and wages that’s what’s draining resources and clubs then stand up to us with there price as they know we will budge.
Nope. Madrid's squad and our squad are at different levels and just comparing them to their competition compared Man Utd's squad to their competition is totally different.
Madrid's squad was ageing and done... before Zidane come back. Don't forget that, they lost C.Ron went through 2 managers and was on the road to nowhere.
They needed a rebuild and new direction. The brought in kids mixed it with experience and the right manager and won the league. So don't tell me there on another planet squad wise than us, there best player is Karim Benzema and there captain is older than Edison Cavani. Take that in.
Assessing the success of a signing has to include transfer fee - Ole knew he was giving up 130 mil of his budget for those two players, so he is equally responsible for that.
It's funny because I agree with the wages but Sanchez has nothing to do with it and the wage scale hasn't increased after Sanchez and it's not a negotiation issue either, it's all about leverage and what the club can offer to players that are in demand, basically United can't offer the prospect of playing for one of the in vogue managers and we can't offer top silverware either.
Now, I do agree that the board has agreed on giving some outrages wages but again the issue isn't the likes of Sanchez who was a cheap transfer for a player that was supposed to be a top player, his wage was normal when you look at what is paid on the continent by top teams for top players. Our issue is with squad players, those are a dime a dozen and should never be paid the way we do, now quite ironically those are also the players that the fanbase and our managers have been enamoured with, not realizing that they are the ones that we should get rid of regardless of how much we like them because put together they cost a fortune for almost no return, an example will be Romero who allegedly earns 3.4m£ per year, Bailly at 4m£ per year or Lindelof 6m£.
A player Sanchez was a supposed top player that didn't perform which will happen but we can't justify the wages paid before that to players that were squad players or prospects that shouldn't be near starter wages.
I've not seen enough of the lad(a video here, a video there) but what I have seen i've never once thought I hope we go hard for him so to speak even at the height of the rumours, he may well go on to be an all time great though I doubt it, and if I had to choose between him and Greenwood i'd go for our Academy Grad over him 11 times out of 10. A true generational talent.
United history is littered with big money signings that haven't been able to cut it/hack it at Old Trafford and I had the horrible feeling(probably shared by Ole and the Board) that if Sancho rocked up as our first ever £100m player he'd have been crushed by the expectancy. You can have all the confidence in the world but once you pull on that Red shirt you've go nowhere to hide and everybody has and wants to share their opinion of you. It was hard enough 15/20 years ago, now with ex-players aplenty not engaging their brain before talking to the media it's even harder. Hi Gary, hi Paul, hi Rio, the list goes on.
To get closer to Liverpool and City we didn't necessarily need to splash the cash we just need to find the team that only lost 3 games in 26/27 in the second part of last season, and the one that is currently unbeaten away from home in 17, something i'm not sure SAF ever did even in the Glory years, apart from maybe '99
I'm still 100% Ole in, and the Board can only do what the Manager wants re. transfers.
I agree with everything you said apart from the last part. What you should have wrote was the manager can only work with what the board provides for him . That's were we differ I think
Easy way to find out if they'd take the Gig, i've got their number here give 'em a ring:
Nien Nien Nien ....
Obviously holding out for Manchester United.
So you just acknowledged that they recruited new players for the manager. That's good enough for me.
We lost against cryst palace.
Stop playing victim. Ole has spend north of 300m during his tenure.
It's good enough to finish top 4.
It sure damn good enough to deal with CP, BHA, and Hotspur
Come on, every team loses games! We did get too 4 last season!
Man City should be beating Leicester and Liverpool should be beating Villa as well.
It’s way too early to say Ole won’t get the team top 4 when he literally did it no less than 2 months ago...
I'm not fuzed about a loss, it happens.
I'm fuzed that after 2 years and 200M spent we still don't know what we're trying to do, how we're trying to play.
Tell me what system are we building for the last 2 years?
Fast transitions...high press...fluid front three... something something cultural reset
So have we
He's been backed with money. But he's not got the players he wanted. Haaland Bellingham Sancho n Grealish were key targets. Ed delivered none of them.
Some people make such a big deal out of Sancho I feel like. Okay, fair enough we were missing out on a world class young player.
But had he joined us, do you think he would have prevented the 3-1 loss against Palace and after that, an embarrassment of a performance against Tottenham?
I don't know, I think it's Ole's responsibility too. His squad isn't exactly at bad level, he actually has some good players and if almost all of them played shit, it's hard to think that they happened to play like shit at the same time. Don't we need a manager capable of motivating his players anymore? is that outdated? is the new way is to let players go out and enjoy the game? is this the new meta? like ball playing centre backs.
But had he joined us, do you think he would have prevented the 3-1 loss against Palace and after that, an embarrassment of a performance against Tottenham?
I don't know, I think it's Ole's responsibility too. His squad isn't exactly at bad level, he actually has some good players and if almost all of them played shit, it's hard to think that they happened to play like shit at the same time. Don't we need a manager capable of motivating his players anymore? is that outdated? is the new way is to let players go out and enjoy the game? is this the new meta? like ball playing centre backs.
Ole's the manager version of pogba. They both need everything lined up perfectly for them in order for them to succeed.
It's never their fault that they're not meeting expectations, it's always the team or the board letting them down.
It's never their fault that they're not meeting expectations, it's always the team or the board letting them down.
So you are saying top 4 should be the target with this squad. Then why was Ole being vilified for finishing 3rd and people are turning on him after just 3 games.
3 very bad games which tells alot he's not good enough
If this continues till early November, can see him under immense pressure and even getting sacked but also his history here as a manager suggests he knows how to turn it around. Last year we were losing to Bournemouth and drawing to Villa at home and were 10th and had spurs home and city away back to back and we managed to beat both of them. Anything can happen.
True. But that's a sign of a clueless manager that doesnt even know how to make it works.
Good managers lost an odd game but their progress is steady. It's not because of "stranger things happens"
No doubt, no doubt, so the question should be why we continually try to match progress with amount spent or "not" spent? Internal improvement is a foreign concept on here and even worse is this misbelief that we should expect to regress unless specific name are bought. Let me not speak in platitudes and be specific, this squad finished 3rd had key depth additions this summer, I should not expect us to regress because it wasn't Sancho or Grealish. In fact I think we can and should expect to improve even if we don't win the title or any major competition, if not by the signings this summer then by internal improvement of what we already have. That was supposed to be the point of assembling a young core
Haaland and Bellingham choice to develop at a different club and different manager. I mean we even got Fergie out for Bellingham. It had nothing to do with Ed. I’m sure if Fergie was actually managing those players would have been here. It’s not like we couldn’t afford them. Grealish cost £80m. I suppose we could have got him instead of chasing Sancho but he plays on the left not the right so it would have solved nothing. If VDB has anything to go by he would have just been on the bench anyway.
If backed means undermined then sure. Whoever has been playing fm upstairs has made a royal mess out of spending all that money.
Ed wouldn’t match Dortmund’s wage for bellingham and wouldn’t go for a release clause in Halands contract. The halands also said it felt like only Ole really wanted him at United. That’s on Ed and the glazers. I don’t think they have a big problem signing players but even being kind about 80% of what we’ve bought has been just been more problems. The first team scouting has been way off.
Can you please remind us what was our expectation of last season?
Where's the better football, fitness and picking players on form and not based on their name?
These are what Ole promised we'll see and yet you've underperforming players having a stinker without any issues while everyone bar the front 3 hasn't improved.
But sure that's on the board I guess.
So according to you, the first 11 Ole select was not best players we have?
Its like you haven't watch us last season and just watch last 3 match.
Its not like our fooball was always bad, or none of our players improve.
Try to look beyond last 3 games.
Also I am taking about season expectation, would you happy if we play good football but miss top 4 this season?
Your initial post basically implied Madrid failed to back Zidane.So have we
That's misleading.
We had 1 preseason game. Palace had 4 preseason game and 2 competitive matches. Not to mention this team depends a lot on physical fitness and pressing to deploy their tactics.
Klopp got to that point because the rest of his side was sorted. It also wasn't sorted by buying players worth half a gazillion pounds. Let's put it like this, their current vaunted front 3 was bought for how much it would cost us just to buy Sancho. They know what they are doing and we are rudderless.
Also you say that's what Ole needed and most would agree with you but is that what Ole wanted? I don't remember us being linked with many Center backs, holding mids or any strikers. The one you can point to is Sancho and we got Traore instead and he's also a huge talent. It's clear Ole sees Martial is our striker for the present and future.
He wanted that attacking midfielder hence he got him. Probably thought we needed depth in that area. He's been back but like our past managers he simply doesn't know what he's doing. Pools defence is cheaper than ours, so is their midfield yet our managers aren't being backed. Why sanction the signing of maguire and AWB for 130 million if we have other needs?
The sooner we get a manager who knows what they're doing the better. Ancelotti is rolling on a limited budget and he's already gotten players he needs to improve the side and has his players playing his system. Yet at our club managers spend 7 times that money and we should expect capitulation. This is madness.