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2021-22 Performances


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RedSky

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One day you´ll injure yourself at work in a way that makes your unable to work for a while. Then I hope you´re man enough not to expect any support. I mean, your work place is not a fecking charity, is it.
If I was earning a salary of over £2.5 million a year, I think i'd manage.
 

golden_blunder

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You'll never get full support though. In an ideal world everyone in the stands would hold hands and throw roses at our players every minute. But we all get pissed off at our players being dumb or doing dumb shit. Some have irrational hatred towards Pogba, some can't stand Lingard etc etc.

Phil Jones is just another name on that list who has repeatidly done dumb shit, but has somehow avoided the axe every single time. It's a shame his career went this way and it's also a double shame that bordering on 30 he doesn't have the appetite for regular first team football, because it's clear as day he'll never get that at United now. Hasn't had that since 14/15. Hope for his sake he stays clear of injuries and leaves next summer so he can actually attempt to play professional football before he retires.
Sorry but what “dumb shit” do you refer to apart from putting his body on the line for the team?
 

RedSky

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Sorry but what “dumb shit” do you refer to apart from putting his body on the line for the team?
Out of position, runs up the pitch to challenge for a header, misses it and leaves a huge space behind. Used to do that on a regular basis. He's just not a very smart footballer, had decent initial talent but never built on it, in part due to injuries and in part due to simply not developing his game. It happens, that's the risk of signing young talents, they don't always work out.
 

golden_blunder

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Out of position, runs up the pitch to challenge for a header, misses it and leaves a huge space behind. Used to do that on a regular basis. He's just not a very smart footballer, had decent initial talent but never built on it, in part due to injuries and in part due to simply not developing his game. It happens, that's the risk of signing young talents, they don't always work out.
I’d still have a half fit Jones over Bailly.
 

RC89

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He really was an outrageous prospect. Very different order of prospect to Evans. Just think back to Fergies comments about him and comparisons to greats like Duncan Edwards. Nobody talked about Evans in those terms.
Fergie also compared Macheda to Ronaldo despite clearly not being anywhere near an outrageous prospect.
 

AjaxCunian

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Why do we need to support Jones? He doesn’t belong here on merit, he is a very average player even if fully fit (which in itself is unimaginable) and continues to receive his high wages for nothing for many a year already.

Supporting Jones (or Andreas for that matter), we support mediocrity - and that’s not a trajectory a club of Man Utd calibre and legacy shall follow.

If a player is clearly not good enough (for whatever reason), the right decision is to part ways with him, not to support such player despite clear facts.
I think we take the term support differently, I might mean just not abuse him as he hasnt really done nothing wrong and hope that he will do well as long as he is at the club. I think that shouldnt be very long.
 

UNITED ACADEMY

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To piss the fans off? That´s your take on it? Not because he wants to restore his name and reputation, because of all the abuse he has received the last few years? Honesty, I think you´re pretty far off.
Come on mate, you really think people will just appreciate footballer by sitting on the bench or at home? Being 5th choice is not the way to restore his name and reputation. Finding new club to play regularly and prove it to people is the way to restore them. You get credit when playing not by sitting and doing nothing. Look at Lingard for example, went on loan to West Ham and he restored his name and reputation.
 

stevoc

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Well it wouldn't be in a journalists interest to sensationally overstate what he's earning at all would it?

Any of the sites listing footballers earnings have him on £70-75k a week, the only place I've seen anyone claiming he's on £130k a week is the tweet from that journalist.
And where do those sites get their salary information?

Most likely from articles that reported his contract extension, which are of course written by journalists. So it's all just guess work as I doubt the club ever confirms a players earnings.

Now I doubt he's on £130k myself but seeing as it was some terrible business in the first place to give such an injury prone player a new 5 year deal, you never know.
 

mu4c_20le

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Come on mate, you really think people will just appreciate footballer by sitting on the bench or at home? Being 5th choice is not the way to restore his name and reputation. Finding new club to play regularly and prove it to people is the way to restore them. You get credit when playing not by sitting and doing nothing. Look at Lingard for example, went on loan to West Ham and he restored his name and reputation.
What reputation?
 

Eyepopper

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And where do those sites get their salary information?

Most likely from articles that reported his contract extension, which are of course written by journalists. So it's all just guess work as I doubt the club ever confirms a players earnings.

Now I doubt he's on £130k myself but seeing as it was some terrible business in the first place to give such an injury prone player a new 5 year deal, you never know.
The point is people shouldn't lose their shit and jump on the joke of a club bandwagon due to one random tweet saying he's on £130k, when every other source available says he's on almost half that.
 

golden_blunder

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You're pretty much alone in this opinion though. Maybe you're right and literally everybody else in football is wrong. Unlikely though
Bailly is not as good as a fit Jones (for being the word here)
 

arthurka

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Strange attitude to a player with an injury
Some on this forum have issues. How can anybody think that Jones isn't giving his all.. He has had such a torrid time with injuries that it's almost beyond belief. People seem to have forgotten just how good this guy was at 18-19 years old. He was meant to become one of the best but he turned out to be a faulty specimen after all. I just feel so sorry for him. Imagine turning down your 10 year charity match because you thought no one would bother showing up. That's just so sad really.
 

Gandalf

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Just to reiterate for those who blame Jones for signing the last contract extension which is a pretty weird take in itself. The argument seems to be that he should have declined and pushed for a transfer because he was not a big part of the clubs future but in all honesty that was not the situation at the time he signed.

In Mar 2019 we had Bailly and Lindelof who had both been less than stellar up to that point, Smalling who was clearly out of favour and Rojo who was being frozen out and was a nutcase. The previous summer he had been part of an England team that made it to the World Cup semi finals and with the sacking of Mourinho and at the time his own return to full fitness he had every reason to think that at 27 years old he was in a great position to nail down one of the starting CB positions in our team even if we did end up signing Maguire. Of course it all went to hell in a handcart over the following months but he could not have known that would happen and like all professional athletes he was focused on the positives and not thinking negatively. In hindsight we can say what happened was inevitable although I think we give ourselves too much credit there but even if it was then tghe fault for the contract lies with Woodward, not Jones. I won't blame him or criticize him for simply getting injured and I hope he does return to the team this year and prove his problems are behind him, I do think that if he manages that and is still 5th choice once his fitness is proven he will willingly move to get regular first team football but that won't happen until he proves it on the pitch for us.
 

Mentality Monsters

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Honestly, I don't get statements like this. Phil Jones should have been sold 4/5 seasons ago and the fact he's still here on the wages he's on is honestly bewildering. I know some people use Fellaini as an example of how this club fell apart, but Phil Jones is a significantly better example of how inept the club has been run by Woodward. I don't have anything against Jones, but why is it close to 2022 and he's still a United player? I mean seriously, it's baffling.
Agree with this.

We're not a charity. If you're not contributing, or cannot contribute, then you need to be moved on. By the time his latest contract comes to an end, his wages over the last 4 years would have cost the club nearly £25 million.

And this is where the idea that we need to extend players contracts to protect their value is a complete false economy. In what world does it make more sense to extend on a long term contract (costing the club £25 million in wages) rather than getting rid a couple of years ago for a small fee (say £8 - £10 million) and then also not having his wage as a burden to the club.

I also agree his situation, more than others, is indicative of what has happened to this club since Woodward took over. For all of Fellaini's faults, he was available when called upon. It may not be his fault, but Jones is a liability who has shown he cannot be replied upon.
 

stevoc

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Jones gives 100% all the time. He is so unfortunate he has this injury history.
He is not just a CB. He is also an option as a DM.
Not sure how people determine this. And to be honest I doubt there's any footballer or any person in any industry that puts in 100% effort, 100% of the time.

Not that there's anything wrong with this its only natural.
 

Red Royal

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Not sure how people determine this. And to be honest I doubt there's any footballer or any person in any industry that puts in 100% effort, 100% of the time.

Not that there's anything wrong with this its only natural.
Agreed, really annoys me when people say he gave "110%" effort... that isn't possible!!
 

Alemar

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Jones gives 100% all the time.
I, for one, don’t give a flying feck - his efforts yield us exactly ZERO value for quite a few seasons already. In this situation it is irrelevant, whether or not he gives 100, 80 or 50%
 

Dve

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If I was earning a salary of over £2.5 million a year, I think i'd manage.
I´d understand this "he does not deserve the fans support" if he didn´t give his all for the shirt. But he does. Every time I´ve seen him play. If you don´t think he deserves our support because he´s been injured, that tells a hell lot about you.
 

Al-T

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Agree with this.

We're not a charity. If you're not contributing, or cannot contribute, then you need to be moved on. By the time his latest contract comes to an end, his wages over the last 4 years would have cost the club nearly £25 million.

And this is where the idea that we need to extend players contracts to protect their value is a complete false economy. In what world does it make more sense to extend on a long term contract (costing the club £25 million in wages) rather than getting rid a couple of years ago for a small fee (say £8 - £10 million) and then also not having his wage as a burden to the club.

I also agree his situation, more than others, is indicative of what has happened to this club since Woodward took over. For all of Fellaini's faults, he was available when called upon. It may not be his fault, but Jones is a liability who has shown he cannot be replied upon.
Totally agree.

I've nothing against Jones and I suspect he's on more like £75k per week than £130k. Even so, that's still £15,600,000 over the term of his contract.

Sadly, assessment of his quality has become secondary to his inability to stay fit. Given how rarely he's actually available for selection, it's hard to see what value the club are/were seeking to protect. He's unlikely to attract interest from the top sides. Clubs that might be interested will baulk at taking a chance on such an injury prone player and his wages are likely to be a sticking point.

Fully expect he'll be here until his existing contract expires. At the moment, there's surely no reason to then renew it.
 

Dve

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On a different note - not related to him deserves our support and such - is whether he´ll make it into our 25 man PL squad for the season. As of today, one of James, Lingard or Jones look most likely to be left out as there are 26 players over 21 in the squad, and unless James or Lingard is being sold, Jones may find himself surplus to requirements, knowing that McTominay also can play DC.
 

RedSky

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I´d understand this "he does not deserve the fans support" if he didn´t give his all for the shirt. But he does. Every time I´ve seen him play. If you don´t think he deserves our support because he´s been injured, that tells a hell lot about you.
I don't think he deserves our full support. There is a difference between supporting someone and giving full unconditional support. I would hope all of our players gives everything for the shirt, those that don't should be fecked off immediately, it's one of the positive things Oles done to this club bringing in the right players who will give everything. Either way, we will not see eye to eye on this, I don't think footballers should be worshipped like demi gods and think the wages they get paid are, well farcical. I will therefore never feel sorry for a player who gets paid millions a year. It's very sad to see a young player at the start of their career have it ruined by a serious injury, but a seasoned pro who's been earning a shed load of money each season, deserves no pity. I'll reserve my sadness for those that are living on the streets or struggling to feed their children. If that makes me a bad guy, so be it.
 

Blood Mage

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Some on this forum have issues. How can anybody think that Jones isn't giving his all.. He has had such a torrid time with injuries that it's almost beyond belief. People seem to have forgotten just how good this guy was at 18-19 years old. He was meant to become one of the best but he turned out to be a faulty specimen after all. I just feel so sorry for him. Imagine turning down your 10 year charity match because you thought no one would bother showing up. That's just so sad really.
Well said
 

zenith

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Not sure how to feel about Jones and his current situation. Frankly, no club would be willing to take him on at this point unless he agrees to a pay as you play type contract.

He and the club have no other option than to stand by each other and hopefully he can get a few early going cup games where we can keep a few clean sheets.
 

Jericho

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Is it possible some of his injuries are things that other players are able to get on with? I remember awhile back a conversation about a player, Sturridge I think but I don't remember, where it was suggested that if they weren't 100% then they were 'injured', but that the truth is that most players aren't 100% and are always carrying some kind of niggle.
 

Isotope

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He's been out for close to 2 years. Let him play in reserve for a month or so, to prove his fitness and quality.
We don't need him in first team anyway. At least for now.
 

McGrathsipan

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The business model is soft.
Players are assets and are paid to perform.
He's not able to perform because he's always fecking injured so he is doing very well to be getting lots of money the whole time.

Football wise you'd have a certain amount of pity but in life no. None.
He's very wealthy.
 

Andy_Cole

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Is it possible some of his injuries are things that other players are able to get on with? I remember awhile back a conversation about a player, Sturridge I think but I don't remember, where it was suggested that if they weren't 100% then they were 'injured', but that the truth is that most players aren't 100% and are always carrying some kind of niggle.
Hargreaves - Ferguson thought it was in his head I believe.
 

Andycoleno9

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Jones gives 100% all the time. He is so unfortunate he has this injury history.
He is not just a CB. He is also an option as a DM.
And? That is some kind of new standard for Man Utd player?
Option for dmc? With his technique and sense for positioning? Bloody hell, he is last player who should play there.
 

Foxbatt

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I am sure he would have gone if anyone was interested in him and United agrees to the fee. It is ridiculous to say that he should have turned down the new contract. It is the club who should take responsibility to sell him. He is a professional footballer and it is the club who should look to offload him. Give him a free transfer and also the club hiring him some money if United wants to get rid of him so badly.
 

E-mal

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Hope he’s fit and ready to go because I don’t think Bailly will hang around once he realises he’s 4th choice
He is dumb if he didnt realise it immediately. Wouldn't be bother if both him and Jones are sold and we get a promising young quick defender or even someone like Rice that can also play in that role when we are stretched.