Pogba Future

[Mainoldo]

Like Koke, Saul, Rakatic, Rodri, Arthur, Vidal, Fabian Ruiz, Allan etc right on what planet does the EPL have the world best midfielders...

You just named 2 teams players Allan would get eaten alive in the Prem.

 

[Cassidy]

You just named 2 teams players Allan would get eaten alive in the Prem.

As opposed to the 3 teams players mentioned in the post I quoted? One not even being a midfielder?

BTW I named 3 teams not 2, and disagree on Allan

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Who deserved it then?

Problem with Pogba is that he's our talisman, our star player and the leader of our team. He fails to deliver on that status time and time again. His performances in big games are seldom to be seen. I can think of one in his whole time with us and that was City away last season.

I think the player he's most like is Ozil for Arsenal. They do great numbers but there's just something missing.

 

[UncleBob]

A bloke on the radio down here last night might be on the right track.

He reckons that Pogba and Raiola want away from OT because his ' marketability ' is being eroded, week in and week out, as his displays prove that he's really not as good as the hype that goes with him and he's so often outplayed and outshone by relatively unknown and unrated midfielders in the EPL, and up to now has shown nowhere near the quality of the better known midfielders such as SIlva, De Bruyne, Ericsen, Hazard, etc.

The great desitre to go to Spain or back to Italy is simply because almost all the world class and better midfielders are in the EPL but he could continue to feed the hype that goes with him if he was surrounded by and playing against fairly average midfielders in Spain and Italy.

Got me thinking....And I think there's more than a grain of truth in that.

No.

This was being brought up when he left for Juventus om a free transfer, 3-4 seasons and change club, repeat. It's Raiola, his clients rarely stay longer, it's all about generating as much € as possibly for his clients and himself via transfer.

If anyone thought pogba signed with the intent on staying until close to retirement, they need their head checked.

He will sign an extension and leave the club next summer, this is all about agreeing that a deal at the right price (and raiola wants it to be huge) will be done next summer

 

[Judge Red]

The ‘time for a new challenge’ line tells you all you need to know about him as a man and as a team player, but so do his performances. This isn’t a player who enjoys a challenge.

As long as the club can make the profit it wasn’t allowed to originally, I can’t wait to see him gone.

 

[Patrick08]

A bloke on the radio down here last night might be on the right track.

He reckons that Pogba and Raiola want away from OT because his ' marketability ' is being eroded, week in and week out, as his displays prove that he's really not as good as the hype that goes with him and he's so often outplayed and outshone by relatively unknown and unrated midfielders in the EPL, and up to now has shown nowhere near the quality of the better known midfielders such as SIlva, De Bruyne, Ericsen, Hazard, etc.

The great desitre to go to Spain or back to Italy is simply because almost all the world class and better midfielders are in the EPL but he could continue to feed the hype that goes with him if he was surrounded by and playing against fairly average midfielders in Spain and Italy.

Got me thinking....And I think there's more than a grain of truth in that.

Could be one of the factors ofcourse yes. Other factors could include,

• Him being forced to take a 25% pay cut as we ended in Europa league, A warning to board to give him a improved offer which pays his 25% pay cut losses ,
• Also a warning to the board to eventually invest in midfield and bring better partners in to compete on all levels and invest in team overall and bring top players.
• Keeping his marketing stock alive with Madrid interest.
• Eventually have a club in Madrid to fall back on unless all this goes south.

 

[Patrick08]

....and you think Lindelof was consistent, reliable and quality? I can't even think of any period when Lindelof was one of our best players.

I'll send you a DVD of last seasons Matches then from the club store.

 

[wolvored]

I think he means the season before last... but still makes very little sense! Is he saying that the fact we managed to keep Hazard quiet for two games makes the guy a bad player?

I got the same impression as you. I was just comparing last season. If we force pogba to stay we will get worse off him imo

 

[Mainoldo]

Good debate. But let’s be honest he’s not going nowhere this summer. Real and Juve are all talk they can’t afford him and we aren’t selling him unless we get his full value.

I just hope we are getting some good summer acquisitions.

 

[Farfetched]

The ‘time for a new challenge’ line tells you all you need to know about him as a man and as a team player, but so do his performances. This isn’t a player who enjoys a challenge.

As long as the club can make the profit it wasn’t allowed to originally, I can’t wait to see him gone.

Totally agree; Chelsea had a ‘want away’ player and got on and sold him for a good fee. We have a player who on his day can either be inspirational or dross, if he is angling for a transfer and is still here for the new season I fear we will only have more of the dross.

 

[2 man midfield]

They dislike him because we are crap and someone needs to get the blame. The only difference is instead of going after the point blank obvious, they’d rather go for the guy that marks everything that is wrong with society (in there eyes). You think if Pogba’s worst traits was he goes down the pub for a beer every now and then he’d get this much dislike towards him? Instead they want to moan because he’s more interested in social media and his haircuts. Which I thought died until the end of the seasons and the fan brought it back up.

I fail to believe it’s performance. The whole teams been crap and he’s been the best out of them all. How can you be the top target when in reality you and Lindelof gave the best performances out of a whole season. It makes no sense.

Like I keep saying if he goes he goes. He was never going to stay long anyway. But I feel the sale is more of s moral victory to some than anything else.

I think the difference is that people know the vast majority of our players are shit. We know we aren’t going to get anymore out of Ashley Young and Phil Jones, that’s just their level. We can bemoan how shite they are, but it’s pointless questioning their effort because we know they couldn’t really do a lot better.

With Pogba it’s different because you know there’s a player in there somewhere. Why is he just casually walking around midfield when he should be setting an example to the others and dragging them up a level? Look at Gerrard, surrounded by mediocrity for years but he put the effort in and made his team mates play better. That’s what you expect of your supposed talisman. Not the half-arsed example we’ve come to expect. He’s getting the flack because he should be doing better.

 

[TMDaines]

Don’t blame Pogba for considering his options after finding himself in his peak years in a dysfunctional team: Our managerial appointment and transfer window so far cannot be inspiring any hope of real change.

I’d be a hypocrite if I got angered at his comments; they are exactly what you would expect from any driven, ambitious professional. I’d be exactly the same in his position and left my last job for the same reason. I was performing crap in the end because I was mired in greater shit around me.

You look at Madrid and Juventus who clearly have their sights on being champions of Europe. Madrid have had one poor season and have been decisive in acting on it. Juventus continue in their drive to become a European giant, rather than just domestic kings. There’s no sense we’re looking to compete at that level. What top talent would be enticed by us currently? Why are you going to invest your efforts into us?

The frustrating thing is that I truly believe Pogba came here with the right intentions, but the club isn’t holding up its side of the bargain. Any organisation who wants keep hold of the best staff needs to provide an environment where they can thrive, or they’ll simply move on. The only people who call that disloyal are those who lack the drive or talent to ever be anything.

 

[sullydnl]

The ‘time for a new challenge’ line tells you all you need to know about him as a man and as a team player, but so do his performances. This isn’t a player who enjoys a challenge.

As long as the club can make the profit it wasn’t allowed to originally, I can’t wait to see him gone.

Tbf what else could he say when publicly pushing for a move? "United are in a hole so I want out"? "I always planned on leaving after a few years anyway"? "Things will be easier for me if I move to a better side"?

Not sure anything else he could say would be any better so I get him trotting out the "new challenge" cliche. It's just something players who want to leave say, it doesn't actually mean anything.

 

[SER19]

Pogba was, along with Shaw, our best player for the first month or so of the season. And then, after a bad period (no worse than anyone else was), he was once again along with Martial our best player for another month or so. This way that I see people on here or people in the media going on about him being terrible all season until Ole took over is simply wrong.

He has been inconsistent as all hell, but there has literally not been a player in the squad who has been more consistent. And his good periods have been far better than anyone else's good periods, and he's generally had more good periods than just about anyone else. He did have two or three absolutely terrible games this season where he did deserve all the shit he got, but otherwise he's been no worse than anyone else yet he gets far more unfairly criticised than his performances actually deserve.


Pogba came to us because he believed we were turning the corner and heading back to being a successful club. We hired Mourinho, we signed Pogba and Zlatan, it all looked like we were on the way back. Unfortunately as we all know it went to shit and he's ended up 'wasting' three years of his career at a club which has been terribly run. Obviously the money we offered him helped, but I'd be almost certain that we would offer him more now to stay than what he'd get at Real/Juve if he does leave.

I don't agree. Thought like most players he was woeful to average in games against Brighton, spurs, wolves where he was at fault for goal. They were all in first couple of months. At this time he was also screaming for attention in the media and helping to create an awful feeling at club.

 

[Mainoldo]

I got the same impression as you. I was just comparing last season. If we force pogba to stay we will get worse off him imo

My point was pretty clear. One is allured for being great when he only plays in patches and looks good when he ‘decides’ to turn up whilst the other is criticised for doing the exact same thing. Non he’s left all of a sudden he was he Prem’s best player. Like when was this now?

 

[Full bodied red]

No.

This was being brought up when he left for Juventus om a free transfer, 3-4 seasons and change club, repeat. It's Raiola, his clients rarely stay longer, it's all about generating as much € as possibly for his clients and himself via transfer.

If anyone thought pogba signed with the intent on staying until close to retirement, they need their head checked.

He will sign an extension and leave the club next summer, this is all about agreeing that a deal at the right price (and raiola wants it to be huge) will be done next summer

Jeez, I hope not.

Don't want him farting around, disinterested, for another season.

Alternatively, let's sign his replacement now and make Pogba a squaddie for the next 12 months - he'll be gone the same day.

 

[Mainoldo]

I think the difference is that people know the vast majority of our players are shit. We know we aren’t going to get anymore out of Ashley Young and Phil Jones, that’s just their level. We can bemoan how shite they are, but it’s pointless questioning their effort because we know they couldn’t really do a lot better.

With Pogba it’s different because you know there’s a player in there somewhere. Why is he just casually walking around midfield when he should be setting an example to the others and dragging them up a level? Look at Gerrard, surrounded by mediocrity for years but he put the effort in and made his team mates play better. That’s what you expect of your supposed talisman. Not the half-arsed example we’ve come to expect. He’s getting the flack because he should be doing better.

Not really because as crap as Phil Jones and Ashley Young are they are still better players that half of the players in the league. Yet we lose to Cardiff and Huddersfield. I mean I hate Phil Jones but I can honestly say he would go to Wolves and be there best defender. He is a good players just injury prone and clueless.

 

[Mcking]

I'm not down with the stats you tell me. I'm judging based off my eyes and commentary on here for most of the season.

There's a bit of revisionism going on from some on here where all his bad games didn't happen apparently. It was in no way a great season from him and his previous ones were significantly better especially his first one.

I don't think you would find many people saying that he didn't have some bad games and a few terrible ones. It was a season of ups and downs, the team was barely consistent and every player had his fair share of poor performances. Pogba had a few bad performances and plenty of outstanding ones, but there were also fairly decent performances which were not outstanding, but relatively good. The problem is those that try to make it look like Pogba was terrible apart from a run of games. We ended the season with a whimper, but in most games over the course of the season, he was always one of our best players and our best player in every other game. I've always held the view that players should be judged relative to the team.

Like Koke, Saul, Rakatic, Rodri, Arthur, Vidal, Fabian Ruiz, Allan etc right on what planet does the EPL have the world best midfielders...

La Liga and Serie A do have some average midfielders right? Some lad in the other thread said that 9-game Longstaff has been just as good, if not better than Atletico's Rodri. Says everything you need to know.

 

[beedoubleyou]

Ah so he's the only player ever to openly ask for a move away only to do a u-turn and stay?

Seem to recall Ramos doing the exact same thing this summer, funnily enough.

Don't want that prick either! I never felt the same about Rooney again. At least Rooney (like Ramos) has but in the best part of a decade doing a shift - Pogba has barely lifted his finger for half a season at a time.

 

[charlenefan]

Like Koke, Saul, Rakatic, Rodri, Arthur, Vidal, Fabian Ruiz, Allan etc right on what planet does the EPL have the world best midfielders...

tbf the players you've just listed all play for 1 or 2 teams in Spain so while yes it's more than likely Pogba will get shown up in El Classico's and Madrid derbies he's potentially unlikely to be shown up against the Spanish equivalent of a Mo Diame, Jonjo Shelvely or Mark Noble like he has repeatedly here

 

[Bastian]

I think we should have a poll on whether people want him here next season or not. Especially now the club is briefing that they expect him to stay.

 

[Cassidy]

tbf the players you've just listed all play for 1 or 2 teams in Spain so while yes it's more than likely Pogba will get shown up in El Classico's and Madrid derbies he's potentially unlikely to be shown up against the Spanish equivalent of a Mo Diame, Jonjo Shelvely or Mark Noble like he has repeatedly here

Why don't you look at the players listed in the post I quoted and see if they don't come from 2 teams in the EPL, the majority from just one (City). I did the same exercise for Spain just to prove a point.

Sure he wouldn't get shown up by a Los Celso, or a Soler or someone like that.

 

[charlenefan]

Why don't you look at the players listed in the post I quoted and see if they don't come from 2 teams in the EPL, the majority from just one (City). I did the same exercise for Spain just to prove a point.

Sure he wouldn't get shown up by a Los Celso, or a Soler or someone like that.

Sorry didn't see the post you quoted, just yours. Apologies

 

[Ciedre]

But according to the media (very well fed by the Barca hype-machine), the only possible reason he'd join us ahead of them is the money.

Climate, bigger City etc might have something to do with it as well. If you dont have a favourite club and the pay is roughly the same, then you choose the club that will give you the most playtime, chance of success and best location. And I will admit, even though I love the city Liverpool, I would rather choose to live in Barcelona

 

[Art]

It obviously sucks that our most talented and creative player wants to leave and yeah he's been largely inconsistent during his time here but I absolutely understand why he'd want to. To go from constantly asking Smalling, Jones and Young to make a forward pass from defense and have our forwards mess up the chances that he creates to playing with Ramos, Varane, Hazard, Jokic, Benzema and Modric, I can see the appeal. He'll just be playing with people who are as similarly talented as him.

 

[Farfetched]

I think we should have a poll on whether people want him here next season or not. Especially now the club is briefing that they expect him to stay.

The problem of a poll is which Pogba would we be voting for? The Pogba who controls a game with passes typical of the one to Rashford racing on to score, a big yes please. Or the Pogba who disappears in a game, where he is easily robbed of the ball and ends up wandering around the pitch looking skywards in distain and not wanting to be here.

 

[Bastian]

The problem of a poll is which Pogba would we be voting for? The Pogba who controls a game with passes typical of the one to Rashford racing on to score, a big yes please. Or the Pogba who disappears in a game, where he is easily robbed of the ball and ends up wandering around the pitch looking skywards in distain and not wanting to be here.

The Pogba who has publicly stated he wants to leave.

 

[Litch]

Some players the circus will always follow them, if it isnt this year, it will be next and a distraction when trying to focus on matters of football. SAF knew even if the player was good, they needed to go if it brought the club into disrepute...

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

The Pogba who has publicly stated he wants to leave.

 

[afrocentricity]

I think we should have a poll on whether people want him here next season or not. Especially now the club is briefing that they expect him to stay.

Yeah we want the Muppet contingent on here giving the impression that the fanbase wants to sell it's best player (and most won't even acknowledge that). No, let's not....

 

[clarkydaz]

It would be stupid to keep him now, he has confirmed what many thought last season. If he was offended by one fan shouting at him then what can he expect now

 

[minoo-utd]

He dosen't want to stay, so be it. Don't keep unhappy players.

 

[Mcking]

I'll send you a DVD of last seasons Matches then from the club store.

Should I refresh your memory instead? If I divide our season into four periods:
- The first weeks of the season -
Lindelof started the season alongside Bailly serving up a disasterclass in the second game against Leicester. He was dropped for the game against Spurs and was later reinstated after Jones and Herrera proved to be no better. Our defence was struggling and Mourinho even had to play Fellaini at DM because Lindelof couldn't compete for aerial duels. Pogba dropped MOTM performances against Leicester and Young Boys, Lukaku popped up with a few important goals, Fellaini did a very good job at baby-sitting Lindelof, but Shaw was the one regarded as our best performer in this period. Remember when his performances were lauded as Mourinho's genuis? Lindelof was a problem, not a solution
- The mid-part of the season and the games leading up to Mourinho's sacking -
Lindelof was no better here too. He had a decent performance against Juve which was blown out of proportion, but Martial and Pogba were comfortably the best here. Martial was scoring like once per game and alongside Pogba, orchestrated many comebacks and victories. Mourinho kept tinkering, trying to find a tune, ranging from playing three at the back, to McTominay and Matic at centrehalf. Our fans were having a go at Woodward for not signing defenders, and Lindelof alongside our defenders bar Shaw were regarded as shite, and rightly so.
- The mid-part of the season and early weeks of Solskjaer's reign -
Lindelof was decent here, but he was not close to being our best player, at least not top three. Martial, Lindelof, Lingard, Shaw, Herrera, Matic were all very good and equal in our great run of form, but Pogba and Rashford were the stars of the show. Even after the team tailed off, they were the ones that delivered most of our goals and assists. Even Lukaku was on a decent run too. Against Bournemouth, Cardiff, Huddersfield, Newcastle, Reading, Arsenal, PSG, Leicester, Fulham, Chelsea, Crystal Palace. Lindelof, Shaw, Jones and Smalling were decent at the back, but the best were Rashford, Pogba and Lukaku to an extent.
- The last few weeks of the season -
Everyone was shite. We couldn't buy a goal, couldn't defend for toffee, couldn't get a cleansheet, couldn't buy a win. Lindelof was as poor as everyone else, resorting to his early season form. McTominay was being lauded as the only bright spot in our season for getting stuck in, in unconvincing performances against the likes of West Ham, Watford, Wolves and heavy defeats in the hands of Everton and Barcelona.
So if you actually try to avoid recency bias and media sentiments, and look over the whole season, you would see that Lindelof was close to being our best player at no point. Shaw was arguably the most consistent from start to finish, but Martial, Rashford and Pogba in one way or the other made last season look better on paper than it actually was and covered for our awful defence. Pogba moreso than the others.
You could make a case for Lindelof as suprised of the season, but POTY? Sentimental POTY perhaps.

 

[sullydnl]

Yeah we want the Muppet contingent on here giving the impression that the fanbase wants to sell it's best player (and most won't even acknowledge that). No, let's not....

Like the impression the caf gives matters in the slightest.

 

[dogwithabone]

The ‘time for a new challenge’ line tells you all you need to know about him as a man and as a team player, but so do his performances. This isn’t a player who enjoys a challenge.

As long as the club can make the profit it wasn’t allowed to originally, I can’t wait to see him gone.

Exactly.

I don’t want him to stay and just want him gone and forgotten about.

Fergie had this bloke bang on when he turfed him out.

 

[SirAF]

Exactly.

I don’t want him to stay and just want him gone and forgotten about.

Fergie had this bloke bang on when he turfed him out.

I agree, but the myth that Ferguson booted him out has to stop. Fergie wanted to keep Pogba and the club offered him a pretty good contract considering his age.

 

[Patrick08]

I agree, but the myth that Ferguson booted him out has to stop. Fergie wanted to keep Pogba and the club offered him a pretty good contract considering his age.

True, but i guess he was not giving him assurances of playing time given his desire to win and retire on a high while also needed to control the middle the way Fergie wanted his players to. And he has little patience for managers who demands improvements in his game.

 

[Vault Dweller]

I agree, but the myth that Ferguson booted him out has to stop. Fergie wanted to keep Pogba and the club offered him a pretty good contract considering his age.

People seem to forget that quite a lot tbh.

 

[afrocentricity]

Like the impression the caf gives matters in the slightest.

It doesn't matter.... It's just a group poll.

But personally, I'd rather not have a poll stuck to the front page (for every media outlet to Twitter troll, and ABU to point to "lololol United fans want" etc...) accompanied by numerous rants rewriting history and rinsing one of our best (but now apparently want away) players.

I'm past caring though so whatever...

 

[Lennon7]

Can we remove that daft poll at the top based on nothing but speculation? What's the point of it anyway?