[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

It's not really him that lacks ambition. He's just not up to the job, but I'm sure he wants to be. We should have sacked Moyes and Mourinho sooner than we did. But even though we know the car is heading to the wall with a brick superglued onto the gas peddle, the majority opinion will always be that it hasn't hit the wall yet so doing anything about it would be premature and definitely not what a real fan would do.

Ironic that a club and fan base who likes to think it styles itself after the mentality of one of the most ruthless managers in the history of the game actually has more in common with a primary school teacher who wants to give the kid yet another chance even after the fire.

Nail on the head.

 

[Red Shorts]

Fair point but do you think Arsenal would have been getting smashed had they got a squad like ours?

Hard to know. Arteta is so new to the managerial world that you have no idea what he can do with a better team.

 

[RoadTrip]

If I could like this post I would. A balanced view from both sides. Dont get me wrong, I dont think we are flying, and not functioning well by any means, but at the same time Im not going to jump into the "get Ole out," camp when we haven't even got out of September.

Thanks . I personally am also not on the “Ole out” train yet. But then I was late on the Moyes out train so my opinion is probably worthless

I think the thing niggling me in the back of my mind is that tactically speaking, we really haven’t progressed under Ole. In the past season we could kind of justify it by saying “yeah, we look crap at times but our team is also pretty crap in places”. Outside of midfield, that excuse is gone. In that context, I don’t agree but am sympathetic to people who’ve decided Ole isn’t right. It’s certainly crunch time for him though, our October schedule is disgusting.

 

[Big Ben Foster]

The amount of posts with Quality control on them .

If Liverpool lose, we are still joint top. Panic stations should arrive when we start losing 3-0 against the relegation teams, and consistently.

Absolute joke of a post. Nobody loses 3-0 consistently to relegation teams. If that were to start happening to us, we'd have much bigger things to worry about than a title challenge or CL qualification.

 

[antohan]

And by recent we don’t even mean the opening of the season we mean most of last. The number of games we pulled out of the fire with last minute winners or equalizers is just untrue. And sure that’s a sign of a team with grit but it’s also a sign of a team with brilliant individual players who can pull something out of the fire. Which is why so often Ole kept those players on the pitch even though they were playing poorly, be it Rashford, Bruno, pogba. Because time and time again they have bailed Ole out so no wonder he trusts them. But this method of playing is just unsustainable. The only way it can work is if you have a brilliant team made up of brilliant individual players where one is always playing well so they can work some magic. And we are pretty damn close. But if your midfield can’t control things and your play of off you can’t hope to beat teams that have good players and are coached correctly. Because we are clearly not.

Yups. I was thinking earlier we miss Rashford. We definitely (tactically) did against Young Boys and down to 10. But as far as WH/Villa games are concerned, it's not we would play much different, just we would have one more individual that could blow hot and get it over the line.

 

[Red Shorts]

Thanks . I personally am also not on the “Ole out” train yet. But then I was late on the Moyes out train so my opinion is probably worthless

I think the thing niggling me in the back of my mind is that tactically speaking, we really haven’t progressed under Ole. In the past season we could kind of justify it by saying “yeah, we look crap at times but our team is also pretty crap in places”. Outside of midfield, that excuse is gone. In that context, I don’t agree but am sympathetic to people who’ve decided Ole isn’t right. It’s certainly crunch time for him though, our October schedule is disgusting.

Yeah I have that passive thought too. Ive said it several times in other threads that we have been so up and down already that it feels Ole still hasn't found the winning formula.

Good thing about this is its still early in the season, and he has time to get it right. Next few months are vital, so if we continue on in a downwards spiral, then yes certainly do need to question whether we have the right man for the job. Hes had £300m in signings right?

 

[bosniamanutd]

i expected a lot more of this season just few days ago. now, i dont know what to expect.

 

[Red Shorts]

Absolute joke of a post. Nobody loses 3-0 consistently to relegation teams. If that were to start happening to us, we'd have much bigger things to worry about than a title challenge or CL qualification.

It was an example, and not the only reason we should start panicking.

 

[Ferguson’s Hairdryer]

Wow you are deluded, it's a good lineup but it's not amazing.

The individual parts are much greater than the parts that Klopp put together to win the CL and Prem.

I remind you that Salah, might be viewed as one of the best but when Liverpool signed him for £39m people thought they were deluded. Also we complain about McFred, but Henderson and Milner were meme players before Klopp took over, a poor manager could have easily used those two as an excuse.

 

[Judas]

Standards on here are so low it's tragic.

There were no real positives to take from this game today, maybe Greenwood, he kept plugging away, but it was a sad thoughtless display. We look so clueless it's just sad to watch.

 

[SirScholes]

I never understand the player doesn't get in our team argument. They might not have the individual players to get in but they do have a quality team. Ings, Watkins, McGinn, Martinez, Buendia, D. Luiz, Cash, Targett will trouble any team thats not on their game. And they can bring on Traore , Hause, Bailey. They're a team that have not got any team in the league to fear, including City, Chelsea and Liverpool.

Utd only lost because of a set-piece, missed penalty and Shaw going off(he's very important to Utd in progressing the ball, the drop off to Dalot is massive.)

We can’t be losing because our left back went off surely

we lost because our manager can’t change a game

 

[RedDevilQuebecois]

Totally agree! Just look at what Chelsea achieved last season once they cut their losses with Lampard and got in a world class coach

That is the main reason why I'm fuming at anybody still defending Ole right now. When it's time to go, it's time to go. This business has no room for sentimentality. If Ole wants to carry on at the club in a far different position, he's welcome to do so. But as a manager, it's the end of the road plain and simple.

 

[Judas]

Didn't we buy Sancho for games like today? Tragic that he didn't see a single minute. I know he's hardly sparkled so far, but todays openness was perfect for him in that second half.

 

[RoadTrip]

The individual parts are much greater than the parts that Klopp put together to win the CL and Prem.

I remind you that Salah, might be viewed as one of the best but when Liverpool signed him for £39m people thought they were deluded. Also we complain about McFred, but Henderson and Milner were meme players before Klopp took over, a poor manager could have easily used those two as an excuse.

Whilst as I’ve said above in this thread that I think we have overall a squad capable of challenging for the title, our midfield is a problem. And I don’t like this comparison with Liverpool’s. On paper individually yeah those players aren’t exceptional. But your central midfielders are probably the most important pairing on the pitch. The issue isn’t the individual quality of ours, albeit that they aren’t great, it’s that they simply don’t compliment each other. At all. It’s almost better to have two average to good midfielders who work coherently than two very good midfielders who don’t complement each other. And that’s before even noting that Fred and McTominay are not very good midfielders.

 

[Mickeza]

Didn't we buy Sancho for games like today? Tragic that he didn't see a single minute. I know he's hardly sparkled so far, but todays openness was perfect for him in that second half.

We had two defensive injuries. It was either him or Cavani. We needed a goal and Cavani has delivered before. Not exactly hard to understand why he came on.

 

[Judas]

We had two defensive injuries. It was either him or Cavani. We needed a goal and Cavani has delivered before. Not exactly hard to understand why he came on.

To be fair, I forgot about the Shaw injury, it felt that long a game. Fair. Should have remembered due to how much Dalot pissed me off though.

 

[antohan]

Carrick wasn't mobile like Fred, he was a very good ball winner.

You wouldn't ever call Carrick a ball-winning midfielder though. Ball-winning through interceptions was a by-product of a rather more comprehensive job description, one that didn't require him being particularly mobile, although against (not as common then) high-pressing sides that shortcoming was exposed time and again.

 

[yipthatman]

It was an example, and not the only reason we should start panicking.

I'm not panicking one bit. I have been on the fence with Ole for a good while now. I have never flip flopped. I now just don't think Ole can do it with these players. I hope I am wrong but I dont see it. Sure, he will probably get top 4 which is great but I think they are capable of so much more. He has built an amazing squad but I don't think he is the man to get the best out of them. Who is? well thats another question and I don't have a clue.

 

[Marcus]

That was disheartening.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

How can anyone be Ole in after a disastrous 2 weeks

Because a season lasts 38 plus games

 

[Judas]

That was disheartening.

Very fitting word. It felt too much like groundhog day for me. We've seen that sort of thoughtless, clueless, hope to feck we some how score a goal type of game so many times.

We don't have a plan beyond the obvious.

 

[acnumber9]

Bringing on Cavani for a midfielder wasn’t going to change that then, was it?

I agree about the quality of our chances. Everything was very rush in the final third. We needed a lot more patience. We weren’t giving anything away though at the other end, unlike the first half.

Well we had a midfielder on the left wing so we could’ve moved him. If what you’re doing isn’t working the solution is never to just keep doing the same thing until it’s too late. A lesson that Solskjaer refuses to learn from.

 

[MrBest]

As ever it's not the money spent it's the strategy for recouping it. Buy a young guy with big resale value. Buy an old guy on a cheap transfer and a big salary who will sell shirts. Don't buy enough of the players in the positions you actually need, Varane excepted. Employ a coach who is loyal, is good at PR and popular with fans, not one who is a great coach.

We have once again been glazed.

Agreed, American culture, hide the reality of what is happening, show everyone you are the best but are you really?

 

[Longshanks]

That's where the Board are supposed to be earning their millions. It they have to wait till we are already out of the running of the league by December, then what's the point in being at such high positions. Might as well let any random guy run the club.

People can point to the table and say joint top (till Liverpool play later today). However, can they not see our fixture list compared to the ones of the other clubs we are sharing the position with now. Chelsea have played City, Arsenal, Liverpool and Spurs.

We have not played anyone in the top 6 from last season. That's the difference.

West ham finished in the top 6 last season, arsenal and spurs did not and I doubt they will this season either.

Being a member of the board doesn't mean you can tell the future, you can only react to what actually happens you can't sack someone because you think we will drop points because of tricky run coming up, there is as much chance as winning all the games as loosing them.

We are joint top at the moment if we are still there or there abouts in a few weeks heading towards Christmas then were doing just fine. If not than the board may have a decision to make.

 

[AndyMUFC]

Just poor all round today. It's gonna be sink or swim time over the next few weeks because we don't have the excuse of Lingard, Pereira and James being three of our front four at this moment in time. This is a strong squad now.

We were lucky we weren't losing beforehand and the stats mask the game because in no way was that a good attacking performance.

 

[Judas]

The sad truth is, performances like today aren't a surprise, and when we kick off you know there's a very good chance we'll see a game like that. Too often we get a goal or the opposition don't take advantage, and we get away with it.

If Bruno scored that penalty it would have slightly got us off the hook. We didn't deserve to get off the hook at all.

 

[NK86]

West ham finished in the top 6 last season, arsenal and spurs did not and I doubt they will this season either.

Being a member of the board doesn't mean you can tell the future, you can only react to what actually happens you can't sack someone because you think we will drop points because of tricky run coming up, there is as much chance as winning all the games as loosing them.

We are joint top at the moment if we are still there or there abouts in a few weeks heading towards Christmas then were doing just fine. If not than the board may have a decision to make.

We are out of a cup. Have had 3 defeats in 4 games. So, I don't think we need someone to see the future. We need someone to look what's happening right in front of them.

If by December we are 10th, we have wasted another year. Have we gotten so poor that wasting years nonstop is now something to be done easily and only hit reset once the season is irreparable? Maybe since SAF retired, the club and the fanbase have accepted mediocrity. Only issue is why do we hen clamour for millions to be spent if we don't expect returns on it - in playing style or in terms of trophies.

 

[Offsideagain]

This was Aston fecking Villa, not Real Madrid. If Shaw and Maguire are out for Wednesday, we’ll lose to Villarreal and can kiss the CL goodbye. Ole is on very thin ice having spent all that money. Still only a few games into the season and Varane and Sancho not up to speed but neither are the coaching staff. Where is the passion, the will to win. Ronaldo can’t do it on his own. I fear for us on Wednesday because they will be well up for it and we had better respond.

 

[Rightnr]

Questioning me as a fan . Ok I apologise for being rational, and will make a note to be an overreactive rude person on this forum.

Great to have the true fans like you who spend more time criticizing us, and probably is one who wants us to lose games so it gets Ole one step closer to the door.

Yeah, you are the peak of rationality.

This is like seeing a man in the sea screaming 'I can't swim' but not taking action until he's 5 seconds away from drowning. OGS is drowning in his incompetence and taking our title ambitions with him. We are simply not winning anything with this guy in charge.

And, by the way, if you think your points are 'rational', you might need to contact the Oxford dictionary so that they change their definition to what you understand the word to be because currenntly you are as rational as a blind man running against traffic on the motorway.

 

[OrcaFat]

It’s not acceptable for them either

True but inevitable.

 

[NinjaZombie]

He’s got to go , worst coached team in the league by a mile absolute shit show today

Sadly this is not far from the truth. We're probably the bottom 5 or so of the worst coached teams in the league, and that's me being generous and not wanting to be seen to be hyperbolic.

 

[Ferguson’s Hairdryer]

Whilst as I’ve said above in this thread that I think we have overall a squad capable of challenging for the title, our midfield is a problem. And I don’t like this comparison with Liverpool’s. On paper individually yeah those players aren’t exceptional. But your central midfielders are probably the most important pairing on the pitch. The issue isn’t the individual quality of ours, albeit that they aren’t great, it’s that they simply don’t compliment each other. At all. It’s almost better to have two average to good midfielders who work coherently than two very good midfielders who don’t complement each other. And that’s before even noting that Fred and McTominay are not very good midfielders.

A well coached team can get but with either Fred or McTominay besides Pogba.

Anyone who watched the defeat vs West Ham will have noticed that VDB has the potential to play a 6, plus he has good forward passing ability. Obviously it would take time and it will be a role that he would master over time… but most of the best 6’s in modern were originally attacking CM’s eg Pirlo, Verratti, im guessing Rodri started out as an attacking CM, in the world of the 433 you play an intelligent, technical number 10 who can read the game as a 6.

 

[HailtotheKing]

When have United been smashed in any game this season? We were a spot kick away today from drawing the game. Not exactly smashed is it.

Yeah I think you missed my point. And I probably missed yours. I’m simply saying you can’t compare us to Arsenal because their team is no way near ours. To be honest though we could’ve been smashed in some games. We give up a huge number of chances that teams aren’t putting away. Personally, I think we should be worried about our performances being that they’re very similar to last seasons, which were covered over by a stream of late goals where we pulled results out of the fire. A good quality to have but more of an individual one than a team one. And thus very hard to reproduce.

 

[antohan]

How can anyone be Ole in after a disastrous 2 weeks

Maybe it's not just a matter of in or out? It's all a bit knee-jerk. Do you expect to just add Ronaldo and Sancho and the attack magically clicks?

I reckon Mason (and us) would have had a far better game if we started Cavani instead of Ronaldo. Should we just bench him then?

You have two big signings to bed in on the go as we had no preseason with either. It won't happen overnight, it doesn't work like that.

Some people are calling for Conte as a proven winner FFS. Rinse repeat, more of the same shite switching styles, having all the wrong players, etc.

Calm the feck down. We've been here before, even with SAF who had the bonus of his GOAT track record.

I'm not convinced by Ole, but more so on the back of how we wilted at the Europa final after a strong end of season, than having a few poor games while trying to rejig the team.

 

[stw2022]

Didn't we buy Sancho for games like today? Tragic that he didn't see a single minute. I know he's hardly sparkled so far, but todays openness was perfect for him in that second half.

My theory on Sancho is that Ole said to him "Play well" and he didn't so he concluded he's done as much as he can so now he's going to buy someone else in January and VDB has someone to talk to on the coach.

 

[Desert Eagle]

He's not rejigging shit. It's more of the same old with new pieces slotting into the same "system"

 

[BulgarianDevil91]

Wasn't intended as a joke, am I missing something?

 

[Berbasbullet]

Didn't we buy Sancho for games like today? Tragic that he didn't see a single minute. I know he's hardly sparkled so far, but todays openness was perfect for him in that second half.

He would have got on the pitch I imagine but for the injuries.

 

[HailtotheKing]

You exaggerate how good our players are.

I don’t think so but one things for sure, not one of those villa players would get into our team yet they played us off the park.

 

[dal]

Outperforms any manager we have had in terms of the premier league, first with two consecutive top 4 finishes.

A challenge for the league is needed this season and I think we will.

This thread has a lot of barmy folk.