PL W FA Premier League

Manchester United 4:0 Chelsea

Post-match discussion


Sun, 11 August 2019

Steerpike

Full Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2018
Messages
428
Pereira supplied the cross for the second goal..
... and he did so because Lingard chased down a misdirected through ball from Rashford, and found Perreira with his pass.

I think some people on here have such a determined agenda against some of our players that it doesn't matter how well they play, they'll still be targets. Lingard actually played very well after being moved into a more central position. Perreira was a bit anonymous, but I like his aggression generally, and I think it provides a useful balance with the flair players. I think in the games where we are clear favourites, Ole could opt for the greater attacking threat of James, or even Greenwood, on the right with either Lingard or Perreira taking the central role (Lingard would get the nod on yesterday's showing).
 

Jeffthered

Full Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2015
Messages
1,295
A good result, for many reasons. Will settle the club for a while. I thnk you could sense the relief as much as anything. Maguire made a huge difference, coming in and being the most composed player we had for 90 mins. Bissaka was great I thought, and has also made a great impact. I felt these were the key lessons from the game, those two players changed the 'feel' of elements of the team.

Pogba is Pogba, and is simply, crucial for our season. That's a big worry, because of all the reasons previously and currently debated.

Rashford should be No 9.

I felt many of our players were quite average.

Chelsea seemed to fall apart, lacked a cutting edge and experience. Some of their defending for our goals was awful.

I expect a bit more of an examination by Wolves. But I also expect us to win.
 

cyberman

Full Member
Joined
May 26, 2010
Messages
16,370
That's a bold claim! I can think of one example in the last... 10 years? The 2014/15 game where we were indeed unlucky to lose 1-0 though the more insufferable members of the Caf were talking about a "Mourinho masterclass".

Chelsea were unlucky yesterday, not sure why that bothers you.
Their weak spot is the attack, when that attack fails to score then its not luck, its what was always going to happen.
Were we unlucky with Lukaku fecking up the approach play of our attack? Or when Jones and Smalling were stumbling about in games we were holding out own in?
You cant excuse a 4-0 loss. Luck has nothing to do with it.
We won at SB in the cup last year, dominated the second half to draw v a hail Mary long ball, fecking Costa with a last minute equaliser when again we dominated, the LVG game where they couldnt get the ball off us and they scored with their one shot on goal
How far back will I go?
 

Gasolin

Full Member
Joined
Dec 22, 2007
Messages
3,476
Location
NYC
Wolves will probably be a better test of how Ole’s system works.
For me, we are definitely playing differently in function of the opposition. I can feel this vibe from SAF's time where we don't persist in one way of playing. I think it will be more than interesting to see that.
 

Sandikan

aka sex on the beach
Joined
Mar 14, 2011
Messages
27,032
Have read quite a few posts playing down our win.

Why? We just drilled Chelsea 4-0! Let's enjoy it!!
 

Cardboard elk

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Jan 9, 2019
Messages
104
Supports
Rosenborg
Chelsea hit the bar twice and United was lucky there, but after Ole changed the formation to a kind of 4-4-1-1 to exploit the space in the middle of the pitch then it all changed. This win was not luck, it was due to tactical failure of Lampard, tactical prowess of Solskjaer and also due to the fact that United is extremely good at counter-attacking. Ole spotted the space and took advantage. Chelsea was not clinical enough and that is on them, not luck for united. Fotball is 90 minutes not 30 or 45 minutes :) Now lets go mess up some wolves.
 

lukepowell1988

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
72
Chelsea won't get top four there going to struggle to find goals.

Mctom and Pogba had a sloppy first half not sure how much of that is down to fitness?
 

Siorac

Full Member
Joined
Sep 1, 2010
Messages
15,820
Location
16th century
Their weak spot is the attack, when that attack fails to score then its not luck, its what was always going to happen.
Were we unlucky with Lukaku fecking up the approach play of our attack? Or when Jones and Smalling were stumbling about in games we were holding out own in?
You cant excuse a 4-0 loss. Luck has nothing to do with it.
We won at SB in the cup last year, dominated the second half to draw v a hail Mary long ball, fecking Costa with a last minute equaliser when again we dominated, the LVG game where they couldnt get the ball off us and they scored with their one shot on goal
How far back will I go?
They hit the post and the bar - in a close game between two teams of theoretically similar strength, that's unlucky. We deserved the win overall but the scoreline flatters us. Again, I don't understand why this upsets you so much. We won 4-0 so who gives a feck if Chelsea feel hard done by?

That Diego Costa equaliser didn't come against the run of play, they had like 90% possession in the last 10 minutes of the game. And what does winning at Stamford Bridge in the Cup have to do with us being unlucky over there?
 

Oaencha

Full Member
Joined
Jan 23, 2014
Messages
2,067
Absolutely, any result against Chelsea is a good one, a one nil would have been great...but to win by four is massive for the lads, the biggest win since 1965 if I am correct.
Great result. We did beat them 4-0 in the 94’ Cup Final as well.
 

cyberman

Full Member
Joined
May 26, 2010
Messages
16,370
They hit the post and the bar - in a close game between two teams of theoretically similar strength, that's unlucky. We deserved the win overall but the scoreline flatters us. Again, I don't understand why this upsets you so much. We won 4-0 so who gives a feck if Chelsea feel hard done by?

That Diego Costa equaliser didn't come against the run of play, they had like 90% possession in the last 10 minutes of the game. And what does winning at Stamford Bridge in the Cup have to do with us being unlucky over there?
And the other 80 minutes? Lingards goal was such a relief because we were creating chance after chance and it looked as if we would never score.
Chelsea never deserved a draw from that game, that was the worst Chelsea performance against us I can remember.
Pressing Chelsea back in their own half in the cup a few years ago only to see Herrera be sent off for so called team fouling that City do every game. Literally have not seen a player get two yellows for two nothing challenges in 35 minutes of the first half before or since.
But there we go..Stamford Bridge!
It bothers me because losing 4-0 isn't luck. Hauling Rashford down isn't luck etc. Having their fullback get into goal scoring positions then wonder why they got destroyed on the break isn't luck
Its giving a warped report of the game IMO, especially when we aren't given the same leeway when we fail to win in worse fashion at SB every year.
 

oLeSoLsKjAeR20

Full Member
Joined
Jan 13, 2014
Messages
611
Location
N.Ireland
And the other 80 minutes? Lingards goal was such a relief because we were creating chance after chance and it looked as if we would never score.
Chelsea never deserved a draw from that game, that was the worst Chelsea performance against us I can remember.
Pressing Chelsea back in their own half in the cup a few years ago only to see Herrera be sent off for so called team fouling that City do every game. Literally have not seen a player get two yellows for two nothing challenges in 35 minutes of the first half before or since.
But there we go..Stamford Bridge!
It bothers me because losing 4-0 isn't luck. Hauling Rashford down isn't luck etc. Having their fullback get into goal scoring positions then wonder why they got destroyed on the break isn't luck
Its giving a warped report of the game IMO, especially when we aren't given the same leeway when we fail to win in worse fashion at SB every year.
How many beers did you have during the game?
 

Siorac

Full Member
Joined
Sep 1, 2010
Messages
15,820
Location
16th century
Of was the turn and volly wasn't it? Or am i me's remembering?
We dominated up until then, i remember because i had an accumulator riding on it.
Yeah, that's the one. And then we inexplicably sat back and invited pressure. That one is on Van Gaal.
 

Terminator

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Jan 8, 2015
Messages
1,160
What a beautiful goal it was from Lingard though.
 

Jonno

Full Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2010
Messages
6,608
Location
Preston, Lancashire
Cheer up lads. We’ve just beaten Chelsea 4-0. Something we’ve not done since the mid 90s?

Enjoy the victory, we’re far from the finished article which I think most people accept, and when you’re far from the finished article there will be issues and bits to sort out. But we’ve just landed a 6 pointer on Chelsea. Excellent result and boosts our chances of making top 4
 

sparx99

Full Member
Joined
May 22, 2016
Messages
402
They hit the post and the bar - in a close game between two teams of theoretically similar strength, that's unlucky. We deserved the win overall but the scoreline flatters us. Again, I don't understand why this upsets you so much. We won 4-0 so who gives a feck if Chelsea feel hard done by?

That Diego Costa equaliser didn't come against the run of play, they had like 90% possession in the last 10 minutes of the game. And what does winning at Stamford Bridge in the Cup have to do with us being unlucky over there?
Hitting the post and bar is not unlucky or lucky though. It’s a shot off target like any other shot off target. Neither were clear goal scoring chances either. Abraham’s came through a fortuitous ricochet and he just turned and hit it from 20 yards out and Emerson was forced high because of the angle and goalkeepers position.
 

Siorac

Full Member
Joined
Sep 1, 2010
Messages
15,820
Location
16th century
Hitting the post and bar is not unlucky or lucky though. It’s a shot off target like any other shot off target. Neither were clear goal scoring chances either. Abraham’s came through a fortuitous ricochet and he just turned and hit it from 20 yards out and Emerson was forced high because of the angle and goalkeepers position.
I always found that a very facetious argument though. The keeper was beaten in both cases and if the ball had gone two centimetres lower, they'd have scored. We got lucky there.

My go-to example with this is Scholes against Sunderland on New Year's Day 2003: his shot hit one post, then hit the other post, then bounced back to the goalkeeper. That's not "poor finishing" or a "a shot off the target like any other", that's just clearly unfortunate. This idea that hitting the corner flag or hitting the post is somehow the same thing is mental.
 

G_and_T

New Member
Newbie
Joined
May 17, 2019
Messages
19
First half was pretty dicey... but a year ago that team would have crumbled and gotten worse. Amazed at the effort in the second half. Defence never seemed panicky or worried (could it be we have a decent defensive line?) and attack improved too. Would have liked to see more from Andreas and McT, I think they struggled to find their way. Maguire, Pogba and Rashford was great. next up Wolves...
 

mitchmouse

Full Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2014
Messages
7,522
So... having been attacked for not saying we are going to win the league by Xmas... it was a good result but don't tell me that midfield is good enough to win battles with the top sides in the PL or in Europe. I think we should actually be focusing a lot of attention on the Europa because that may be the best chance to get back in the CL (and attract better players). There were some very good performances but Chelsea could have been at least one up before we scored. I think Wolves away will be a much greater test. That said, the guys we need to score did score and as the saying goes, you can only beat what's in front of you. But excuse me if I don't get carried away just yet...
 

Gator Nate

Full Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2019
Messages
479
Location
Orlando, FL
Supports
Unaffiliated
Chelsea hit the bar twice and United was lucky there, but after Ole changed the formation to a kind of 4-4-1-1 to exploit the space in the middle of the pitch then it all changed. This win was not luck, it was due to tactical failure of Lampard, tactical prowess of Solskjaer and also due to the fact that United is extremely good at counter-attacking. Ole spotted the space and took advantage. Chelsea was not clinical enough and that is on them, not luck for united. Fotball is 90 minutes not 30 or 45 minutes :) Now lets go mess up some wolves.
Many here would feel better about life if they had this plastered above their television while watching the game. :D

Ole finally has (just barely) enough personnel and training to do what he was trying to do last year. IMO, most the criticism of his tactics boiled down to his inability to do what he wanted with who he had. Six weeks of pre-season following clear off-season expectations, and not being in the roiling boil of PL top-4 fights and CL knockout rounds, and we saw a much clearer vision of his game. Maguire and AWB helped tremendously, too...

Ole's post-match interview was different, too. He was a bit more guarded and cautious in his look and his words, but I could see he was holding back. This is a good team with a lot of room for improvement and he just bought much-needed credit in the minds of his players to trust him even more.
 

bondsname

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Aug 28, 2018
Messages
312
Many here would feel better about life if they had this plastered above their television while watching the game. :D

Ole finally has (just barely) enough personnel and training to do what he was trying to do last year. IMO, most the criticism of his tactics boiled down to his inability to do what he wanted with who he had. Six weeks of pre-season following clear off-season expectations, and not being in the roiling boil of PL top-4 fights and CL knockout rounds, and we saw a much clearer vision of his game. Maguire and AWB helped tremendously, too...

Ole's post-match interview was different, too. He was a bit more guarded and cautious in his look and his words, but I could see he was holding back. This is a good team with a lot of room for improvement and he just bought much-needed credit in the minds of his players to trust him even more.
I agree 100%. A win against Wolves next week and it will seal the deal.
 

tombombadil

Full Member
Joined
Oct 1, 2010
Messages
1,615
Location
Some god forsaken part of Middle Earth
A great win. Very happy for the result. 4 - 0 is not only a good win against a potential rival, it is also good for our goal difference.

However, I think we really must not get ahead of ourselves here as it is only the first game against a Chelsea in transition and I think we were lucky to head into halftime at 1 - 0. Chelsea had the better chances and we were too open in the first half. The second half saw us grow into the game and take advantage of an increasingly desperate and tiring Chelsea side. The result flatters us and I think there will be bigger tests in the coming weeks.

For now, it's on to the next game. Hoping for the best.
 

TRUERED89

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Jan 23, 2019
Messages
1,804
Location
England
DE-FCUKIN-LIGHTED!!!

Shut a few of these moaning fecks up on here for a while at least!!
Yea only a few unfortunately. People already saying we’ll lose to wolves.
A good result, for many reasons. Will settle the club for a while. I thnk you could sense the relief as much as anything. Maguire made a huge difference, coming in and being the most composed player we had for 90 mins. Bissaka was great I thought, and has also made a great impact. I felt these were the key lessons from the game, those two players changed the 'feel' of elements of the team.

Pogba is Pogba, and is simply, crucial for our season. That's a big worry, because of all the reasons previously and currently debated.

Rashford should be No 9.

I felt many of our players were quite average.

Chelsea seemed to fall apart, lacked a cutting edge and experience. Some of their defending for our goals was awful.

I expect a bit more of an examination by Wolves. But I also expect us to win.
We couldn't beat them in 3 attempts last season, drew 1, lost 2. We owe them a good fecking hiding!
 

032Devil

Full Member
Joined
Oct 26, 2004
Messages
21,611
All this talk about how the 4-0 win flattered United is something I don't get.

The way I see it is Chelsea had their chances but never converted them. A number of their shots were either off-target or saved - that's what a defence and goalkeeper is for. And on the two occasion the ball was whipped across United's goal mouth, none of their players were in position to meet it. True, the ball hit the woodwork twice but its not "bad luck", just not precise enough or unfortunate that the strike wasn't a tad more accurate.

After the first goal Chelsea players lost some of their confidence. After the second goal they almost totally capitulated. The first goal was utter bad defending by one of their players. The second goal was a beautifully cut across that was met by our striker in the perfect position that neither their goalkeeper or defenders could do anything about. The third was a magical pass by Pogba that was clinically finished off. And our forth goal was somewhat fortunate to end up in the back of the net.

We scored at least 3 excellent goals whereas the opposition were either taking long pot-shots or were not able to hit the target because of United's defence or good goal-keeping. Just because Chelsea had 18 attempts doesn't mean they were unlucky but that the quality of their finishing was either poor or well-defended against by United.

Maybe its the pundits way of sympathising with the great Chelsea but for me its bad analysis.
 

Sandikan

aka sex on the beach
Joined
Mar 14, 2011
Messages
27,032
All this talk about how the 4-0 win flattered United is something I don't get.

The way I see it is Chelsea had their chances but never converted them. A number of their shots were either off-target or saved - that's what a defence and goalkeeper is for. And on the two occasion the ball was whipped across United's goal mouth, none of their players were in position to meet it. True, the ball hit the woodwork twice but its not "bad luck", just not precise enough or unfortunate that the strike wasn't a tad more accurate.

After the first goal Chelsea players lost some of their confidence. After the second goal they almost totally capitulated. The first goal was utter bad defending by one of their players. The second goal was a beautifully cut across that was met by our striker in the perfect position that neither their goalkeeper or defenders could do anything about. The third was a magical pass by Pogba that was clinically finished off. And our forth goal was somewhat fortunate to end up in the back of the net.

We scored at least 3 excellent goals whereas the opposition were either taking long pot-shots or were not able to hit the target because of United's defence or good goal-keeping. Just because Chelsea had 18 attempts doesn't mean they were unlucky but that the quality of their finishing was either poor or well-defended against by United.

Maybe its the pundits way of sympathising with the great Chelsea but for me its bad analysis.
It's rival fans getting worried at just a little sign United look in a good place again.

There can't be many games in football history where a team battered 4-0 can count themselves hard done by, and this certainly wasn't one.
United losing 4-1 to Pool at home that time Evra and Vidic made uncharacteristic errors is an example I'd use of a scoreline not matching the flow of a game, but yesterday was nothing like it.
 

Sandikan

aka sex on the beach
Joined
Mar 14, 2011
Messages
27,032
Yea only a few unfortunately. People already saying we’ll lose to wolves.

We couldn't beat them in 3 attempts last season, drew 1, lost 2. We owe them a good fecking hiding!
Just a shame that with a 4-0 first leg Europa league lead that they can probably rest their whole team
 

Amarsdd

Full Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2013
Messages
346
I was just checking what journalists were saying regarding yesterday's game after the amount of criticism they gave Ole and praise they were handing Lampard beforehand. It's amazing that they were being positive about Chelsea and completely negative about United. For example, in the Football Writers Podcast, they spent 15 mins talking about how good were Lampard's team when in the game they only created one real chance (i think a ball across the 10 yard box that Abraham was very close to ) whereas the two times they hit the post it was more of great strikes than dangerous chance created. Most of the other time, they only just moved the ball around without any penetration. They were also gushing about how Chelsea playing the kids was great for English football completing forgetting they had no real choice when United had 5 academy graduates starting and had the youngest team in EPL this week.

Whereas when it came to United, they literally didn't even mention we destroyed Chelsea in the second half with a deadly counter-attacking system. The only thing they said was how our defense still looked vulnerable (it was only for the first 15 min), the midfield is not good enough (alright, ok) and don't judge United by this result, they are not this good.

These things really grind my gears. At least give credit where credits due. At least, the pundits for Sky including Jose were pretty balanced with the praise and the criticism.
 

Tincanalley

Turns player names into a crappy conversation
Joined
Apr 12, 2011
Messages
6,468
Location
Ireland
I love that some of our fans occupy an alternative universe, connected only to Earth by tenous quantum entanglement. Very entertaining. Meanwhile, back in the quasi-real world, that was great fun. Just watched most of it back (skipped the last 15 mins of the first half). The third goal was the killer, what a pass by Paul Pogba. I don't think the way we played will fill anyone with confidence or swagger. Perhaps its for the best. I did predict a lot of goals this season and for this game, only I expected it to be 2 - 2. I think Chelsea will bother a lot of teams and will improve. We need to be able to switch into a one-nil machine with park-the-bus lower sides. Certainly there is a revived hope from this performance. The midfield were decent, Pogba was wayward at times, but McTominay was great. Andreas Pereira is a bit of a wait an see, right now he seems like an immature player too far where a creative, intelligent, tough minded foil for PP is needed.
 

Crackers

Coolest Cracker in the box
Scout
Joined
May 30, 2012
Messages
24,867
Location
Glazers Out
I love that some of our fans occupy an alternative universe, connected only to Earth by tenous quantum entanglement. Very entertaining. Meanwhile, back in the quasi-real world, that was great fun. Just watched most of it back (skipped the last 15 mins of the first half). The third goal was the killer, what a pass by Paul Pogba. I don't think the way we played will fill anyone with confidence or swagger. Perhaps its for the best. I did predict a lot of goals this season and for this game, only I expected it to be 2 - 2. I think Chelsea will bother a lot of teams and will improve. We need to be able to switch into a one-nil machine with park-the-bus lower sides. Certainly there is a revived hope from this performance. The midfield were decent, Pogba was wayward at times, but McTominay was great. Andreas Pereira is a bit of a wait an see, right now he seems like an immature player too far where a creative, intelligent, tough minded foil for PP is needed.

And in both quantum states, scousers don't have jobs
 

Fully Fledged

Full Member
Joined
May 23, 2013
Messages
11,353
Location
Midlands UK
Couldn’t decide who the MOTM was. So many candidates today. Such a refreshing change. Long may that continue.
I know. I could pick a player of the season last year because I could think of anyone deserving. It's amazing that first match of the season there are too many candidates.
 

Player Ratings

7.1 Total Average Rating

Highest Rated Player

Lowest Rated Player

Compiled from 901 ratings.
View full results

Score Predictions

658,101,188
  • Man Utd win
  • Chelsea win
  • Draw

Detailed Results

  • 23% Man Utd 2:0 Chelsea
  • 21% Man Utd 2:1 Chelsea
  • 13% Man Utd 1:1 Chelsea
  • 9% Man Utd 3:1 Chelsea
  • 7% Man Utd 1:0 Chelsea
  • 6% Man Utd 3:0 Chelsea
  • 4% Man Utd 1:2 Chelsea
  • 4% Man Utd 0:0 Chelsea
  • 3% Man Utd 2:2 Chelsea
  • 2% Man Utd 0:2 Chelsea
  • 2% Man Utd 5:0 Chelsea
  • 1% Man Utd 0:1 Chelsea
  • 1% Man Utd 0:5 Chelsea
  • 1% Man Utd 0:3 Chelsea
  • 1% Man Utd 4:0 Chelsea
  • 1% Man Utd 1:3 Chelsea
  • 0% Man Utd 4:1 Chelsea
  • 0% Man Utd 1:4 Chelsea
  • 0% Man Utd 3:2 Chelsea
  • 0% Man Utd 4:2 Chelsea
  • 0% Man Utd 5:1 Chelsea
  • 0% Man Utd 5:3 Chelsea
  • 0% Man Utd 1:5 Chelsea
Compiled from 947 predictions.
Show more results Score Predictions League Table