Success is all in the mind - the hippies were right! If you're weak mentally you'll never luck your way into form these days, what with social media and the analysis being what it is. Rashford looks beaten every time he plays. If he doesn't perform this season he should be moved on. A new scene in a new city can make all the difference if you can't make the difference yourself. Shame for the guy.
Rashford considering his future...
- Thread starter Jericholyte2
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Absolutely - an academy product, born and raised in Manchester, is obviously going to be placed in a different category than a big money signing from abroad. Many fans will obviously feel different about such a player per default.
The odd part is that we - now - have a significant number of fans who are just the opposite in this regard: the default for them seems to be to treat local players with suspicion, not to say disdain.
why do think that is?
That's no mystery: they think getting behind - on general principle - local lads/academy products is silly/sentimental and part of the reason why we have struggled so badly in the post-SAF era.
The actual logic or reasoning behind this is tenuous as feck, for one thing. But more importantly, the sentiment (or lack thereof, if you will) will be alien to many - say - traditional fans.
I want to slap him just for wearing these giant headphones like a complete arse. I'm not even talking about that he is the first person I really have heard speaking the words "should of" out loud, what an absolute weapon.
Wilshere is so stupid
Nobody’s suggesting Fergie didn’t mellow but Anderson became a very peripheral player and seemed content in that role. Ferguson didn’t rely on him, he didn’t see him as crucial or vital to what he wanted to do. If Rashford accepted the same role I’m not sure there’d be as much hostility.
What’s annoying about Rashford is he wants to half-arse it on the pitch then go full on PR mode and start attacking managers, position rivals and giving the impression he’s outraged he isn’t the first name on the team sheet.
His response to the challenge of being dropped hasn’t been to up his game at all - when he did get the chance in games he looked even more dreadful than he did when he got dropped. Instead he doubled down on PR and I understand the lack of tolerance towards that now. You can work hard to regain your place or you can play like you’re protesting against being dropped and leak about how rivals are desperate to sign you. The path he picked leaves a huge question mark on his character.
What’s annoying about Rashford is he wants to half-arse it on the pitch then go full on PR mode and start attacking managers, position rivals and giving the impression he’s outraged he isn’t the first name on the team sheet.
His response to the challenge of being dropped hasn’t been to up his game at all - when he did get the chance in games he looked even more dreadful than he did when he got dropped. Instead he doubled down on PR and I understand the lack of tolerance towards that now. You can work hard to regain your place or you can play like you’re protesting against being dropped and leak about how rivals are desperate to sign you. The path he picked leaves a huge question mark on his character.
Ffs.
Wilshere is so stupid
Precisely. And some people wonder why he is in the dog house
So we going to pretend Wellbeck wasn’t the bigger talent? Show me where Rashford had Welbeck’s youth team status?
Wilshere is so stupid
I can appreciate many will have an opinion that Rashford is/was better but it's far from the ridiculous comparison some are making out here. You would think Rashford was Rooney level the way some are laughing at the comparison here.
*looks into crystal ball*
I see you, Marcus Rashford... on the wing... for Everton... interchanging with Alex Iwobi...
I see you, Marcus Rashford... on the wing... for Everton... interchanging with Alex Iwobi...
Speaking as a traditional fan (Wilf had two weeks to go when I started being a regular at OT) I don’t think it’s that straightforward. I’ve certainly got more sceptical (I wouldn’t go as far as hostile) towards “local lads” in recent times, and I know that the same is true for plenty of my generation.
I think there’s a feeling that the club exploits the “sentiment” that such players engender, resulting in their becoming spoilt and unlikeable.
Well put.
A bit of a difference between a typo and the bolding of a word that wasn't even the right word in the first place. You are very amusing - I'll give you that (obvious anger issues notwithstanding.)
All that to further pull the debate from your initial claim of being ‘justifiably wary’ about the charitable actions of a footballer whose charitable actions pre-date his poor form & more importantly aren’t aimed at you, although the way you just tried to gaslight me at the end of your post is certainly juvenile so you might infact be a the demographic he aims to help most.
It’s simple really, we can either argue the merits of attributes & contributes whilst you tell me what ‘im’ actually means or we could return to the topic at hand. ‘justifiably wary’, ‘blatant disrespect’ , ‘downed tools’, a few things I addressed & you’ve yet to re-address over the course of multiple replies. Let’s return to Rashford, if you want to talk grammar my DMs are open.
Hardly one bad season, his play has been bad for 18 months/two years.
As to his attitude, last season it was disgraceful, he should have been sold just for that.
Totally agree with all that.
Rashford has had Van Gaal, Mourinho, Ole and Ragnick....all different type of managers. Yes all failed here, some badly, but do people really think Ten Hag and his coaching can turn Rashford into a fabulous player?
As someone else mentioned, we are not talking about Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney here....he has never been anywhere near those levels. Also he isnt a striker for me at all, very much left wing is his only real position, in which we are stacked. So we arent just relying on Ten Hag getting a good player out of him again, a good player not a world beater, we are also relying on him at the same time getting the best out of Sancho....on the right wing.
That in itself is a big ask, we have SAncho who has only shown glimpses of his talent here in his first season and then we have Rashford....back from injury and rehabilitation, , looks to have lost a yard of pace, confidence, belief and from the outside looking in his attitude, especially regarding demanding more games....was very poor,
What he has done off the pitch, the fact he is local and a role model is all irrelvant if he cant perform on it and for me judging his career and apparent value over his CAREER here, not just last season, should without doubt have been the big sale this summer for me at the club, In a season of awful individual performances from some supposedly big player like Fernandes and Maguire, Rashford was comfortably the worst in my book, which says all you need to know
As someone else mentioned, we are not talking about Giggs, Ronaldo, Rooney here....he has never been anywhere near those levels. Also he isnt a striker for me at all, very much left wing is his only real position, in which we are stacked. So we arent just relying on Ten Hag getting a good player out of him again, a good player not a world beater, we are also relying on him at the same time getting the best out of Sancho....on the right wing.
That in itself is a big ask, we have SAncho who has only shown glimpses of his talent here in his first season and then we have Rashford....back from injury and rehabilitation, , looks to have lost a yard of pace, confidence, belief and from the outside looking in his attitude, especially regarding demanding more games....was very poor,
What he has done off the pitch, the fact he is local and a role model is all irrelvant if he cant perform on it and for me judging his career and apparent value over his CAREER here, not just last season, should without doubt have been the big sale this summer for me at the club, In a season of awful individual performances from some supposedly big player like Fernandes and Maguire, Rashford was comfortably the worst in my book, which says all you need to know
This is correct for me, at least partially.
What's also something else that annoys me beyond belief is the notion that 'local lads' should be supported beyond 'foreign mercenaries' (a ridiculous notion to say the least, given how many of our legends are 'foreigners').
And why does it annoy me you would reasonably ask? Well, because in recent times the 'local and British lads' have failed to show time and again the thing that should give them more leeway - desire, application and spirit when playing for us because they should understand what it is to play for United. This is especially true in the big games.
However, what we've seen on the pitch is the opposite of the 'local lads' giving their best and fighting for the shirt. I won't forget the humiliations we suffered this season and how these players couldn't be arsed to do anything on the pitch to change a damn thing. Rashford stands out for me in this.
Basically, words are wind and actions speak louder than any journalist. I've made my mind on Rashford (as I have on Martial tbh, as much as I rated him at one point) and it'll take an almighty season to make me change it.
I think it's fair for the fanbase to take this position because Rashford has just squandered too much goodwill. If he pulls off a very good to great season, I'd reassess but not before that. I am thinking of it as the second season of a bad signing. You get one bad one and then you're out. In most cases, players don't really turn it around but let's see.
I said nothing about being wary of his charitable actions; as I mentioned, I have consistently applauded those. Many, however, are justifiably wary of Rashford posting videos documenting how hard he's been working out, when that very same level of dedication was conspicuously absent on the playing field. Nice shoehorning in of 'gaslighting' though! I await your next frenzied response!
Or could it be they think those academy graduates have become so entitled they're not worth supporting anymore?
Or is it that they've just not been very good recently?
Personally, Id go with those two reasons before yours.
Being a product of the club should mean the standards they aim for are higher than any others. You can’t demand anyone is better that the limits of their ability, but you can demand if they’re a product of the club and grew up loving and immersed in the culture of the club, that they burst a bollock every day of the week in training and twice on match day for that club - wouldn’t you.
Perversely it seems to be that we use someone’s status as a home-grown player as reasons why we should accept poor attitude and apparent lack of application and effort.
Much of the current Rashford defence is -outside of citations of his charity work - based on pretending he was a much better player than he actually was two years ago.
Perversely it seems to be that we use someone’s status as a home-grown player as reasons why we should accept poor attitude and apparent lack of application and effort.
Much of the current Rashford defence is -outside of citations of his charity work - based on pretending he was a much better player than he actually was two years ago.
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Give Rashford a break. Every human being is different.
He was from under privileged background, broke into Man Utd 1st team at 17/18 years old, suddenly earned tens of millions, became superstar, hundreds of millions fans worldwide, start to campaign to feed the poor, all the fame and glory.
His world crumbled when he had a long term injury. His form nosedived. He lost his starting place for Man Utd and England. He was rediculed by his own fans. He was never the same again and lost all the confidence on the field.
He is still young at 24 years old. The club and supporters should help him back to his best again. It's more of psychological things that he needs to work on. He trains very well and needs to show up on match day.
He was from under privileged background, broke into Man Utd 1st team at 17/18 years old, suddenly earned tens of millions, became superstar, hundreds of millions fans worldwide, start to campaign to feed the poor, all the fame and glory.
His world crumbled when he had a long term injury. His form nosedived. He lost his starting place for Man Utd and England. He was rediculed by his own fans. He was never the same again and lost all the confidence on the field.
He is still young at 24 years old. The club and supporters should help him back to his best again. It's more of psychological things that he needs to work on. He trains very well and needs to show up on match day.
Some of the lies in this thread
Some of the posts as if he was poor throughout his ManUtd career. Also not sure where this myth that "he wasn't highly rated as a youth player" is coming from.
The posters who post exclusively on youth players said its wrong and the guardian article from long back also proves that myth wrong.
Some of the posts as if he was poor throughout his ManUtd career. Also not sure where this myth that "he wasn't highly rated as a youth player" is coming from.
The posters who post exclusively on youth players said its wrong and the guardian article from long back also proves that myth wrong.
Like nearly all footballers then?
One of the reason for decades the elite have portrayed the average footballer as ‘a bit thick’ is because nearly all of them come from disadvantaged backgrounds with comprehensive school educations.
In this country at least there aren’t many players who grew up in cosy middle-class surroundings. You may as well say we need to leave off criticising Rashford as he has both bollocks.
He should be getting a decent pre-season and rest.
Let's how ten hag rates him then, till that time arrives i think he has earned the right to get a second chance from the fans(some of his childish bellendry notwithstanding).
I think there's a good lad in there as well as a good footballer and even though he's become extremely one dimensional and a bit of a run and kick merchant i feel it could be improved.
As long as he cuts down on his obnoxious pr maneuvers I'll be happy to afford him an another chance, he deserves it.
Let's how ten hag rates him then, till that time arrives i think he has earned the right to get a second chance from the fans(some of his childish bellendry notwithstanding).
I think there's a good lad in there as well as a good footballer and even though he's become extremely one dimensional and a bit of a run and kick merchant i feel it could be improved.
As long as he cuts down on his obnoxious pr maneuvers I'll be happy to afford him an another chance, he deserves it.
Indeed.
They have become like this largely because of the rotten culture that’s been allowed to develop at the club. Overpaid, overhyped and overmarketed; it’s hardly surprising they’ve turned out that way. Wasn’t there some news a few weeks ago about the club acknowledging that its pastoral care for young players hadn’t been good enough and needed improvement? There’s another reason.
The club’s inability to move players on when it’s become apparent they aren’t good enough hasn’t helped either.
Yeah I never get the “never rated him anyway” brigade. The Player Performance thread is full of them, and they have a really corrosive effect on discussion of a player’s actual strengths, weaknesses and form.Some of the lies in this thread
Some of the posts as if he was poor throughout his ManUtd career. Also not sure where this myth that "he wasn't highly rated as a youth player" is coming from.
The posters who post exclusively on youth players said its wrong and the guardian article from long back also proves that myth wrong.
I suppose they think it helps them establish their credentials as super sages or something.
There are so many posters with same attitude or lets say posts. As soon as the player hits poor form, they will come up with posts saying why they were always right to not rate the player, their entire career will be written off and their previous good seasons will be forgotten.
Rashford was picked as best young player in ManUtd academy by Guardian, who used to pick one player from each club, like player to keep eye on. Somehow there are few who think he was some scrub who suddenly got chance and he took it well.
Good lad or not is not relevant. The likes of Giggs and Keane are not “good lads” but they contribute more to the club than Rashford had and likely, will have.
Why only Rashford deserves a chance though. Why not Martial?
Both were exciting young talents that fell by the wayside. Both had looked lackluster on the pitch for prolonged periods. Is it because of difference in birthplace? One gets forgiveness and acceptance while the other gets condemnation.
I'm being sentimental obviously, I think we can afford to be so here and there.
And yes some of is due to Marcus being homegrown.
Horrible post.
What does that mean out of curiosity?
This thread is triggering
Completely agree.
It happened on a lesser scale with SAF teams too. The scapegoat was usually an academy product eg Fletcher, OShea, etc
Modern fans love new shiny toys and academy products don’t count but they need to remember that’s what this club was built on
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Hasn’t really improved technically since breaking through so not sure how effective he will be under ETH.
His pace is frightening and makes him a threat in behind if he can manage to get his finger out though.
If he continues his form from last season it will be a case similar to Dele which would be sad to see from one of our own.
His pace is frightening and makes him a threat in behind if he can manage to get his finger out though.
If he continues his form from last season it will be a case similar to Dele which would be sad to see from one of our own.
Louis nails it. Marcus is unplayable on his day. The trouble is those days represent about 0.2% of his total output, yet he has the status of a player who plays like that 60-70%+ of the time.
I agree with that, and the same should also apply to Shaw, Maguire, Bruno and McT.
One season to prove that they can completely turn it around and show that they can take the club forward, otherwise, adios.