Souness at it again…

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RoyH1

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Has there ever been a man with such strong "old man yelling at a cloud" energy on television? I find it hard to find someone on his level.

That and his thinly disguised contempt for foreign players just raises my contempt for him.
 

devilish

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Footballing talent doesn't necessarily translate to punditry or even having any clue about football. Have you heard Scholes speak? He quite clearly has absolutely no idea why he was so good at the game.

I think the very best players are elevated to an almost god like status that makes them unrelatable as pundits. Theyre not like you or I, Neville and Carragher are. They're loveable idiots, happy to have their flaws acknowledged to make them more relatable. There's a little bit of the hero worship with Henry, but can you imagine if R9 got into punditry? Or Messi? Their name would overshadow anything they had to say. You'd just look at the screen and think 'that's Ronaldo', and so would the other pundits.

It's why managers make the best pundits. They have the knowledge but they don't have the status.
There's a fantastic quote in Rocky II which reminds me of this. Basically Rocky was thought to be too hurt to fight again and he asks Mickey to give him a job in the gym. The old coach tells him that he's royalty there and that his dignity would be hurt big time if he's seen carrying towels and buckets. I can't see Ronaldo and Messi ever be pundits. They certainly don't need the money and their ego is too big to be sitting around and discussing football
 
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Pascal Quiff

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This is what happens in my opinion. The likes of Carra and Gaz had lived in the shadows of far more talented players such as Giggs, Scholes and Gerrard since their childhood. What comes easy for the likes of Giggs would sound incredibly difficult for the likes of Gaz. When its time to burst into first team football, the talented players tend to attract the fans (and women), they end up making more money, they are treated better by the club (its more difficult to replace Scholes then Gaz) and due to their talent they achieved all of that with a style of football that is often less taxing on their body. This reverence towards these players is often hardcoded in them as they know very well that if there's a spat between Gerrard and Carra to an extent that the club will have to choose one between them then that choice will be quite natural for them. This reverence survive to this day with Carra refusing to criticise Gerrard even though he's a shit manager and with our own players struggling to criticise Ronaldo's form.

Once these players retire they notice that fans tend to forget about them quite quickly. Not to forget that the new generation of players are making far more money then they do. Thus they end up in punditry pouring their sourness and making themselves look like the football geniuses that they never were.

You rarely see real top talented players who had attracted the love of fans being so sour as pundits (I am referring to the likes of Cantona, Baggio, Totti, Ronaldo (Brazilian) etc). For them football was a fabulous chapter in their life, they came in and out of it with their ego satisfied for the rest of their life.
Agree with the sentiment here but you also have talented players like Henry, Rio and Ian Wright that were absolutely adored by their fans and players alike. I think some players are just football obsessives and Carragher and Neville fall into this category.

It's also worth pointing out that when it came to playing the game, Souness was clearly levels above the majority of pundits like Carragher, Neville, Richards etc. so I can understand the broadcasters wanting someone in there who experienced playing at the very top, it's the same reason Keane constantly gets the gig.
 

11101

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Agree with the sentiment here but you also have talented players like Henry, Rio and Ian Wright that were absolutely adored by their fans and players alike. I think some players are just football obsessives and Carragher and Neville fall into this category.

It's also worth pointing out that when it came to playing the game, Souness was clearly levels above the majority of pundits like Carragher, Neville, Richards etc. so I can understand the broadcasters wanting someone in there who experienced playing at the very top, it's the same reason Keane constantly gets the gig.
I think Neville played at every bit as high a level as Souness, especially when you look at what Souness's main talent was as a player.

Are there any genuinely generation defining talents who turned to punditry? Henry was the closest i can think of but he's a)not doing much and b) not on the level of the very, very best.
 

Boondog

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Souness is just another ex-player who offers little in the way of good perception on the game. Being good at one does not guarantee the other. He has way too many bad and straight ignorant takes for me to seriously consider his opinion. Guys like him are in the media for the clicks their ridiculous takes create.
 

EngimaMK

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I think Neville played at every bit as high a level as Souness, especially when you look at what Souness's main talent was as a player.

Are there any genuinely generation defining talents who turned to punditry? Henry was the closest i can think of but he's a)not doing much and b) not on the level of the very, very best.
Agreed. The take that souness achieved way more than neville is bollocks. Gary was a key part of a star studded United team for a decade. Souness was also high quality but to say he was superior to Neville is fantasy.
 

Dan_F

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Agree with the sentiment here but you also have talented players like Henry, Rio and Ian Wright that were absolutely adored by their fans and players alike. I think some players are just football obsessives and Carragher and Neville fall into this category.

It's also worth pointing out that when it came to playing the game, Souness was clearly levels above the majority of pundits like Carragher, Neville, Richards etc. so I can understand the broadcasters wanting someone in there who experienced playing at the very top, it's the same reason Keane constantly gets the gig.
Yeah that makes sense. Neville clearly didn’t get enough experience at the top level in his 600 appearances for United, winning 20 trophies, captaining the team and playing for England for a decade. Thank god they have Souness to give us some insight to modern day football.
 

Lentwood

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I think Neville played at every bit as high a level as Souness, especially when you look at what Souness's main talent was as a player.

Are there any genuinely generation defining talents who turned to punditry? Henry was the closest i can think of but he's a)not doing much and b) not on the level of the very, very best.
Alan Shearer?
 

Chief123

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I think Neville played at every bit as high a level as Souness, especially when you look at what Souness's main talent was as a player.

Are there any genuinely generation defining talents who turned to punditry? Henry was the closest i can think of but he's a)not doing much and b) not on the level of the very, very best.
Roy Keane, Owen, Rio, Scholes?

To be fair a lot of the greatest players of their generation go on to become managers rather than punditry. Xavi, Zidane, Gerrard, Vieira. I’d imagine some of them would have gone into punditry if it wasn’t for management.
 

Withnail

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Roy Keane, Owen, Rio, Scholes?

To be fair a lot of the greatest players of their generation go on to become managers rather than punditry. Xavi, Zidane, Gerrard, Vieira. I’d imagine some of them would have gone into punditry if it wasn’t for management.
I think they meant became quality pundits. None of Roy, Owen, Rio or Scholes are good pundits who'll give anything approaching decent analysis. I think for a lot of elite players the game come to them so naturally they aren't able to analyse it because they never really had to.

And yes I agree those with talent in that area invariably become managers.
 

cyberman

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Roy Keane, Owen, Rio, Scholes?

To be fair a lot of the greatest players of their generation go on to become managers rather than punditry. Xavi, Zidane, Gerrard, Vieira. I’d imagine some of them would have gone into punditry if it wasn’t for management.
Van Basten is a huge pundit in Holland as well
 

Chief123

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I think they meant became quality pundits. None of Roy, Owen, Rio or Scholes are good pundits who'll give anything approaching decent analysis. I think for a lot of elite players the game come to them so naturally they aren't able to analyse it because they never really had to.

And yes I agree those with talent in that area invariably become managers.
Yeah it seems quite common a lot of the greatest players are pretty rubbish at analysing the game and doing punditry.
 

Pascal Quiff

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I think Neville played at every bit as high a level as Souness, especially when you look at what Souness's main talent was as a player.

Are there any genuinely generation defining talents who turned to punditry? Henry was the closest i can think of but he's a)not doing much and b) not on the level of the very, very best.
Yeah that makes sense. Neville clearly didn’t get enough experience at the top level in his 600 appearances for United, winning 20 trophies, captaining the team and playing for England for a decade. Thank god they have Souness to give us some insight to modern day football.
I might have worded it badly. I meant that in terms of technical ability, Souness was above pundits like Neville, Richards, Carragher etc. That this is the reason that him, Keane and Shearer (forgot him but someone else pointed him out) are included on panels, because it's hard to go back at them with the "well how would you know?" argument.

Not wanting to turn this into a 'who was better - Souness or Neville' debate, I was just making the point that at the time of Liverpool's dominance, Souness was regarded as one of the world's best midfielders.
 

Foxbatt

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Van Basten is a huge pundit in Holland as well
Very interesting. I always thought Gullit at most times knew what he was talking about . I remember one game particularly, the Ajax home game against Spurs. All the British pundits thought Ajax would shut up shop. Gullit said No. They will play the same way. They didn't believe him. They played the same way and lost.
How is Van Basten as a pundit? He played for the top most managers in the World as Cruijff, Sacchi and Michaels so hopefully he is good?
 

AlPistacho

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Does he ever have a go at Maguire? Just wondering.
Paul Merson once dared say United were being taken for mugs by paying £80m for Maguire and he wasn’t worth that much. Merson later apologised on TV.

I’m telling you this guy is protected by up and high from the Prince of darkness.
 

Red00012

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I think we can all admit we have big problems up top but only Souness can come out and say the Ronaldo situation could have been handled better. Souness is a unique person to be fair to him.
 

McGrathsipan

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why do you people give this twit any attention?
He will never say anything positive about United.
feck him
 

Devil81

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Why can't some of these so called experts see that Ronaldo is no longer scoring goals. Its like they are refusing to accept the absolute blatant evidence.

He couldn't hit a barn door against some of the smallest teams in Europe during the Europa groups and he total stunk out the world cup.
 

DJ_21

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Why do we still have a thread on this clown? None of us reds should be wasting our time on him. He’s an absolute weapon who needs to focus on his own crap team.
 

I’m loving my life

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I was wondering whether he plays up to everyone by being like this, and deliberately trolls United….or is it possible he really is actually that bitter.
 

Rayman96

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I begrudgingly admire his blatant hatred for UTD. :lol:
Other ex Liverpool like Danny Murphy are similar.
Just wish some of our ex player pundits could be as biased. YES YOU GARY
 

RedDevilRoshi

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He’s like the annoying guy in the pub that just chats a ton of shite. Still doesn’t rate one of the best CDM in the world in Casemiro which is just beyond bizarre when you look how good he has been throughout his career & the major honours he’s won.
 

Idxomer

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I was wondering whether he plays up to everyone by being like this, and deliberately trolls United….or is it possible he really is actually that bitter.
He's probably asked to say certain stuff to drive up engagement and make headlines, most of those guys are definitely playing characters.
 

Red in STL

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I might have worded it badly. I meant that in terms of technical ability, Souness was above pundits like Neville, Richards, Carragher etc. That this is the reason that him, Keane and Shearer (forgot him but someone else pointed him out) are included on panels, because it's hard to go back at them with the "well how would you know?" argument.

Not wanting to turn this into a 'who was better - Souness or Neville' debate, I was just making the point that at the time of Liverpool's dominance, Souness was regarded as one of the world's best midfielders.
Can't really compare them, 1 was a full back and the other a midfielder, Souness was a good player but he was a dirty git as well - part of his era but as I recall Nutty Norman sorted him out one time
 

Red_toad

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Can't really compare them, 1 was a full back and the other a midfielder, Souness was a good player but he was a dirty git as well - part of his era but as I recall Nutty Norman sorted him out one time
Good player? He was a very very good player.
 

GazTheLegend

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I think we can all admit we have big problems up top but only Souness can come out and say the Ronaldo situation could have been handled better. Souness is a unique person to be fair to him.
The only way we could have handled the Ronaldo situation better is never signing him in the first place, he was unbelievably toxic for our club.

It got me wondering "how did Ferguson manage all these narcissistic egomaniacs to begin with" like Ronaldo, Beckham, Cantona, Ruud, Keane, etc but the answer to that is he sold them all and never looked back.... (Although the Cantona case was a bit different I suppose in that he just retired)
 

Betson

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I agree with Souness on Lloris , always has a mistake in him. Was glad nothing ever concrete every came of our links to him.
 

Pogue Mahone

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He’s obviously a sour tit but he’s not wrong on how big a risk we’re taking in relying on Rashford and Martial for goals as much as we are. Which is something that will inevitably come back to haunt us unless we can somehow pull a loan deal for a class attacking player out of our arse in the next couple of weeks.
 

Red in STL

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The only way we could have handled the Ronaldo situation better is never signing him in the first place, he was unbelievably toxic for our club.

It got me wondering "how did Ferguson manage all these narcissistic egomaniacs to begin with" like Ronaldo, Beckham, Cantona, Ruud, Keane, etc but the answer to that is he sold them all and never looked back.... (Although the Cantona case was a bit different I suppose in that he just retired)
If you crossed Fergie you were out, didn't matter who you were, a lot harder to do in today's game as managers aren't allowed total control like he and others of his generation had
 

Red in STL

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He’s obviously a sour tit but he’s not wrong on how big a risk we’re taking in relying on Rashford and Martial for goals as much as we are. Which is something that will inevitably come back to haunt us unless we can somehow pull a loan deal for a class attacking player out of our arse in the next couple of weeks.
He's not known as Sourpuss for nothing but you and he are right about Rashford and Martial, we need someone who is a number 9, doesn't have to score lot's but can hold it up because that's what we're lacking
 

Rockets Redglare

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He’s obviously a sour tit but he’s not wrong on how big a risk we’re taking in relying on Rashford and Martial for goals as much as we are. Which is something that will inevitably come back to haunt us unless we can somehow pull a loan deal for a class attacking player out of our arse in the next couple of weeks.
If he just said that instead of shoehorning that Portuguese pensioner into the conversation I’d have agreed with what he was saying. But to say we’d be better off with Ronaldo in the squad is madness.
 

CloneMC16

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He’s obviously a sour tit but he’s not wrong on how big a risk we’re taking in relying on Rashford and Martial for goals as much as we are. Which is something that will inevitably come back to haunt us unless we can somehow pull a loan deal for a class attacking player out of our arse in the next couple of weeks.
Agreed. Martial is injury prone and Rashford is not clinical. He's in great form now, but it's not going to last all season. Bruno is going to have to chip in with more goals.

The Ronaldo shite is wrong, though.
 
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