Hey ep1 had separate climaxes too!
Maul v 2, the forgettable stuff with Padme+guards vs Trade Federaton leaders, the awful Gungan battle, and "let's try spinning, that's a good trick."
Film Star Wars: Episode IX (The Rise of Skywalker) | Teaser Trailer Released
- Thread starter Hoof the ball
- Start date
Maul v 2, the forgettable stuff with Padme+guards vs Trade Federaton leaders, the awful Gungan battle, and "let's try spinning, that's a good trick."
Maul was good, though I still can't get over the "hey these forcefields close quick, wish I had some kind of way to move really fast" bit.
Oh god the trade federation.
Also the ending, where another "nobody" kid just hearing about these legends from a distance uses the force. It's a "anyone can be a hero" film.
Having Rey be special because of some family connection undermines everything else the film is trying to be about and on multiple levels too.
This is probably my biggest issue with the film. There’s nothing left to care about. It may work as a stand-alone film, if you forget it’s other faults, but as a middle film in a trilogy it’s awful.
Ah, the Lost approach to story telling. And that turned out really well.
If this turns out have Rey be some chosen one character, or that she's secretly already a fully trained Jedi who got space amnesia and the ship she sees in her dreams isn't her parents abandoning her but actually some bullshit metaphor then I'm just flat out done with modern sequels or remakes, or in TFA's case sequels that were also remakes. But having her flip over a fighter with, what, one training session with a Jedi Master where she planted her arse on a rock for five minutes, makes me think they've just said "feck it".
It looks contrived and badly put together. That Rian Johnson part is as important as Empire was to the originals. But sadly he had to try to make it controversial not following the Star Wars formula and pulling it all apart. The worst is that Disney didnt have a clue what to do with the franchise. They should have made a outlined story for the trilogy before they started remaking New Hope. But instead they now have to skip the middle and try to fix what they ruined. It feels just lacking ideas and pulling Lando and the Palpatine is another shithousery. It wouldnt surprise me one bit if Ray and Ben are twins..
The problem with TLJ is that it could have been a good movie if it wasn't part of the trilogy. Sure, another Star Wars movie which is separated from the Skywalker saga and is unorthodox would have been a nice thing to watch (I loved Thrawn trilogy and KOTOR games which are very different to SW movies). But as part of the nine movie series, it is just awful and nothing makes sense in that established universe. He decided to become conservative for the sake of being conservative, and kind of broke Star Wars for many fans. For me, it is the worst movie in the entire saga (although much better than the first two prequels in a technical level, but they at least kind of made sense in that universe, while this one doesn't).
I will be delighted if JJ undoes as much as possible from that movie. Make Snoke a Palpatine clone body (and resurrect him again), change Rey to a trained Jane Skywalker, whatever. If I was a world dictator I would have banned TLJ and delete it from the existence.
I will be delighted if JJ undoes as much as possible from that movie. Make Snoke a Palpatine clone body (and resurrect him again), change Rey to a trained Jane Skywalker, whatever. If I was a world dictator I would have banned TLJ and delete it from the existence.
How does TLJ not make sense in the universe? As far as I am aware everything in that movie is established in previous films.
The idea of retreading more of the old trilogy in this isn't exactly promising. Hopefully the Rey/Ren arc is concluded in a satisfying way as it is the best thing about these new films.
Last Jedi was wank. No-one cares about any of the new characters, so they have to constantly wheel out the old ones. The insult to injury is how poorly they use them once they do so.
Killing off Luke Skywalker, or least pretending to, was the worst move they could've made. He was the only main character left everyone really wanted to see in action.
Yawn.
Why would that be the case?Retconning Vadar's redemption & Luke's victory.
There's nothing Disney won't turn to shit in the persuit of Nostalgia Dollars!
Vader still saved Luke's life, he still cut the head off the snake which allowed the Empire's leadership to splinter. That still won the war.
Even if Palpatine is properly back (and tbh, I think he'll either be in a severely weakened form or as a force ghost or some shit) what Vader/Luke did still had meaning.
He was certainly the only character that a lot of 30+ year old men wanted to see in action. Unsurprisingly the millions of children and teens these films are trying to appeal to are likely more interested in the hero from the films they like than the hero from films that were made several decades before they were born.
True, Disney are probably most interested in attracting the younger fans, getting them to buy the lego shit, the toy lightsabers, all that jazz.
Probably already been said but Palpatine and his master Plagueis were obsessed with the idea of bringing the dead back to life and only the dark side had the power to do this.
I wonder if Palpatine is back back in a different vessel (body)?
I wonder if Palpatine is back back in a different vessel (body)?
Because for some reason they’re incapable of watching the older films? Or those same heroes aren’t in all the new stuff too?
Last edited:
I always saw this as total bullshit, and just Sidious trying to lure Anakin in because he wanted to save Padme. I never actually took it as a genuine story but Palpatine being manipulative.
Shit name. Last one was shit. Dunno if I'll actually go to the cinema for this.
Let's not pretend this aspect of Star Wars was started by Disney. It's a key factor in its success from the off.
Its almost like SW is aimed towards kids.
Almost
In fairness most of the adults I know will be watching it, it's definitely not just a kid thing. But people do need to have some level of understanding that these films are mainly meant to just be fun for the younger generation.
In fairness, it's not like Star Wars was adverse to targeting the feck out of kids with merchandise before Disney got involved. But yeah, basically. Aside from the huge amount of younger viewers who attend the films themselves, they spend a fortune afterwards on merch too. It would be weird for Star Wars films not to prioritise their younger audience.
By far the largest demogragphic for Star Wars cinema goers is 18-49, average age 34. The merch, epecially the new stuff is rotting in discount stores.
The kids dig the MCU, not Star Wars.
I’m pretty sure Darth Plagueis is a canon character, and he was Palpatine’s master.
Yeah I get that I just don't know whether the whole 'he could stop people from dying' claim was true in the films, or whether it was manipulation on Palpatine's part.
A lie mixed with the truth is the best lie, right?
Apparently that's backfired with the merch not really selling. Not surprising as the new characters aren't even really characters, there's no real development or anything with them. The lack of a clear plan has a lot to answer for.
Although the aimed at kids defence has always been there, it's never really washed. A film about trade embargoes and galactic politics is aimed at kids? The hero going berserk and murdering women and children is aimed at kids? All those limbs being chopped off? It's just an excuse for some of the awful decisions made in the prequels and now. There are elements designed to sell toys, but vast swathes of these films are not aimed anywhere near children.
Ahh yeah, that may have very well been a lie. He was obsessed with figuring out how to beat death, but nothing to say with certainty that he ever actually achieved it. I agree that might have just been manipulation.
People like to use the “aimed at kids” defense so they can sit on their high horse and feel superior while saying “ha ha look at these 30 year old man children getting upset over something meant for children”
'Kids' is perhaps an oversimplification but they're definitely family films. They're made to be fun and quite camp with some occasionally dark undertones. The prequels may have contained trade federations but then that was the shite part of the movie no one enjoyed, and it also had Jar-Jar Binks who's hardly intended to be a character for some sort of high-brow audience.
I think part of the problem is that some of the films are confused with what they actually want to be.
You've got Jar Jar in the prequels next to the boring, complicated shit, and then two films later you have Anakin butchering a bunch of kids before he's lying there getting cooked by lava. Weird and inconsistent tone.
New ones are kind of similar. In the opening scene of the Force Awakens you have Kylo and his troopers executing an entire village and Hux doing a Hitleresque speech, but loads of comedic/family fun moments too.
Who knows what Lucas really thought, but one of the most respected Star Wars writers wrote a book (after being consulted with Lucas) in the backstory of Plagueis/Palpatine, and it shows to have been a genuine story. Plagueis had really managed to stop aging, and actually, reverse it, and when Palps kills him, by the rule of two he inherits all the information Plagueis had (the holocrones and all that shit). Additionally, even after the old extended universe was reset, Plagueis remained as Palpatine's master.
Of course, in the movie it was just a 5 minute scene (also the best scene in the prequels), and could be interpreted in both ways. Of course, it didn't really matter that much in the end if the story was genuine or not, it served Palps to turn Anakin to the dark side.
Also, Palps is around 80 in the old movies, but still the strongest entity in the galaxy, and clearly isn't planning to die soon from the old age. Not hard to imagine that he had already mastered the ability of immortality.
Last edited:
Fair enough. I was aware about some of the comic backstories, but wasn't sure how much of that was relevant to films and whether Lucas had gone his own way with it.
I feel like Sidious could possibly have worked out how to extend his life unnaturally, but resurrection/actual immortality seems a step beyond that. Will be interesting to see his role in the new film, and whether he is actually 'back' or simply a force projection/recording/hallucination of some sort.
I can see where you're coming from. It's just, for me, they had more enjoyable things than this new lot. Bar the cameos of past characters, there really isn't anything I particularly like. The story is poor, the new characters are forgettable, and it just feels like a cash in all round. I know Star Wars as a whole is pretty much that, but the better films/games/etc made it feel like it was more than that. To me, anyway.
As for the Rey and Kylo scenes, I wasn't that fond of them because, again, they're forgettable characters. I remember their mind speaking scenes being really, really bad. Especially when they tried to be funny.
The prequels were no doubt bad (though I admittedly enjoyed, and still do enjoy 3!), but at least they had the Anakin becoming Vader story which, yes, they kinda butchered, but there was more to be invested in than in these new ones. You also still had classic characters at the forefront in Palpatine, Yoda, Obi-Wan, and, unlike the new ones, they introduced new characters that were pretty good like Count Dooku, Genral Grievous, Darth Maul, Jar-Jar Binks to add to the classics.
True, but then SW was sort of always like that. Empire is undoubtedly the darkest of the OT, and contains the main character discovering his dad is actually a mass murdering maniac after said dad has just chopped his hand off, prompting him to a prospective suicide over siding with him...but then the same movie still contains lots of camp, fun moments and silly humour. Even when it does get dark, you're never intended to take it that seriously. There's rarely blood, no 'adult' content so to speak, and you know the good guys will pull through in the end.
I have defended with passion the prequels here, but even I cannot help but
at this.Definitely liked Dooku though, and found Maul meh but apparently, people liked him. JJB and Grievous were awful.
Aye. The only really dark movie is Revenge of the Sith, but even there in the first half, you have the scenes with R2-D2.
I was only kidding about Jar-Jar!I have defended with passion the prequels here, but even I cannot help but
Definitely liked Dooku though, and found Maul meh but apparently, people liked him. JJB and Grievous were awful.
I did like Grievous, though. Maul, whilst lacking character, was memorable for just being bad-ass in design and fighting style.
Even then though...the dark stuff is almost always immediately undermined. The Obi-Wan/Anakin scenes and Padme dying because she's sad is so ridiculous it's hard to take it seriously.
Don't forget about Major Surgery and Field Marshall Amp.