State of the refs in this country

[Bestie07]

Also worth investigating whether we should let refs get continuous assistance in their ear from another ref sat next to a monitor. They need all the help they can get.

This could be a good idea, referees spend so much time discussing with their assistants while making major decisions, it'd help if they get a word or two from the fourth official or someone who has access to video replays.

 

[SirHenryPercy]

There's plenty of talking points after every game even if the referee does a splendid job. Does a ref making no controversial wrong decisions also ruin the game then? Gridiron has flow issues due to the very fundamental rules of the game which is nothing like football at all. Considering how much time is wasted by players coming up to referees and arguing their case, I'm sure a video replay would not cause much more delay.

This is the problem and there would even more arguments with video replays. The Bravo Rooney incident yesterday would be a classic example. If United appealed that, it went to review and they decided it was a penalty and a sending off theirs going to be huge problems. As a neutral I think it was 50/50, can see why Utd are aggrieved but if I was in City's camp I would also be massively aggrieved if somebody in the stands changed the decision.

 

[montpelier]

We already have too much time wasting in the game, adding more opportunity would be detrimental to the game in my opinion.

Me too.

 

[kps88]

This is the problem and there would even more arguments with video replays. The Bravo Rooney incident yesterday would be a classic example. If United appealed that, it went to review and they decided it was a penalty and a sending off theirs going to be huge problems. As a neutral I think it was 50/50, can see why Utd are aggrieved but if I was in City's camp I would also be massively aggrieved if somebody in the stands changed the decision.

I don't see the problem with that. Even after video replays, you aren't going to have everyone agreeing on every decision but so what? You just have to go with what the most qualified person thinks, who in this case would be a ref with access to video. He's obviously going to be in a better position compared to the ref on the pitch.

 

[SirHenryPercy]

I don't see the problem with that. Even after video replays, you aren't going to have everyone agreeing on every decision but so what? You just have to go with what the most qualified person thinks, who in this case would be a ref with access to video. He's obviously going to be in a better position compared to the ref on the pitch.

The claims of bias and cheating would be ridiculous, change that decision yesterday and the City camp would understandably be going bonkers, don't change it and the Utd camp are angry. How is this going to help?

 

[Skills]

How about 2 refs on the pitch, one on each half of the pitch. These unfit, middle age feckers have to keep up with the ball all game which must be pretty difficult. I reckon the ref covers more ground than most players.

 

[montpelier]

Arsenal pen yesterday - I want to appeal it.

foul on Long is a FK - sorry, too far back in the play, we can't be doing that

Game should be stopped - sorry at discretion of idiot in charge, overruling on that would look bad, hard luck

Kos is offside - not active is he, for the pen occurring, sorry

It's not a pen - isn't totally clear either way, we'll go with the ref thanks, sorry

How does that help, and how long does it take?

 

[kps88]

The claims of bias and cheating would be ridiculous, change that decision yesterday and the City camp would understandably be going bonkers, don't change it and the Utd camp are angry. How is this going to help?

United camp are anyway angry but they aren't throwing around accusations of cheating. I don't understand why you're so concerned with the club's/fans' reactions.

It helps by giving the referees a better chance at reaching what they feel is the right decision. Up to everyone else to respect that decision.

 

[SirHenryPercy]

United camp are anyway angry but they aren't throwing around accusations of cheating. I don't understand why you're so concerned with the club's/fans' reactions.

It helps by giving the referees a better chance at reaching what they feel is the right decision. Up to everyone else to respect that decision.

It sounds great in theory, in reality it will be a disaster. If it's about respecting decisions then just respect them whether they be right or wrong.

Arsenal have picked up 3 points already from injury time penalty decisions, as frustrating as that is it is what it is.

 

[kps88]

It sounds great in theory, in reality it will be a disaster. If it's about respecting decisions then just respect them whether they be right or wrong.

Arsenal have picked up 3 points already from injury time penalty decisions, as frustrating as that is it is what it is.

I dunno. Think of all the clear cut decisions referees have gotten wrong that could have been easily corrected. Everyone is focusing too much on the negatives/possible tricky situations as people are naturally resistant to change.

No system is going to be perfect right off the bat. Start by trialing it for a few years in the lower leagues and we could eventually come up with something workable. A lot of sports went through these exact same arguments and are now better off thanks to video technology.

 

[JohnnyKills]

Is there a reason why they don't hire ex-players as refs?

Surely the money would be good for an ex-league 1-2 player and they'd have a better grasp of the game than some clown like Clattenburg (and less desire to get into the limelight)

 

[Mrs Smoker]

Arsenal pen yesterday - I want to appeal it.

foul on Long is a FK - sorry, too far back in the play, we can't be doing that

Game should be stopped - sorry at discretion of idiot in charge, overruling on that would look bad, hard luck

Kos is offside - not active is he, for the pen occurring, sorry

It's not a pen - isn't totally clear either way, we'll go with the ref thanks, sorry

How does that help, and how long does it take?

So, this is a scenario where hypothetically Southampton appeals...just the penalty? If they do appeal just that, and it "isn't totally clear either way", then they definitely should go with the ref.

Or are they appealing the penalty but including all preceding incidents too? I wouldn't allow that, should appeal specific thing.

If they appeal everything, but it's all rejected, yeah, it wouldn't help them a bit, but if they appeal everything, and just one thing is in their favour, it'll help immensely.

And I don't mind taking it as long as it takes.

 

[whatwha]

Is there a reason why they don't hire ex-players as refs?

Surely the money would be good for an ex-league 1-2 player and they'd have a better grasp of the game than some clown like Clattenburg (and less desire to get into the limelight)

That's a pretty good idea. Suppose there's nothing stopping them from doing refereeing badges or whatever it's called. Is there a single player who has gone on to be a ref?

 

[SirHenryPercy]

So, this is a scenario where hypothetically Southampton appeals...just the penalty? If they do appeal just that, and it "isn't totally clear either way", then they definitely should go with the ref.

Or are they appealing the penalty but including all preceding incidents too? I wouldn't allow that, should appeal specific thing.

If they appeal everything, but it's all rejected, yeah, it wouldn't help them a bit, but if they appeal everything, and just one thing is in their favour, it'll help immensely.

And I don't mind taking it as long as it takes.

We could all go get a hot dog whilst we're waiting, isn't football a game of fluidity and momentum?

These appeals will be used tactically to disrupt the flow of the game, break up momentum and more.

 

[montpelier]

So, this is a scenario where hypothetically Southampton appeals...just the penalty? If they do appeal just that, and it "isn't totally clear either way", then they definitely should go with the ref.

Or are they appealing the penalty but including all preceding incidents too? I wouldn't allow that, should appeal specific thing.

If they appeal everything, but it's all rejected, yeah, it wouldn't help them a bit, but if they appeal everything, and just one thing is in their favour, it'll help immensely.

And I don't mind taking it as long as it takes.

I don't know, Mrs S. I was just throwing it in as a possibly silly scenario. I don't like the 2nd bold at all, personally.

First bold, which one do they go with?

If the theory supporting vid analysis is 100% right & everybody happy, it ain't gonna happen. Odd occasions will be well short of that. Just swapping one mess for another different mess. And not a better mess, either, imo. <---- which I'm totally happy for people to disagree with. Might be worth a trial, Carling Cup or something?

 

[EyeInTheSky]

Middle aged men required to run the length of the pitch, for 90 minutes, chasing top athletes in the prime of their lives, while retaining ultra acute powers of observation and judgement. Kind of ridiculous isn't it?
My proposal, TWO REFS, neither of which runs past the centerline. If a player is going end to end, the second ref simply picks up his run and follows him down the field til the play turns around, and the other ref again takes charge when the ball comes into his half.

There won't be any more crowding on the field than if there was only one referee, and both men will still be relatively fresh and sharp even after 90 minutes.
Go ahead, scoff, I'm ready ;-)

Your only going to confuse the players, which reff are they going to run to in order to shout abuse over a decision? I can just see it now like a confused swarm of angry bees floating left and right to whoever the closet reff is.

What if there is an incident on the halfway line, who argues the toss to get duristiction?

Or you will get good cop bad cop lol.

 

[Mrs Smoker]

We could all go get a hot dog whilst we're waiting, isn't football a game of fluidity and momentum?

These appeals will be used tactically to disrupt the flow of the game, break up momentum and more.

Flow is broken every now and then in the current, videorefless game.

And with having no idea how it'll work, it was not too serious of an answer anyway. I probably wouldn't want it to take five minutes.

 

[Skills]

We could all go get a hot dog whilst we're waiting, isn't football a game of fluidity and momentum?

These appeals will be used tactically to disrupt the flow of the game, break up momentum and more.

It's why you should try to discourage flagrant appeals.

Give teams say 5 appeals for the entire season. You get it wrong you lose the appeal, get it right you get to keep it. No more than 2 wrong appeals in a game.

Cricket fecked up at the start with 3 appeals an inning.

 

[Mrs Smoker]

I don't know, Mrs S. I was just throwing it in as a possibly silly scenario. I don't like the 2nd bold at all, personally.

First bold, which one do they go with?

Posted about 2nd above, as for first, well, depends on challengers (Southampton manager(?) in this case). If they didn't appeal right after that foul on Long, and the whole penalty incident already happened, guess they'll challenge whatever they feel might be most successful.

Definitely for a trial, ASAP!

 

[Akshay]

The claims of bias and cheating would be ridiculous, change that decision yesterday and the City camp would understandably be going bonkers, don't change it and the Utd camp are angry. How is this going to help?

I think it would be just a matter of getting used to it. If the video decision was considered final and irrevocable I doubt the players would persist in arguing it much. It's not really about this particular incident - it'd be a boon to the game overall. There are more controversial and wrong decisions made week in week out in the league.

 

[ZDwyr]

Is there a reason why they don't hire ex-players as refs?

Surely the money would be good for an ex-league 1-2 player and they'd have a better grasp of the game than some clown like Clattenburg (and less desire to get into the limelight)

I think having ex-players would only make it 'more' about the refs. They'd have more attention on them because of their playing career.

 

[the hea]

It's getting beyond ridiculous and killing all the joy of watching football.

 

[Amar__]

They aren't getting better if their "superior" Howard Webb and all pundits refuse to criticise them. Fouls don't get clearer than that, I bet 1 out of 2 refs would give yellow card in that situation too yet people on TV keep pretending it was a tough one to decide, just because it fits their expectations of Watford scoring and making the game more interesting. Incredible.

 

[rimaldo]

we all know oliver is a spineless weed. he was blatantly bullied at school and now wants to use his authority to pretend he's important.

 

[Cascarino]

Was the martial foul really an example of terrible reffing? I've seen it in slow-mo and I'm still not sure if it's a foul or not

 

[Pexbo]

we all know oliver is a spineless weed. he was blatantly bullied at school and now wants to use his authority to pretend he's important.

That's what I've been saying for ages. Someone needs to give him a wedgie in the tunnel.

 

[Sandikan]

Was the martial foul really an example of terrible reffing? I've seen it in slow-mo and I'm still not sure if it's a foul or not

it wasn't quite Vardy on Rafael in that 5-3, but I was surprised it wasn't given.

 

[roonster09]

That's 3 games in a row ManUtd are done by refs.

 

[SecondFig]

Was the martial foul really an example of terrible reffing? I've seen it in slow-mo and I'm still not sure if it's a foul or not

I think it was a pretty clear foul, but it's hardly an example of consistently shocking refereeing, we were a little unlucky with the foul but fully deserve to be behind because we've been shit

 

[saivet]

Was the martial foul really an example of terrible reffing? I've seen it in slow-mo and I'm still not sure if it's a foul or not

I don't think so. Emotion getting the better of people here I think.

 

[Acquire Me]

The refs in this country need to be replaced.

 

[marjen]

Was the martial foul really an example of terrible reffing? I've seen it in slow-mo and I'm still not sure if it's a foul or not

WUM, surely?

It's as clear a free kick as you're ever going to get and Oliver is possibly the worst amongst a bad bunch.

He should've given Watford a pen for Fellaini's shirt holding, but the sheer amount of little incidents he gets entirely wrong is infuriating.

 

[Harry190]

This one action wasn't a bad one. Some days you get them, some days you don't . If it were given against us, we would be angry.

We're very poor at football. That's why we're lashing out on this one.

 

[SecondFig]

It's getting beyond ridiculous and killing all the joy of watching football.

That's nonsense, no ref gets all calls right, and the refs in the Premier League are on a par with the other major leagues and on a par with PL refs for the last couple of decades.

What's killing all the joy of watching football is seeing Man Utd managers shoehorn Rooney into the team week after week after week

 

[SirHenryPercy]

Was the martial foul really an example of terrible reffing? I've seen it in slow-mo and I'm still not sure if it's a foul or not

This is a classic case of why video refs will cause even more controversy, Utd will
Appeal that goal, the video ref will look at it and say good goal leading to Utd going mad. Or he looks at it and says yep free kick to Utd and Watford go mad.

It's such a marginal decision.

 

[Swaters16]

This one action wasn't a bad one. Some days you get them, some days you don't . If it were given against us, we would be angry.

We're very poor at football. That's why we're lashing out on this one.

Nope. I can guarantee you if it was given against us I would say, it's a foul. 100% of the time. It's not bias, it was a clear foul

 

[padr81]

Its one of those 50/50's your annoyed when it goes against you, when it goes for you its fine. It did look like Martial was caught but he did take the ball first.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Was the martial foul really an example of terrible reffing? I've seen it in slow-mo and I'm still not sure if it's a foul or not

He went in really hard and might have got the tip of his toe on the ball before pole axing Martial. It is a bit of a grey area as Howard Webb said. Oliver has been giving Watford some really soft free kicks in attacking areas though so I was surprised he didn't blow for that.

 

[Laphroaig]

Are people complaining about the goal? Martial is the one at fault there, not the ref.

 

[Classical Mechanic]

Are people complaining about the goal? Martial is the one at fault there, not the ref.

He could have been suffering from concussion in fairness to him. Or maybe he went down out of convenience? I'm not sure. The bench should have taken him off after that clash IMO and that would have been the end of that.