Support David Moyes thread

togg said:
I think this is an important point. No one is really saying that Fergusons last team was the best..but they were champions, which in the premier league is no mean feat. Having said this...which new manager recently has ever taken over from a hugely successful manager that has been in charge for 27 odd years? I think hardly anyone is there. So really Moyes is setting some sort of precedent here, trail blazing a new path so to speak, and for that reason...yeah perhaps the board is right is giving him some leeway.
However...the way we are playing bloody hurts...and the mass enjoyment by everyone else annoying!!
Click to expand...

By definition, a club which finishes atop the table with an 11 point cushion over the second place team IS the best club in the league. There's just no way around the logic of that.

If you mean by "best" the best Ferguson side of all time, then the point is well taken. But there can only be one "best" Ferguson team of all time and whether you think it was the 98/99 side or the 07/08 side it's a completely irrelevant point. The 12/13 side won the league easily and had an outstanding Real side on the ropes. We are nowhere near where last season's side and there's only variable factor that really matters -- the manager.

I'll grant you that Chelsea, Arsenal, City and Liverpool all got stronger. Two of those clubs have new managers as well. But we regressed under the new manager with almost exactly the same squad that destroyed our competition last season.

Fukk the excuses (not that you're making any, togg). Moyes inherited a very solid squad which at worst should be in third or fourth place in the league. But look at where we are now. Sad and pathetic.
 
Livvie said:
People like Noodlehair have asked questions about Moyes style of management and some of his decisions, which no-one seems to want to address. They seem very valid concerns to me, and I'd really like to see some convincing arguments against them.
Click to expand...

This. I'm definitely open to being convinced if somebody can make a pro-Moyes argument that isn't based on "he needs more time". He's been here long enough to have some kind of impact. Surely people defending him can point to some actual positive signs from the things he's done? Any kind of positive developments in our approach that we can definitely credit Moyes for would be reassuring. Even a vague sign he knows what to do here would be nice.
 
Livvie said:
People like Noodlehair have asked questions about Moyes style of management and some of his decisions, which no-one seems to want to address. They seem very valid concerns to me, and I'd really like to see some convincing arguments against them.
Click to expand...
I've yet to hear somebody argue against the point I made that we would simply be better off and would see an instant improvement with many other managers out there, just so long as they were attack minded or were proven to be successful before. I have no idea why we are settling for mediocrity and hoping that if we spend 200m more, on top of the 65 he already spent on a title winning team, that we'll make the top 4 with him. I'm sure even Moyes' biggest fans are in agreement that with somebody like Hiddink, or any other top manager, we would be challenging for the title this season and with an extra 265million, along with Januzaj added on to it, that we would be looking at arguably our best team ever with many world class players all around. I just don't understand why we want to have somebody like Moyes dragging us down when we would see an instant improvement with him (and Steve Round probably) gone.
 
sullydnl said:
This. I'm definitely open to being convinced if somebody can make a pro-Moyes argument that isn't based on "he needs more time". He's been here long enough to have some kind of impact. Surely people defending him can point to some actual positive signs from the things he's done? Any kind of positive developments in our approach that we can definitely credit Moyes for would be reassuring. Even a vague sign he knows what to do here would be nice.
Click to expand...

Well..I think this is the main problem. I'm not aware of all Noodles points, because like most people on here it's sometimes difficult to keep up to date with all the dicussions/threads etc since we do all have normal lives out there! However, I think before December there were signs that things were at least getting on an even track, that the players were starting to play a bit more consistently after such a traumatic and dramatic change of management and staff. But since then I really fail to see how anyone can see any positives with how the team are playing, our results, the tactics, style, plan etc..apart from the argument of giving him more time. The fact that there are intimations that he might have lost a few of the team in the dressing room is just fuel to the fire. Some people might say keeping Rooney is an indication of something positive. Others think that this may well prove to be a hindrence....

We shall see in the summer...
 
Loon said:
#justsaying

Tara280113_0_zps1ddc9b5e.jpg
Click to expand...
This.
 
The next few weeks could be pivotal with home games against Olympiakos, Liverpool and Man City. I've always thought Moyes would have at least until Dec 2014 but if we get nothing from these games, and don't even look the part in the way we play, the Glazers may well cut the cord at the end of the season. I have a really strong feeling however, we're going to overturn Olympiakos and may well beat Liverpool.
 
I hope Moyes is able to turn it all around. I dont know if he is capable of turning it around but I hope he does because I always like to see people come out on top and find the answers when things are going badly.
 
Stack said:
I hope Moyes is able to turn it all around. I dont know if he is capable of turning it around but I hope he does because I always like to see people come out on top and find the answers when things are going badly.
Click to expand...

This. I really want Moyes to succeed. I think he should be given one more season.
 
Right, is there much to add until the end of the season?

Just saying, this is going in big stupid circles. I think both camps have explained themselves well so now we wait.
 
Stack said:
I hope Moyes is able to turn it all around. I dont know if he is capable of turning it around but I hope he does because I always like to see people come out on top and find the answers when things are going badly.
Click to expand...
Can't agree more>the world and their dog want him to fail but imagine if he came up trumps!!! I dreamt last night that we were at home to Stoke and 2-nil down in no time and OT emptied and Moyes was for some reason stood in the away end??? I will support the teamk and I will give Moyes my support but I don't know if he has it in him.I felt let down beyond belief in midweek as we all did but players need to share the blame, and yes I know he picks em and the formations and tactics are gash but some of those players made every angry.I won't have it that Moyes told Rio and Vidic to keep puntingg the ball long and out of play.Lazy and stupid footballers who don't give a shit! Once more, what a to do!
 
Salfordlad70 said:
Can't agree more>the world and their dog want him to fail but imagine if he came up trumps!!! I dreamt last night that we were at home to Stoke and 2-nil down in no time and OT emptied and Moyes was for some reason stood in the away end??? I will support the teamk and I will give Moyes my support but I don't know if he has it in him.I felt let down beyond belief in midweek as we all did but players need to share the blame, and yes I know he picks em and the formations and tactics are gash but some of those players made every angry.I won't have it that Moyes told Rio and Vidic to keep puntingg the ball long and out of play.Lazy and stupid footballers who don't give a shit! Once more, what a to do!
Click to expand...

Go watch a few games of Everton from last seasons and you will see how Jagielka and Distin how they consistently hoof the ball. I think it is a coincidence.
 
Revan said:
Go watch a few games of Everton from last seasons and you will see how Jagielka and Distin how they consistently hoof the ball. I think it is a coincidence.
Click to expand...

On top of that, what people seem to miss is that if he hasn't told them to do that, he also hasn't told them not to which is just as bad.
 
David Moyes red and white army!

I have a feeling good things are around the corner. No, I haven't based it on anything. Yes, it's blind faith. Yes, it's very unlikely. No, it might not happen. I'm also not willing to explain myself.

Onwards and upwards, I feel positive.
 
pocco said:
It's going to be fun on here if/when he turns it around. I'm pretty sure we'll improve a lot next season and he'll be safe.
Click to expand...

it will probably be things like 'look...yes I had my doubts and voiced them...but deep inside I always had a feeling things might be ok...that maybe Moyes was the right guy after all...'

....and that will probably be me....;)
 
Tomalonge said:
Not really, but another reason to be positive! We didn't drop points this weekend. Our league form's at least starting to get somewhere judging from the palace game.
Click to expand...
We all know that the real reason for you being positive is because you are enjoying FF9 :D
 
I am a Moyes supporter, but I am willing to give him until chrustnas get in his new squad. Then i would judge him. I think this will allow an accurate judgment without blindly following a manager.

But, with all that said, how would yo feel if at west brom we do not perform? Especially when Moyes had a full 2 weeks to work with the players.
 
yanuzay said:
I am a Moyes supporter, but I am willing to give him until chrustnas get in his new squad. Then i would judge him. I think this will allow an accurate judgment without blindly following a manager.

But, with all that said, how would yo feel if at west brom we do not perform? Especially when Moyes had a full 2 weeks to work with the players.
Click to expand...
Wouldn't be a full two weeks as there are internationals. Not that I'm defending him.
 
Sunny Jim said:
that's actually an interesting point - i feel people spin things to match their negative narrative. I'm not a Moyes fan by any means but sometimes people get on his back with no reason.
Click to expand...
I'd agree with that. There are absolutely plenty of reasons why I would respect someone wanting rid of Moyes, the times I do get into arguments with people is when they bring irrelevant stuff or twist things to suit their agenda. I'd say 80% of people who want Moyes out have come to a reasoned conclusion that I just happen to agree to disagree with, and I always leave them to their views.
 
Who knows what kind of signing Moyes has in his mind? I'm optimistic that he could build an exciting squad in the summer. However, it's all well and good talking about what we're going to do next season but what's happening now is a more pressing concern and Moyes has seriously disappointed me so far. It's so hard to justify giving him the funds in the summer if performances don't drastically improve soon. Based on his transfer record at Everton and his apparent rigorous scouting of players, I am very curious to see what kind of players he would bring to United and that's why I find it so frustrating and disappointing just how bad he has us playing at the moment. I know he's better than what we're seeing at the moment, his Everton team could be an entertaining side but the pressure and expectations seem to weighing very heavily on him; the players definitely shoulder some of the blame too though, many simply aren't good enough - hence why giving him time to rebuild seems like a reasonable suggestion.

If it could be guaranteed that waiting for Moyes to find his feet would not result in a prolonged lack of competitiveness then I would be all for giving him more time but such guarantees just aren't possible, it could do serious damage to the club if he doesn't manage to improve -years of building a winning culture could be undone very quickly.

In a nutshell I want him to succeed but don't know if he can. I seem to be changing my mind on whether he should stay constantly. What is a year, or even two or three years without success in the grand scheme of things if sticking with him eventually does pay off? If we beat West Brom and Liverpool in our next two games and put in a proper performance against Olympiakos I'd be happy to keep supporting him.

If we lose, well that's for the other threads...
 
pocco said:
It's going to be fun on here if/when he turns it around. I'm pretty sure we'll improve a lot next season and he'll be safe.
Click to expand...

Fun because we'll be playing good football and genuinely enjoying ourselves?

Or fun because a faction of juvenile tossers will spend the entire season reminding everybody of exactly what they said the season before, with some kind of moral high ground?

I hope it's the former, I really do, because I'm not enjoying this football whatsoever.
 
I still want to support Moyes but he hasn't given any tangible reasons yet. The results have been bad and the football appalling which are the main concerns for me. I wouldn't care about the rest if at least those two were better. He could play Young and Valencia all season long for all I care but at least if we were in the top 4 (the arbitrary barometer lots of people agreed up in his first season) I'd be satisfied, nay even if we didn't finish top 4 but were in contention for it I'd still say give him time. But things are just so bad on all fronts right now. Statistically speaking at least Moyes has crossed the event horizon of no return. No manager in football history has taken over the champions, tanked them to 7th and survived more than a season.

As for the people who say it's going to blow up in my face if he turns around you surely can't be serious ? I'd be the happiest guy here if he can make us play attractive football while providing good results. I don't have anything personal against him. But I just can't envision it tbh. The scale of the task hauling us back is too big for him.
 
Moyes was never my first choice.But for those who wanted him here,one of his qualities was getting things done on a budget and how he would cope with a larger transfer kitty.So let's see how he does and give him till Christmas at least.
 
Drifter said:
Moyes was never my first choice.But for those who wanted him here,one of his qualities was getting things done on a budget and how he would cope with a larger transfer kitty.So let's see how he does and give him till Christmas at least.
Click to expand...
Ironically, Moyes' supporters now are asking to give Moyes a lot of money to replace a lot of players (after he spend 65m).

It's contradictary to the previous thinking that Moyes can do things in a tough budget and for that he is a better choice than Mourinho/Pep etc. Now the only way for the problem to get solves seems to be by doing a City aka throwing a lot of money. And even there there is nothing in Moyes' past to suggest that would actually solve the problem (his transfer record was good but his big money signings were generally poor).
 
Revan said:
Ironically, Moyes' supporters now are asking to give Moyes a lot of money to replace a lot of players (after he spend 65m).

It's contradictary to the previous thinking that Moyes can do things in a tough budget and for that he is a better choice than Mourinho/Pep etc. Now the only way for the problem to get solves seems to be by doing a City aka throwing a lot of money. And even there there is nothing in Moyes' past to suggest that would actually solve the problem (his transfer record was good but his big money signings were generally poor).
Click to expand...

Totally agree. And, whatever the problems with this squad, there is no way it is so bad that we should be battling for 7th with Newcastle having been knocked out of both domestic cups at home by relegation candidates. The mantra seems to have gone from "the squad is not as good as City and the big Champions League teams" to "we need to go on a Real Madrid/City style spending spree just to get back into the top 4".

I share your concerns on his ability to spend money effectively (Beattie, Johnson, Bilyatdinov), IPad or no IPad.

Unfortunately, we seem to be in one of those situations where to desire to save face (SAF, Woodward) within an institution may prevent effective decision making, at least until the share price really tanks.
 
Kag said:
Fun because we'll be playing good football and genuinely enjoying ourselves?

Or fun because a faction of juvenile tossers will spend the entire season reminding everybody of exactly what they said the season before, with some kind of moral high ground?

I hope it's the former, I really do, because I'm not enjoying this football whatsoever.
Click to expand...

Definitely a bit of both! I'm not going to lie, but I'll be first in line to rip apart some of the more unreasonable ones that have had it in for him since day one. I expect the same should it go the other way, so why not? Anyone that has tried to remain positive or get behind him has had to take a lot of shit so far. Some have set themselves up for a big fall.
 
pocco said:
Anyone that has tried to remain positive or get behind him has had to take a lot of shit so far.
Click to expand...
A looooooot of it.

It's also great being asked to highlight every single reason we have for remaining in support of Moyes. And the sentence usually goes;

"Yeah, but what have you seen that makes you think that? My gut feeling says we can't turn it around ever."
 
You must log in or register to reply here.